New Master Spa Owner

[SpaTechSince1979]

Am I the only one here of the opinion that 95% of members here have zero credibility because of their constant running down the competition. I have never seen an industry like it.

Where is that coming from? If memory serves me right I think last month you may have had issue with someone not being a fan of Coast but how does that equate to using a wide brush on the people on this site.

For myself, I have many posts on this site. When someone asks for a suggestion for what spas I like I mention about 6 brands, not just 1 or 2. I may think there are a handful of top spas and I also may think there are a few to avoid.

As far as what is being said about Master, thats due to their past and present actions. Have you been to one of their shows? Did you look over that fraudulent website they created to dupe people?

[SpaTechSince1979]

You guys crack me up...You say that you don't like Master because of the past and present???

I Stated Facts about them winning awards...

Master Spas have won...

1. 2010 Certified Trade Award from Spa Search

2. 2010 Certified Spa Award from Spa Search

3. The BBB Torch Award for Business Ethics

4. The INSPIRE AWARD given out by our Industry-The Hot Tub Industry's highest award!!!

5. Ernst & Young Entrepreneur of the Year Award

6. The Blue Chip business Award

7. Dr. Gadget's Seal of Approval

8. Consumers Digest Best Buy Award

9. Discovery Channel Chose Master Spas to show everyone "How It's Made"

10. Master Spas have more Certified Spa Retailers than any manufacturer...

That's more credibility than the stuff East TX, Dustin, Spa Tech or Spa Guy make up and consumers can see through it.

You guys get an A for creative writing...

[East TX Spa]

[spatech (the unreal one)]

Hi,

I just purchased a Master Spa TS240 ( 3 person )this was a spur of the moment purchase at a county fair and now I am doing my research. I have a small window of opportunity to change my mind and cancel the purchase so I would be interested in hearing from any Master Spa owners or detractors on your personal experience with the brand. I had never heard of master spa before my purcahse and was actually looking to purchase a Cal Spa but the guy did a great sales job. I was converted primarily because of Lupus and Arthritis Foundation endorsements this was important to me since the spa will be used mostly by husband who has severe scoliosis. This was not a dealer purcahse but rather a direct factory purchase with a price tag of 4,999.00. There is a lcoal dealer in my area in the event I decide to keep it and need service. Let me hear from you.

We shouldn't lose sight of what the original poster was asking,

Caligirl,

As you can see Master is a brand that many have issue with. Some of us have nothing to gain by telling you there are better options out there, we're just telling you what we've know, the choice is yours. The Master apologists try to say that all the complaints are untrue and point to silly things like "awards" which are typically bought and paid for in one way or another. Between the disgraceful traveling spa circus show they tote around the country and that fraudulent website of deception that has been traced back to their corporate guys there is no way some of us will remain silent.

I know it may still seem confusing when you see contradictory statements so maybe the best thing to do is to listen to what regular spa owners say who didn't research before buying like you are doing and regret going with Master:

BILL: Keep running from Master Spas!!!! I bought at their traveling road show.

ELIZABETH: the sales people were as dishonest as could be...I have met with one frustration after another...

DAVID: if you are looking for a tub that works well with good service STAY AWAY FROM MASTER SPA

MICHAEL: Finding someone to work on a Master Spa is like hitting the lottery... I will be sending this hot tub to the land fill

[East TX Spa]

Yes, buyer beware!

Spa, Pool & Patio Customers

Rebate Ripoff

Origin of the Rebate Scam According to a Former Dealer

To be continued in order to protect the consumer.....

[East TX Spa]

Side splitting hilarity....har har har!

Pure Comedic Genius

[East TX Spa]

Oh No...Go!

The human resource gals are pretty good dancers...I wish the whole video was just of them.

[spatech (the unreal one)]

Yes, buyer beware!

Origin of the Rebate Scam According to a Former Dealer

Wow, you found a gem there. That rebate scam from earleir in the decade was a huge black eye for Master but I'd never mentioned it along with their show scams and that website because I hadn't seen a link to corporate Master but you've got it coming directly from someone who was a Master dealer at that time frame.

I laughed when I saw this:

"Master Spas pushed us on this program when it came out. Tim Baele, their sales manager, was the guy that started the whole program in the spa industry."

Isn't that the same name that someone discovered was linked to that overtly fraudulent Master/"hot tub brokers" website that SpaTechSince2010 referred to?

[East TX Spa]

Well, I don't know Tim Baele, but SpatechSince79 said that a Hot Spring Dealer started it. I'm making inquiries to find out if Tim Baele ever worked for Watkins or just who he is, exactly. It's a mystery at this point.

Termie

[THE SPA GUY]

You know i found spatechsince1979 10 list awards, obviously he does not read spa retailer, I know in the latest issue our dealership was recognized as a national treasure in the Northwest, and term you guys were it for the Southwest. so i guess he got us there !!!! so i did not see his dealership on there, did you notice that term...i must have missed it?

[THE SPA GUY]

You guys crack me up...You say that you don't like Master because of the past and present???

I Stated Facts about them winning awards...

Master Spas have won...

1. 2010 Certified Trade Award from Spa Search

2. 2010 Certified Spa Award from Spa Search

3. The BBB Torch Award for Business Ethics

4. The INSPIRE AWARD given out by our Industry-The Hot Tub Industry's highest award!!!

5. Ernst & Young Entrepreneur of the Year Award

6. The Blue Chip business Award

7. Dr. Gadget's Seal of Approval

8. Consumers Digest Best Buy Award

9. Discovery Channel Chose Master Spas to show everyone "How It's Made"

10. Master Spas have more Certified Spa Retailers than any manufacturer...

That's more credibility than the stuff East TX, Dustin, Spa Tech or Spa Guy make up and consumers can see through it.

You guys get an A for creative writing...

o.k what is credibility here.i guess he is calling me out...what a shame......

1. D1 also 2010 Certified Trade Award.....whoa....you got me there!!!!

2. our dealership is a 2010 Certified award dealer...ok thats 2 you are on a roll!!!!

3. BBB grade a local area,oh i believe D1 earnesd that also....man your killn me...

4.same thing i also believe Marquis, Sundance, Hot Springs have all won that one...

5.Ernst & Young entrepreneur also won by D1...still with me....

6.sorry don't know what blue chip award is....ok i give you that one on forfeit....

7.Dr who i read him once, did you get that because he bought Master. i did not know he did survey and checked all high end brands.

8.Consumer Digest Best Buy, (Master was the only company with D1, Hot Springs, Jacuzzi, Marquis, Cal Spas, Clearwater)..did i need to keep going

9. Thats because your high end manufacturers have better things to do then to show each competitor there secrets.... ok you win on this one...

10.More certified dealers than anyone else, i took a quick look , i was getting tired i think there were 2-3 manufacturers ahead, but dealer certified is not the brand , the only way to be audited for certification is a ceritified brand. its put more on the dealership. standing with trade groups, referals, clean store, and espresso stand in your store helps. could not resist needed to laugh.....

11. D1 won Stevies award, business award, oh they beat out microsoft for that.

12. D1 featured high end product in Robb Report.

13. 2004 exporter of the year (San Diego)

14. would you like me to keep going.

15. i bet Hot Springs, SUndnce,JAcuzzi, Marquis to just name a few can do the same thing.

Term,Spatech,Dustin i could not help myself. on the credibilty call here. obviously spatechwetbehindtheears on hear has not read enough of our posts. Term and Spatech have a lot of posts. if i did not sit back since i started on hear in 2006 i would have more posts. i started posting because of the b.s like spatechsince1979 throws around and questions credibilty, has he not seen the thread about him and spabrokers..

[footie]

So what you are saying is that D1 have the same list of achievements as Master Spas do, plus a few more. Call me dumb but surely that gives more credibility to the Masters products because it shows that D1 as a company also value such achievements/awards. I am sure that if we dig deep enough Hotsprings, sundance and quite a few others promote similar awards.

It appears to me that maybe Master Spas is not a bad product at all.

[spatech (the unreal one)]

So what you are saying is that D1 have the same list of achievements as Master Spas do, plus a few more. Call me dumb but surely that gives more credibility to the Masters products because it shows that D1 as a company also value such achievements/awards. I am sure that if we dig deep enough Hotsprings, sundance and quite a few others promote similar awards.

It appears to me that maybe Master Spas is not a bad product at all.

I'll pass on commenting on their product specifically, that is debatable and everyone prefers theirs so I haev no issue with them thinking their product is good whether I agree or not. Its the company itself that is a sham IMO with that traveling show, website of deceit and I won't even comment on that past rebate scam.

As far as those "awards" lol, they're given out like gold stars in kindergarten and therfore mean little yet its what they try to use to refute the bad reputation they've earned.

My favorite is one that is really not an award,

9. Discovery Channel Chose Master Spas to show everyone "How It's Made"

They "chose" Master? LOL, what he forgot to say is that the way that works is you PAY to have your company on that show. Its just a huge advertisement. They don't scour the country choosing who can be on like you've won the lottery. You contact them requesting to be on, they check you out and tell you how much it will cost and you decide if it fits your ad budget.

It's really not much different that the Consumers Digest "award" which is also NOT an award but just a case where you pay to have that gold star.

I have no issue with either the show (I love the show, who doesn't) or the Consumer's Digest "award"; they are simply paid for advertising but when they try to pass it off here as some achievement to indicate your company is special is a joke.

[East TX Spa]

I'll pass on commenting on their product specifically, that is debatable and everyone prefers theirs so I haev no issue with them thinking their product is good whether I agree or not. Its the company itself that is a sham IMO with that traveling show, website of deceit and I won't even comment on that past rebate scam.

As far as those "awards" lol, they're given out like gold stars in kindergarten and therfore mean little yet its what they try to use to refute the bad reputation they've earned.

My favorite is one that is really not an award,

9. Discovery Channel Chose Master Spas to show everyone "How It's Made"

They "chose" Master? LOL, what he forgot to say is that the way that works is you PAY to have your company on that show. Its just a huge advertisement. They don't scour the country choosing who can be on like you've won the lottery. You contact them requesting to be on, they check you out and tell you how much it will cost and you decide if it fits your ad budget.

Master Spa got hosed on that infomercial. The words "Hot Spring" were used two times in the first 43 seconds. The words "Master Spa" were never mentioned.

If I were them, I'd demand a refund.

Termie

[Dr. Spa]

My favorite is one that is really not an award,

9. Discovery Channel Chose Master Spas to show everyone "How It's Made"

They "chose" Master? LOL, what he forgot to say is that the way that works is you PAY to have your company on that show.

This I can confirm. But, I didn't call them, they cold called me...I turned them down. There have also been a number of other "TV shows" that have called with the same "deal". Prices have started at about 10 grand, and go up from there (they typically call it a "production fee"). These days, I just tell them that if they want to charge anything, I'm not interested. Usually they just hang up.

[East TX Spa]

I've never heard of Dr. Gadget, but then I just don't watch much TV. He is apparently a paid spokesperson for consumer products. I'd lend as much credence to his choice of spas to promote as I would to the late Billy Mays constantly trying to sell me Mighty Putty and Kaboom!

Nothing wrong with it, but it is paid advertising....nothing less, nothing more.

Termie

[footie]

Well then, please tell me which awards are important and should hold weight within the industry?

Because as a newcomer to this industry and especially to this forum all I see is a lot of back stabbing among the brands and among the dealers which sell/favour a particular brand. I have no doubt that some brands are better than others but to be honest I don't believe for one moment that the list of brands discussed here are as bad as being made out, maybe I'm wrong on all of this but it appears that everyone on this forum should pick from about 4~5 brands and disguard the rest which is total BS. Sure the odd one or two can be problematic and might have more complaints than some others but I generally find that if you sell a **** lot of product (which in this instance is hot tubs) then you are going to have more faults and unsatisfied customers, even though the percentage of failures haven't increased.

The onus always comes back to the dealer when a fault arises, repair the fault and every one's happy but fail to fulfil your obligation and it's the brand that gets the bad press. A bit like football teams, it's never the players fault, always the manager's.

[Kreg]

Just wanted to thank you guys for all the publicity. Just sold a Master Spa to a customer who saw this thread. He said, "I had to see why your competitors hate you so much!"

[spawn]

Just wanted to thank you guys for all the publicity. Just sold a Master Spa to a customer who saw this thread. He said, "I had to see why your competitors hate you so much!"

Did the "mark" pay the average price listed on hottubbroker.com?

[spatech (the unreal one)]

Well then, please tell me which awards are important and should hold weight within the industry?

Because as a newcomer to this industry and especially to this forum all I see is a lot of back stabbing among the brands and among the dealers which sell/favour a particular brand. I have no doubt that some brands are better than others but to be honest I don't believe for one moment that the list of brands discussed here are as bad as being made out, maybe I'm wrong on all of this but it appears that everyone on this forum should pick from about 4~5 brands and disguard the rest which is total BS. Sure the odd one or two can be problematic and might have more complaints than some others but I generally find that if you sell a **** lot of product (which in this instance is hot tubs) then you are going to have more faults and unsatisfied customers, even though the percentage of failures haven't increased.

The onus always comes back to the dealer when a fault arises, repair the fault and every one's happy but fail to fulfil your obligation and it's the brand that gets the bad press. A bit like football teams, it's never the players fault, always the manager's.

#1) I'd ignore all "awards" to be honest. I'd pay attention to what other consumers have to say and to any spa professionals you think are independent minded (and if you're skeptical on them as I suspect may be the case (which is certainly fine) then just go with what the consumers are saying in as big a sample size as you're willing to research). Also, part of making the decision is what you think when you see the product in person, how it wet tests and what level of confidence you feel with that dealer. In the end it partially about the brand you buy/ how well they stand behind their product and partially about the dealer and their service.

2) I don't think there is widespread back stabbing here. I know you are not happy that one individual who has issues with Coast that debated you on the merits of your brand. That happens but did others jump on board like sharks and back stab your brand in that debate or was that a 1-1 debate?

Otherwise there is mostly the Costco debate and the Master debate; they've been going on for years. Meanwhile there are MANY other brands and there is much respect from one to another. Personally, when someone asks about top brands I'll say things like "D1, Caldera, Hot Spring, Jacuzzi, Marquis and Sundance are my top choices with other like Artesian, Arctic, and Beachcomber also worthy options IMO". I don't say every other brand is crap and neither do others typically. Persoanlly I just give my top choices but having si=uch a list/opinion is not a knock on others like Dynasty, Catalina, LA, Coast, Emerald, Maxx or Bullfrog. Sure, I have said in the past that I'm not a fan of Cal, Master and Thermospas; that's only 3 brands and that's my opinion and in each of those cases its more about the company and how they do business and treat their customers.

I know you may be scarred by that Coast thread and your debate with that person but please don't make it seem like everyone is bashing left and right.

[East TX Spa]

Just wanted to thank you guys for all the publicity. Just sold a Master Spa to a customer who saw this thread. He said, "I had to see why your competitors hate you so much!"

Congratulations! Now THAT is the way to sell product....straight, honest, face-to-face with the customer in your store, being able to see and experience your product in a relaxed environment without the sleazy, high pressure tactics espoused by dealers/regional managers such as SpaTech79.

A double congratulations is in order, I believe. According to SpaTech79's in-depth research, you have SOLD THE VERY FIRST SPA that is a direct result of a consumer's having been to this forum.

Continued success and let us all hope that our local customers are as diligent in their undertakings as yours.

Termie (the Supportive)

[spatech (the unreal one)]

Just wanted to thank you guys for all the publicity. Just sold a Master Spa to a customer who saw this thread. He said, "I had to see why your competitors hate you so much!"

Congrats, I'm glad they bought from your store rather than from the traveling show. Whats my cut for helping you get that sale?

[East TX Spa]

Just wanted to thank you guys for all the publicity. Just sold a Master Spa to a customer who saw this thread. He said, "I had to see why your competitors hate you so much!"

As a favor to all of us (and, if I may be so bold to speak on their behalves, the owners of this forum), I think it would be a WONDERFUL exercise in marketing dynamics if your new customer would relate their experience to the rest of us. I think we could all learn a thing or two about the consumer mindset, which is the primary reason I began frequenting spa forums in the first place.

If they choose not to do this, I certainly understand.

Again, sincere congratulations!

Termie (seeker of knowledge)

[SpaTechSince1979]

You guys crack me up...You say that you don't like Master because of the past and present???

I Stated Facts about them winning awards...

Master Spas have won...

1. 2010 Certified Trade Award from Spa Search

2. 2010 Certified Spa Award from Spa Search

3. The BBB Torch Award for Business Ethics

4. The INSPIRE AWARD given out by our Industry-The Hot Tub Industry's highest award!!!

5. Ernst & Young Entrepreneur of the Year Award

6. The Blue Chip business Award

7. Dr. Gadget's Seal of Approval

8. Consumers Digest Best Buy Award

9. Discovery Channel Chose Master Spas to show everyone "How It's Made"

10. Master Spas have more Certified Spa Retailers than any manufacturer...

That's more credibility than the stuff East TX, Dustin, Spa Tech or Spa Guy make up and consumers can see through it.

You guys get an A for creative writing...

o.k what is credibility here.i guess he is calling me out...what a shame......

1. D1 also 2010 Certified Trade Award.....whoa....you got me there!!!!

2. our dealership is a 2010 Certified award dealer...ok thats 2 you are on a roll!!!!

3. BBB grade a local area,oh i believe D1 earnesd that also....man your killn me...

4.same thing i also believe Marquis, Sundance, Hot Springs have all won that one...

5.Ernst & Young entrepreneur also won by D1...still with me....

6.sorry don't know what blue chip award is....ok i give you that one on forfeit....

7.Dr who i read him once, did you get that because he bought Master. i did not know he did survey and checked all high end brands.

8.Consumer Digest Best Buy, (Master was the only company with D1, Hot Springs, Jacuzzi, Marquis, Cal Spas, Clearwater)..did i need to keep going

9. Thats because your high end manufacturers have better things to do then to show each competitor there secrets.... ok you win on this one...

10.More certified dealers than anyone else, i took a quick look , i was getting tired i think there were 2-3 manufacturers ahead, but dealer certified is not the brand , the only way to be audited for certification is a ceritified brand. its put more on the dealership. standing with trade groups, referals, clean store, and espresso stand in your store helps. could not resist needed to laugh.....

11. D1 won Stevies award, business award, oh they beat out microsoft for that.

12. D1 featured high end product in Robb Report.

13. 2004 exporter of the year (San Diego)

14. would you like me to keep going.

15. i bet Hot Springs, SUndnce,JAcuzzi, Marquis to just name a few can do the same thing.

Term,Spatech,Dustin i could not help myself. on the credibilty call here. obviously spatechwetbehindtheears on hear has not read enough of our posts. Term and Spatech have a lot of posts. if i did not sit back since i started on hear in 2006 i would have more posts. i started posting because of the b.s like spatechsince1979 throws around and questions credibilty, has he not seen the thread about him and spabrokers..

[spatech (the unreal one)]

My favorite is one that is really not an award,

9. Discovery Channel Chose Master Spas to show everyone "How It's Made"

They "chose" Master? LOL, what he forgot to say is that the way that works is you PAY to have your company on that show.

This I can confirm. But, I didn't call them, they cold called me...I turned them down. There have also been a number of other "TV shows" that have called with the same "deal". Prices have started at about 10 grand, and go up from there (they typically call it a "production fee"). These days, I just tell them that if they want to charge anything, I'm not interested. Usually they just hang up.

Thanks, I knew that to be the case but since you've experienced it first hand the confirmation is appreciated. Being on that show is fine and a good advertising opputtunity if you so choose to buy the time BUT to try to pass it off as an achievement/award is the kind of thing that gets so tiring to see.