Scott B Posted March 25, 2020 Report Share Posted March 25, 2020 The dedicated circuit breaker on my house panel is tripped. Resetting lasts only 20 seconds or so. GFCI at spa is not tripped. When I reset the panel breaker, the spa starts to operate - circulation pumps is on, then trips again. 120v. Where do I start my troubleshooting? Likely problem? Thanks for any help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ratchett Posted March 25, 2020 Report Share Posted March 25, 2020 I'm by no means an expert. But I've read enough to know you should start by taking out the filters and then try flipping the breaker. See if it still trips or if removing the filters fixes the problem Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted March 25, 2020 Report Share Posted March 25, 2020 When was the last time you cleaned your filter? Remove filters until issue is fixed. Make sure nothing is in spa the can go down into where the filter screws in. If the spa has ozone disconnect it first and try breaker again Inspect the pumps and make sure it is not leaking and sucking water into the dry motor end when running causing fault. Look for water around pumps. You could also have a bad plug GFCI. Does the test button on it work? Can you try the test button before it trips inside? Sounds like the 20 seconds is just about when the heater will try and test fire or ozone comes on. With power off disconnect heater from circuit board and reset breaker. If none of that works keep disconnecting components until breaker holds. Main pump and try. Then circ pump and try. Light and try. Process of elimination. Safety first Let us know results Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDspaguy Posted March 25, 2020 Report Share Posted March 25, 2020 Also about the time main pump will kick in. It is not a ground fault, nor is it filter related. In addition to Canadaguys suggestions, check the breaker for loose wire terminals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott B Posted March 26, 2020 Author Report Share Posted March 26, 2020 Thank for your input. I will get to work and try these things when it stops raining! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott B Posted March 26, 2020 Author Report Share Posted March 26, 2020 I took the cover off a little while ago and turned the breaker on. It ran, no cutoff! After about 5 mins. I turned the light on to see what would happen. It cut off immediately. I flipped the breaker back on, and it went right off. Then I unplugged the ozonator (new JED 103 I installed a year and a half ago), and turned the breaker on, and it ran. Now, about 30 mins later it's still running. I haven't touched anything like light or pump yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDspaguy Posted March 26, 2020 Report Share Posted March 26, 2020 Gonna have to try... not getting an answer if we don't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott B Posted March 26, 2020 Author Report Share Posted March 26, 2020 OK, I checked the temp after about 3 hours, it was 87 so the heater is working. I turned the pump on via the clean button and everything shut down instantly. I didn't see water around pump when I had it open. The pump had sometimes, but not always, been surging in recent months. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted March 27, 2020 Report Share Posted March 27, 2020 You sure the breaker is dedicated for just the spa? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott B Posted March 27, 2020 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2020 Yes, just the spa. Also, the only breaker with a test button. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDspaguy Posted March 27, 2020 Report Share Posted March 27, 2020 Turn off power. Open control pack. Locate wire for main pump and disconnect from circuit board. Determine if you have an ozonator. Turn power on, press clean button. If it doesnt trip it is your pump or pump wiring. If it does trip, reconnect pump and disconnect ozone. Try again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott B Posted March 27, 2020 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2020 OK. I've done some of this already. Initially it was tripping within seconds. I disconnected the ozonator (see my posts above), and the spa stayed on. I was hopeful it was the ozonator that was tripping it, but then when I turned the pump on it tripped. Also, when I turned the light on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDspaguy Posted March 27, 2020 Report Share Posted March 27, 2020 Try disconnecting the pump. If thats not it, try the light. It's a process of elimination if it is a component. With it being on a gfci breaker as well as plug, it could be a ground fault or amp draw causing the trip. It could be a chewed wire, a bad pump, a leak onto the pump, inside the pump, onto the circuit board, onto the light (if it is 120v), a faulty breaker, loose wire connection, or any number of things. There is only so much I can do from here. You are going to have to track it down my friend. At face value, pump or breaker. The light causing a trip as well is either a different issue, or something is leaking on both. You have a head-scratcher, sorry to say. Gonna have to get in there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted March 27, 2020 Report Share Posted March 27, 2020 It's not tripping the GFCI 120 V male plug but the one in the main panel and trips it when a load is put on it. Not saying this is your problem but have seen several of those GFCI plugs fail. I might try disconnecting the black and white wires from the spa pack leaving the green attached and tape them up for safety and then try the test button and see if it works. Were there any issues with the spa recently prior to the current problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDspaguy Posted March 27, 2020 Report Share Posted March 27, 2020 Right. Tripping the gfci breaker in the panel. The one with the test button. Gfci cords are not reliable, I agree, but it may not be malfunctioning, just the breaker is more sensitive and trips at a lesser fault, so trips first. You don't need 2, so as long as one works you are ok. It's ridiculous how much they get for one of those cord ends. I usually put in a gfci plug and standard cord when I run in to a bad one. This one having the gfci dedicated circuit, he doesn't even need that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted March 27, 2020 Report Share Posted March 27, 2020 12 hours ago, Scott B said: The dedicated circuit breaker on my house panel is tripped. Resetting lasts only 20 seconds or so. GFCI at spa is not tripped. When I reset the panel breaker, the spa starts to operate - circulation pumps is on, then trips again. 120v. Where do I start my troubleshooting? Likely problem? Thanks for any help. You sure the breaker is dedicated for just the spa? ...............here I was asking if the breaker in the main panel was dedicated to just the spa with nothing else from the house wired into it. Yes, just the spa. Also, the only breaker with a test button. Mildly confused. The cord that came with the spa and comes from the spa pack and plugs into the wall outlet outside doesn't have a GFCI test button? To me that would be odd. Does the breaker in the main panel have a test button? Where is the test button located in the main panel or outside on the plug that plugs into the wall outlet' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDspaguy Posted March 27, 2020 Report Share Posted March 27, 2020 Both, I think. He has the standard gfci cord end, plugged in to a plug on a 20a gfci breaker. The breaker is tripping, not the cord. Could be the cord is bad, could be the breaker is more sensitive than the cord end. Could also be over-amping the breaker, but would expect some humming out of it if that were the case. Gotta be pretty close on amp draw. Not sure of the kw of the heater, but it's probably pulling 8 or up to 12. Has a circulation pump, ozone, main pump, control. Gotta be on the cusp of 20 amps. If that breaker is old, or has loose connections, it could be tripping for that. He could disconnect his ground, assuming it is not grounded elsewhere, to determine if it is a ground fault or amperage issue. The light tripping it throws me. That almost has to be wet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott B Posted June 4, 2020 Author Report Share Posted June 4, 2020 Thanks for all the help with this everybody. I changed out the GFCI 20A breaker on my main panel for a regular 20 A breaker and everything works fine - no tripping. Now I have only the Hot Springs GFCI on the cord. When I push that test button, it momentarily breaks, then comes back on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDspaguy Posted June 4, 2020 Report Share Posted June 4, 2020 Sounds risky. If it doesn't trip for a test it won't trip to save your life. Get rid of the GFCI cord and use the GFCI plug. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott B Posted June 4, 2020 Author Report Share Posted June 4, 2020 Thanks, but I don't understand the difference between a GFCI cord and a GFCI plug. What I have is made by Hot Springs. It's a box at the end of the power cord, I plug it in, it has three prongs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDspaguy Posted June 4, 2020 Report Share Posted June 4, 2020 The thing on the cord is technically called a gfci cord end. A gfci plug, technically a gfci receptacle, is the thing in the wall you plug it in to. Cord ends are notorious for failing. Receptacles are too, but not as bad and much cheaper to replace. If it does not trip and have to have the reset button pressed to get it working again it is faulty and not providing gfci protection as is should. This is an electrocution hazard and a code violation. The faulty cord end could cause the receptacle to trip. I would go to the hardware store and get a 20 amp standard (non-gfci) cord end and a gfci receptacle (required by code). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott B Posted June 4, 2020 Author Report Share Posted June 4, 2020 Thanks for explaining the difference. Yes, I have the gray box Watkins GFCI cord. My mistake in previous post. I push the black test button, it goes off, I push the yellow button, it comes back on. Everything seems to work normally. I may consider changing to the GFCI plug, but for now, the cord works properly and I will test regularly. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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