rmcderm313 Posted December 31, 2020 Report Share Posted December 31, 2020 Hi All, I'm nearing the point where I turn this tub into a planter. I went out to test the water for NYE festivities, and while the temp was set to 89, the actual temp was 84. The 24 HR circulation pump was running strong. I removed the control panel cover and opened the spa-pac and I could visibly see one of the connections to the heater sizzling/arcing. I shut down the GFCI immediately and took these pictures. I can't be sure how long this was happening but I haven't opened the cover in 2 days. It may have been going on for a while. This is a Thermospa -Manhattan (not sure that matters), with a balboa board and heater. I'm assuming the board has been ruined, but can someone give me a better sense of what might have been damaged? I actually have a spare board that came with the tub. Any thoughts as to a cause? I've been running this heater for a few months now with no issues at all. I don't see any water damage on the board and everything is dry under the tub. Does the heater need to be replaced? How do I check on the heater's state. I'm so frustrated right now. I need to settle down and think clearly. It doesn't help that here in MA we are approaching deep freeze weather so I need to fish or cut bait with this repair, else risk the water freezing. No such thing as a 'free' hot tub. And I just got the bleach/dichlor method down perfect. Thanks, Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmcderm313 Posted December 31, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 31, 2020 Also if anyone might have a place where I could find a Balboa 55690 heater replacement or equivalent that would be greatly appreciated as well. Balboa Direct has them back ordered and I cannot find a reference for a replacement part. Where I'm fearful of freezing temps, would it be better to disconnect the heater and turn the tub back on? Would circulation be better at this point? Thanks, Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmcderm313 Posted December 31, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 31, 2020 Just adding a few additional close-up and possibly relevant pictures in case anyone gets to take a look. Thanks. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDspaguy Posted December 31, 2020 Report Share Posted December 31, 2020 Please tell me that spa is properly wired on a gfci breaker... Your heater looks shot before it burned up. I suspect you had a loose connection heat up at the heater. Replace the board, heater element, and connector. Be sure you do not twist the terminal stud on the new heater and that the element does not touch the tube. An electronics repair guy may be able to fix that board. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted December 31, 2020 Report Share Posted December 31, 2020 That's to bad I was rooting for you. You have come a long way. Yes a good electronics repair guy should be able to piece it back together for you...maybe. Place a small space heater inside to keep it from freezing until you can figure out a plan of attack. Pull the board (take pics of every connection on the board before removing so you can get it back together) and take a few pics of the back side where the damage is and I will tell you what is possible and what is not with repairing that board. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmcderm313 Posted December 31, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 31, 2020 Thanks @RDspaguy, I do have the spa hooked to a properly wired GFCI. It didn't trip though. It should have right? What makes you say that the heater looks shot? Before this incident I thought it looked pretty clean. Are you seeing something that meant is was going? I will be replacing the elements you suggest. Do you know of a good resource to help find an equivalent heater for this Balboa 55690? I'm hoping they make a newer more available model as a replacement. Only Balboa Direct references that part number and they have it as back ordered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmcderm313 Posted December 31, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 31, 2020 Thanks @CanadianSpaTech, I appreciate the encouragement. I'm too far down the path to give up now. And I do have an extra board that came with the tub, so it's just the heater and the connectors. I will take pictures of the old board and post them anyway as apparently having a spare of everything for a spa is a good idea. Good tip on the space heater. Luckily the weather for the next few days is supposed to be in the 40's so I have a little time. I am concerned about finding a replacement heater quickly though. Any sources you might recommend would be appreciated. Thanks, Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDspaguy Posted January 1, 2021 Report Share Posted January 1, 2021 8 hours ago, rmcderm313 said: didn't trip though. It should have right? Not necessarily. It depends on the cause of this issue. 8 hours ago, rmcderm313 said: Are you seeing something Just the corrosion on the other terminal. Spadepot.com. They make a titanium version that I do recommend. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted January 1, 2021 Report Share Posted January 1, 2021 The replacement should be a standard/universal offset heater element 5.5 KW or 4 KW. Will say KW rating on heater tube. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmcderm313 Posted January 1, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 1, 2021 Thanks @RDspaguyand @CanadianSpaTech. Just so I'm clear, are you guys recommending I replace the 'whole' heater (tube and all), or just replace the element inside? Thanks, Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted January 1, 2021 Report Share Posted January 1, 2021 Just the element 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDspaguy Posted January 1, 2021 Report Share Posted January 1, 2021 Definitely the element. Just be careful on the install that the element does not contact the side of the tube. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmcderm313 Posted January 2, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2021 Thanks guys. On the advice about not letting the element hit the sides, is that difficult to achieve? It looks like the bolts that go through the manifold would hold the element in only one position. Just trying to prepare myself for the repair. Would you guys recommend the copper tabs to connect the heater to the board or the jumper wires? Do either have an advantage? Any other tips and tricks for this repair are appreciated. I can’t thank you guys enough for the guidance and assistance. Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted January 2, 2021 Report Share Posted January 2, 2021 10 minutes ago, rmcderm313 said: On the advice about not letting the element hit the sides, is that difficult to achieve? Remove the one sensor from the heater tube. It will make getting the old one out and the new one in. Don't overtighten the plastic sensor nut when you put it back in. Just stick your finger inside the tube and hold the element in the middle as you tighten the 2 large nuts. I will normally tighten the farthest from your finger inside the tube first then the other one. There are 2 o-rings on the heater element that will press up against the heater tube on the inside when you tighten it. Make sure they don't fall off when you insert the new heater. Once you have everything tightened look down the tube and make sure the element is not touching the tube. Copper tabs are what it came with I would continue using them so don't forget to order if the other board doesn't have them attached. Again when tightening the 3/8" nuts to the heater element don't forget to hold the nut that will be below the copper tabs on the heater element with a wrench. If it twists the cold weld will break and the heater will be ruined. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmcderm313 Posted January 2, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2021 Awesome. Thank you. I got the damaged board out this morning and I'll start draining the tub when I know the heater element is on it's way. Here are some pictures of the back of the damaged board. There is actually still connectivity between the heater relay and the spade tab connector on the damaged connection (tested with a meter), so hopefully the board can be salvaged. I've seen videos where this connection can be jumpered from that extra tab if the connection is destroyed like mine is, using those jumper wires I asked about. I wouldn't trust it the way it is but hopefully an electronics shop can make it reliable again. Thanks once again. I'll keep you posted on my progress. Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmcderm313 Posted January 5, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 5, 2021 Heater element is on it's way. It's supposed to be here on Friday. When I install the new heating element in the manifold, should I use any type of sealant on the o-rings on the part of the element that passes through the manifold? Given that this was probably caused by this heater connection becoming loose and building resistance and therefore heat (I can't think of any other reason it would have happened), should I use some kind of threadlock on the nuts to prevent it from occurring again? This question applies to both the connection to the element and to the circuit board. I do see torque specs for the nuts on the heater (I'll be careful to hold the small nut underneath to avoid twisting), but no mention of the specs for the board nuts or any thread locking compound. Finally, any opinions on the repair-ability of the damage to the board? I did contact an electronic repair company but I haven't heard back. I think this job might be too small for the company I reached out to and I might need to find an independent/smaller business. Any leads on someone local to MA would be great, or a reliable mail in place. Any advice is appreciated. Thanks, Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDspaguy Posted January 5, 2021 Report Share Posted January 5, 2021 2 hours ago, rmcderm313 said: should I use any type of sealant on the o-rings No. Just verify that the old o-ring didn't leave any chunks behind on the tube. I get after it with a wire brush myself. 2 hours ago, rmcderm313 said: should I use some kind of threadlock No!!! Never!!! Hold the bottom nut with a thin wrench and tighten the top nut TIGHT. Don't let the bottom wrench move. Same for the board, although your repair may end in a wire off of the relay instead of the tab connection. I would find a computer repair shop. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmcderm313 Posted January 7, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 7, 2021 The saga continues.... I received the heater element today and the bulkhead/terminal stud portion is shorter than the one that came out of my manifold (see picture). Because of this, the element touches the top of the inside of the manifold so I don't think this will work. Notice that there is a sort of washer under each of the poles that connects them on my old element. I reached out to Thermospa and they are no longer answering their support phone (literally no longer accepting calls). I called Balboa and they told me that Thermospa is no longer in business and the assets were bought by Jacuzzi. The heater in my spa was a special run for Thermospa and while they still manufacturer them, she told me it could be up to 3-4 months before I receive it. I think the dimensions of the heater manifold are the same as the standard Balboa 5.5W dual sensor M7, even though the part number is different. I'm hoping I can just buy a new complete manifold. I'm not sure why a replacement element would be shorter than the bulkhead/terminal stud that is in my manifold, but maybe they made changes to the tube in some way. Although it's round, so I can't imagine how it's different. I also included the markings on the original element, which appear to be: 71M 58235 E63331 J5557T2 240V 5500W 9188439 In case there are any heater element historians in the house that can explain to me why the bulkhead/terminal stud on this newer element is shorter than the one I'm replacing. Anyway I will be fully winterizing this weekend as this is taking longer than I expected. Thanks for the help thus far, any further insight would be greatly appreciated. I will update if/when I make progress. Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted January 8, 2021 Report Share Posted January 8, 2021 You might have to bend the element down a bit but IMO it should fit. Cut the metal clip off if you have to to get the element to bend a bit...gently. Get a pic of it installed so we can see. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmcderm313 Posted January 8, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2021 Thanks @CanadianSpaTech. First picture is the old one installed. Second picture is the new one installed. -Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDspaguy Posted January 8, 2021 Report Share Posted January 8, 2021 Just reach in and gently push the end opposite your pic down. Use a small flat pry bar or such if needed, but don't go to far. It will bend enough to clear the tube by 1/8", which is all you need. Removing the clips on the element will make it easier to bend but can create a vibration in the element that can damage the element and create a rattle. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmcderm313 Posted January 8, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2021 Thanks as always guys. I'll be doing this today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmcderm313 Posted January 8, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2021 I cannot get the element to bend at all, even if I pull the other end all the way down to the bottom of the tube, that just forces the part that is touching, which is the pivot point when I do that, to press harder against the top. Then it goes right back up to where it was. The 'guy' from the company I bought the part from, who will remain nameless for the time being, told me it's fine to install it with the top touching. That doesn't sound right. It seems to be the tabs holding the pieces together that are keeping the two pieces from moving independently. Based on your responses I really don't want to cut those tabs. I'm going to keep trying to bend it but I'm not optimistic... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmcderm313 Posted January 8, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2021 With the new element installed, I did check for any continuity between the manifold and the terminal posts and there is none. Of course I assume that is the titanium coating preventing continuity. I guess that means it won't short out in its current state. If I understand correctly, that is just one of the potential issues which only develops if the coating corrodes. Having the heated element touching the manifold must be bad right? Sorry, I'm rambling from frustration and don't know where to go next. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDspaguy Posted January 8, 2021 Report Share Posted January 8, 2021 The element touching the side creates a hot spot that will burn out the element. It will not create continuity to ground. Remove the clips, bend the element, replace the clips if you choose. They usually just snap on. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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