Trigger Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 Hey guys Up here in New England we were hit with an early winter storm. My local electric company is saying I won't have power until the end of the week (It's been out since Early Sunday morning) I'm not sure what I should be doing with my 2007 Caldera Geneva. It's a 475 gallon full foam tub. Weather forcasts call for the days to be in the low 50's and going to 30 at night. The water is still warm as of this a.m I'm told that that a full foamed tub will be fine for a few days, but this will be without power for about 6 days with temps right on the edge. Should I keep it buttoned up and hope for the best? Or do I drain it (without power, a drain will be using the tub drain on the lower corner of the tub)? Advice? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gman Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 <br />Hey guys<br /><br />Up here in New England we were hit with an early winter storm. <img src='http://www.poolspaforum.com/forum/public/style_emoticons/default/wacko.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' /> My local electric company is saying I won't have power until the end of the week (It's been out since Early Sunday morning)<br /><br />I'm not sure what I should be doing with my 2007 Caldera Geneva. It's a 475 gallon full foam tub. Weather forcasts call for the days to be in the low 50's and going to 30 at night. The water is still warm as of this a.m <br /><br />I'm told that that a full foamed tub will be fine for a few days, but this will be without power for about 6 days with temps right on the edge.<br /><br /><br />Should I keep it buttoned up and hope for the best? Or do I drain it (without power, a drain will be using the tub drain on the lower corner of the tub)?<br /><br /><br />Advice?<br /><br /><br /><br />If your water temperature was high when you lost power, I don't think you have to worry about pipes freezing unless you're going to have freezing temperatures for an extended period. KEEP YOUR COVER CLOSED. Your water temperature should stay above the freezing point. To improve the existing insulation barrier to your tub, you can cover any ventilation slots, if any, in your tub cabinet/engine compartment to minimize the amount of cold air gaining access to the inside of the tub. Do this from the outside so you don't have to remove a cabinet panel(which would defeat the purpose). If your tub is situated where it is routinely exposed to high winds, you could also put up a wind screen to help keep the coldest temps from battering your tub. If the weather gets significantly colder than is currently forecast for your area and/or your electrical service is not restored as predicted, then you may have to reconsider draining the tub. Just my $0.02. It's your tub, though, and your call. gman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Spa Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 The main body of water isn't the issue. There's enough mass there that it will take a long time to cool to the point of freezing. The biggest concern is the equipment, and plumbing in that general area. Being a much smaller volume of water, it will cool quickly and potentially freeze. As gman said, that's the area that needs to be protected. Cover the vented door! The main body of water should then keep the equipment above freezing temps. Just draining the spa would be a HUGE mistake. Without blowing out the lines, small amounts of water would remain in the plumbing that almost certainly WILL freeze....rather quickly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trigger Posted October 31, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 The main body of water isn't the issue. There's enough mass there that it will take a long time to cool to the point of freezing. The biggest concern is the equipment, and plumbing in that general area. Being a much smaller volume of water, it will cool quickly and potentially freeze. As gman said, that's the area that needs to be protected. Cover the vented door! The main body of water should then keep the equipment above freezing temps. Just draining the spa would be a HUGE mistake. Without blowing out the lines, small amounts of water would remain in the plumbing that almost certainly WILL freeze....rather quickly. Thanks guys. I'll plug the vent holes and keep her covered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gman Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 <br />The main body of water isn't the issue. There's enough mass there that it will take a long time to cool to the point of freezing. <br /><br />The biggest concern is the equipment, and plumbing in that general area. Being a much smaller volume of water, it will cool quickly and potentially freeze. As gman said, that's the area that needs to be protected. Cover the vented door! The main body of water should then keep the equipment above freezing temps. <br /><br />Just draining the spa would be a HUGE mistake. Without blowing out the lines, small amounts of water would remain in the plumbing that almost certainly WILL freeze....rather quickly.<br /><br /><br /><br />Dr. Spa, Good catch on blowing out the lines. I forgot to mention that when I suggested to Trigger that he might need to reconsider draining the tub. Blowing out the lines would be a "must do" if he followed that route. gman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trigger Posted October 31, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 <br />The main body of water isn't the issue. There's enough mass there that it will take a long time to cool to the point of freezing. <br /><br />The biggest concern is the equipment, and plumbing in that general area. Being a much smaller volume of water, it will cool quickly and potentially freeze. As gman said, that's the area that needs to be protected. Cover the vented door! The main body of water should then keep the equipment above freezing temps. <br /><br />Just draining the spa would be a HUGE mistake. Without blowing out the lines, small amounts of water would remain in the plumbing that almost certainly WILL freeze....rather quickly.<br /><br /><br /><br />Dr. Spa, Good catch on blowing out the lines. I forgot to mention that when I suggested to Trigger that he might need to reconsider draining the tub. Blowing out the lines would be a "must do" if he followed that route. gman If it came to that, I'd go fill up my portable air tank at a gas station that had power and use that to blow out the lines. As Doc says, the thermal mass of the water should be ok, it's the equipment in the front compartment that's the issue. I'll check in later this week and let you know how it worked out. I think my saving grace is the temps are going to be fairly warm during the days and no hard freezes at night. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 The main body of water isn't the issue. There's enough mass there that it will take a long time to cool to the point of freezing. The biggest concern is the equipment, and plumbing in that general area. Being a much smaller volume of water, it will cool quickly and potentially freeze. As gman said, that's the area that needs to be protected. Cover the vented door! The main body of water should then keep the equipment above freezing temps. Just draining the spa would be a HUGE mistake. Without blowing out the lines, small amounts of water would remain in the plumbing that almost certainly WILL freeze....rather quickly. Thanks guys. I'll plug the vent holes and keep her covered. A small electric heater or even a trouble light inside the equipment area, safely, will also work if it gets to be more than a week or so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sanders Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 Dipping below freezing for short periods (a couple of hours) per night won't be too much of a worry. It's extended times that will cause you a problem however you still have lots of heat in the tub water. If you need to spread that heat into the pipe work from time to time then make yourself a little hand pump (a plastic baggy will do. Fill it up, place it over one of the intakes and squeeze the warm water in. Do that a few times and you'll be good to go for another while. Careful to balance this however with the number of times you NEED to remove the cover. The longer the cover is off... the more heat you lose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sanders Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 A small electric heater or even a trouble light inside the equipment area, safely, will also work if it gets to be more than a week or so. In a power outage? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trigger Posted November 2, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 2, 2011 Power came back on last night at 10:00 p.m. All-in-all, power was out for 3 days. Much less than what the municiple electric company had told me to expect. As advised, I covered the vents on the bottom of my equipment panel door to minimize heat loss in the equipment bay. And only quickly opened the cover very slightly once to stick my hand into the water. During the evening, temps droppped below freezing for only short periods, but nothing severe. As of last night the water was still warm. Thankfully the weather wasn't too cold. But I belive in colder weather, the tub still would have sat uneffected for seveal days. As far as the light in the equipment bay. that's actually a good idea, and with my new generator I could run a work light out to the equipment bay if this happens agains. Thanks for all the input. I appreciate it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spatech (the unreal one) Posted November 2, 2011 Report Share Posted November 2, 2011 As far as the light in the equipment bay. that's actually a good idea, and with my new generator I could run a work light out to the equipment bay if this happens agains. If you do this don't go green and use a compact flourescent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trigger Posted November 2, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 2, 2011 As far as the light in the equipment bay. that's actually a good idea, and with my new generator I could run a work light out to the equipment bay if this happens agains. If you do this don't go green and use a compact flourescent. As I think about me new generator and what I would do differently if I loose power again, I wonder if my 5500 watt generator could power the hot tub, -if i wire a transfer switch into my house, and have the generator power a subpanel, should I put the hot tub on it? Could a generator run this? Or would it be too much of a drain and I should focus on my hot water heater, lights and pellet stove. If running the tub off the generator (even for brief periods to keep the temps up) ISN'T feesable, I wonder if I should now while everything is fine and the weather is nice, place a work light into the equipment bay, and run the coord out throuh the vent tuck up and out of the way an unplugged. If I ever loose power again, I wouldn't even have to open the equipment bay, I could run a line from the generator to the work light cord. Actually, I could place a work light in the bay, wire it to a weatherproof socket that is on the outside of the equipment bay panel, and all I'd have to do is plug a line from my generator into the socket...viloa!, heated equipment bay for emergencies (Hey Watkins...not a bad feature to add to your tub.). Or am I all wet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spatech (the unreal one) Posted November 2, 2011 Report Share Posted November 2, 2011 As far as the light in the equipment bay. that's actually a good idea, and with my new generator I could run a work light out to the equipment bay if this happens agains. If you do this don't go green and use a compact flourescent. As I think about me new generator and what I would do differently if I loose power again, I wonder if my 5500 watt generator could power the hot tub, -if i wire a transfer switch into my house, and have the generator power a subpanel, should I put the hot tub on it? Could a generator run this? Or would it be too much of a drain and I should focus on my hot water heater, lights and pellet stove. If running the tub off the generator (even for brief periods to keep the temps up) ISN'T feesable, I wonder if I should now while everything is fine and the weather is nice, place a work light into the equipment bay, and run the coord out throuh the vent tuck up and out of the way an unplugged. If I ever loose power again, I wouldn't even have to open the equipment bay, I could run a line from the generator to the work light cord. Actually, I could place a work light in the bay, wire it to a weatherproof socket that is on the outside of the equipment bay panel, and all I'd have to do is plug a line from my generator into the socket...viloa!, heated equipment bay for emergencies (Hey Watkins...not a bad feature to add to your tub.). Or am I all wet? If you really want to take an extra step I'd take the leads from the circ pump off the control panel and wire them direct to your generator and run the circ pump. It actually tranfers some heat (mostly directly to the water) and it will give you constant water flow and would be all you'd need. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trigger Posted November 2, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 2, 2011 As far as the light in the equipment bay. that's actually a good idea, and with my new generator I could run a work light out to the equipment bay if this happens agains. If you do this don't go green and use a compact flourescent. As I think about me new generator and what I would do differently if I loose power again, I wonder if my 5500 watt generator could power the hot tub, -if i wire a transfer switch into my house, and have the generator power a subpanel, should I put the hot tub on it? Could a generator run this? Or would it be too much of a drain and I should focus on my hot water heater, lights and pellet stove. If running the tub off the generator (even for brief periods to keep the temps up) ISN'T feesable, I wonder if I should now while everything is fine and the weather is nice, place a work light into the equipment bay, and run the coord out throuh the vent tuck up and out of the way an unplugged. If I ever loose power again, I wouldn't even have to open the equipment bay, I could run a line from the generator to the work light cord. Actually, I could place a work light in the bay, wire it to a weatherproof socket that is on the outside of the equipment bay panel, and all I'd have to do is plug a line from my generator into the socket...viloa!, heated equipment bay for emergencies (Hey Watkins...not a bad feature to add to your tub.). Or am I all wet? If you really want to take an extra step I'd take the leads from the circ pump off the control panel and wire them direct to your generator and run the circ pump. It actually tranfers some heat (mostly directly to the water) and it will give you constant water flow and would be all you'd need. there ya go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Posted November 2, 2011 Report Share Posted November 2, 2011 A small electric heater or even a trouble light inside the equipment area, safely, will also work if it gets to be more than a week or so. In a power outage? Doesn't everyone have a small generator? I use the Honda 2000EU Awesome machine runs for 7 hours on a fill (.6 gal) and one cord away you can't even hear it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trigger Posted November 3, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 3, 2011 A small electric heater or even a trouble light inside the equipment area, safely, will also work if it gets to be more than a week or so. In a power outage? Doesn't everyone have a small generator? I use the Honda 2000EU Awesome machine runs for 7 hours on a fill (.6 gal) and one cord away you can't even hear it. I do now!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walleye Posted November 4, 2011 Report Share Posted November 4, 2011 Highs of 50's and low of 30, nothing to worry about. You could go all year like that and never freeze. Prob would not be below freezing for more than a hour or two, not enough to freeze and damage your equipment. Glad you have power back though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waterbear Posted November 12, 2011 Report Share Posted November 12, 2011 Dipping below freezing for short periods (a couple of hours) per night won't be too much of a worry. It's extended times that will cause you a problem however you still have lots of heat in the tub water. If you need to spread that heat into the pipe work from time to time then make yourself a little hand pump (a plastic baggy will do. Fill it up, place it over one of the intakes and squeeze the warm water in. Do that a few times and you'll be good to go for another while. Careful to balance this however with the number of times you NEED to remove the cover. The longer the cover is off... the more heat you lose. Thought this quote from another thread was relevant here: You don't seem to understand that it is not my knowledge and experience that is being talked about. I've already admitted SEVERAL TIMES NOW that I have very little experience when it comes to discussing things directly related to spas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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