Arctic Buying Experience In Northern Va

[klt1200]

This is a long posting, this deals with my experience with the Arctic dealership in Northern VA (Manassas). I am sure that other customers have had good experiences and I am also sure the dealer would refute this, but mine has been sub standard, when you look at the quality of the spa and the amount you spend a customer should not feel regret for purchasing one of their dreams. I have also been in contact with Arctic Corporate headquarters, which now seems to be an issue as well. For you NVA folks looking at spa’s at the upcoming Home and Garden shows, my advice to you is buyer beware and get EVERYTHING in writing and check the spa out from top to bottom inside out.

I would like to thank Tom G (Moderator) from Arctic who listened to my complaints and forwarded them to the customer service reps. I hope involvement did not cause undue hardships within the corporate HQ.

Northern Virginia spa buyers: How a dealer can give a great spa a bad name:

Here is my purchasing experience in a chronological order, some may think it is no big deal but I feel that if you spend a considerable sum of money on a product - which is a long term purchase - the customer should be treated fairly, professionally and with the desire to bring you back with your next sale. There were some good parts to this experience but the majority was like sitting in the dentists office and hearing the drill for hours, annoying and aggravating.

The purchase –

Arctic Frontier Legend Extreme (floor model), 1 two tier set of steps 60”, delivery and removal of old spa.

Freebies – 2 Arctic Robes (major shock), 1 Arctic Refresh, 1 Peak Boost and Bromine tablets. No complaints about the chemicals but it was the same basic package and size I was offered by the Marquis dealer.

The total came to $8665, a very good deal - except.

December 2, 06 - 1st visit was very pleasant, not overly informative but cordial. Asked questions about diverters, how many 90’s were in the plumbing, how many gallons filtered through the system, the majority of answers were “I will ask and I could get back to you.”

Told Spa was an 06 model and the Spa has been on the floor for about 10 months to a year. The salesperson (“She”) said I should talk to Stan the owner, they are going to move and do not want to bring any of the floor models along, so he would be the one to give the best price. Told the price would be about $8,000 - $8,200.

December 6, 06 - 2nd visit without family to get differences between Arctic and Catalina (they sell both). OK for about ten minutes then received the impression that I was bothering her. Not overly informative again, I was getting more info from the web site and forums. Asked if the owner had given a price, told they would let it go for about $7,900.

December 8, 06 - Talked to Stan (Owner) asked him questions about the spa, gave different answers on price and what came with the spa from his sales person and said she did not realize that this spa had an ozonator (sales person said it had the normal ozonator). Said it would cost me $250 to remove the old spa – reminded him that he was going to give me $500 credit for my old spa last year at a home and garden show. His response “that was then…this is now”. Asked questions about motors and plumbing. He asked what kind of delivery and set up I would need, explained about the deck and that it had 6 stairs, 48” wide. The next thing out of his mouth was come down and sign the purchase agreement and he will give me the Great price of $8,600. Told him that I would think about it and I still needed to wet test the Hot Springs. Stan said he would drop delivery charge to $150.00. Told him I would talk to him after their Arctic corporate trip to Cancun.

At this point if there was an Arctic dealer somewhere close, they would have received my business. During this period, we wet tested a Hot Springs and Marquis, decided to go with Arctic.

December 19, 06 – Spoke to Stan (owner) he started making several concessions and said he will drop the price of the spa to $7,900 plus $150 for the ozonator. I indicated to him that I will not pay for the ozonator since it is already included with the spa. He did concur with this…I also said they would need to remove the old spa if he wanted to make the sale, it was also included without the $500 credit. At this point, I agreed to purchase the spa and would come by to sign the purchase agreement also reminded him that it was going to be placed on a deck.

Arrived at Paradise @ 5pm, the sales person needed to correct two items on the hand written invoice. Changed $8,300 to $7,900 and deducted the $150 for the ozonator. I did not have a warm and fuzzy feeling with this purchase but I kept going. A particular item that really made me wonder – when I came in - they had a hand written sign on the frontier that said “Clearance $7,900”. Why was an invoice for $8,300? Told her I am purchasing the spa because it is a good deal but I still want to wet test prior to delivery. We set up a delivery date of December 27th with a wet test on the 23rd while it was being (Arctic) tested.

December 22, 06 - was informed that the spa was not ready and not to come by.

December 27, 06 – Delivery @ 11 am, a crew of 4 came out they looked at the deck and said there is no way they could lift this up the stairs with only 4 people. They asked if the could remove the railing on the deck, I gave them permission to remove one section. The crew did not have the tools necessary to remove the railing; therefore, I had to provide tools.

Once the railing was removed, they were unloading the spa onto a dolly to bring it around the house. This is the first time I was able to inspect the complete spa. I purchased the spa knowing that there were some scratches and divots on the spa (expected on a floor model), the amount of new divots and dings were fairly significant. The cover was filthy and there were rust bands on the underside, mold and mildew stains, a seam was separating and it smelled terribly.

As they were about to move the spa from the trailer to the dolly, I had to stop them. They were going to let it ride on bare metal bars, the padding they had was torn to shreds and hanging off the supports. As they maneuvered the spa, it flipped up onto the dolly and water went everywhere. The spa landed on the dolly with a thud, really good for the frame and the mounted motors.

I looked at the bottom and saw damage from fork lift operators. There were several gouges – at that point I called Paradise and asked about the cover and damage to the forever floor. I was basically barked with “I am sick and tired of people getting good deals on spas and then complaining. We now have to pick the one up that we just delivered, just because of buyers remorse.” I told her not to complain to me I just want to make sure it is still covered and to get me a new cover, The response was (a long sigh) in a real aggravated tone “It’s covered and if you’re not happy, just return it now. Our delivery man will not be happy if you wait to return it.” – Like an idiot I kept it.

As the crew brought the spa to the deck, they started asking if I had any 2x4’s to use as ramps (this blew me away). Luckily, I have 2x6 ramps for general purpose loading into my truck. They slid the spa up to the lip of the deck and could go no further since they needed more strength. The crew called Paradise and could not locate any additional landscaping teams in the area. The only help was the sales clerk and her husband. They finally arrived about 5:30pm to assist the crew. They barely said anything but scowled. The crew finally asked for some PVC pipe to assist the roll up the ramps. Once the spa came up on the deck, they positioned it, put on the cover caddy and left. There was no explanations, no instructions – nothing. When I looked into the spa, I found the filter laying halfway out of its basin, it looked dirty and loose (disposable filter). It was dark by the time they were done and I could not get a proper look. I also had to cancel the electrician for the 28th because they said it would not be ready.

Dec 28 – Called Paradise to find out if there was an owner’s manual and if they have the new cover. Told that they gave me the owners manual and they do not know if there are any more covers.

Dec 29 – Called Paradise again told them I will be there to pick up an owner’s manual because they DID NOT provide one. Same story on the cover.

Jan 2, 07 – electrician came out and updated the wiring and circuit breakers. Started filling the tub.

Jan 3, 07 – used the tub for the first time, had issues with the filter it kept coming out of its basin knocking the filter ring off.

Jan 4 – Called Paradise to find out why the filter kept knocking the ring off. We received the “Oh, it’s you again attitude” and were told that there needs to be a strainer in the filter to hold it in place. The sales person said she found a strainer in the closet and we could have it (where was it for the testing). Brought the filter to the dealer when we needed to pick up the skimmer, asked them to check it – looked beat and shaggy, stained in places a brown color. Told that they would not replace the filter and it’s ok, did not look at all like a filter that has been used just twice. My wife also picked up “Adjust up” and “Adjust down” and “Best defense” chemicals and she was told “You can’t take those for free - you need to pay for them” as she was walking up to the register. Major attitude.

Called twice more to find out if they went out to their yard to find the cover that belongs with that spa – negative responses both times.

Jan 26 – My wife called Paradise to find out the status of the cover and the bottom clips for the cover. She was told – the second cover was in much worse shape than what we have, she said Arctic does not have a very good response time on things that they order. They have had items on order for over three months and it will take over three months for us to get a cover, asked if one was ordered there was a pause and she said there has been no compromise yet and the manufacturer is over three months behind in responses.

She said they will send out the repair man late next week (1 Feb) to attach the clips.

Feb 14 – Called to find out about the status of our cover and inform them of a leak, I will give credit that the sales person did not get an attitude but stayed cordial. The response was that as I told your wife the cover we had in the yard is in much worse shape than yours. I asked if they had ordered a new one, after a pause she said that since you contacted Arctic what did they say to you? They have heard nothing from Arctic about replacing the cover and since we contacted them that Arctic can replace it. They scheduled the service man to come out the week of Feb 19, 07, we shall see.

Issues:

• Price changed three times.

• Told Spa was an 06 model, spa was built 03/05.

• Serial number on invoice does not match spa.

• Delivery – team was not fully equipped. Did not have tools to remove deck railing, cart for maneuvering spa did not have any padding to protect sides ( gave carpet to protect, statement was “guess I should take care of that”), gave them 2x4’s for leverage PCP piping to roll up on deck. Provided ramps to get up 4.5 feet.

• Once set up on deck they did not even look inside the spa. Filter was half out of the filter basin, as they were leaving they gave me the filter ring.

• Told them the cover was just sitting on the tub with no latches attached to the tub, how do you lock it? – I will check and get back to you – never did.

• Did not bring manuals.

• Hot tub was purchased with the knowledge it had some gouges/scratches, delivered with several additional scratches and divots.

• Buyer had to provide carpet, ramps, dolly, tools to remove railing on deck

• Filter cover would not adhere properly – later discovered that no filter strainer was provided.

• Buyer expressed concern over cold air blowing from some of the jets, “its normal how do you think we cool the water in the summer”.

• The cover was delivered with mildew all over the inside and it smelled, a seam coming apart, some areas were rust covered. We were given ½ bottle of cover cleaner (Cover & Cabinet Renew by Arctic) and told to clean the cover ourselves, asked if they had located a cover on property, I have not looked yet and will not until I get help.

• There was a discrepancy in the “date of manufacture”. What we were informed was different than what was printed on the data plate.

• There was no locking mechanism placed on the cover

• Called and asked for the sales person told she will call me back – never received a response.

• If spa was properly tested to “The Arctic Standard” how come there was no strainer in the filter compartment. It was filled for some kind of testing, the spa flipped out of the trailer on to the dolly with water going everywhere. Real good for the mounted pumps.

Since we made this purchase, several additional trips needed to be made to the dealer for picking up the skimmer, the cover cleaner, etc. We have placed several requests to get the cover replaced by another new cover that we were told was in stock or just put a new one on order. Tried to address our concerns about different issues and the attitude and comments that we had to endure were uncalled for. I am sure the dealer would give a different story and that we grumble too much but when you spend $8,665 on a floor model you should be entitled to a decent product.

One of the reasons I purchased an Arctic was the quality of the spa itself, even Jim Arguna (Haven Spas) doesn’t slam them. I figured that such a quality item would be sold by dealers that provide quality service. If I could, I would return the spa and purchase a Marquis, Hot springs or something else because I feel the service that will be provided in the Northern Virginia area will be substandard. I feel like I could have gone through this and spent thousands less by going to a warehouse sale. Legally, the only thing I could get would be a new cover, it would cost more in legal fees than to go out and purchase it.

Good Luck to all you who are in the market

[pg_rider]

Sounds a lot like my dealer! Here's the letter I wrote to Sundance corporate HQ after I got my spa, outlining my concerns. It was about two months after writing this letter that I found out Spa Palace is no longer selling Sundance. Not sure if that's due to my letter alone, or if I was just the straw that broke the camel's back, but it's good to see Sundance dropped them -- they were really poor.

--------

I'm writing to express my concerns and frustration with the dealership from which I bought my 2006 Sundance Optima - Spa Palace in Colorado Springs, CO. After an initial smooth and pleasant purchase with the regional sales rep I've had a slew of incidents that have left me with absolutely no confidence in Spa Palace.

- Shortly after purchase I went back to the store to remind them that I needed my tub configured for 60 amps (it had not been noted that way on the contract). I watched the woman in the back office (Nita) put a yellow sticky on my paperwork saying "configure for 60 amp". In spite of that, when my tub was delivered it was set up for 50 amps. The delivery person had to change the jumper at my house, a process he was unfamiliar with but luckily did correctly.

- Similarly, while waiting for my tub to arrive I went back into the store on two occasions to request chlorine instead of bromine in my chemical start-up kit. The second time the store manager even changed it in the computer system. However, at delivery I was still given bromine. This caused me the hassle of having to make an extra trip to the store to exchange the bromine for chlorine.

- The tub took a very long time to be delivered from the factory to Spa Palace (apprx. 6 weeks), during which time I'd made several requests from Nita for an update - I received none. Finally, the tub apparently arrived at Spa Palace on Friday, Oct 13th, although the only reason I found out was because I happened to call on Monday the 16th to ask yet again for an update and was told "oh, it arrived here on Friday". A phone call on that Friday to let me know it had arrived and to schedule delivery would have been nice. Furthermore, after finding out that the tub had arrived after a full six weeks (contract stipulated 2-4 weeks by the way), I still couldn't get delivery for yet another week, on Oct. 23rd. Having made 50% of the purchase price as a down payment (i.e. $5000), I would have liked to have been kept in the loop and to have seen a greater effort to get me my tub in a reasonable amount of time. 7 weeks is a long time to have $5k tied up and have no idea what's happening.

- At delivery the spa was not wrapped; I assume that was because the ozonator was installed at the shop which I have no issue with. However, the tub was extremely dirty when it arrived at my house requiring me to spend over an hour cleaning out the accumulated dirt and dirty stains prior to filling. Even worse, after completing the electrical hookup the next morning the tub was completely unresponsive. The electrician verified there was 240 volts at the spa panel so I called Spa Palace to request guidance. I was immediately and rudely told that I or the electrician "must have done something wrong". After finally convincing her that no we hadn't, she agreed to send a service tech out. As luck would have it, my electrician then looked around in the spa control panel and noticed a plastic connector that looked like it was loose. He plugged it tightly back in and the tub fired right up. I can only assume it was plugged in correctly at the Sundance factory for the final test, and therefore must have been disconnected at Spa Palace during the ozonator installation process, or perhaps when the delivery guy was trying to jumper my tub for 60 amps.

- Finally, from day one after receiving my spa I noticed that the clock was running fast, gaining nearly an hour a day. By chance, I read about a Jacuzzi customer on an internet spa forum who was having the same issue. He was told that it was a known problem with Jacuzzi and Sundance controls, and his "EPROM chip" was promptly replaced under warranty. On Wednesday Nov. 8th I called Spa Palace and told them about this issue and was told by Connie that she'd "look into it and call me back". As of today, Nov. 11th (three days later) I've heard nothing back from Connie or Spa Palace.

When taken individually these incidents may not seem like huge issues, but when looked at as a whole I'm left with a very dissatisfied feeling toward Spa Palace. This feeling was confirmed by another Sundance owner in town that bought from Spa Palace and was not impressed with them either. Specifically, he's had trouble getting them to respond to issues with his tub, much the same as I have.

We love the tub and have heard nothing but good things about Sundance as a company. However, after spending $10,000 on your product I would like to think that I could expect better service from your dealer in my area. I have yet to see a more unprofessional place of business. I am truly worried about what will happen in the future if/when I require service, and I dread having to deal with the same people I've been dealing with to date. I certainly will not spend another dollar in that store, and will strongly recommend my friends to not purchase from Spa Palace as well. Unfortunately that means that they will most likely not be purchasing any Sundance products as Spa Palace is the only Sundance dealer in town.

-----

There's more to the letter but I'll stop here! I basically asked for another dealer to provide me warranty service. Luckily Sundance dropped these guys shortly thereafter and are using another dealer in town...

[jennaemac]

I am so sorry to hear of your experience!! It sounds like you really got unlucky with your dealer. I have to say that our experince with our Arctic dealer buying a floor model in early Nov. was not at all like yours. We a got a great deal with no surprises. Im glad you shared your story however, I hope that others will not be deterred from exploring Arctic. You are right when you say it is a quality spa and we have been very happy with it but a bad experience with sales people can make or break how you feel about a product.

The delivery people were great. They stayed and filled it to the point where the jets were started. Everything was very easy and smooth. We have had a couple of issues since purchase, (a venturi valve seized up and the we had an error message that caused it to stop heating) Both issues were dealt with quickly and with no charges. Any questions I have had regarding chemistry, since this is my first spa, were answered courteously and without any impatience. Everytime I call there, I feel like everyone remembers who I am, even after nearly 4 months! I just hope after all this, if you get your spa working well, you can enjoy it without regret. Hopefully, Arctic corporate can assist you. Good luck!

This is a long posting, this deals with my experience with the Arctic dealership in Northern VA (Manassas). <snip> Good Luck to all you who are in the market

Please edit a long quote, it makes it easier to follow the post! Many thanks -- Tom

[Roger]

There can be bad dealers with any brand, and that's why there importance is stressed by us who are asked advice. The majority of the dealers out there make there living by being customer oriented, but there's always those that lack in this department.

[paintnsunni]

wow! what a horror story. I would be upset to say the least. Can you return the spa on the basis it is not the spa you made the del n as the serial numbers dont match. I bet if it was financed the contract woud be null and void as they loaned money on a different spa. I would lean on getting the deal reversed and get a new spa or cash back as their attitude sucks and they dont deserve your sale.

[jwillard]

After reading about your experience it makes me want to cringe! The only advice I can give is when you make a purchase of an item that cost what you paid please stand up for yourself better than you did in this situation. The first time they made me feel like I was a bother or answered me rudely I would have taken my business else where.

Another suggestion if possible is to make purchases like this with a credit card so you can dispute the charges through Visa if you aren't given what was promised.

I remember when I went to see one of the local dealers here in Orlando, they told me I would need to order one since the floor models were not a color I would have. I asked how much difference in price it would be to order one without the stereo system and I was told it would be the same price either way. If you look at the mark up for a stereo system and tell me that one with is the same as one without your out of your mind! At that point I kinda laughed out loud and headed for the door.

Of all the spa dealers I visited the only one who had prices posted was REC Warehouse. What gets me is why do most dealers NOT post their prices on their units????

Hell, as corrupt as car dealers are most post their price on the vehicle. I think if more spa dealers posted their price it would make people feel better and not feel like they are being played!!! Thats my opinion...

You work hard for your money...DON'T SETTLE!!!

[Jim_The_Jim]

Did either of you contact their customers?

You sould get a list of customers and contact them. We do it all the time, because our customers are treated as friends and they support our hard work.

http://www.soundclick.com/havenhead

[Tom]

This is a long posting, this deals with my experience with the Arctic dealership in Northern VA (Manassas). <snip>

I would like to thank Tom G (Moderator) from Arctic who listened to my complaints and forwarded them to the customer service reps. I hope involvement did not cause undue hardships within the corporate HQ. <snip>

Good Luck to all you who are in the market

It's an unfortunate situation that I hope is resolved to the customer's satisfaction. My involvement has ended and I will be unable to discuss the matter further in the forum in order to maintain impartiality as a moderator. I trust that everyone understands.

Tom

[Trigger]

Dear Arctic, please come by and remove your spa. I have stopped payment on the check and put the CC amount into dispute.

Amazing.

You have more paitence than I do.

[Jim_The_Jim]

It's an unfortunate situation that I hope is resolved to the customer's satisfaction. My involvement has ended and I will be unable to discuss the matter further in the forum in order to maintain impartiality as a moderator. I trust that everyone understands.

Tom

It is very important who you buy from. If you want good service and a quality products, you need to investigate the dealer, by contacting his customers. There are a lot of "I don't give a s#it" dealers out there who got in the industry for the quick bucks. When the work starts to show up, they disappear.

There are more ex-hot tub dealers than the present number of dealers. The spa industry is in the crapper and that is their own fault.

Most customers who bought locally instead of from us are now without any service. They were afraid to buy over the net, and that fear manifested in no dealer at all.

I remember a mortician who got into the spa industry, because he thought it was easy compared to the problems in the mortician business. What a joke. There is no business any harder than the spa business, and the ignorant wimps will do stupid things to increase the bad reputation of the industry. I don't know where the modern work ethic comes from in the US, but the rest of the world is kicking our asses, when it comes to hard work and work ethics.

If you are not willing to work hard for a living, the get the h#ll out of my industry.

[Brulan1]

It is very important who you buy from. If you want good service and a quality products, you need to investigate the dealer, by contacting his customers. There are a lot of "I don't give a s#it" dealers out there who got in the industry for the quick bucks. When the work starts to show up, they disappear.

There are more ex-hot tub dealers than the present number of dealers. The spa industry is in the crapper and that is their own fault.

Most customers who bought locally instead of from us are now without any service. They were afraid to buy over the net, and that fear manifested in no dealer at all.

I remember a mortician who got into the spa industry, because he thought it was easy compared to the problems in the mortician business. What a joke. There is no business any harder than the spa business, and the ignorant wimps will do stupid things to increase the bad reputation of the industry. I don't know where the modern work ethic comes from in the US, but the rest of the world is kicking our asses, when it comes to hard work and work ethics.

If you are not willing to work hard for a living, the get the h#ll out of my industry.

That's in every industry and business in general. What makes selling a spa different than selling furniture besides physical characteristics. "There is no business any harder than the spa business"? Are you serious? I would be a little skeptical buying one of your wooden tubs over the net because I don't think you would service something in Long Island. I'll take my chances local.

[Jim_The_Jim]

I would be a little skeptical buying one of your wooden tubs over the net because I don't think you would service something in Long Island. I'll take my chances local.

First of all we don't focus on wooden tubs, we do customize high end products and we have them in many places in Long Island. We have used service people out there. By the way the odds are much higher that you will have service in the future when you buy from us. One of the largest dealers on Long Island recently crashed and burned, because it is a difficult time for hot tub companies.

Pretty soon there will only be big box stores with Internet sales and us. Haven if you want real quality.

So many people bought "locally" are now finding that was not such a good idea. I am having to help them with their problems, but I can't get parts if they have exclusive parts.

Sandy and I have been all the way to East Hampton, where we have a "fully loaded" Super Custom Fallsburg owner. If the spas don't have warranty issues it is a big plus for any spa dealer. That is why we don't have any issues even sending them to the UK or the Netherlands. We have a Springville in Scotland, where much of my blood is from. I am 3/4 Scottish, mom is full Scottish, Campbell. She is also going on 96 years old.

http://www.soundclick/havenhead

[Atali Awa]

Sorry to hear about your Arctic Spa experience. I'm having major problems with Arctic and my local dealer as well...

I'm an engineer, researched in depth and chose the spa that was built similiar to the way I would design one. I purchased my Arctic Summit in November, paid by credit card and it was delivered as promised with the only issue being the scum I had to clean before filling... OK, it's a floor model and at least I know it works without leaks. After getting power to the spa a few days later (I was travelling on business) we began the start up process. The spa got to 84 degrees, displayed a "FLO" error (even though there was not an issue with the water flow) and stopped heating. The dealer came out, replaced the main control unit and found another sensor was bad. What suprised me was that the main control unit installed in the spa was an older model, not the one I was shown and lead to believe that I was getting. OK, they replaced it with the newer style unit... Get over it. A few weeks later, the chrome finish spa jets began failing. The dealer explained that there was a known problem with the new plastic that Arctic was now using... He reported that everyone supplied with the new jets was experiencing failures and Arctic was working on a solution but not to worry, Arctic would continue to replace the jets throughout the warranty period (Why didn't I know this prior to the sale? What happens after the warranty period?). He said the jet problem had already cost Arctic over $500,000. Now the dealer's story has conveniently changed citing that I'm the only one having these failures. Arctic has been little help... I was promised by the Arctic warranty manager that he would speak to the dealer about changing out my chemicals (with some undefined concession) and filter (he claims the Baqua is causing the failures). He said he would supply a complete new set of jets and see if the chemical change would solve the problem. According to my dealer, Beau never made the phone call and never spoke to him about his proposed solution. I asked him (Beau) for an action plan and he never responded after at least two requests. There is no apparent proactive action or attempt by Arctic or the dealer to resolve the problem.

To date (4.5 months since purchase), I have had more than 80 jets catastrophically fail (of 33 installed). The dealer blames the plastic... He says that Arctic changed jet suppliers and that's when the problems started. Arctic blames the chemicals (the same chemicals that my dealer uses in his tub and recommends - the dealer tests my water weekly to bi-weekly and all his instructions are followed to the letter). Three different jet styles have been tried and all fail (the styles are a cheaper, less attractive style than the chrome finish design that I originally purchased). I began asking for a full refund within 60 days... The dealer says it's Arctic's problem and Arctic says it's his problem - clearly this is my $8,592 problem. As an engineer with an analytical mind, it appears there is a profound problem with the polycarbonate material the jets are constructed of (heat, humidity and some chemical classes cause polycarbonate to degrade making this an odd material selection - source for this information is not from the spa industry).

This is the third spa I have owned and I have never had equipment failures other than regular wear and tear items and the occasional heater element. I purchased this spa as a stress and tension reliever... To date, it's the largest source of tension in my life. I wish I'd never heard of Arctic or the local, unresponsive dealer.

Is anyone else out there having jet failures? Any advice as to how to force Arctic and my dealer to refund my money???

[Aric]

Worst case scenario you'll end up in small claims court. But you have already made some mistakes.

First of all I live in Arizona so I can't say how your state laws are, but it is legal to record phone conversations in this state, as long as one party involved in the conversation knows it's being recorded (i.e. you would know because you are recording it.) I'd recommend in the future recording all phone conversations. I record them to my iPod for situations like this.

Second, if you used a credit card and are within 90 days of purchase put the charge in dispute, now. Even if you are outside of the 90 days, you can request a dispute, although the credit card company can deny it.

Lastly contact your state attorney general and let them know that the dealer has sold you a spa and been unable to make it work and you want their assistance in getting your money back. Make your letter only one page long (the smaller the better), but do include copies of all invoices, work orders, receipts, etc. You could CC Arctic spas on the letter as well, but that probably won't do too much good.

Good luck, and report back.

[Atali Awa]

<< Worst case scenario you'll end up in small claims court. But you have already made some mistakes. >>

Yeah, I know I've made some mistakes (buying an Arctic is the biggest)... You asked for an update:

As of yesterday, the song remains the same. The dealer blames the shoddy Chinese plastic and Arctic's warranty manager blames the chemicals the dealer sold me. Neither will step up and do the right thing.

I have filed a complaint with the local BBB. The dealer and Arctic have received it and have until April 28th to respond. Beau from Arctic called... This guy is so arrogant and obtuse, it turned into a shouting match.

I have filed a complaint with Colorado's State Attorney General's office. No response yet. Hot tubs are one of the few things not listed under my State's lemon law. There is a clause that may allow me to pursue this venue.

I have filed a complaint with the US Attorney General's office... Since Arctic is in Canada, maybe they'll respond.

I met with my attorney and learned that I can'recover legal fees in Colorado. He feels strongly that he can recover my money but the legal fees will offset any settlement. The only option is to try a class action and sign up as the principal complaint. A firm has been chosen and the investigation began yesterday to see if this is a certifiable case.

I am basically screwed... For me, it's now become a moral issue. About the only thing I can do is become the biggest pain in the rear that Arctic has ever experienced. If they had a brain, they'd refund my money and make me go away. Unfortuneatly, if they don't act quickly, it will be too late for me to turn back.

Any other ideas???

[104 Degrees]

<< Worst case scenario you'll end up in small claims court. But you have already made some mistakes. >>

Yeah, I know I've made some mistakes (buying an Arctic is the biggest)... You asked for an update:

As of yesterday, the song remains the same. The dealer blames the shoddy Chinese plastic and Arctic's warranty manager blames the chemicals the dealer sold me. Neither will step up and do the right thing.

I have filed a complaint with the local BBB. The dealer and Arctic have received it and have until April 28th to respond. Beau from Arctic called... This guy is so arrogant and obtuse, it turned into a shouting match.

I have filed a complaint with Colorado's State Attorney General's office. No response yet. Hot tubs are one of the few things not listed under my State's lemon law. There is a clause that may allow me to pursue this venue.

I have filed a complaint with the US Attorney General's office... Since Arctic is in Canada, maybe they'll respond.

I met with my attorney and learned that I can'recover legal fees in Colorado. He feels strongly that he can recover my money but the legal fees will offset any settlement. The only option is to try a class action and sign up as the principal complaint. A firm has been chosen and the investigation began yesterday to see if this is a certifiable case.

I am basically screwed... For me, it's now become a moral issue. About the only thing I can do is become the biggest pain in the rear that Arctic has ever experienced. If they had a brain, they'd refund my money and make me go away. Unfortuneatly, if they don't act quickly, it will be too late for me to turn back.

Any other ideas???

Good Luck. As a consumer i know what its like to be in your shoes. keep us informed.

[Atali Awa]

Good Luck. As a consumer i know what its like to be in your shoes. keep us informed.

It appears that a few folks are interested in the progress so I started a new topic (Arctic Spa Jets - Is anyone else havng failures?). I am posting updates there... So far, no one from Arctic has contacted me directly and the dealer is resorting to personal attack and distortion of the truth in defense of the BBB action.

[Tom]

So far, no one from Arctic has contacted me directly

I emailed you. And you said up above that "Beau from Arctic phoned". Isn't that contacting you directly?

[soakerman]

This sure looks like damage controll on the part of Arctic.....Would you guys please just replace the spa already. this isn't rocket science and no, you won't be flooded with returns. Costco has had a liberal return policy on spas with a very low R.T.V. rate.

[klt1200]

I had the unfortunate pleasure of starting this thread a few months ago. I am still engaged in a battle with my Arctic dealer, I have contacted Arctic corporate - NO RESPONSE - so much for customer service. The BBB has taken some action, I am waiting for the dealer rebuttal to my rebuttal to the Office managers unbelievable claims and accusations sent to the BBB.

Here is a good one - They claim that they came out to fix my supposed leak I am "Whining" about, They stated in the first part of the responses that they let the tub run for over 20 minutes with all pumps working and could find no leak ( I was losing 1/3 tub per week). near the end of the letter they said they came out a second time and fixed the leak I was complaining about - A stripped pump plug, unless they took it apart when they came out the first time, it was most probably done at the factory.

They said they have ordered a new cover, even though the one they gave me was perfectly fine, per the rebuttal to BBB, it was supposed to arrive from Arctic mid April. I do not know what is up with Arctic and the dealers but if I knew what kind of FECES I would go through I would NEVER have purchased an Arctic. I tell anyone who is looking my experience and to buy a different brand here in NVA.

Good idea on filing a BBB complaint against Arctic - I may/will follow suit.

[Atali Awa]

I emailed you. And you said up above that "Beau from Arctic phoned". Isn't that contacting you directly?

This quote is taken out of context and I'm not sure why it is important at this stage. The dealer had me contact Beau back in January (you know, back when your dealer was still blaming the Chinese plastic jets). Beau's phone call to me on or around April 13th was so he could yell at me for filing a BBB complaint. You have said from the first contact with me that you could not be involved in working out the solution (I see similiar disclaimers mentioned on all of the Arctic problems that you have responded to on this and other forums).

You can ignore the statement, Tom... It's just another unreasonable request from the consumer.

[Richs100]

Hey Atali:

These posts to multiple threads are very confusing. Why don't you try to limit your updates and responses to one of these. Just a suggestion. I think your main "jets" thread would be the most logical.

Rich

[Richs100]

Atali:

You can ignore my last post. The thread has been locked.

I guess the issue has been resolved to the satisfaction of the manufacturer and dealer

Good Luck,

Rich

[Pathfinder]

Nah, it got locked for too much Arctic bashing and I think he got banned???

[Richs100]

Nah, it got locked for too much Arctic bashing and I think he got banned???

If true, that would be upsetting and unfortunate.

Guess I will just concentrate on reading Jim-the-Jim threads from here on out....

Seems safe enough.