IMPORTANT: Question on Electrical Danger of Disconnect Box Location

[mscdman]

Hello.  I’m having a last minute panic attack.   My hot tub delivery is coming 12/30 and I’m extremely concerned about something:

Below is a photo of the pad for my hot tub and the electrical disconnect GFCI box.  This box is located on the brick wall and will be only 2ft behind the hot tub (which is on the gravel box I built) and also the cover will open toward this brick wall and the cover when open will fall/lay very close to the spa disconnect GFCI box (I.e the cover opens toward the brick wall)  

Im fully aware that this is not to state code which states the box must be located at least 5 feet from the tub and line of sight.  However, there simply is no where the GFCI box can be moved so It is 5ft away from the tub unless I went around the corner of the house behind my fence gate (in the photo) with the conduit and then back up/around that fence post on the  right in the photo.  Now - I’m not as much

worried about code violations or fines or anything but....
 

Where it is at now, Im VERY worried about the steam rising from the tub or a splash causing a ground to the tub and causing electrocution from that box the water in the tub (and me).   Am I right to be freaking out about this with the steam rising up toward that Box or a splash?  
 

if so, any advice on how I could make this work/re-route any of the conduit?   If I can’t find a way to make it work I don’t even know if I can cancel the fully paid order at this point in time.... 

photo below. 
 

[CanadianSpaTech]

Personally I would have gone to the side of the house beyond the gate... open the gate and it is in line of sight.  In my area it was just mandated that we have to be more than 10' from spa. Being away from the spa is more important than line of sight IMO. If it has to be inspected have the inspector come out and tell you where it can go. What's to the left of the building? 

[mscdman]

12 minutes ago, CanadianSpaTech said:

Personally I would have gone to the side of the house beyond the gate... open the gate and it is in line of sight.  In my area it was just mandated that we have to be more than 10' from spa. Being away from the spa is more important than line of sight IMO. If it has to be inspected have the inspector come out and tell you where it can go. What's to the left of the building? 

I’m not worried about the inspector as much as as I am safety.  I don’t want to get electrocuted from a splash oR the hot tub steam rising near that box.  I wasn’t even planning a permit.   When you say to the “left” it depends what way you face.  If you mean beyond the gate it’s just a brick wall/exterior of my garage.  
 

what about re-routing the conduit like the below photo to the other wall behind the fence?  The only other issue there is that since the wire is already pulled through the conduit to the GFCI box I presume he would need to create a junction box somewhere on this wall anyway to re-route the conduit and splice the wires and wouldn’t a junction box on this wall where the GFCI is be just as bad as the Risk of electrocution from the GFCI box?

[jimmythegreek]

The location it's at now is no good. I would route it to either behind the fence on right, or around the corner to the left of the window. Either way being around a corner will provide alot of protection from splash outs.  This is a plug in tub not a hardwire install?

[mscdman]

2 minutes ago, jimmythegreek said:

The location it's at now is no good. I would route it to either behind the fence on right, or around the corner to the left of the window. Either way being around a corner will provide alot of protection from splash outs.  This is a plug in tub not a hardwire install?

220v hard wired

[CanadianSpaTech]

16 minutes ago, mscdman said:

When you say to the “left”

Left hand side of the photo on the backwall of what looks like your sunroom...to the left of the windows

 

[mscdman]

9 minutes ago, CanadianSpaTech said:

Left hand side of the photo on the backwall of what looks like your sunroom...to the left of the windows

 

Left side is another patio but that sunroom is 100 ft long. 
 

question:   If I re-route to behind the fence, there would likely need to be a junction box installed up near the soffit to splice the wires. It would be about 10ft off the ground thoigh.  Is is a concern if the rising steam from the tub going up to the top of the wall/soffit and getting in that potential new junction box up there or is that safe?

[CanadianSpaTech]

Use a water tight junction box.

 

[mscdman]

29 minutes ago, CanadianSpaTech said:

Use a water tight junction box.

 

Excellent.  So then that should be relatively safe being up that high (10ft) with a water tight junction box and the conduit rerouted to the side behind the fence and putting the GFCI disconnect there?

[RDspaguy]

Ok. Code says... Code says alot of things. One is that any electrical outlet or switch (disconnect) within 5ft if a water source must be gfci protected. So if your gfci is in the disconnect, it must be at least 5ft from the surface of the water. If your gfci protection is in the main panel, it may be closer but must be labeled "gfci protected".

It also says it must be no less than 5ft, no more than 25ft, and in a direct line of sight from the spa. But it doesn't say where on the spa or that you have to be looking at the front of the box. This is actually fire safety code, not electrical, and is so the spa can be turned off in the event of an emergency.

But code also says that a disconnect box must be accessible, and includes clearances and height restrictions. I think it's around 7ft above grade to the top of the box and 3ft clearance in front of it. But look that up to be sure, it's been a few decades since I read it.

[mscdman]

7 minutes ago, RDspaguy said:

Ok. Code says... Code says alot of things. One is that any electrical outlet or switch (disconnect) within 5ft if a water source must be gfci protected. So if your gfci is in the disconnect, it must be at least 5ft from the surface of the water.

“my GFCI is currently in the disconnect.  As installed now that disconnect is only 2ft from the surface of the water and pretty much is in close contact/proximity to the cover when it will be opened”

If your gfci protection is in the main panel,  

“main panel has regular breaker - GFCI in the spa disconnect”

it may be closer but must be labeled "gfci protected".

 

7 minutes ago, RDspaguy said:

It also says it must be no less than 5ft, no more than 25ft, and in a direct line of sight from the spa.
 

right now it’s in direct sight - but it’s way to close to the tub   Steam and splashing could get on that box being only 2ft

But it doesn't say where on the spa or that you have to be looking at the front of the box. This is actually fire safety code, not electrical, and is so the spa can be turned off in the event of an emergency.

But code also says that a disconnect box must be accessible, and includes clearances and height restrictions. I think it's around 7ft above grade to the top of the box and 3ft clearance in front of it. But look that up to be sure, it's been a few decades since I read it.

 

See embedded responses above. 

[mscdman]

I guess my only safe option at this point is to:

1) at the top of my soffit on the wall (10ft up)where the disconnect currently resides reroute wire and conduit towards, around the corner and behind the fence   To do this will need a water tight junction box somewhere up there to splice in the needed wire and conduit   

 

2) about 3-4 feet behind the fence come down with conduit so about 6 foot to top of disconnect box and install there 

3) route conduit BACK towards the fence and THROUGH the left fence post to the wall and down to the rubber conduit tail that goes to the spa. 
 

it’s not technically line of sight but would be at least 5 feet away from the tub this new way + around the corner. Would still have that water tight junction box on that spa wall but it would be 10ft in the air and hopefully tight enough so no steam and or splashes would get there.  
 

thoughts on this approach 

[RDspaguy]

If you can touch the spa and see the disconnect it is line of sight. From what I see, neither of your corners presents a problem there. 

The 5ft requirement is measured from the surface of the water and around obstructions. 

If it were me, I would run the wire above the soffit. It looks like they came through the attic with the wire, so you could mount your j-box up there if you need to lengthen the wire. You may find enough slack in the wire in the attic to reach the new location if rerouted. I doubt that conduit is anything more than a sleeve and likely doesn't go much past the soffit.

[mscdman]

52 minutes ago, RDspaguy said:

If you can touch the spa and see the disconnect it is line of sight. From what I see, neither of your corners presents a problem there. 

The 5ft requirement is measured from the surface of the water and around obstructions. 

If it were me, I would run the wire above the soffit. It looks like they came through the attic with the wire, so you could mount your j-box up there if you need to lengthen the wire. You may find enough slack in the wire in the attic to reach the new location if rerouted. I doubt that conduit is anything more than a sleeve and likely doesn't go much past the soffit.

This is the new plan ^^ exactly.   Re-route INSIDE the soffit and drop down the wall around the corner.   Line of sight is Iffy with the gate there  but I’d at least feel comfortable using the tub with the box mounted on the wall around the corner vs sitting right next to the tub