Pad: Concrete Or Crushed Stone?

[karenb]

I just bought a Limelight Pulse. It's going to be delivered in a few weeks, so I need to either get a concrete, or crusted stone pad put in. Crushed stone is cheaper. Any thoughts on the quality of crushed stone vs. concrete? Also, the tub is 7'5" square, how big does the pad need to be?

[DK117]

consensus seems to be a 3 to 4 inch (or more) slab.

http://www.poolspaforum.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=20937

I'd like to see some additional details (feedback) on this myself. I've seen tubs on wooden decks, but the tub I'm looking at is nearly 4000 lbs with water, so I'm leaning towards a slab too.

DK117

[imnay]

We get a LOT of rain and wanted our spa elevated (plus we didn't know any better) so I built a deck. I used 4X4s for joists spaced only 12 inches apart and 2X4s for deck boards and I think it would easily hold most any weight you care to put on it.

Between your two choices I would go with crushed stone if it will allow drainage of water caused by heavy reain.

[ps558]

I just bought a Limelight Pulse. It's going to be delivered in a few weeks, so I need to either get a concrete, or crusted stone pad put in. Crushed stone is cheaper. Any thoughts on the quality of crushed stone vs. concrete? Also, the tub is 7'5" square, how big does the pad need to be?

Crushed stone is cheap yes, you better make sure it packed really tight. It is not a recommended surface for a spa. You can put spa pads on top of them, wal mart sells them cheap

http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=5301138

this way the wieght of a filled spa will be distributed even across the pads.

The concrete pad should be a 4 inches thick reinforced, dealer should have given you a pre delivery page from Limelight.

http://www.limelighthottubs.com/downloads/...nstructions.pdf

A wooden platform built like in the previous post will also work and also should be cheaper then concrete.

You make a investment in a costly product, don't skimp on the install

[bart6453]

I just bought a Limelight Pulse. It's going to be delivered in a few weeks, so I need to either get a concrete, or crusted stone pad put in. Crushed stone is cheaper. Any thoughts on the quality of crushed stone vs. concrete? Also, the tub is 7'5" square, how big does the pad need to be?

Go for the slab...concrete is only $120 a yard right now...so if you did a 10'x10'x6" you are looking at. .1.85 cubic yards....so $222 in concrete....add $50 for rebar(maybe) and another $25 for wood forms....and you are still under $300. You are gonna need the wood forms for the crushed rock anyways so thats a wash...and you should put crushed rock underneath the spa pads so thats also a wash. Your most cost effective solution is concrete for sure.....it is super easy and takes only a few hours to do. Remember.....it does not need to look pretty....your spa will be covering up the entire surface......just make sure it's level.

[DK117]

my intent isn't to hijack the thread, but to expand the discussion without creating a new topic. We're on concrete or crushed stone. However I'd like to add pavers to the conversation. All the pro's here claim an affinity for high end quality, endurance, and substance over cheap alternatives. That mentality would certainly lead me to believe everyone has pavers installed. But I'm guessing that's not really the case. Cement, which bows and cracks over time is $4 a sq foot. Pavers are $12 a sq foot (take a quick look at Rome for durability.) I've been getting some mild flack for looking at a Costco Evolution Mediterranean Spa, but the context is a 500 sq ft paver patio plus two pergolas and a few extras. Pavers will last longer and drain better. Anyone else going with pavers vs concrete?

DK117

[karenb]

I just bought a Limelight Pulse. It's going to be delivered in a few weeks, so I need to either get a concrete, or crusted stone pad put in. Crushed stone is cheaper. Any thoughts on the quality of crushed stone vs. concrete? Also, the tub is 7'5" square, how big does the pad need to be?

Go for the slab...concrete is only $120 a yard right now...so if you did a 10'x10'x6" you are looking at. .1.85 cubic yards....so $222 in concrete....add $50 for rebar(maybe) and another $25 for wood forms....and you are still under $300. You are gonna need the wood forms for the crushed rock anyways so thats a wash...and you should put crushed rock underneath the spa pads so thats also a wash. Your most cost effective solution is concrete for sure.....it is super easy and takes only a few hours to do. Remember.....it does not need to look pretty....your spa will be covering up the entire surface......just make sure it's level.

I am going to hire someone to do this for me. My contractor estimated $2500 to do the 10x10 concrete slab or $1200 for crushed stone. Are these estimates excessive? How much is reasonable (in Chester county, PA, in the Philly suburbs)?

[ilovesilverchair]

It's a shame you can't do it yourself. We just got some crushed stone to put under our concrete pad as well as to do a patio around it and it was only $133.00 for the crushed stone and the sand we need for the pavers as well. The concrete we did ourselves as well, borrowed a friends concrete mixer. It was about $250.00 for the concrete, our pad is 8 1/2 by 8 1/2. Definetly cheaper to do it yourself. I don't know anything about contractors doing it, but I would definetly get other estimates if you are going to go that route. Good luck!

[shovelhd]

Anyone else going with pavers vs concrete?

I have my Jacuzzi on a concrete paver patio. We put the patio in specifically for the hot tub. I'll post some pics this weekend.

[bart6453]

I just bought a Limelight Pulse. It's going to be delivered in a few weeks, so I need to either get a concrete, or crusted stone pad put in. Crushed stone is cheaper. Any thoughts on the quality of crushed stone vs. concrete? Also, the tub is 7'5" square, how big does the pad need to be?

Go for the slab...concrete is only $120 a yard right now...so if you did a 10'x10'x6" you are looking at. .1.85 cubic yards....so $222 in concrete....add $50 for rebar(maybe) and another $25 for wood forms....and you are still under $300. You are gonna need the wood forms for the crushed rock anyways so thats a wash...and you should put crushed rock underneath the spa pads so thats also a wash. Your most cost effective solution is concrete for sure.....it is super easy and takes only a few hours to do. Remember.....it does not need to look pretty....your spa will be covering up the entire surface......just make sure it's level.

I am going to hire someone to do this for me. My contractor estimated $2500 to do the 10x10 concrete slab or $1200 for crushed stone. Are these estimates excessive? How much is reasonable (in Chester county, PA, in the Philly suburbs)?

Oh Jeezus thats high. I had 20 yard of concreted poured for $5000 including a foundation for my garage. I would check with someone else....or seriously do it yourself...it is very easy...so easy that the concrete delivery driver may even give you a quick hand if it's on a Saturday(when it's mostly residential delivery)

[mikeyk36]

Hi ,

I just put down a 8x8 concrete pad myself. To do it all over again would have gone with crushed stone or brick in a heart beat! I have done smaller pads for deck stairs and such but first off don't make the mistake of thinking 8x8 4" pad is easy to put down. The key is you have to get it perfectly level because once it starts to cure, there is no turning back. A perfectly level pad although good for the stability of the tub, will not drain water off like your cement patio or sidewalk, so keep that in mind if planning on making the pad larger than the tub. Stone is easy, cheap, mistake proof and if formed correctly with something durable it will not shift and move once weight is placed on it. If crushed stone moved so much why is it recomended as a base under a 4 " concrete pad!? It's not permenant, it drains well, the advanteges go on and on. My parents have had their hot tub on crushed stone for 8 years, it's level and like new. Why did I go concrete, I let the majority opinion get the best of me I guess. Just my 2 cents.

[bart6453]

Hi ,

I just put down a 8x8 concrete pad myself. To do it all over again would have gone with crushed stone or brick in a heart beat! I have done smaller pads for deck stairs and such but first off don't make the mistake of thinking 8x8 4" pad is easy to put down. The key is you have to get it perfectly level because once it starts to cure, there is no turning back. A perfectly level pad although good for the stability of the tub, will not drain water off like your cement patio or sidewalk, so keep that in mind if planning on making the pad larger than the tub. Stone is easy, cheap, mistake proof and if formed correctly with something durable it will not shift and move once weight is placed on it. If crushed stone moved so much why is it recomended as a base under a 4 " concrete pad!? It's not permenant, it drains well, the advanteges go on and on. My parents have had their hot tub on crushed stone for 8 years, it's level and like new. Why did I go concrete, I let the majority opinion get the best of me I guess. Just my 2 cents.

You are correct on a couple of points, but they must be addressed in proper context.

there are a couple of things to keep in mind....if it's 90 degrees out, sunny and a hot wind is blowing....you are not working in amateur conditions...even the pros run into concrete curing too fast on days like that. Wait until it is overcast, and between 55 and 75.....with little wind...it will make the cure much slower and easier to work.

The level issue is of debate. If you are only putting your tub on a slab with nothing really around it....level is fine....but if you have a patio connected or simply don't want water standing around the tub....drop it about 1/2" in 10 feet. (this is what I have on my pad, my wife wanted her plants to be watered a lot, so the slab runs to the garden) This is much less than what is required for run off but definitely will work for a spa pad (i.e. if it was a patio connected to your house you would have problems in heavy rain) So...to acheive that drop...just drop one side of the slab 1/2" compared to the opposite side.

The reason for a compacted base for concrete is mainly to stop erosion from water running underneath the slab...dirt would be washed out...1/2" crushed rock is kind of gonna stay there with no erosion. So that equation really does not work.

Keep in mind that any project taken on without proper planning or basic education will quickly become a very frustrating project. Ever tried to bake a cake without the recipe?

[shovelhd]

Here are some shots of my Jacuzzi J345 on my concrete paver patio. The tub was in it's cleaning cycle when I took the shots. The water is 6 weeks old.

[bart6453]

Here are some shots of my Jacuzzi J345 on my concrete paver patio. The tub was in it's cleaning cycle when I took the shots. The water is 6 weeks old.

Nicely executed.....looks great!

[mikeyk36]

Nice tub and Patio! Did you put down the patio yourself?

[DK117]

Here are some shots of my Jacuzzi J345 on my concrete paver patio. The tub was in it's cleaning cycle when I took the shots. The water is 6 weeks old.

That looks fantastic, you may have just pushed me over the edge on pavers, they are a bit expensive, but worth it! Did you install yourself or have someone else install?

DK117

[shovelhd]

That looks fantastic, you may have just pushed me over the edge on pavers, they are a bit expensive, but worth it! Did you install yourself or have someone else install?

DK117

I paid a bricklayer to have them installed. I was going to do it myself, but he made me a deal I couldn't refuse. I did all of the stone dust after he laid the pavers.

[DK117]

That looks fantastic, you may have just pushed me over the edge on pavers, they are a bit expensive, but worth it! Did you install yourself or have someone else install?

DK117

I paid a bricklayer to have them installed. I was going to do it myself, but he made me a deal I couldn't refuse. I did all of the stone dust after he laid the pavers.

I just received a quote for $12 a sq foot for top of the line pavers, plus $1000 site prep. I know this is a quality installer, but this sounds high. I've got a little over 700 sq feet. Now I've seen people spending 10K plus on tubs, but now I'm looking at 10K for the patio. Anyone else have paver bids they want to share?

DK117

[d1dennis2009]

I'm partial to concrete slab, they are a little more likely to remain even over time. The pavers definitely look awsome and if the ground is stable they should be fine, but I have heard horror stories before. One other option is to build a pad for the spa and install some of detailed pavers to finish area around the spa.

Just a thought.

[poptones]

I just received a quote for $12 a sq foot for top of the line pavers, plus $1000 site prep. I know this is a quality installer, but this sounds high. I've got a little over 700 sq feet. Now I've seen people spending 10K plus on tubs, but now I'm looking at 10K for the patio. Anyone else have paver bids they want to share?

Go look on ebay; USED pavers that have to be cleaned (and picked up) are going for a dollar or more each. With a brick sized paver that's like 5-6 bucks a sf... 3500 to 4200 bucks for that 700sf.

I'm dealing with the same issue because I want a paver driveway. Now I'm wishing I had loaded up all those old bricks when the old house burned down!

Look at it like this: it's a better investment than new carpet. How long will new carpet last compared to a well made patio? I spent 2500 on my 600sf (wooden) deck (my brother is a carpenter and did the work with his boys) and I'm dead certain it was worth every penny!

[shovelhd]

I just received a quote for $12 a sq foot for top of the line pavers, plus $1000 site prep. I know this is a quality installer, but this sounds high. I've got a little over 700 sq feet. Now I've seen people spending 10K plus on tubs, but now I'm looking at 10K for the patio. Anyone else have paver bids they want to share?

DK117

I bought the pavers myself from a local wholesaler and brought them to the site in my truck. That saved a lot by itself. The site prep was done by a local landscaper, which included raising and leveling off the area around the patio, digging down a foot and adding crushed stone and a thick layer of compacted stone dust. He also dug the footing holes for the small deck. I think I paid about $1500 for the prep and the same for the bricklayer, somewhere around $4K total for everything including the deck material, which I did myself. The patio size is around 13x24, so your quote of $12/ft. is good.

It is true that if you are going to do pavers, you have to do them right. Spend the money on the proper prep work, or down the road, it is going to look awful.

[Warp9]

I'll add another positive experience with pavers. Here's the thread where I first installed the patio. There's a link to photos there.

We did the concrete paver patio last year. This year we got the tub. We've had it for about a month and a half. The pavers are doing just fine. I probably have about $500 in the materials for this 10x12 paver patio. My wife and I did all the labor ourselves. It was the first time we'd done a project like that, and I'd say that we had about 45 hours of work between the two of us.

The tub is 7.5x7.5, I'm glad I didn't go any smaller than 10x12 with the pavers. I'm also much happier with the look of the concrete pavers than I would be with a concrete pad.

I guess it will probably be a few years before I really know if the pavers will hold up. But they've been through one hard North Dakota winter already, and have now had the filled spa for 45 days or so. No settling/shifing yet. I'm very happy with the result so far.

-- Greg

[Pipeliner542]

I have installed pavers for driveways in the northeast of pa that have been down for 14 years now. Lots of freeze thaw cycles. no problems if prepped the right way. I'll try to post some pics of my deck with pavers off the side. tub is on crushed stone for drainage reasons been there three years less than .1 degree out of level just compact the base and stone and foget about it.

I'll add another positive experience with pavers. Here's the thread where I first installed the patio. There's a link to photos there.

We did the concrete paver patio last year. This year we got the tub. We've had it for about a month and a half. The pavers are doing just fine. I probably have about $500 in the materials for this 10x12 paver patio. My wife and I did all the labor ourselves. It was the first time we'd done a project like that, and I'd say that we had about 45 hours of work between the two of us.

The tub is 7.5x7.5, I'm glad I didn't go any smaller than 10x12 with the pavers. I'm also much happier with the look of the concrete pavers than I would be with a concrete pad.

I guess it will probably be a few years before I really know if the pavers will hold up. But they've been through one hard North Dakota winter already, and have now had the filled spa for 45 days or so. No settling/shifing yet. I'm very happy with the result so far.

-- Greg

[DK117]

I've been following this thread too http://www.poolspaforum.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=21399 on tub cost / pricing policy.

Total project cost is huge. Personally I'm leaning towards a Costco tub. However for this thread, tonight I just received my second quote at $12 a sq ft for a paver patio, final bid was for 660 sq feet. But I'm also getting a pergola, an herb garden, a gas fire pit w/fire glass and lava rock. New furniture, outdoor lighting, propane heater, hot tub, chemicals, steps, cover lifter, electrical ... I think that's about it. So here I am on the brink of a decision .... I can't comprehend those of you spending 8 to 10K on a tub (US.) But I'm looking at 18K for a total patio makeover. I'm confident the price is fair, the question is, do I want to spend that much? I'm not looking at ROI, I'm seeking advise from this board, how much is your total backyard/hot tub experience worth to you? Mine is priceless without a tub and hardscape, will the upgrade be worth it?

DK117

[blue1234]

I just bought a Limelight Pulse. It's going to be delivered in a few weeks, so I need to either get a concrete, or crusted stone pad put in. Crushed stone is cheaper. Any thoughts on the quality of crushed stone vs. concrete? Also, the tub is 7'5" square, how big does the pad need to be?

We just got our Limelight Flair. We decided to go with concrete pad with concrete walkway connecting the pad to our existing patio. Our tub is 7' x 7' and we went with 11' x 9' pad. It cost us $800.