New Tub Pros And Cons

[rabbit_ears]

Looking at replacing my old Maax spa with a new one (but probably not 'til spring now). My old tub was wired with 8ga so i'll have to trench and run 6ga and there's a foot of snow out now. anyways have narrowed my search to four brands; Paragon, Beachcomber, Arctic and Bullfrog.

I've looked at others but i have some logistics problems as far as where the steps in the spa are in relation to the pumps as the tub is set at the end of the deck and if the pumps are under the steps i wouldn't have access unless i drained the tub and pulled it out. also eliminated some other fine tubs (caldera/hotsprings) because i don't trust the dealer.

As far as equipment goes i think i've decided that i want circ pump but leaning away from an ozonator. might consider uv in its place though. i don't have an ozonator on my current tub so i don't have any experience with it, but there seem to be a lot of people having problems with them and their settings and ruining pillows and underside of covers. is this a fair statement? anybody have any experience with uv in a tub?

Paragon and Arctic both use modified version of the thermopane insulating principle which i like, because it makes sense to capture that heat and gives access to plumbing etc. Bullfrog and beachcomber are both full foam which has a proven history. however arctic and beachcomber both use wooden framing structure while the others use composite. which i think is better for a wet environment, not that it should be wet but things happen.

if any of you are familiar with paragon and are thinking that all paragon tubs have their pumps under the steps so why are they in the running? i live in southern ontario, a couple hours from the factory and my dealer called them and they are willing to reroute plumbing to put the pumps wherever necessary to accommodate me. also willing to raise a couple of the seats (2-4") as my wife is a foot shorter than i am and most of the seats in the paragon tubs are deep.

all things being equal where would you put your money? if price difference between each tub was negligible, wet tests proved all to be equally comfortable and each dealer had good service what factors would you look at to base your final decision? should i be concerned with wooden substructure rotting? what is the life expectancy of a tub? is there any one of the brands that i've chosen that clearly doesn't belong with the others? is there one that stand out above the rest? if so why?

i'm pretty sure any one of these will be a step up from what i currently have and a substantial savings in operating cost.

PLEASE HELP ME SPEND MY HARD EARNED MONEY WISELY.

[Water Boy]

Hello Rabbit,

Arctic Spas also offers a maintenance free cabinet if you don't want to go with the cedar cabinet. It is available in three different color choices. I took the following from the Arctic Spa website:

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Forever Flex cabinets are a stylish, carefree alternative to out cedar range. The entire cabinet is constructed from composite fibreglass.

The exterior of the tub has specialized Eon panelling, creating an impervious and maintenance free spa.

The panelling comes in a choice of colors and can be removed for access. Should you wish to change colors or renew the panels these can be easily replaced independently of the spa.

Their sleek design gives a modern look to any location.

[rabbit_ears]

thanks waterboy, i know about the composite skirting for the arctic (and there's no way i wouldn't go that route after what i went through with the cedar skirt on my current tub-painted green when i moved in, spent weeks stripping and re-staining). i was referring to the wood framing inside. maybe it's not a big deal because my house is framed with wood but if there's a possibility for rot, mold, insect/rodent damage why not avoid it?

[Roger]

thanks waterboy, i know about the composite skirting for the arctic (and there's no way i wouldn't go that route after what i went through with the cedar skirt on my current tub-painted green when i moved in, spent weeks stripping and re-staining). i was referring to the wood framing inside. maybe it's not a big deal because my house is framed with wood but if there's a possibility for rot, mold, insect/rodent damage why not avoid it?

The wood framing on most quality tubs will outlast the tub and is usualy warrantied as such. Think of it this way. What lasts long a cedar or treated deck or the weber grill sitting on it? I would not make framing material one of my top prioritys. I would consider the price you are comfortable with, the comfort you have in the dealer and on your butt when you test.

[Water Boy]

thanks waterboy, i know about the composite skirting for the arctic (and there's no way i wouldn't go that route after what i went through with the cedar skirt on my current tub-painted green when i moved in, spent weeks stripping and re-staining). i was referring to the wood framing inside. maybe it's not a big deal because my house is framed with wood but if there's a possibility for rot, mold, insect/rodent damage why not avoid it?

Rabbit,

If you go with the Flex cabinet option on the Arctic, it doesn’t use a wood frame at all. It is all constructed of fiberglass composite, including the forever floor. Arctic only uses a wood frame on the cedar cabinet spas, but they don’t on the flex cabinet spas. Here is apicture of the flex cabinet that shows the fiberglass composite frame. Hope that helps some. Good luck in your search for the perfect spa Rabbit ears!!

[Hillbilly Hot Tub]

Out of the tubs you have mentioned and what we see i the field, I would steer toward Arctic, although we are not personally farmilar with Paragon. Also, if there is a dealer nearby, I would look at Clearwater spas. They have all the features you mentioned above.

Good luck!

[soakerguy]

thanks waterboy, i know about the composite skirting for the arctic (and there's no way i wouldn't go that route after what i went through with the cedar skirt on my current tub-painted green when i moved in, spent weeks stripping and re-staining). i was referring to the wood framing inside. maybe it's not a big deal because my house is framed with wood but if there's a possibility for rot, mold, insect/rodent damage why not avoid it?

Rabbit,

If you go with the Flex cabinet option on the Arctic, it doesn’t use a wood frame at all. It is all constructed of fiberglass composite, including the forever floor. Arctic only uses a wood frame on the cedar cabinet spas, but they don’t on the flex cabinet spas. Here is apicture of the flex cabinet that shows the fiberglass composite frame. Hope that helps some. Good luck in your search for the perfect spa Rabbit ears!!

I really like the colour coded hoses and fiberglass frame but what is with the radiator band clamp fittings on the larger return lines? The only time I see that is when there has been a leak and a field repair is made on a spa. Is this radiator band clamp standard from the factory or has this spa leaked at the connections? All the other connections have the friction clamp and glue/primer connections as on most spas.

[Water Boy]

Hey Soaker,

The clamps are installed at the factory on all of the larger return fittings as sort of a emergency backup plan if the glue joints were to ever fail. This picture was taken on a brand new spa on delivery.

[rabbit_ears]

Hillbilly;

could you be a little more specific about the things you see in the field? do you get more service calls for the other brands than you do for arctic? a lot of other dealers that i talk to when i mention i've been shopping around and am considering arctic amongst other brands pretty much verbatim they mention about how small the access panels are on the arctic. is this a warranted concern? i know it's somewhat biased and jaded coming from other dealers but the fact that they all say the same thing?

what are you thoughts about my other questions:

• circ pump over programmed main pump?
• UV over ozonator?

[Tom]

however arctic and beachcomber both use wooden framing structure

Thank you for your interest in our product.

I hope you have a chance to see and inspect an Arctic Spa because we do NOT use a wooden frame.

* An Arctic Spa has a self-supporting hull reinforced with two layers of hand-rolled fiberglass; it does not require a frame.

* The cedar cabinet serves to give additional support around the lip where people sit. We use premium grade clear Western Red Cedar which is naturally resistant to moisture, rot, and insects. Even unmaintained, it has a life expectancy of up to 100 years so we think it's a good choice. (Of course, occasional attention will help keep it looking beautiful!)

* The Eon version has a fiberglass composite cabinet -- as shown in the photo (thanks, Water Boy!) -- for the same reason. The Eon panels are decorative and serve no structural purpose. Even the "no maintenance" Eon will benefit from an occasional wash with a car brush and a hosing down to keep it looking good.

* The Forever Floor is pressure-molded fiberglass. It's impervious to moisture, insects, vermin.

* The only wooden support structures are at points where a cover lifter might be attached.

a lot of other dealers that i talk to when i mention i've been shopping around and am considering arctic amongst other brands pretty much verbatim they mention about how small the access panels are on the arctic.

LOL I do hope you get to see one. I assure you that the access panels are of sufficient size (check the photo), and there are two panels on each side of most models for a total of eight access panels. Some smaller models have only six.

If you hear that "the unsupported hoses flop around" in an Arctic Spa, just take a look at the size of the water hoses in the photo, if nothing else, and decide how floppy they look. Then if you have a chance to look inside an Arctic, note all the places where the hoses are spot-tacked with foam.

Wishing you happy spa shopping

Tom

[rabbit_ears]

my short list has been shortened to 3. Bullfrog is out because it's like sitting on the ground. the spa is deep enough to keep most of my upper body submersed but the footwell is really shallow, which is ok if you're alone but put even one other person and you'll be playing footsies unless you both tuck your knees under your chin. this is not something that was readily apparent just looking at the tub but was evident within 5 seconds by dry testing.

i plan on doing the same thing with an arctic sometime soon.

i checked out beachcomber and dry tested one this afternoon as well and it seems like a really nice unit. comfortable, well built and the dealer is great-family owned business that's been selling the brand for 17 years. not a whole lot of info on this site about beachcomber though. i read/heard somewhere that 1 in 3 hot tubs sold in Canada is a beachcomber. i'm sure the percentage is less south of the 49th but that still a lot of tubs. the only slightly negative things i've read about them was an undersized heater that would drop a couple degrees when in use in the winter. that problem has apparently been rectified with a 5.5kW heater.

i haven't made up my mind entirely yet, although it's starting to sound like i have.

i will report my thoughts regarding the other two manufacturers on my list (Arctic and Paragon) after closer examination and dry/wet testing.

i also think i've decided to definitely go with a circ pump but no ozone; i just don't see the benefits if you can maintain proper water chemistry without it. just added maintenance costs.

Again any personal experience with Beachcomber, Arctic or Paragon that you could share would be greatly appreciated.

[rabbit_ears]

visited my local Arctic dealer today and ruled out the Yukon because of pump placement and inaccessibility for my situation. also i didn't care for the seating. there's only one seat deep enough for me (i'm only 6'2"), all other seats had the head rest not on my head but between my shoulder blades. i could slouch so that the headrest were where they should be but the deep contoured seating is somewhat prohibitive. which brings me to the seat which was deep enough, it had the same issue as the bullfrog where it was like sitting on the ground, though not as bad because they've sunk the back of the seat and raised the front giving a little more of a footwell. i also found this seat a little restrictive (a little bit too deep contour). I am going to go back to the dealer to test drive the Glacier which they have in the show room filled with water; allegedly running with the pump unplugged to show that it maintains 103° from the heat captured from the pump during the filtering cycle, of course they wouldn't tell me what the filter cycle was set for (24hrs?) and also a little curious as two of the access panels were removed on the pump side. never-the-less the people here seems to like them (doesn't hurt that the moderators work for the company) so i figure they're worth a look. not exactly budget tubs though at almost $2K more than a beachcomber.