Spabalancer

[Rob Holland]

In Germany there is a product on the Spa market "SpaBalancer". Which is a non-chloride product. The price is €109,-/$149,- for 750mL.

http://www.spabalancer.com/spabalancer-en.html

Are there any expiriences with SpaBalancer? Pros, cons, do'es and don'ts?

[waterbear]

In Germany there is a product on the Spa market "SpaBalancer". Which is a non-chloride product. The price is €109,-/$149,- for 750mL.

http://www.spabalanc...alancer-en.html

Are there any expiriences with SpaBalancer? Pros, cons, do'es and don'ts?

Personally, I would not use a product that is that expensive, does not kill biofilms, still requires the use of chlorine to destroy biofilms (which indicated it is NOT a fast acting primary sanitizer), does not list its ingredients, has a very vague website, does not provide the science behind how it works but only provides "testimanials" from "users", and (since I am in the USA) is NOT an EPA approved spa sanitizer.

Snake oil is snake oil.

[Rob Holland]

In Germany there is a product on the Spa market "SpaBalancer". Which is a non-chloride product. The price is €109,-/$149,- for 750mL.

http://www.spabalanc...alancer-en.html

Are there any expiriences with SpaBalancer? Pros, cons, do'es and don'ts?

Personally, I would not use a product that is that expensive, does not kill biofilms, still requires the use of chlorine to destroy biofilms (which indicated it is NOT a fast acting primary sanitizer), does not list its ingredients, has a very vague website, does not provide the science behind how it works but only provides "testimanials" from "users", and (since I am in the USA) is NOT an EPA approved spa sanitizer.

Snake oil is snake oil.

[Rob Holland]

Thank you for answer. I use at this moment chloride but the last month we are a bit allergy for Cl. Do you know a good alternative for Cl. We are not allowed to use Br here in the Netherlands.

Thanks,

[waterbear]

Thank you for answer. I use at this moment chloride but the last month we are a bit allergy for Cl. Do you know a good alternative for Cl. We are not allowed to use Br here in the Netherlands.

Thanks,

chlorine allergy is very rare. What type of chlorine do you use? If you are using diclor then it is more likely you have overstabilzation from buildup of cyanuric acid and might have an outbreak of Pseudomonas (hot tub itch).

[aqua]

Hi Newbie,

First of all, please forgive my bad English.

I'm a german dealer of SpaBalancer. I have more than 600 customers using SpaBalancer. I give a money-back-warranty. The last 2 years I only had 8 customers who where not satisfied.

SpaBalancer works without Chlorine. The science behind SpaBalancer is the same as homeopathic medicine. But it is not accepted by science. I don't care. As long as it works.

If you like I send you a bottle of SpaBalancer free of charge. Just give it a try.

[waterbear]

And there is your answer. Homeopathy is questionable at best, there is no real answer HOW the product actually works, and this product is certainly NOT a spa sanitizer.

Caveat emptor.

[aqua]

And there is your answer. Homeopathy is questionable at best, there is no real answer HOW the product actually works, and this product is certainly NOT a spa sanitizer.

Caveat emptor.

The same situation we have in germany. The prof's say it can't work and the customers are just using it and they are happy with it. You are right. Homeopathy is questionable. But some time ago we believed that the world is a plate and it would be very dangerous to get to the edge because of falling down.

[waterbear]

And there is your answer. Homeopathy is questionable at best, there is no real answer HOW the product actually works, and this product is certainly NOT a spa sanitizer.

Caveat emptor.

The same situation we have in germany. The prof's say it can't work and the customers are just using it and they are happy with it. You are right. Homeopathy is questionable. But some time ago we believed that the world is a plate and it would be very dangerous to get to the edge because of falling down.

Then please explain the chemistry of how it works to sanitize the spa water and provide test results showing the control of fecal bacterial and the kill times. If it really works this will be a simple thing to do since this is a pretty much accepted standard for spa water sanitation world wide. If this cannot be provided then I say the product is just more snake oil.

[Rob Holland]

Hi Newbie,

First of all, please forgive my bad English.

I'm a german dealer of SpaBalancer. I have more than 600 customers using SpaBalancer. I give a money-back-warranty. The last 2 years I only had 8 customers who where not satisfied.

SpaBalancer works without Chlorine. The science behind SpaBalancer is the same as homeopathic medicine. But it is not accepted by science. I don't care. As long as it works.

If you like I send you a bottle of SpaBalancer free of charge. Just give it a try.

Hi Aqua, my English is also not very well because I live in the Netherlands. I have read the reviews on your website only the most disadvandage is the costs for 750mL. I have calculated that I need to use at least four bottles per year. I have a 5 persons spa. Please add some comments. Thanks, Rob

[aqua]

Hi Rob,

the cost's are quite high. Thats right. But on the other hand you don't need so many other chemicals. And you don't need to change the water as often as with chlorine. I changed my water after 17 month. And it is much more healthy than chlorine. Chlorine is killing all bakterias on your skin. And your skin needs all the bakteria. Without them, the skin will get dry and itchy. Most of my customers got trouble with their skin after 2 to 3 years with chlorine. And beside, using chlorine will build up trihalomethane in your spa. And this is causing cancer. Also the skin is absorbing chlorine in a high rate. Did you ever smell your skin after you have touched freshly chlorinated water. It smells very strong. For me enough reasons to look for something else.

The 75 ml per week is to much. After 4 weeks you will only need about 40 ml per week. Most of my customers buy 3 to 4 bottles a year. One customer with a Hotspring took only one bottle for a whole year.

SpaBalancer will react with the amount of pollution in the water. It doesn't matter how big the spa is. Having a good ozonator, using the spa 3 times a week with 2 people and you will need only 30 ml each week.

You can try it. If you don't like it you can go on with chlorine without changing water. If you want to have a bottle of SpaBalancer send me a mail: info(at)aqua-whirlpools.de I will send a bootle free of charge.

[waterbear]

Hi Rob,

the cost's are quite high. Thats right. But on the other hand you don't need so many other chemicals. And you don't need to change the water as often as with chlorine. I changed my water after 17 month. And it is much more healthy than chlorine. Chlorine is killing all bakterias on your skin. And your skin needs all the bakteria. Without them, the skin will get dry and itchy.

Please provide some medical references that confirm this

Most of my customers got trouble with their skin after 2 to 3 years with chlorine. And beside, using chlorine will build up trihalomethane in your spa.

NOT if you are shocking the spa and allowing the oxidation byproducts to gas off. Build up of volatile oxidation byproducts is more of a problem with indoor pools that do not have adequate air handlers. Let's get our facts straight and not resort to the scare tactics that 'chlorine is bad."

And this is causing cancer.

Once again, let's stop the scare tactics and get our facts straight.

Also the skin is absorbing chlorine in a high rate. Did you ever smell your skin after you have touched freshly chlorinated water. It smells very strong.

This is the smell of chloramine, not chlorine. Once again let's get our facts straight.

For me enough reasons to look for something else.

The 75 ml per week is to much. After 4 weeks you will only need about 40 ml per week. Most of my customers buy 3 to 4 bottles a year. One customer with a Hotspring took only one bottle for a whole year.

SpaBalancer will react with the amount of pollution in the water. It doesn't matter how big the spa is. Having a good ozonator, using the spa 3 times a week with 2 people and you will need only 30 ml each week.

You can try it. If you don't like it you can go on with chlorine without changing water. If you want to have a bottle of SpaBalancer send me a mail: info(at)aqua-whirlpools.de I will send a bootle free of charge.

Once again I ask you to provide studies that it has fast kill times on fecal bacteria and pseudomonas, which are how spa sanitizers are tested in most of the world.

Clear water is not necessarily SAFE water. Does your product provide safe water and if so, please provide the research to back it up.

[aqua]

Hi Waterbear,

I don't intend to make you angry. And I really appreciate you kowledge. I also was working with chlorine more than 10 years. And I'm still selling chlorine products. And Chlorine is really the strongest disifectant known. But maybe you just read these two artikles:

http://ehp03.niehs.nih.gov/article/fetchArticle.action?articleURI=info:doi/10.1289/ehp.1001959#abstract0

http://www.bidness.com/esd/showering.htm

There are many more artikles. Just search: chlorine, trihalomethane, cancer. You claim that the water has to be free of germs to be clean. You are right. When the water is free of germs it is clean. But when I test spring water I will find millions of germs. Is it polluted? Or is it clean? Has a water to be free of germs? Or only to be free of some special germs?

Yes, we have tested SpaBalancer. Some results are:

SpaBalancer was tested for 12 months in a whirlpool used each week by between 4 and 12 different people. The ozonator was also switched off for 2 months, and it still functioned even then.

After 2 months of use without the ozonator, the water was microbiologically examined by the Dr.Fintelmann laboratory. The result:

Coliform bacteria in 100 ml: <1

(EN ISO 9308-1)

Escherichia coli in 100 ml: <1

(EN ISO 9308-1)

Pseudomonas aeruginosa in 100 ml: <1

(EN ISO 12780)

Legionella in 100 ml: <1

(ISO 11731)

The whirlpool is still in use (12 months without a change of water). The water is clear, clean and odour-free. Cushions are no longer breaking and plastics are no longer attacked.

But there are a lot of germs still in the water. But not each germ is dangerous to the body. And for people who are afraid of germs: You can schock the water with chlorine weekly if you like.

I'm using SpaBalancer for more than two years now. And I'm still alive. The water is always clean, soft and fresh smelling. I don't do anythig except putting 50 ml SpaBalancer into the water. Once a week. All two weeks I clean the filter. Thats it. The water is 15 months old.

I have more than 600 customers. And I give a money-back-warranty. I don't want to cheat people. Please tell me why 600 people are using SpaBalancer and have no problems?

A lot of my customers with asthma, dry and sensitive skin or neurodermatitis can enjoy their spas again. A lot of them didn't use the spa any more. Maybe they did a lot of things wrong. It is not very easy to handle disinfectants. And in Germany we don't have a forum like this where people like you (with a huge knowledge) explain everyting about water care. And then people tend to make mistakes.

Since SpaBalancer is very expensive not many people will use it. But in the end: We are living in a free country. Nobody is forced to buy such a product. When you say, SpaBalancer is snake oil (very interesting expression-we don't have it in german) than it is fine with me. I don't want to persuade you. I just offer something different.

[waterbear]

Hi Waterbear,

I don't intend to make you angry.

You did not make me angry but you are comparing apples to oranges, so to speak.

And I really appreciate you kowledge. I also was working with chlorine more than 10 years. And I'm still selling chlorine products. And Chlorine is really the strongest disifectant known. But maybe you just read these two artikles:

http://ehp03.niehs.n...01959#abstract0

http://www.bidness.c...d/showering.htm

The first is an actual scientific paper and it was an INDOOR swimming pool, as I stated above! The second one deals with showers, which will also be similar to an indoor pool.

If you review the many papers they deal with INDOOR pools and the health problems can be taken care of by making sure there are adequate air handlers in the facility.

Let's keep our facts straight please.

I rest my case.

[Rob Holland]

Thank you for answer. I use at this moment chloride but the last month we are a bit allergy for Cl. Do you know a good alternative for Cl. We are not allowed to use Br here in the Netherlands.

Thanks,

chlorine allergy is very rare. What type of chlorine do you use? If you are using diclor then it is more likely you have overstabilzation from buildup of cyanuric acid and might have an outbreak of Pseudomonas (hot tub itch).

Hi Waterbear,

Sorry for my late reaction: I use ones a week one tablet 20g 90/20 ex Melspring, Cyanuric trichloride (85% active Cl) and to chock Calciumhypochloride granulate (65% active Cl). Further I use a ozonarator and pH plus end minus. Do know better chemicals. Thanks, Rob