Spa Prices

[sonomablue]

Hi all. Quick question.

Why is it so impossible to get prices online (even approx, even Mfg suggested) for Spas?

I still have not purchased yet, and am doing my research. I wish to thank the many people of this forum who have responded to my other thread. Your answers and information have been very helpful.

Back to my question, I am very very surprised, that it is such a huge secret "the prices".

I am not naive, nor stupid, so i do realize that (just like with cars) sales people want to get the biggest profit that they can. Therefore, I am not surprised that even IN stores, the prices are not typically marked, nor are they easy to find. But what i did not realize is that it would be so difficult. The manufacturer's brochures do NOT list the prices, not even Manufactuer's Suggested, or List price. At least with automobiles, you can go online, and AT LEAST find the list price or Manufacturer's price. It's almost as if the sales people have to quiet their voice, make sure that no one is listening, and then whisper it in my ear. (I am exaggerating, for the sake of making a point. It should NOT be so impossible to find out what the dang things are going to cost).

I have yet to find any website, even the manufacturer's or a retailer's website, that will list any numbers at all.

To give you an example of how dumb it is. What if the nearest manufacturer of some well known brand is 20 or 30 miles away. So I am supposed to drive 20-30 miles just to find the prices, so that I can see if they are even in the ballpark of what i am planning to spend.

(exception: how many bet that i will hear from a certain 'someone' that a certain big box 'store' DOES list the prices of their spas on the big-box-store's website?). Please, you know who you are, I am asking you ahead of time, please do NOT post your reply in this thread. Thank you for 'hearing' me, and thank you for your consideration, and thank you for NOT posting info about the big-box store's prices. Thank you.)

To all others... have you found any website (i know that we can not post URL's). But if someone has found a website that list Mfg's prices, you can tell me what to google to get to the website. :-)

Thanks all.

[Roger]

Hi all. Quick question.

Why is it so impossible to get prices online (even approx, even Mfg suggested) for Spas?

I still have not purchased yet, and am doing my research. I wish to thank the many people of this forum who have responded to my other thread. Your answers and information have been very helpful.

Back to my question, I am very very surprised, that it is such a huge secret "the prices".

I am not naive, nor stupid, so i do realize that (just like with cars) sales people want to get the biggest profit that they can. Therefore, I am not surprised that even IN stores, the prices are not typically marked, nor are they easy to find. But what i did not realize is that it would be so difficult. The manufacturer's brochures do NOT list the prices, not even Manufactuer's Suggested, or List price. At least with automobiles, you can go online, and AT LEAST find the list price or Manufacturer's price. It's almost as if the sales people have to quiet their voice, make sure that no one is listening, and then whisper it in my ear. (I am exaggerating, for the sake of making a point. It should NOT be so impossible to find out what the dang things are going to cost).

I have yet to find any website, even the manufacturer's or a retailer's website, that will list any numbers at all.

To give you an example of how dumb it is. What if the nearest manufacturer of some well known brand is 20 or 30 miles away. So I am supposed to drive 20-30 miles just to find the prices, so that I can see if they are even in the ballpark of what i am planning to spend.

(exception: how many bet that i will hear from a certain 'someone' that a certain big box 'store' DOES list the prices of their spas on the big-box-store's website?). Please, you know who you are, I am asking you ahead of time, please do NOT post your reply in this thread. Thank you for 'hearing' me, and thank you for your consideration, and thank you for NOT posting info about the big-box store's prices. Thank you.)

To all others... have you found any website (i know that we can not post URL's). But if someone has found a website that list Mfg's prices, you can tell me what to google to get to the website. :-)

Thanks all.

Here in Duluth Minnesota if you ask for a price from one of the sales staff at any of the 4-5 stores you will get an answer. Matter of fact if you investigate online to find the model your interested in and then call them they will give you a price over the phone, no biggy. Have you called your local dealer and told him you have been eyeballing a particular model online and want to know the ballpark cost? And then of course everything is negotiable.

[sonomablue]

Here in Duluth Minnesota if you ask for a price from one of the sales staff at any of the 4-5 stores you will get an answer. Matter of fact if you investigate online to find the model your interested in and then call them they will give you a price over the phone, no biggy. Have you called your local dealer and told him you have been eyeballing a particular model online and want to know the ballpark cost? And then of course everything is negotiable.

Roger, Thanks. I need to add a statement of clarification. When i have asked the price from a salesman, they have answered me, and they have provided the price. Several of the times there has been some type of qualifying statement preceeding it (which i guess is to be expected). Some statement about "If i bring in a stuffed animal for some Charity Kids, then they will knock off $500", or "if i pay cash, then they will knock off 2%", or, "if i buy before the end of the year then ....".

I guess part of my complaint is that the ONLY way to find out the price - is out of the mouth of a salesman (and i am sometimes suspect of a salesman).

The prices are not posted to the spa itself.

There is no price list that is provided to customers (except behind the counters).

There is absolutely no price info on the internet.

What other consumer products are like this? That you can not easily find the price.

Like my first post noted, at least with Automobiles you can easily find the Mfg List price.

And, on the lot, the prices are in the window.

Also, it it not uncommon to find the price over the Internet for cars.

Sure, with cars, there are sales.

And with cars, you can negotiate. You can attempt to say "i want it for $500 over factory cost".

You may or may not get what you are asking for, but you have a mutually agreed upon base number to work from.

Lastly, cars, for the most part, are even more expensive than Spas.

That's all. I guess there is no answer to my question. I am just very surprised, as a new Spa consumer reseracher, to find out how secretive the prices are. Why not just list it? If i can afford it, and i like it, then i will buy it. (That's how it works with TVs, Couches, Refrigerators, etc.).

Oh well. Welcome to the world of spas, right?

[wesj53]

This subject seems to be re-occurring more than most subjects on this forum recently and I'm sure it has something to do with internet and big box store sales policies. As I see it as a consumer, while spas are a retail item, they are a larger ticket item, and therefore prices are subject to negotiation just like cars, furniture, home improvement items, etc.

I agree with Roger that here in Chicago, dealers did give me ballpark prices on specific units I had expressed interest in, but did withhold exact prices because comparing one of their units with an unknown competitior's is not always a fair comparison. With as many product differences and features between mfg models in the market that exist, a dealer can instantly lose a sale over the phone before ever meeting the potential client just because he may have quoted a higher price than a competitor (whose model may not be a fair comparison). It happens to me all the time in the insurance field when current clients of mine compare my price to a solicitation from another company; telling me I'm high but when asked if they are receiving the EXACT same coverages, they have no idea! So the public is not always as educated as they should be. In addition, I hardly ever quote specific COMMERCIAL prices over the phone until I obtain ALL the necessary information from the client including loss information, housekeeping of his business, financial data, etc. Only when I visit a client would I extend credits to a client whom I thought deserved them (or yes, for me to get the order).

Yes, dealers are trying to maximize their incomes which I don't blame them for doing. We are all in our respective fields to make the most amount of $$ honestly and ethically. At some time, consumers must take responsibiltiy to shop around and make educated decisions based on the information they collect. Unfortunately, many times consumers are - quite bluntly - too lazy to travel around and visit multiple dealers like my wife and I did to wet test, discuss mfg differences, and get a feel for the dealer who we would be relying on for many years to come. If all a consumer is interested in is a low price, then he or she should just go down to one of the big box stores and buy a unit there (and I think most dealers would agree with that statement). That's my take on this subject!

[Stevie]

There isn't much more to add to wes' post as it covered most everything.

I would like to add that pricing isn't listed on web sites due to protected territories as well. If you live in an area and get a savings of $500 at a store 300 miles away for the same spa, where are you going to purchase? The reality is that this industry is EXTREMELY COMPETITIVE and no one is making HUGE money on sales in this day and age. If there is a cost difference, it can be based on the cost of doing business in a given region and that specific dealers overhead may be slightly higher. He will be making the same (or similar) margins, but his cost is greater. This could be associated to shipping, cost per sq. ft., etc.

Purchasing from a dealer out of your territory also becomes an issue for warranty & service. Who is looking after that warranty? The dealer 300 miles away?

I want to be clear. Every dealer operates their business as they see fit. Afterall...It's THEIR business! Some display pricing on the spas and some don't. It's not done to piss you off, but rather allow you to understand what you are looking at and then YOU get to determine the value. If it's not there, you leave.

If you want a serious price, you need to invest the time to do so. Walking into a store and asking, "how much is THAT spa...how much is THAT spa", is not intelligent shopping. As I've said many times, shopping by price is a poor way to determine value and you will never be able to clearly determine that by price alone.

There will always be some dealers that play games as in ANY industry and although there are some here that feel EVERY dealer is out to get them, the fact remains that every dealer needs to survive and in order to do so, they need to be comeptitive and honest in their approach. I think you will find that to be true in most instances and you seem sharp enough to know that during your communication with the dealer.

Hope this helps,

Steve

[sonomablue]

This subject seems to be re-occurring more than most subjects on this forum recently and I'm sure it has something to do with internet and big box store sales policies. As I see it as a consumer, while spas are a retail item, they are a larger ticket item, and therefore prices are subject to negotiation just like cars, furniture, home improvement items, etc.

I agree with Roger that here in Chicago, dealers did give me ballpark prices on specific units I had expressed interest in, but did withhold exact prices because comparing one of their units with an unknown competitior's is not always a fair comparison. With as many product differences and features between mfg models in the market that exist, a dealer can instantly lose a sale over the phone before ever meeting the potential client just because he may have quoted a higher price than a competitor (whose model may not be a fair comparison). It happens to me all the time in the insurance field when current clients of mine compare my price to a solicitation from another company; telling me I'm high but when asked if they are receiving the EXACT same coverages, they have no idea! So the public is not always as educated as they should be. In addition, I hardly ever quote specific COMMERCIAL prices over the phone until I obtain ALL the necessary information from the client including loss information, housekeeping of his business, financial data, etc. Only when I visit a client would I extend credits to a client whom I thought deserved them (or yes, for me to get the order).

Yes, dealers are trying to maximize their incomes which I don't blame them for doing. We are all in our respective fields to make the most amount of $$ honestly and ethically. At some time, consumers must take responsibiltiy to shop around and make educated decisions based on the information they collect. Unfortunately, many times consumers are - quite bluntly - too lazy to travel around and visit multiple dealers like my wife and I did to wet test, discuss mfg differences, and get a feel for the dealer who we would be relying on for many years to come. If all a consumer is interested in is a low price, then he or she should just go down to one of the big box stores and buy a unit there (and I think most dealers would agree with that statement). That's my take on this subject!

Wesj53 - you did not specify your response directly at me, but since i started the thread and the issue, i feel, at least in part, that your statements were attributed to me. Therefore, i will respond. If I am mistaken, then feel free to clarify your remarks, and indicate that they were not directed at me.

First, I resent being called "lazy". My complaint above, if you read my first post, was that i did not feel that i should have to drive 20-30 miles just to get a price on a spa. (are you saying that driving 20-30 miles is nothing to you?). In addition, I have been to about 7 Spa retailers. That means i got in my car, and i drove to those locations, and i spoke with those retailers. I spent several hours, driving, walking, standing, observing, etc. I hardly consider that as "lazy".

Second, as for the "big-box" stores. I specifically mentioned big-box stores, and excluded them from my discussion. I have no intention of buying from a big-box store. There is a certain individual who either works for, or who is very supportive of, big-box stores, and i was attempting to kindly communicate to him to please not chime in with info regarding big-box stores.

Third, in my post, I stated prior to you, that Spas are more expensive items, and i compared them to cars. Your statement sounds like you are educating me to that fact. I stated it first. I do realize that Spas are expensive (like cars). However, with automobiles, you can easily find Mfg List price, even on the Internet. And, if you wish to exclude the internet (sounds like you have something against using the internet and technology). Then, also with cars, if you go to a car dealership, and you look at the window of a car for sale, what do you see? You see the price. You see the price. It may or may not be the price that you end up paying, but at least you have a starting point. How about Spas? Have you ever been in a spa retailer that actually lists the price on the Spa.? On the 7 spa dealers that i visited, NONE of them listed any price on the spa.

Fourth, Yes, i do realize that i have to shop around. That i have to wet-test. That i have to talk to dealers about the pro's and con's. However, none of those is a reason to NOT post the price. With cars, I do the same thing (i shop around, i test drive, i talk to dealers and learn of the pro's and con's., etc.) Why is it with cars (that are actually MORE expensive than Spas) that i have to do the same "type" of research, yet with cars, the dealers have no problem posting prices on the cars. Lastly, with cars, you can easily surf the internet and find approx. prices (Mfg List, and even sites like Edmonds, that suggest base prices, etc.).

For what it is worth, I AM going to go through the process, whatever it takes, because i DO want a Spa, and i will purchase a Spa. I am amazed at how protective and defensive you are of "the spa price" process. It makes me think that you are a dealer.

I, like any other decent consumer, realize that i have to drive around, do research, wet-test, talk to dealers, compare options, etc. Why can't you concede that it is somewhat frustrating to obtain prices for Spas. (Imagine if you were looking for a car, and you went to a dealer's lot, and everytime that you found a car on the lot that you liked, you had to call a salesperson over to ask them the price. You might get "frustrated". I bet, instead, that you appreciate the fact that when you go to a car lot, the prices are on the window, so that you get a rough idea. Then, when you have some ballpark ideas of what is in your price range, then you feel more comfortable talking to the dealer, about 2 or 3 models in your 'approx' price range, rather than asking the prices of the 20-30 models that are on the lot).

Lastly, I am not a car dealer. I work in IT with computers/software. Maybe that is my problem, i am not a salesman. I do realize, and i do appreciate, that sales people have to make a decent living. However, posting a Mfg List price does not stop a consumer from shopping.

For you to make some reference regarding consumers only wanting to hear a price - so that they can quickly purchase from a competitor who will sell it for less, raises another issue. There is NO local competition within the same manufacturer. If I want a Sundance Optima, how many dealers do you think there are within 20 miles of my house? The answer is ONE. So, when i get a quote, i have NO other location to go to if i want that Sundance Optima. (and, no, i am certainly not going to drive 30-50 miles to find a cheaper sundance, and pay for delievery charges for a spa that has to be transported 30-50 miles.). If you are knowledgeable on Spas, and if you have done the shopping around that you are encouraging me to do, then YOU already know what i am saying is the truth. There might be 15-20 Spa dealers within my local 20 mile radius, but none of them carry the same manufacturer. So, how does price shopping even apply.

[Roger]

The prices are not posted to the spa itself.

There is no price list that is provied to customers (except behind the counters).

There is absolutely no price info on the internet.

What other consumer products are like this? That you can not easily find the price.

I guess the dealers could do the same thing that they do on vehicles give the MSRP and put it on the sticker on the tub. But then you still wouldn't know what you are going to pay, because how many of us pay the sticker price for a car? Same game.

[wesj53]

First of all sonoma, none of my comments were specifically directed to you.

Secondly, I am not a spa dealer or salesperson; I have been in sales for 30 years in 2 different fields (print supply and insurance) and know how sales companies operate.

Thirdly, I know many foks who own spas who went to the closest 2 stores and made their decisions on convenience, not necessarily the best product or value, which is fine - it's a free country and I don't care.

Fourth, my comment about cars and other big ticket items was added just to remind folks that spas are not the only negotiated-priced items that we all purchase.

Fifth, I have nothing against the internet. I use it everyday in business and for researching, reading, etc. But I don't use it to buy things that require personal visual inspection or testing (like shoes, clothing, etc.)

Sixth, I DID drive about 30 miles to the Arctic dealer (the only one in metro Chicago) to see their units (and this was urban driving; not country so it took me about an hour to get there). But the exercise was part of my due diligence.

Seventh, I don't know why dealers in your area don't list prices. I believe almost every one here in the Chicago area did have signs in front of the units. If they didn't, all I had to do was ask for a price and then negotiate. I don't know why that is such a big deal. And as Steve pointed out, a dealer should be able to give you a ballpark price over the phone; both the Arctic and Vita dealers did it for me before I made the jaunts to their stores.

Lastly, I think you misinterpreted my comment about low pricing. I simply said that if a consumer wants a low priced unit, the box stores are usually the ones that market such products. Again, nothing wrong with that and I was not criticizing those folks who don't want to or can't spend a lot of $$ on a spa. In answer to your question about multiple dealers for the same brand, that is a decision left to the mfg. In our market, we have many, many HS, D1, and Sundance (for example) dealers to choose from. Can a consumer play one off the other? I suppose if you desire to do so. How much can you save by doing it? That's up to the individual consumer to find out for himself. I know people who do this with car purchases. They decide on a specific make and model and then call 10 dealerships to get the lowest price. I would never do that because I don't like when prospective clients call me telling me they have 10 insurance quotes. I elect not to get into a price war, spend hours of my time with a limited chance of getting the business. As you admitted, you are not a salesperson so you don't have any idea what it's like fighting the battle daily. IMO, sales people -regardless of field - deserve every penny they earn. It is a difficult profession and one which most would fail in, let alone ever try!

I hope these answers help you, but in no way was I attacking you personally. Good luck in your search.

[sonomablue]

First of all sonoma, none of my comments were specifically directed to you.

Secondly, I am not a spa dealer or salesperson; I have been in sales for 30 years in 2 different fields (print supply and insurance) and know how sales companies operate.

Thirdly, I know many foks who own spas who went to the closest 2 stores and made their decisions on convenience, not necessarily the best product or value, which is fine - it's a free country and I don't care.

Fourth, my comment about cars and other big ticket items was added just to remind folks that spas are not the only negotiated-priced items that we all purchase.

Fifth, I have nothing against the internet. I use it everyday in business and for researching, reading, etc. But I don't use it to buy things that require personal visual inspection or testing (like shoes, clothing, etc.)

Sixth, I DID drive about 30 miles to the Arctic dealer (the only one in metro Chicago) to see their units (and this was urban driving; not country so it took me about an hour to get there). But the exercise was part of my due diligence.

Seventh, I don't know why dealers in your area don't list prices. I believe almost every one here in the Chicago area did have signs in front of the units. If they didn't, all I had to do was ask for a price and then negotiate. I don't know why that is such a big deal. And as Steve pointed out, a dealer should be able to give you a ballpark price over the phone; both the Arctic and Vita dealers did it for me before I made the jaunts to their stores.

Lastly, I think you misinterpreted my comment about low pricing. I simply said that if a consumer wants a low priced unit, the box stores are usually the ones that market such products. Again, nothing wrong with that and I was not criticizing those folks who don't want to or can't spend a lot of $$ on a spa. In answer to your question about multiple dealers for the same brand, that is a decision left to the mfg. In our market, we have many, many HS, D1, and Sundance (for example) dealers to choose from. Can a consumer play one off the other? I suppose if you desire to do so. How much can you save by doing it? That's up to the individual consumer to find out for himself. I know people who do this with car purchases. They decide on a specific make and model and then call 10 dealerships to get the lowest price. I would never do that because I don't like when prospective clients call me telling me they have 10 insurance quotes. I elect not to get into a price war, spend hours of my time with a limited chance of getting the business. As you admitted, you are not a salesperson so you don't have any idea what it's like fighting the battle daily. IMO, sales people -regardless of field - deserve every penny they earn. It is a difficult profession and one which most would fail in, let alone ever try!

I hope these answers help you, but in no way was I attacking you personally. Good luck in your search.

Wesj53 - thanks for the clarification. Greatly appreciated. A few sent me PMs with more info or questions about the "20-30" miles. Let me post one public piece of information. I commute 75 miles each way to my job (150 roundtrip each day). So, i am capable of driving long distances when i have to. Primarily due to my long commute, i would rather not drive even ONE additional mile, unless i have to. I am tired of driving - every day.

I live in CA Bay Area, and I am not sure why the dealers do not overlap local areas. I have yet to find two local dealers (within 15-20 miles) that carry the same brand/manufacturer. Yet there must be 15 dealers or more within 15-20 miles of my home. And, as i stated, none of the retailers have the prices listed on the tub. So, yes, i am bugged to have to go get the attention of a sales person - just to get a quote. You all know better than me, that the "quote" given to me is most likely a rough quote anyway. Depends on features, sales, cash-only, year end, day of the week, time of the day, etc.

You are probably tired of me comparing it to cars, i extend my apologies. But if i go to a certain dealership, i can tell just by the Mfg Sugg Price, that certain cars are out of my range. Certain Lexus models, certain BMW models, certain Mercedes models, OK all Porsches, all Corvettes, etc. are above my range. When the Mfg List price is $72,000 - it doesn't matter what kind of sale might be going on, it is a waste for me to hear about the 400+ horsepower, the 0-60 time, and all the other features, i will not pay that much for a car.

In the same way, I have a "rough" range for a Spa. This is not my range, but for discussion sake, let's say that my range is $8,000.00 (again it is not my range). If there are spas that list for 12k-15k, and typically go out the door for $10k-12k, then what BENEFIT is it for ME to have the features of those models explained to me. I learn about filter systems, or audio systems, or jets, or pumps, etc. that do not apply in my price range. All you have accomplished is to create a frustrated consumer.

I will end this post with a question to you: Think about any purchase that you make. A car, going out to dinner, a hotel reservation, a house, a stereo, a steak in a grocery store, a shirt in a department store, a new TV, a computer, a ski boat, etc. etc. I am confident that you would feel "frustrated" if every one of those items did not have a price on it. And on every item, you have to go ask a sales person (regardless of how wonderful, how nice, how helful that sales person might be).

I am obviously NOT going to change the way that Spas are priced, and listed, at least not in my area. But, you can bet that dealer who finally makes a sale with me, will know my thoughts on prices. :-)

Best Regards to all...

[Roger]

i can tell just by the Mfg Sugg Price, that certain cars are out of my range.

I can give you the MSRP on any D1 model you would like.

[sonomablue]

I can give you the MSRP on any D1 model you would like.

Since you are offering... (thanks)

Lotus Day (Bay Collection)

Nautilus (Reflections)

Wayfarer (Home HotTubs).

thanks

[geenosr]

Hi Sonoma Blue,

I can sympathize with you, because I felt the same frustration when I was doing 'research' for my recent spa purchase. I like to investigate on the Internet about all the details I can find out about, and then armed with decent knowledge--march out into the dealerships to talk and wet test spa tubs. I could not find any unified information about price, repair occurances, and general knowledge except for very biased information coming from people who have a vested interest on a particular model. Finally I gave up looking on the Internet, and went out to do my homework in dealer stores. This is not fun for me because I have many back and knee problems, and I wear out quickly---Hence the need for a good "therapy" tub--not a party tub. I was extremely disappointed that Consumers Reports only reviewed whirlpool bathtubs and not portable spa tubs. In the end, I got what I wanted, but it took several months, when it should have taken several weeks instead. Good luck with your search, and when you get close to a decision, wet test, wet test, wet test! I thought I wanted several tubs until I tested them, and then went in different directions.

Thanks,

geenosr

[Roger]

Since you are offering... (thanks)

Lotus Day (Bay Collection)

Nautilus (Reflections)

Wayfarer (Home HotTubs).

thanks

I'm sorry I forgot to look at the forum at the office. Please send me a PM as a reminder blue. I will give you them quick in the morning.

[jmendoza17]

Woild you mind sharing what you learned from wet testing?

[Brulan1]

Woild you mind sharing what you learned from wet testing?

Old japanese saying: He who buy tub gets what he pays for

[paintnsunni]

Old japanese saying: He who buy tub gets what he pays for

Can you please share what your refering to as to a good spa versus a bad spa?

[jmendoza17]

Probably one that works properly from the start. That means it aint a Hydrospa.

[Brulan1]

Can you please share what your refering to as to a good spa versus a bad spa?

Top 10 spas:

No paticular order of what is better:

1) Sundance 2) Coleman 3) Artic 4) Master spa 5) Marquis 6) Hotsprings 7) Jacuzzi 8) Caldera 9) L.A. spas 10) Cal spas

Some bad ones

1) Hyrdo 2) thermospas 3) Aspen spas 4) softtub 5) other unrebutable companies.

[Stevie]

paintnsunni'

Please educate us as to why you list the spas in that order? What makes them more unreliable?

It was quite clear that Brulan stated: "Top 10 spas: No paticular order of what is better:"

[Guzz]

Please educate us as to why you list the spas in that order? What makes them more unreliable?

That's his opinion, mine would be, HotSprings, Sundance, D1, Marquis,Tiger River, Caldera, Coleman, Artic, Jacuzzi, LA spas.

[Brulan1]

That's his opinion, mine would be, HotSprings, Sundance, D1, Marquis,Tiger River, Caldera, Coleman, Artic, Jacuzzi, LA spas.

D1 is up there too, can't forget about that!

[paintnsunni]

D1 is up there too, can't forget about that!

How are these as to priceing? what do they cost in general for the models?

[Guzz]

How are these as to priceing? what do they cost in general for the models?

Why, are you thinking of buying one?

[paintnsunni]

Why, are you thinking of buying one?

Just wondering what they sell for? No one seems to know is all, what's the secret?

[Stevie]

Just wondering what they sell for? No one seems to know is all, what's the secret?

I want to know how much a Chrysler 300C is?