New NW tub owner Posted April 30, 2007 Report Share Posted April 30, 2007 Some of the 'regulars' (who I assume are dealers or connected with the hot tub business in some way) repeatedly call the discount Costco hot tubs 'cheapy' hot tubs and extoll the quality of the hot tubs sold at dealers. I bought a Costco Platinum Elite II hot tub last year so I have had some time to get to know it and have been very happy with it. I was recently in a hot tub store that was a Jacuzzi dealer (to buy water test stuff) and I spent some time looking at one of the very high-end floor models with a clear plastic panel on the pump compartment to show its guts. Naturally, I gave it a close inspection to see if maybe I should be looking to 'trade-up' from my 'cheapy' hot tub to one that is allegedly 'non-cheapy' but I couldn't see what I was supposed to be getting. The components, construction methods, pumps, shell, features, etc look very similar. So come on, all you hot tub experts. What exactly are the differences in design, quality, features, between my PE2 tub and the much more expensive tubs in dealers? One thing I could see was that the Jacuzzi tub that I was looking at had a very elaborate lighting setup with little rows of lights as well as two led lights in the tub while my tub only has one color-changing led light so that would be an extra feature but I'm sure there is a substantial extra cost for that as well. One other thing. If the Costco hot tubs are as bad as some of you claim, then why aren't there any used ones for sale by people looking to dump them and trade up? There are a LOT of used hot tubs for sale on Craig's list from all of the major manufacturer's but I didn't see a single listing for a Costco PE1 or PE2. I can see why there wouldn't be any of the new Costco Legend Elite models up for sale used but if the PE1 or PE2 were really dogs, I'd think there would be at least a couple up for sale somewhere by trade-uppers since Costco has to have sold thousands of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trigger Posted April 30, 2007 Report Share Posted April 30, 2007 One other thing. If the Costco hot tubs are as bad as some of you claim, then why aren't there any used ones for sale by people looking to dump them and trade up? There are a LOT of used hot tubs for sale on Craig's list from all of the major manufacturer's but I didn't see a single listing for a Costco PE1 or PE2. I can see why there wouldn't be any of the new Costco Legend Elite models up for sale used but if the PE1 or PE2 were really dogs, I'd think there would be at least a couple up for sale somewhere by trade-uppers since Costco has to have sold thousands of them. Wouldn't they just return them to Costco, rather than try and sell them? isn't that the whole deal with buying costco? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
104 Degrees Posted April 30, 2007 Report Share Posted April 30, 2007 Some of the 'regulars' (who I assume are dealers or connected with the hot tub business in some way) repeatedly call the discount Costco hot tubs 'cheapy' hot tubs and extoll the quality of the hot tubs sold at dealers. I bought a Costco Platinum Elite II hot tub last year so I have had some time to get to know it and have been very happy with it. I was recently in a hot tub store that was a Jacuzzi dealer (to buy water test stuff) and I spent some time looking at one of the very high-end floor models with a clear plastic panel on the pump compartment to show its guts. Naturally, I gave it a close inspection to see if maybe I should be looking to 'trade-up' from my 'cheapy' hot tub to one that is allegedly 'non-cheapy' but I couldn't see what I was supposed to be getting. The components, construction methods, pumps, shell, features, etc look very similar. So come on, all you hot tub experts. What exactly are the differences in design, quality, features, between my PE2 tub and the much more expensive tubs in dealers? One thing I could see was that the Jacuzzi tub that I was looking at had a very elaborate lighting setup with little rows of lights as well as two led lights in the tub while my tub only has one color-changing led light so that would be an extra feature but I'm sure there is a substantial extra cost for that as well. One other thing. If the Costco hot tubs are as bad as some of you claim, then why aren't there any used ones for sale by people looking to dump them and trade up? There are a LOT of used hot tubs for sale on Craig's list from all of the major manufacturer's but I didn't see a single listing for a Costco PE1 or PE2. I can see why there wouldn't be any of the new Costco Legend Elite models up for sale used but if the PE1 or PE2 were really dogs, I'd think there would be at least a couple up for sale somewhere by trade-uppers since Costco has to have sold thousands of them. My dealer tried to sell "hydro-spa" all three floor modles leaked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ieremia Posted April 30, 2007 Report Share Posted April 30, 2007 OP, I have wondered the same thing. With all due respect to the guys in the spa industry, I think the major difference is the overhead. Costco can buy thousands of spas at a fraction of the price, doesn't spend a lot on marketing them, has tons of space to store/display them and most likely has a really small markup. Now, having said all of that, I do see where the value comes from in buying from an actual spa shop. You get the knowledge of the experienced staff and the comfort in knowing that you have a place to call/go to when you have problems or need help. That isn't to say that you couldn't go to them after buying your Costco spa but I'm sure there is a slight difference in the level of service you're going to get since you didn't buy from them to start with. If I wasn't able to find the spa we love at a price we could afford from a reputable spa shop, we would have most likely gone with the Costco model, but so far I am happy with my decision. Btw, I think the Costco spas are beautiful and have some really nice features to them! Regards, Brian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Posted April 30, 2007 Report Share Posted April 30, 2007 Some of the 'regulars' (who I assume are dealers or connected with the hot tub business in some way) repeatedly call the discount Costco hot tubs 'cheapy' hot tubs and extoll the quality of the hot tubs sold at dealers. I bought a Costco Platinum Elite II hot tub last year so I have had some time to get to know it and have been very happy with it. I was recently in a hot tub store that was a Jacuzzi dealer (to buy water test stuff) and I spent some time looking at one of the very high-end floor models with a clear plastic panel on the pump compartment to show its guts. Naturally, I gave it a close inspection to see if maybe I should be looking to 'trade-up' from my 'cheapy' hot tub to one that is allegedly 'non-cheapy' but I couldn't see what I was supposed to be getting. The components, construction methods, pumps, shell, features, etc look very similar. So come on, all you hot tub experts. What exactly are the differences in design, quality, features, between my PE2 tub and the much more expensive tubs in dealers? One thing I could see was that the Jacuzzi tub that I was looking at had a very elaborate lighting setup with little rows of lights as well as two led lights in the tub while my tub only has one color-changing led light so that would be an extra feature but I'm sure there is a substantial extra cost for that as well. One other thing. If the Costco hot tubs are as bad as some of you claim, then why aren't there any used ones for sale by people looking to dump them and trade up? There are a LOT of used hot tubs for sale on Craig's list from all of the major manufacturer's but I didn't see a single listing for a Costco PE1 or PE2. I can see why there wouldn't be any of the new Costco Legend Elite models up for sale used but if the PE1 or PE2 were really dogs, I'd think there would be at least a couple up for sale somewhere by trade-uppers since Costco has to have sold thousands of them. Any one who thinks the same components are used in the Costco tubs as in the higher end tubs is kidding themselfs and themselfs only. A tub that last's for 6-10 years is different than a tub that lasts for 15-20 years. Pretty simple. I am not a dealer nor do I sell any brand. I own a 4000 dollar tub and have service or seen and sat in hundreds of 8000 dollar tubs, there is a difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spatech (the unreal one) Posted April 30, 2007 Report Share Posted April 30, 2007 OP, I have wondered the same thing. With all due respect to the guys in the spa industry, I think the major difference is the overhead. Costco can buy thousands of spas at a fraction of the price, doesn't spend a lot on marketing them, has tons of space to store/display them and most likely has a really small markup. I would agree buying that spa from Costco saves money over buying that same spa from a Hydrospa dealer so yes, there is a savings based on less overhead. You loose some by not having a dealer but we've covered that to the nth degree. I'd say a big part of all this discussion is many of us are not exactly blown away with Hydro's product quality so while you may be getting a discount price versus buying it from a Hydro dealer we may feel it's only a so-so spa (without the dealer service but with the Costco return policy). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightRyder Posted April 30, 2007 Report Share Posted April 30, 2007 Wouldn't they just return them to Costco, rather than try and sell them? isn't that the whole deal with buying costco? It's a nice option to have but I'm sure if Costco were getting any substantial returns they would already have discontinued their relationship with Hydro-Spa. NightRyder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Posted April 30, 2007 Report Share Posted April 30, 2007 It's a nice option to have but I'm sure if Costco were getting any substantial returns they would already have discontinued their relationship with Hydro-Spa. NightRyder How long has Costco been selling Hydro units? Have we reached the 5 year mark yet? I'm sorry but when I reccomend a value tub I fully expect it to last 10 years with very little trouble. I have reccomended several brands that I feel will make the 10 year mark with one sitting in my yard that has reached the 6 year mark. Will these Hydro units make it to 10? Can anyone answer this million dollar question? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightRyder Posted April 30, 2007 Report Share Posted April 30, 2007 How long has Costco been selling Hydro units? Have we reached the 5 year mark yet? I'm sorry but when I reccomend a value tub I fully expect it to last 10 years with very little trouble. I have reccomended several brands that I feel will make the 10 year mark with one sitting in my yard that has reached the 6 year mark. Will these Hydro units make it to 10? Can anyone answer this million dollar question? Obviously, no one can say one way or the other. My PE I is 2 1/2 years old and doing fine. What will it be doing in 7 1/2 years, I don't know. I've been trying to figure out exactly what about my spa would make it not last...Is it the shell? Doesn't look any different from my neighbors Marquis as far as thickness and finish goes. Is it my Waterway Pumps and jets? My ABS Base? The treated wood frame? My 56 frame motors? My Hydro-Quip control pak? My manifold plumbing? With the exception of the shell, everything about the spa is standard replaceable off the shelf parts. I'm not saying my spa is the equivalent of a Marquis or Hot Springs but for $3400 I'm quite happy with it. Having said all that, would I buy the new PE III for over $5K? Probably not, I can get a $9K Marquis at the yearly factory clearance for that kind of $. NightRyder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flibotte Posted April 30, 2007 Report Share Posted April 30, 2007 I would say quality of insulation would be the biggest difference. There have been plenty of posts here where people complained of very high electical costs and lots of posts about adding insulation to these tubs. Haven't seen a single post about someone with one of the higher end tubs looking to upgrade insulation. I'm sure that some of the savings are due to less markup but not all of it. I'm sure corners were cut. I agree with the other poster, I liked these tubs at $3,500 Not at $5K. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soakerman Posted May 1, 2007 Report Share Posted May 1, 2007 How long has Costco been selling Hydro units? Have we reached the 5 year mark yet? I'm sorry but when I reccomend a value tub I fully expect it to last 10 years with very little trouble. I have reccomended several brands that I feel will make the 10 year mark with one sitting in my yard that has reached the 6 year mark. Will these Hydro units make it to 10? Can anyone answer this million dollar question? It is only a $3500.00 dollar question. and I am not convinced that the corners where cut other then a dealer markup. Mines is now one year old without a single glitch and no dreaded huge winter electric bills as many naysayers here said I would get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Solo Posted May 1, 2007 Report Share Posted May 1, 2007 THis would qualify as a "cheapy hot tub". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmendoza17 Posted May 1, 2007 Report Share Posted May 1, 2007 Some of the 'regulars' (who I assume are dealers or connected with the hot tub business in some way) repeatedly call the discount Costco hot tubs 'cheapy' hot tubs and extoll the quality of the hot tubs sold at dealers. I bought a Costco Platinum Elite II hot tub last year so I have had some time to get to know it and have been very happy with it. I was recently in a hot tub store that was a Jacuzzi dealer (to buy water test stuff) and I spent some time looking at one of the very high-end floor models with a clear plastic panel on the pump compartment to show its guts. Naturally, I gave it a close inspection to see if maybe I should be looking to 'trade-up' from my 'cheapy' hot tub to one that is allegedly 'non-cheapy' but I couldn't see what I was supposed to be getting. The components, construction methods, pumps, shell, features, etc look very similar. So come on, all you hot tub experts. What exactly are the differences in design, quality, features, between my PE2 tub and the much more expensive tubs in dealers? One thing I could see was that the Jacuzzi tub that I was looking at had a very elaborate lighting setup with little rows of lights as well as two led lights in the tub while my tub only has one color-changing led light so that would be an extra feature but I'm sure there is a substantial extra cost for that as well. One other thing. If the Costco hot tubs are as bad as some of you claim, then why aren't there any used ones for sale by people looking to dump them and trade up? There are a LOT of used hot tubs for sale on Craig's list from all of the major manufacturer's but I didn't see a single listing for a Costco PE1 or PE2. I can see why there wouldn't be any of the new Costco Legend Elite models up for sale used but if the PE1 or PE2 were really dogs, I'd think there would be at least a couple up for sale somewhere by trade-uppers since Costco has to have sold thousands of them. Just for the record, the unit would be listed for sale as a Hydrospa Platinum Elite. Costco sells them, they do not brand or name them. I guess some people just cannot stand having the Hydrospa-Costco threads die a timely and merciful death, because I have not seen any recent references of dealers-- or anyone else- calling Costco's tubs "Cheapy." What I have seen are posts from a cross-section of reasonably knowledgeable spa people legitimately question the quality of Hydrospa's products, and intelligently challenge assertions by a rabid band of Costco owners who seem intent on hyping the product even though it lacks proven historical performance. Personally, I am the underwhelmed owner of a nearly one-year old $5000 Costco-distributed Hydrospa PEII. For the money, its OK and no more. After starting off with a terrible ownership experience and crappy customer service, I cannot give the product great marks. It has indeed worked well for the past few months, but isn't that what new products are supposed to do. Even now, I am concerned over the looseness of a few of the jet heads and the thing is really an energy hog, consuming an excessive amount of energy. So, I'll save my Kudos until its at least a few years old. All in all, for $5K it isn't all that great. Another $2000 and I could have had a brand name tub that has a demonstrated history of low-cost energy usage. Furthermore, with the price tag on that new Costco Hydrospa model now closer to $6,000, I would think long and hard about buying a subpar brand when another $1500 will get you into brand product lines that have proven their value over time. Frankly, its easier to see the logic of someone who buys a $3,000 tub from Sam's or WalMart. At least they really get cheap tubs. For that matter, if the person who started this thread can't see a difference between the Jacuzzi and Hydrospa components, why would there be any difference between the components in Hydrospa and those in a Members Mark (Sams) or Keys Backyard (WalMart) unit. I guess by that logic, the Costco Hydrospa tub is overpriced by $3,000. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim_The_Jim Posted May 1, 2007 Report Share Posted May 1, 2007 Some of the 'regulars' (who I assume are dealers or connected with the hot tub business in some way) repeatedly call the discount Costco hot tubs 'cheapy' hot tubs and extoll the quality of the hot tubs sold at dealers. I bought a Costco Platinum Elite II hot tub last year so I have had some time to get to know it and have been very happy with it. I was recently in a hot tub store that was a Jacuzzi dealer (to buy water test stuff) and I spent some time looking at one of the very high-end floor models with a clear plastic panel on the pump compartment to show its guts. Naturally, I gave it a close inspection to see if maybe I should be looking to 'trade-up' from my 'cheapy' hot tub to one that is allegedly 'non-cheapy' but I couldn't see what I was supposed to be getting. The components, construction methods, pumps, shell, features, etc look very similar. So come on, all you hot tub experts. What exactly are the differences in design, quality, features, between my PE2 tub and the much more expensive tubs in dealers? One thing I could see was that the Jacuzzi tub that I was looking at had a very elaborate lighting setup with little rows of lights as well as two led lights in the tub while my tub only has one color-changing led light so that would be an extra feature but I'm sure there is a substantial extra cost for that as well. One other thing. If the Costco hot tubs are as bad as some of you claim, then why aren't there any used ones for sale by people looking to dump them and trade up? There are a LOT of used hot tubs for sale on Craig's list from all of the major manufacturer's but I didn't see a single listing for a Costco PE1 or PE2. I can see why there wouldn't be any of the new Costco Legend Elite models up for sale used but if the PE1 or PE2 were really dogs, I'd think there would be at least a couple up for sale somewhere by trade-uppers since Costco has to have sold thousands of them. Very good eyes! Go look at Hot Spring, you will see even less inside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Posted May 1, 2007 Report Share Posted May 1, 2007 Very good eyes! Go look at Hot Spring, you will see even less inside. Jim charges 23,000 dollars for his tubs and they have the same components as your Costco tub also. I like this logic Jim, He says there is no difference that he can see between the components in the Jaccuzi he looked at and his Costco tub, yet the components you use are closer to the same as the costco units made by Hydro. The analogy that they're the same is ludacrist. The analogy that they are overpriced at 5 grand because they should be priced at 3 is closer. Until I see or hear of a 5-6-7 year old one I am not going to say these units are a good value. The Hydro units in this area at this point are not making it past 5-6 But manufacturing practices change all the time and they may be better now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaRiSpaTech Posted May 1, 2007 Report Share Posted May 1, 2007 Hydro uses average components but they use unskilled labor to assemble the tubs. During the short time that I sold hydro, the first thing I would do before delivering a tub would be to remove all of the cabinet panels. Then I would replace any kinked hoses or even attach hoses that where not connected to the jets at all (so much for fill testing). I would then rewrap the cabinet with the single layer of heating/AC duct wrap insulation that came with the tub. Many times the foil insulation would not be cut wide enough to reach from top to bottom, so I would add a strip of my own. I am a smaller dealer, so I could do this for every spa that I sold. I know it sounds like a ridiculous process, but I really enjoy working on spas and was trying to build a good reputation in my area. I would find at least 1 kinked (bent) hose for every 5 spas that I sold. Eventually I smartened up and started carrying better constructed spas. Hydrospa is an alternative to more costly units if you can repair them yourself and you add extra insulation. The insulation method they use is not energy efficient because it is too thin and has way too many air leaks in the cabinet space. It might work better if it was sealed on the top and bottom of the cabinet panels to stop infiltration of cold air. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flibotte Posted May 1, 2007 Report Share Posted May 1, 2007 As one of the evil "naysayers" I think it's time we (all the other "naysayers") come clean and just admit that these tubs are just as good as more expensive tubs. These lies have gone on long enough. All the posts that we made up about the tubs having poor insulation, questionable construction, unknown longevity are obviously not working. Our plan to team up will all the hot tub owners who are furious that they paid thousands more for their tub and now have buyers remorse also has backfired. It's time we just face the fact that Hydro has revolutionized the way tubs will be made in the future, making tubs that are of the exact same quality for thousands less then the ones we all sell from the mother ship. I plan to discuss this at the next secret meeting (if I can remember the secret knock). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
New NW tub owner Posted May 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted May 1, 2007 Any one who thinks the same components are used in the Costco tubs as in the higher end tubs is kidding themselfs and themselfs only. A tub that last's for 6-10 years is different than a tub that lasts for 15-20 years. Pretty simple. I am not a dealer nor do I sell any brand. I own a 4000 dollar tub and have service or seen and sat in hundreds of 8000 dollar tubs, there is a difference. So Roger, I think you've said that you repair hot tubs for a living so I'd expect that you have some insights into hot tub components, design, quality, features, etc. What would I get if I sell my PE2 and 'trade-up' to some other tub that is allegedly better quality? Exactly what? You seem to be suggesting above that the more expensive tub will last longer. I cannot see any of the components on my tub that might have a shorter life expectancy than the 'high end' tub. The piping and tubing looks to be the same. The pumps and motors seem to be the same. The shell actually seems to be better (still looks brand new on my tub). The cabinet and panels seem about the same. The controller seems to be t about the same. What exactly is it that will wear out and fail prematurely leading me to ruefully contemplate my allegedly poor choice of a 'cheapy' tub? Or what feature is it on the 'high end' tub that my 'cheapy' tub is sadly lacking? (The PE1/PE2 lounging seat is especially awesome if you want to start a family but seems to have been sadly dropped from the new Legend model...unlikely that that little 'feature' would have been discovered in a 'wet test' in the showroom though). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spatech (the unreal one) Posted May 1, 2007 Report Share Posted May 1, 2007 So Roger, I think you've said that you repair hot tubs for a living so I'd expect that you have some insights into hot tub components, design, quality, features, etc. What would I get if I sell my PE2 and 'trade-up' to some other tub that is allegedly better quality? Exactly what? You seem to be suggesting above that the more expensive tub will last longer. I cannot see any of the components on my tub that might have a shorter life expectancy than the 'high end' tub. The piping and tubing looks to be the same. The pumps and motors seem to be the same. The shell actually seems to be better (still looks brand new on my tub). The cabinet and panels seem about the same. The controller seems to be t about the same. What exactly is it that will wear out and fail prematurely leading me to ruefully contemplate my allegedly poor choice of a 'cheapy' tub? Or what feature is it on the 'high end' tub that my 'cheapy' tub is sadly lacking? (The PE1/PE2 lounging seat is especially awesome if you want to start a family but seems to have been sadly dropped from the new Legend model...unlikely that that little 'feature' would have been discovered in a 'wet test' in the showroom though). New NW, Why exactly did you restart this topic that we've previously learned leads to nowhere? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soakerman Posted May 1, 2007 Report Share Posted May 1, 2007 We are awaiting Rogers reply....................................................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spatech (the unreal one) Posted May 1, 2007 Report Share Posted May 1, 2007 We are awaiting Rogers reply....................................................... Is his opinion or anyone else's with the spa experience even relevant to you? I think you're only awaiting his response so you can summarily disregard it and claim he's biased. He gives his opinion based on the various spas he has seen in his repair business where he takes them apart and repairs them. You have your opinion based on the spa in your back yard and based on looking at a few at dealers. I doubt any dialogue between you two will lead to any meaningful revelations. This thread should be killed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightRyder Posted May 1, 2007 Report Share Posted May 1, 2007 Is his opinion or anyone else's with the spa experience even relevant to you? I think you're only awaiting his response so you can summarily disregard it and claim he's biased. He gives his opinion based on the various spas he has seen in his repair business where he takes them apart and repairs them. You have your opinion based on the spa in your back yard and based on looking at a few at dealers. I doubt any dialogue between you two will lead to any meaningful revelations. This thread should be killed. Let's see, you want a thread killed because the topic annoys you, but you continue to keep it alive by reading and posting in it; including responding to a post not directed at you Yeah.......OK NightRyder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmendoza17 Posted May 1, 2007 Report Share Posted May 1, 2007 New NW, Why exactly did you restart this topic that we've previously learned leads to nowhere? Not sure why NW posted the topic, but he is avoiding the dead-on argument that if, by his logic, PE2 is better value than many name brand tubs, then WalMart and SamsClub tubs are a better value than PE2. His rejection of this argument will bring us back to the more logical conclusion that, ultimately, you get what you pay for. NW hoist by --or with-- his own petard. A lovely sight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spatech (the unreal one) Posted May 1, 2007 Report Share Posted May 1, 2007 including responding to a post not directed at you Yeah.......OK NightRyder I've never been one to wait for someone to ask for my opinion. If I have one and feel like expressing it I will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightRyder Posted May 1, 2007 Report Share Posted May 1, 2007 Let's see, you want a thread killed because the topic annoys you, but you continue to keep it alive by reading and posting in it; including responding to a post not directed at you blink.gif Yeah.......OK I've never been one to wait for someone to ask for my opinion. If I have one and feel like expressing it I will. All fine and good but it's a damn funny way to kill a thread or make it go away.......... That's what I like about this place, always good for a laugh, plus the insight into the mindset of those in the industry is always enlightening. NightRyder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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