How To Override 104 Limit

[sealginCO]

I have read a lot of the dialog on this topic. I too want to increase my spa temp by a few degrees sometimes.

I also am aware of all the nanny's who want to lecture us about how the federal temperature police will get us. That is my secondary motivator - to do it just because the nanny's dont like it.

Anyway... the resistors in sensor circuit approach seemed like a rats nest to me. Defeating my Balboa controllers seemed pretty impossible. So here is my brute-force but quite simple method. Works great!

Buy:

--15 minute wall timer (like from homedepot)

--240v/12vac relay

Now:

--Run line voltage from the controller's line-in posts to the relay

--Run line voltage from the relay to the spa heater terminals.

--Supply the relay with 12vac from the Controller's transformer.

--Switch the relay with the 15min timer.

Operation:

--When I set the timer, the heater will turn on regardless of temperature. I do this about 10 or 15 min before I get in the spa. The spa heats at about 5 degress per hour so its easy to set the timer for two or three degrees of increase over the starting temperature. This takes the temp from 104 to about 106 - which is what I want.

-- My spa has an always-on circ pump so starting the heater is not a problem. If your spa runs on a filter cycle then you will have to ensure that the pump is running before you turn on the heater - else it will instantly burn up. You may think of your own creative way to ensure the pump is running.

-- no resistors. no controller changes. no bogus temperature displays. Hooking this up is easy if you are smarter than a 5th grader and not a nanny.

[Dr. Spa]

Well that beats wiring in a 12 cent resistor

[drylandfarmer]

Some controllers allow you to do it by pressing a couple of buttons. 106 is veeerrry niiice. (Borat voice)

[Pathfinder]

Some controllers allow you to do it by pressing a couple of buttons. 106 is veeerrry niiice. (Borat voice)

Not after 2006, before it was no problem

[Dan.The.Spa.Man]

I have some controllers for CalderaSpas that will go to 108 degrees if any one is interested...LMK

[Hillbilly Hot Tub]

Doesnt your system shut down since it should sense an overheat. Circ pumps shut off when 2 degrees over the set temp, entire spa shuts off when it reaches 107-108, You would have to be careful since overriding these protections could toast the control system and or other components

[PoolSpaGuy30]

Doesnt your system shut down since it should sense an overheat. Circ pumps shut off when 2 degrees over the set temp, entire spa shuts off when it reaches 107-108, You would have to be careful since overriding these protections could toast the control system and or other components

many spas straight from the factory can override to 106 but 108 is nuts...waay to hot for my liking

[Dr. Spa]

FYI. All of this has nothing to do with nanny's or the federal temperature police. It IS all about liability and the litigious populating of this country.

On Dec 31, 1979, the Consumer Products Safety Commission (CSPC) released advisory #79-071, which warned of heat strokes caused by 106 °F water. This advisory recommended 104°F as the maximum temperature for a spa. Underwriters Laboratory (UL) adopted this advisory and lists it in their controlling document for home spas, #UL 1563 (Electric Spas, Equipment Assemblies, and Associated Equipment.

With all of that, if someone, ANYONE, were to get injured in a spa, and could successfully argue that the injury was caused by the temperature of the water being OVER 104 degrees and that the spa manufacturer* designed the spa to operate this way, just about any court in this land would rule against the spa manufacturer. "You knew there was a possibility of water hotter than 104 to cause injuries, therefore you're liable".

This could EASILY be a 6 figure, if not 7 figure judgment. Of course, everyone has insurance, and that would pay the judgment...maybe. Now the insurance companies are saying, if you want us to insure you, your spa can't go above 104.

If you want to blame someone, look to the people that refuse to take responsibility for their own actions and will sue anyone for anything at any time...just to make a buck (I won't even begin to start in on attorneys, that perpetuate this type of thing).

*It's very easy to alter a spa to increase it's maximum temperature. But, if I tell you how to accomplish a higher than 104 temperature, I then also have the same liability. Don't even start in with, "I wont hold you responsible", or, "I'll sign a release". Over and over, these things have been shown to not be worth the parer they're written on in court.

[drylandfarmer]

You can still overide the 104 max temp on some hot tubs built after 2006, mine is a 2010 model and I have it set for 106 degrees, was easy to do, kinda just stumbled on it.

[Dnepr Dave]

My 2005 Caldera has two OT (Over Temperature) settings above 104 F. So I can just got to OT2 and I have 106F. but that is too hot for me. I keep it set at 103F.

Dave

[texasradio]

With Hot Spring, there is evidently some trick to override the 104 setpoint on the new models, because this is what a local dealer told me. But only if you buy the new spa do you get the info. Since I have a 2006, it's not an issue because these models have higher setpoints that are "coded" ut1, ut2, ut3, and ut4. How these codes would shield them from liability issues, that is a dang good question.

Anyways, my spa appears to have a 2-4 degree variation between setpoint and actual. Then again, I don't have a whole lot of faith in the accuracy of the floating thermometer that came with the tub. But if the tub temperature is out of whack, then it is likely Hot Spring has a way to adjust or compensate for the difference. My guess is that therein lies the "trick" to temperature modifications.

[Jimmy Dee]

On 2/18/2011 at 2:57 PM, drylandfarmer said:

You can still overide the 104 max temp on some hot tubs built after 2006, mine is a 2010 model and I have it set for 106 degrees, was easy to do, kinda just stumbled on it.

So how do you do it on a Hot Spot tub? Please and thanks. 

[coupe1942]

On 2/18/2011 at 11:24 AM, Dr. Spa said:

FYI. All of this has nothing to do with nanny's or the federal temperature police. It IS all about liability and the litigious populating of this country.

On Dec 31, 1979, the Consumer Products Safety Commission (CSPC) released advisory #79-071, which warned of heat strokes caused by 106 °F water. This advisory recommended 104°F as the maximum temperature for a spa. Underwriters Laboratory (UL) adopted this advisory and lists it in their controlling document for home spas, #UL 1563 (Electric Spas, Equipment Assemblies, and Associated Equipment.

With all of that, if someone, ANYONE, were to get injured in a spa, and could successfully argue that the injury was caused by the temperature of the water being OVER 104 degrees and that the spa manufacturer* designed the spa to operate this way, just about any court in this land would rule against the spa manufacturer. "You knew there was a possibility of water hotter than 104 to cause injuries, therefore you're liable".

This could EASILY be a 6 figure, if not 7 figure judgment. Of course, everyone has insurance, and that would pay the judgment...maybe. Now the insurance companies are saying, if you want us to insure you, your spa can't go above 104.

If you want to blame someone, look to the people that refuse to take responsibility for their own actions and will sue anyone for anything at any time...just to make a buck (I won't even begin to start in on attorneys, that perpetuate this type of thing).

*It's very easy to alter a spa to increase it's maximum temperature. But, if I tell you how to accomplish a higher than 104 temperature, I then also have the same liability. Don't even start in with, "I wont hold you responsible", or, "I'll sign a release". Over and over, these things have been shown to not be worth the parer they're written on in court.

Good solid info above: As a state investigator in Texas for many  years in MHMR group homes and state schools and hospitals, we used to shut down facilities immediately if their water temps were above 112 degrees. Once you get above 104 to the nearer range of 112 degrees it becomes all too easy to fall asleep, exacerbate medical conditions and drift off to sleep to where you actually do either damage to your skin or even slide down and drown.  It was always a bit ironic that we held these facilities to this state and federal rules for in-house water temps, but the same clients could just as easily go to any restroom or facility out in the public on a daily basis and the water temps at those places may be out of the limits that they would be exposed to. Still, no one wanted to contend with any child or adult who had suffered burns from such, especially if they were mentally handicapped, so the rules were strictly enforced. I retired out from the state in 2009, so it all may have changed since then. Being obstinate about rules by the state or feds is okay if you wish to assume the consequences if anything negative happens with what you do. Sometimes it works for you and sometimes it simply is not worth doing. Pick which choice to make for yourself.

[Perry]

Hi! Can someone explain how I can increase the temp on my eco spa? I would greatly appreciate any help. Thanks Perry pmagers@watrust.com

[Ryan J]

On 10/17/2019 at 9:39 PM, Perry said:

Hi! Can someone explain how I can increase the temp on my eco spa? I would greatly appreciate any help. Thanks Perry pmagers@watrust.com

Hey there. Did you ever get a response to this? I would also love to know! Thanks :)

[SteveSenger642]

I have a new eco spa as well and 104 just does not cut it, I need 105 or 106, does anyone know how to do this?

[Bearbottom]

 I've been working on my Watkins problems. First I changed the water and heater would not run. So I changed the sensors and it seemed to go to high limit and shut down on overtemp.  I changed the circ pump and the heater. It was set at 102 and it went to 104 before shutting down. Is that normal and what do I need to do next.

[Maskman]

I would love advice on how to raise the temperature on an American Spa! I lived in Japan for many years and 104 is just luke warm. I would be happier with even a few degrees hotter! Can I insulate the heat sensor? Is there a code? Please help!

[RDspaguy]

A spa cannot get a UL rating if it heats above 104*. It is not a code or law, but required for a safety certification. Very few brands still have a way to go higher. 

Sensors are superconductors that change resistance with temperature. Temp goes up, resistance goes down. If you add resistance to the sensor circuit, it will think the water is cooler than it actually is, and so heat it more. The temp reading will no longer be accurate. Both sensors must be the same.

Here is a chart from a popular control manufacturer. Other manufacturers may be different.

https://www.clearcreekspas.com/sensortable.html

Tampering with your sensors will void your warranty and leave you liable for any damages that may result. 

[CanadianSpaTech]

Pull sensors and put in ice cold water and wait 30 mins then add celery, carrots, and onion cook for 20 mins then add any small animal...

[RDspaguy]

How'd you get grandmas secret recipe?

[Canuckgirl]

On 2/17/2011 at 11:46 PM, Dan.The.Spa.Man said:

I have some controllers for CalderaSpas that will go to 108 degrees if any one is interested...LMK

I have a 2020 Canadian Spa with Balboa controls please help me override the 104 lockout, it’s too cold after 10 minutes on these cold winter days 😢

[CanadianSpaTech]

@Canuckgirl Hi please start your own thread and provide details of the spa. What model?   Is it hooked up 110V or 220V. Post pics of the spa pack and the schematic on the inside cover. Where in Canada?

[Mrs.kroupa]

On 4/14/2020 at 4:18 AM, Maskman said:

I would love advice on how to raise the temperature on an American Spa! I lived in Japan for many years and 104 is just luke warm. I would be happier with even a few degrees hotter! Can I insulate the heat sensor? Is there a code? Please help!

Did you ever find out how to do it we are getting a American spa should be here by may 10th and have been searching with no luck mrs.kroupa@gmail.com

 

On 4/14/2020 at 4:18 AM, Maskman said:

I would love advice on how to raise the temperature on an American Spa! I lived in Japan for many years and 104 is just luke warm. I would be happier with even a few degrees hotter! Can I insulate the heat sensor? Is there a code? Please help!

 

[Mrs.kroupa]

On 4/14/2020 at 4:18 AM, Maskman said:

I would love advice on how to raise the temperature on an American Spa! I lived in Japan for many years and 104 is just luke warm. I would be happier with even a few degrees hotter! Can I insulate the heat sensor? Is there a code? Please help!

Did you ever get a response or figured out how to do it if so I would love to know how please