Pool Pump Priming Problems

[newtothepool]

Hi all,

I just bought a new home with a pool and I am trying to get as much info as possible on some problems I am having. My pool is approx. 13.5K gallons with a Sta-Rite 1hp pump and a Hayward DE filter. I have been told that the Sta-Rite models are notorious for leaking causing problems with suction. I have trouble trying to prime the pump each time I open it to clean the basket. I try and try with a garden hose filling the basket and eventually am able to get it to prime. And each time I turn the pump off a small amount of water squirts out from under the lid. I have been told this is normal, but I am looking for advice. The lid does go on tight and the seal or o-ring seems to be in good shape. Once primed it seems to be ok, but I just installed a Hayward Navigator cleaner and realized that my pump is not staying primed each time it turns off. I'm worried that I am going to run my pump when dry (set to run from 10 pm to 1 am) and eventually burn it out. Any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

[Pool-newb]

You don't want to let the pump start automatically if it won't prime or if it loses it's prime.

I have no experience with that pump (I am also new here) but I did have plumbing problems when I first got my pool. Here are some general things I would look at while you wait for someone more knowledgeable to answer about that pump.

Priming the pump with a garden hose could be difficult because the water you're trying to spray in is just going through the plumbing back down to the pool.

Inspect the plumbing on the suction side from the pump down to where the pipes go into the ground. If there are any valves. make sure they are open and that nothing is leaking (sucking air). If you do have functioning valves on the suction side you could close them whenever you want to clean the basket and that should keep the basket area full of water. I replaced all my above ground plumbing last year and I put a ball valve on every pipe that came out of the ground. It makes it very easy to maintain prime while I clean the pump basket or do anything else to the system.

I would also re-re-re inspect the rubber o-ring on the lid, maybe even replace it. I cannot imagine that it is normal for water to squirt out from the lid seal. Remove it (if you can without damaging anything), make sure there is no foreign matter between it and the sealing surfaces, then put some pool lube on it.

Pool lube is a grease much like Vaseline but is made specifically for pool applications (don't use Vaseline!) that will help the o-ring seat and seal. Local pool store should have it.

After you've done all this watch the pump while it's running. Does the pump strained basket area fill with air or does it fill fully with water with no air bubbles?

If everything is perfect you will see nothing but water in the strained basket while the pump is running - no bubbles, no air.

If you're seeing huge amounts of air, or if the basket never gets mostly full of water you have a leak or some other problem.

[Pool Clown]

When you turn the pump off, do you get bubbles that start to float to the surface (inside the pump pot)? Where the pot and the rest of the pump come together is there four bolts that holds it together? Or is it one piece from the pot to the steel band?

[ps558]

Hi all,

I just bought a new home with a pool and I am trying to get as much info as possible on some problems I am having. My pool is approx. 13.5K gallons with a Sta-Rite 1hp pump and a Hayward DE filter. I have been told that the Sta-Rite models are notorious for leaking causing problems with suction. I have trouble trying to prime the pump each time I open it to clean the basket. I try and try with a garden hose filling the basket and eventually am able to get it to prime. And each time I turn the pump off a small amount of water squirts out from under the lid. I have been told this is normal, but I am looking for advice. The lid does go on tight and the seal or o-ring seems to be in good shape. Once primed it seems to be ok, but I just installed a Hayward Navigator cleaner and realized that my pump is not staying primed each time it turns off. I'm worried that I am going to run my pump when dry (set to run from 10 pm to 1 am) and eventually burn it out. Any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Water is not suppose to squirt out of any pump lid. If water quirts outs air can get and thus you lost prime. Them sta rite lids are not are a pain. try replacing the lid oring. If it is a lid that does not have a handle that you can put your hand around, replace that too

[newtothepool]

When you turn the pump off, do you get bubbles that start to float to the surface (inside the pump pot)? Where the pot and the rest of the pump come together is there four bolts that holds it together? Or is it one piece from the pot to the steel band?

thanks for the response.... Yes when I shut the pump off I do start to see air bubbles coming into the basket which seems to cause the water level to diminish. I will have to take a closer look at the pump to see if there are four bolts or if it is a one piece unit. I am pretty sure that there are the four bolts you are asking about. Someone else gave me the reccomendation of having a check / ball valve installed to prevent water from leaving the filter? I started the pump again today and had more trouble getting it to prime, on another suggestion I opened the bleed valve at the top of the filter to relieve the air and I think it may have helped. I am still wondering if some of this problem is somehow coming from my new hayward navigator pool cleaner? Once the pump is primed and running the air bubbles returning to the pool do go away so I am hoping that this is an above ground issue and not one below the concrete deck.....

[Pool-newb]

Where do the air bubbles appear - from the lid, from the input side, output side, or elsewhere.

- If they're from the lid, clean and lube the gasket - maybe even replace.

- If they're from the input (suction) side, it's a plumbing problem

- If they're from the output side (going towards the pump impeller and motor) it's probably a pump problem

- anywhere else could indicate a hairline crack in the pump body that may not be visible if the pump is turned off.

This is all assuming that there is no water leaking out anywhere when the pump is running or off.

[UncleOllie]

Hi all,

I just bought a new home with a pool and I am trying to get as much info as possible on some problems I am having. My pool is approx. 13.5K gallons with a Sta-Rite 1hp pump and a Hayward DE filter. I have been told that the Sta-Rite models are notorious for leaking causing problems with suction. I have trouble trying to prime the pump each time I open it to clean the basket. I try and try with a garden hose filling the basket and eventually am able to get it to prime. And each time I turn the pump off a small amount of water squirts out from under the lid. I have been told this is normal, but I am looking for advice. The lid does go on tight and the seal or o-ring seems to be in good shape. Once primed it seems to be ok, but I just installed a Hayward Navigator cleaner and realized that my pump is not staying primed each time it turns off. I'm worried that I am going to run my pump when dry (set to run from 10 pm to 1 am) and eventually burn it out. Any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

If that lid is on tight and still spits water just replace it and clean the living daylights out of all that old gunk around the lid and pump pot.. When you get it to prime again pay close attention to the valve in front of the pump (usually a three way Jandy valve.) Lean down and listen for any sucking noise. You won't see water leak when it is running but when you shut the pump off watch the center of the valve handle. If it spits a little water, you'll need to either replace the o-rings or the diverter. Don't forget the nipples that thread into the front of the pump. Those schedule 80, male adapters or CPVC nipples will shrink if the pump runs dry or had ran dry for too long. You may be able to see water squirt out between the front of the pump housing and that nipple when you shut it off. Sorry if I am rambling on, hope this helps you.

[newtothepool]

Hi all,

I just bought a new home with a pool and I am trying to get as much info as possible on some problems I am having. My pool is approx. 13.5K gallons with a Sta-Rite 1hp pump and a Hayward DE filter. I have been told that the Sta-Rite models are notorious for leaking causing problems with suction. I have trouble trying to prime the pump each time I open it to clean the basket. I try and try with a garden hose filling the basket and eventually am able to get it to prime. And each time I turn the pump off a small amount of water squirts out from under the lid. I have been told this is normal, but I am looking for advice. The lid does go on tight and the seal or o-ring seems to be in good shape. Once primed it seems to be ok, but I just installed a Hayward Navigator cleaner and realized that my pump is not staying primed each time it turns off. I'm worried that I am going to run my pump when dry (set to run from 10 pm to 1 am) and eventually burn it out. Any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

If that lid is on tight and still spits water just replace it and clean the living daylights out of all that old gunk around the lid and pump pot.. When you get it to prime again pay close attention to the valve in front of the pump (usually a three way Jandy valve.) Lean down and listen for any sucking noise. You won't see water leak when it is running but when you shut the pump off watch the center of the valve handle. If it spits a little water, you'll need to either replace the o-rings or the diverter. Don't forget the nipples that thread into the front of the pump. Those schedule 80, male adapters or CPVC nipples will shrink if the pump runs dry or had ran dry for too long. You may be able to see water squirt out between the front of the pump housing and that nipple when you shut it off. Sorry if I am rambling on, hope this helps you.

no I appreciate the info. unfortunately I am learning as I go here. The one thing I did notice is that there are really no valves on this system. There was at one time a spa also connected to the system but that was removed before I bought the house. There is one main suction line coming into the equipment area and no valves. I do have two "main drains" at the bottom of the pool and the skimmer. Im not sure how unusual it is to only have the one line coming in, I know If I had my choice I would have a valve(s) and be able to isolate parts of the system. There was a small leak in the discharge side of the pump, and the home warranty company came out and used some type of silicone to fix it. I will try and get a closer look and see if I can tell where exactly the air bubbles are coming from. I will also try and clean the basket lid again and get some lubricant/sealer to help close off any leaks. But from what I have read on some other blogs there are pumps that are known to relieve excess pressure from the lid when the pump is stopped to prevent overpressurizing the pump? I am also replacing my heater in the very near future so I am going to see if they can replace all of my above ground fittings i hopes that I can find and eliminate any air leaks.

[Pool Clown]

It is normal for the sta-rite pump to spit a little bit of water out between the pot and the lid just at the instant the pump is shut off.

there is a gasket where those four bolts are, and that is probably where you are loosing prime from. Take the 4 bolts out, spread the two apart just enough to get the old gasket out, (you don't need to cut any plumbing) maybe kind of a paper gasket and replace with same, or rubber type (try to avoid the real thick ones).

[newtothepool]

It is normal for the sta-rite pump to spit a little bit of water out between the pot and the lid just at the instant the pump is shut off.

there is a gasket where those four bolts are, and that is probably where you are loosing prime from. Take the 4 bolts out, spread the two apart just enough to get the old gasket out, (you don't need to cut any plumbing) maybe kind of a paper gasket and replace with same, or rubber type (try to avoid the real thick ones).

I appreciate the help, I will give that a try. I was playing with it again today and I noticed when I turn the pump off I start to hear a "gurgleing / bubbling" sound in the filter. So I will try the gasket idea and also check into having a check valve put in the discharge line before the filter.

Thanks again

[95_240]

It is normal for the sta-rite pump to spit a little bit of water out between the pot and the lid just at the instant the pump is shut off.

there is a gasket where those four bolts are, and that is probably where you are loosing prime from. Take the 4 bolts out, spread the two apart just enough to get the old gasket out, (you don't need to cut any plumbing) maybe kind of a paper gasket and replace with same, or rubber type (try to avoid the real thick ones).

I appreciate the help, I will give that a try. I was playing with it again today and I noticed when I turn the pump off I start to hear a "gurgleing / bubbling" sound in the filter. So I will try the gasket idea and also check into having a check valve put in the discharge line before the filter.

Thanks again

If you hear the filter draining down then you probably have a pressure side leak. Whoever came out and used silicone to fix your plumbing obviously didn't know what they were doing. Silicone would only be a temporary fix. Another likely spot would be the nipple on the top of the pump.

[txpoolguy]

Any time there is a leak in the system, the gurgling sound in the filter will be normal. Since you are trying to hold water above the water level, the plumbing and equipment must be airtight, or you will hear the gurgling a few moments after the pump shuts down. It is an indication that the water is draining back into the pool, due to the air leak.

As mentioned previously, replace and lubricate the pump lid o-ring, taking care to clean the seating surfaces of the o-ring, which are the underside of the clear pump lid, and the groove that the oring rests in. Use a silicone based lubricant (not a sealant) on all your pool equipment o-rings. Other types of lubricant (teflon base, petroleum base) will cause your o-rings to deteriorate prematurely. Silicone lubes cost a little more, but are well worth it.

If there are ANY visible leaks when the pump is running, no matter how small they may be, get them fixed, as they allow air to seep into the system when it is not pressurized.

Often, water spitting out of a location at the moment that the pump shuts off, is an indication of a leak. Usually, you will see this on the suction or inlet side of the pump, rather than the return or pressure side of the pump. Check all gaskets, as previous posts suggest.

While valves can be beneficial in some instances, you should not need one, unless your pump sits below the normal pool water level. If there are no leaks, there will be no drain-down, and no need for any other check valves. If you feel that you must install a valve, use a valve that can be manually adjusted, not the check valve.

[Pool-newb]

...

While valves can be beneficial in some instances, you should not need one, unless your pump sits below the normal pool water level. If there are no leaks, there will be no drain-down, and no need for any other check valves. If you feel that you must install a valve, use a valve that can be manually adjusted, not the check valve.

Hey TX

When I replaced the above ground part of my plumbing I put in ball valves and disconnects and all 5 pipes (skimmer, drain and 3 return lines). I am very happy I did for several reasons;

- When I clean the pump basket I don't lose prime, the basket, filter and plumbing stays full of water.

- when I vacuum I can close off the drain and leave only the skimmer

- when I have any sort of problem I can troubleshoot - for example if air is coming into the pump or I'm losing prime for some reason

All in all it just gives me much more flexibility.

[txpoolguy]

Was this the replumb you did after the wood stove incident? LOL

I don't mind valves or even unions, but with only a single line coming into his pump, the valve won't do much for him, and will be one more potential air leak in future years and added expense now. For most people, simpler is better.

Since most pumps are "self-priming", a valve isn't normally needed to prevent loss of prime, unless the pump sits 3' or more above water level in pool. He won't be able to turn the valve to isolate the skimmer for vacuuming, as he doesn't have the separate plumbing lines.

You are also a very "hands-on" pool owner, and many don't have the time or interest that you do. Your pool is your hobby...hence the wood stove, lol.