dprocket Posted March 22, 2022 Report Share Posted March 22, 2022 I have a 2010 model Cal Spa, over the past few years, I've replaced several key components and have felt more and more comfortable working on it myself. I've saved hundreds of dollars doing this. A few weeks ago, the hot tub stopped heating. I replaced the tube heater assembly a little over 1 year ago. I assumed that it had gone bad already....frustrating...but at $180, it's easy enough to fix without calling for service. I replaced the tube heater, no-change. It's still not warming. I thought maybe I had a bad heater, so I ordered a replacement. When it arrived, I went to swap it out, again, and noticed the heater was warm. I tested the water and sure enough...the temp of the tub was in the 90s. Not the 100 like it is set to, but not the 70 degree water either. I decided not to swap the heater out again, as it seems like maybe the original heater was not bad after all. I've gone through other trouble shooting steps. It appears that my pumps are working fine, I have pressure coming out of the jets when I turn them on. The skimmer is showing good suction by the filter. I recently replaced the filter, and thought maybe I had a junk filter or something....I replaced it and the next day the hot tub was nearly 100-degres. But went back down to low 80's again. I'm a bit at a loss for what to try next. Any tips on troubleshooting? I have a Homeline 50-Amp Spa Panel outside and the GFCI is not tripping. I've turned it off, and then turned it back on, no change. Everything appears to be functionating properly, it's just not heating up. What would be the next things to inspect? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted March 22, 2022 Report Share Posted March 22, 2022 If you have a multi meter and knowledge of how to safely use it I would disconnect the heater from the circuit board and test for 240V power coming off the circuit board. Make sure the heat indicator LED is solid and not flickering when testing. It is possible that one of the heater relays is burnt/blown and the spa is only heating off one leg or 120v only. Cal has used a couple of different heaters over the years. Please poet photos of the circuit board, Heater and schematic on the inside cover. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dprocket Posted March 28, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2022 Thank you. I will do this later tonight. It's been quite cold and rainy here, and with my busy schedule I haven't had much suitable time to trouble shoot. On observation that I made. Yesterday, i turned power off at the breaker. I flipped it back on, and let it go through it's pre-cycle. After the precycle, i heard (I think) the heater kick on. I put my hand in the tub and felt warm water circulating. The tub was at around 75 degrees, and I could feel warm water coming into the tub. I closed it up, waited a few hours and then checked again. No temp change. I think that warm water was short lived. This makes me wonder if something is causing the heater to turn on momentarily, and then stop. Possibly a fuse? I do have a multi meter, but am not real experienced with it. I plan to do some testing tonight with it. The heater that I have is a Balboa 25-175-1010 VS M7 OEM Heater Assembly, 5.5KW, 220V, 58083. I *believe* the circuit board is a ELE09907283, but I will need to double check that this evening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted March 28, 2022 Report Share Posted March 28, 2022 2 hours ago, dprocket said: Possibly a fuse? no it wouldn't work at all if fuse was no good. Remove filter until issue is fixed. Remove it from the equation. Are there any error codes on the topside display? 2 hours ago, dprocket said: but am not real experienced with it. I plan to do some testing tonight with it Please don't die. Power off. Disconnect the 2 copper tabs from the heater element and lift them up so they don't touch anything. Power on and set multi meter to AC. Wait until the heat indicator LED is solid and not flickering and touch the 2 copper tabs. You should get 240V. If you do replace element if you don't you are in for a board repair likely due to a blown heater relay. Cheaper to repair then to replace entire board if you can find a local electronics repair shop. When you replaced the heater did you just replace the element or the entire chrome tube with the heater element already installed? If you replaced it did you make sure the element was not touching the side wall of the chrome tube? If not the element will hot spot and burn out in short order. See #5 and second photo below Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dprocket Posted March 29, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 29, 2022 "Wait until the heat indicator LED is solid and not flickering and touch the 2 copper tabs" I do not have any heat indicator LED. Am I missing something? There is nothing on my control panel and nothing on the board that would show anything like this. No errors thrown. I'm going to run it without nthe filter for a few and see if anything changes before I risk killing myself. 😀 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dprocket Posted March 29, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 29, 2022 And yes, I replaced the entire heater Barrell, not just the element. I replaced this fuse that is directly on top of the heater. It has been running for about 10 minutes. I can touch the outflow tubing where water comes thru the heater and it is a little warm. Feels a little warmer than the ambient air. It feels like maybe warm water is circulating. I don't know how long it should take to feel a tangible change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dprocket Posted March 29, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 29, 2022 Nothing. A few hours later and no temp change. I'll test more on Wednesday evening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted March 29, 2022 Report Share Posted March 29, 2022 Post photos of the circuit board the topside control and the schematic on the inside cover of the spa pack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dprocket Posted March 29, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 29, 2022 (edited) I didn't get a pic of the board last night. Here's the schematic. Update...Wrong photo haha!... trying again! Edited March 29, 2022 by dprocket Wrong photo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cranbiz Posted March 29, 2022 Report Share Posted March 29, 2022 17 minutes ago, dprocket said: I didn't get a pic of the board last night. Here's the schematic. Wrong picture. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dprocket Posted March 29, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 29, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted March 29, 2022 Report Share Posted March 29, 2022 In the photo I can see a burnt/cracked wire just above the copper tabs off the heater element and up to the right. It joins the 2 black heater relays. Now WHY is that wire burnt crispy is the question and you might get away just replacing the wire but personally I would do more investigation by removing the circuit board from the housing and looking on the back of the circuit board for darkened or burnt areas around those 2 relays. Obviously the wire will need to be replaced. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dprocket Posted March 29, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 29, 2022 19 minutes ago, CanadianSpaTech said: In the photo I can see a burnt/cracked wire just above the copper tabs off the heater element and up to the right. It joins the 2 black heater relays. Now WHY is that wire burnt crispy is the question and you might get away just replacing the wire but personally I would do more investigation by removing the circuit board from the housing and looking on the back of the circuit board for darkened or burnt areas around those 2 relays. Obviously the wire will need to be replaced. Wow. Thanks. have not even noticed that. I will get into this and report back in a few days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dprocket Posted March 30, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 30, 2022 On 3/29/2022 at 4:06 PM, dprocket said: Wow. Thanks. have not even noticed that. I will get into this and report back in a few days. I removed the wire and have it turned off. I won't have time to take the board completely out for a week or so. What are the implications of putting a new 10G wire in there and testing it out? Can I power on the HT and let the water at least keep circulating with the wire removed? (I guess the burnt up wire likely wasn't doing anything anyway). I read that those relays can burn up of a strap is not tightened correctly on a heater install. I don't see any burn marks around the relay, but surely will have to remove the board to see if there's any sign of burn behind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dprocket Posted March 30, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 30, 2022 On 3/28/2022 at 5:36 PM, CanadianSpaTech said: If you replaced it did you make sure the element was not touching the side wall of the chrome tube? If not the element will hot spot and burn out in short order. This evening, I looked inside the old heater tube. I was surprised to see a build up of chlorine sediment in the tube and on the elements. I also noticed it caked on the inside of the connectors of the tobe in either side of the heater. I do not use bromine in this tub. I've used pool chlorine and shock for many years. Bromine caused skin irritation for several family members but we've had good luck with treating not like a pool. Thoughts on this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted March 31, 2022 Report Share Posted March 31, 2022 Not uncommon. Bad but I have seen worse. 11 hours ago, dprocket said: What are the implications of putting a new 10G wire in there and testing it out? I would. 11 hours ago, dprocket said: Can I power on the HT and let the water at least keep circulating with the wire removed? (I guess the burnt up wire likely wasn't doing anything anyway). I would remove the wire if you want to keep spa running. With the new wire installed you could test from the white neutral to the top relay where the wire connects and see if you get power coming out of the relay. If you do the top relay is good (spa calling for heat) the power then follows that wire down to the bottom relay and goes into that relay where the wire connects. Then that power should come out of that relay to the heater so if the top relay is good but you don't get power to the heater the bottom relay might be blown. Right beside that bottom relay on the left there is a male tab coming off the circuit board. You should get power to that tab if it is flowing through the bottom relay. So testing white neutral to that male tab you should get power. If you look to the left of the left copper tab you will see another relay that relay should carry 120 V at all times. To verify test white neutral to the small male tab just below Red AC and right next to the copper tab on the left marked J10. You should get 240V testing between those 2 male tabs. Please be careful Electricity can Kill and if you are the least bit unsure call a professional. Know your limit. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dashmer Posted March 31, 2022 Report Share Posted March 31, 2022 What is chlorine sediment? Salt? Wouldn't this more likely be calcium? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dprocket Posted March 31, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2022 4 hours ago, dashmer said: What is chlorine sediment? Salt? Wouldn't this more likely be calcium? I believe it to be from a chlorine disc , because earlier this year I put one of those chlorine discs in the tub (I had some leftover from my pool). I put a half of one in the skimmer and didn't like how it worked. So opted not to do it any more. That Is the only thing I've changed to the tub in years. I've been in the guts a few times over the last several years and this is the only time I've seen build up like that..so I'm assuming it's from that disc/cake. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dprocket Posted March 31, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2022 4 hours ago, CanadianSpaTech said: 4 hours ago, CanadianSpaTech said: Please be careful Electricity can Kill and if you are the least bit unsure call a professional. Know your limit. I am unsure, so this may be where I call in a pro. I might replace the wire/jumper to see what it does, but I'm not versed enough on the electrical components. Unfortunately, in my area, I don't have lots of confidence in the spa repair people. So I need to do some checking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted March 31, 2022 Report Share Posted March 31, 2022 Note where the wire goes first. See the black wire the goes from the large fuse on top of the heater element. Power off remove the fuse then take that black wire and temporarily use that to replace the crispy one going between the 2 relays. The fuse and the holder with the black and grey wires are sometimes used for pump #2 protection but it's sometimes not even needed. So if you remove the fuse and pump 2 still works then it is not even needed for your set up. You can use that black wire just for testing. You don't need pump 2 for testing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dprocket Posted March 31, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2022 1 hour ago, CanadianSpaTech said: Note where the wire goes first. See the black wire the goes from the large fuse on top of the heater element. Power off remove the fuse then take that black wire and temporarily use that to replace the crispy one going between the 2 relays. The fuse and the holder with the black and grey wires are sometimes used for pump #2 protection but it's sometimes not even needed. So if you remove the fuse and pump 2 still works then it is not even needed for your set up. You can use that black wire just for testing. You don't need pump 2 for testing. Cool. I may even try this late tonight. Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dprocket Posted April 1, 2022 Author Report Share Posted April 1, 2022 Ok, I swapped the wire. The tub is running, but it's been a few hours and no change in temperature, unfortunately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted April 1, 2022 Report Share Posted April 1, 2022 Likely going to be a relay. Have to pull the board and look on back for darkened or burnt area around those relays but they don't always show. Relays can be replaced. I use a local electronics circuit board repair shop but can be done DIY if you have the tools and a bit of skill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dprocket Posted April 2, 2022 Author Report Share Posted April 2, 2022 4 hours ago, CanadianSpaTech said: Likely going to be a relay. Have to pull the board and look on back for darkened or burnt area around those relays but they don't always show. Relays can be replaced. I use a local electronics circuit board repair shop but can be done DIY if you have the tools and a bit of skill. Here it is. No doubt. I'm on the hunt for a circuit board repair place. I've never done that before, so it's something new. Can they just pop off the old relay and put a new one in? Solder in new connections and test everything? It looks like the relays are very inexpensive ($15). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted April 2, 2022 Report Share Posted April 2, 2022 35 minutes ago, dprocket said: Can they just pop off the old relay and put a new one in? Solder in new connections and test everything? Yes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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