D.P. Roberts

I'm not sure about that particular model, but the Platinum series Artesians are well liked by lots of people. Those tubs have a lot of great features - I'm no expert, but if I had my choice I'd pick an Artesian platinum over any other type of tub. Do a search for reviews on the other platinum series tubs, like the Piper Glen or Dove Canyon.

Check out this site for replacement parts. I'm not sure if it's the exact same stereo or not.

As has been mentioned above, summer in Florida doesn't tell us much. Most of your electricity usage with a spa is from the heater, so I can't imagine your heater has run at all in Florida (mine never ran in Ohio during the summer).

I did a search and could not find a link to the article. The FAQ link on rhtubs does not exists. Do you have a link to the article? This link worked for me: http://www.rhtubs.com/bbs/FAQ.htm

The advice above is really good. If you decide not to go with an indoor hot tub, most people look at a jetted bathtub instead. The main drawbacks to those are A) You have to fill them each time you want to use them, Their jets & therapy are not nearly as good as a stand-alone hot tub, and C) Their plumbing can harbor bacteria (water sits in the pipes after you drain it). I was looking at the same thing, and ran across a company called Sanijet. They make jetted tubs with jets & plumbing that can easily be removed for cleaning, & the therapy looks better than what one normally finds in a jetted tub. You might want to check them out.

I was just at my Sundance dealer today - I didn't look at the Solo, but I looked at most of the other models and that sounds like a pretty good price to me. Most of the tubs near that in size (2-3 seat Sundance tubs) were close to $6000.

Do a search here for the "vermonter" method of chemical maintenance. Most people would recommend dichlor (chlorine) over bromine- there's nothing wrong with bromine, most of us just find chlorine to be easy and odor-free when used correctly. Congrats on the Altamar. Good luck, and keep us posted!

My advice would be to not be scared of full foam spas, and broaden your search. The whole "finding a leak in a full foam spa" is way overblown. If you do a search here or at other spa forums you will find that most people would agree. Among others, I would include Hot Spring, Sundance, Jacuzzi, Caldera, Dimension One, Marquis, and Artesian in your search, just to name a few.

1) I'll second what the two guys mentioned above about those two sites. If they can't help you on those two boards, no one on the internet can. 2) Have you tried calling a nearby Sundance dealer for help? If you explain the problem over the phone they may have some suggestions for you.

Scion does that too. Apparently, the "younger" generations aren't into haggling. The plethora of data available on the internet is slowly making price information more available to everyone, making haggling unnecessary. I wouldn't be surprised if "no haggle" soon becomes a thing of the past, for hot tubs and cars as well.

Being somewhat of a stereo / home theater nut, I've always known that most manufacturers overcharge for their stereo systems. After reading through all the threads going today about music systems, I'm wondering if anyone has gotten a quote from a major manufacturer for a stereo system. I know that some of these systems may have features that aren't readily available to the home installer, such as transducers mounted to the shell, etc. However, I think it would be interesting to hear how much dealers are asking for music systems. Has anyone gotten a quote lately?

I agree with Jim. I was looking at this unit here because you can get a floating remote with it. Only $300 for the unit, remote, and a waterproof box to mount it in. A DC converter is $50, but then you have to find a waterproof place to put it, I haven't figured out that part yet. If we ever get around to getting a spa, we're going to put it next to a privacy screen, so we'll just mount speakers at ear level on the screen. In my humble opinion, Definitive Technology makes the best speakers in the world, and they make outdoor speakers you can read about here. Pricey at $400 per pair, but great.

Here's the Dolphin for anyone interested. My question - the Dolphin says it can control the hot tub as well. I'm still a little confused about controlling the spa functions. Wouldn't you need an R/F receiver hooked up to the spa in order for the remote to work? The manual also says that your remote might accidentally control your neighbor's tub. That could be a whole lot of fun!

No, metal framing is the only way to go. Wood will all go to rot in a few years, and your hot tub will fall apart. Wait a minute. My house is framed in wood. Uh oh. I'd better move out before the whole thing falls apart on me...

Several of you have mentioned Tiger River - are they really around $5000?

I'm not sure if you've counted this in your budget or not, but be sure to get an estimate from an electrician for your electrical hookups, as well as making sure you have an adequate base to put your spa on. Those two things can make or break a budget. Not too many of the "top, reputable" dealers have tubs in that range, especially seating 4-5 people. A Costco tub may be the best bet for you. I would also consider Nordic - they're probably one of the better values in that range, at least from the research I did (which included a lengthy e-mail correspondence with one of their engineers, who really seemed to know what he was talking about).

Have you ever heard of Godwin's law? It's the theory that the longer a forum post goes on, the greater the probability that someone will be compared to Hitler. The spa forums are like that, except we have Jim's nonsense instead of Hitler's nonsense. Can I call this one the Roberts Law? "The longer a post on a Spa forum goes on, the probability that it will digress into Jim the Jim vs. all his detractors approaches one."

That is SO true! Here's a good thread from another forum about wet testing - if anyone out there is not yet convinced about how important a wet test is, read this: In Praise of Wet Testing

That may or may not be true. However, that's irrelevant as to whether they make a good product or not. You seem to equate "evil people" with "bad quality product" and "good people" with "fine product". Those things aren't always true. Many a well-meaning company or person can make bad things or poor decisions, and many bad people have been very successful.

However, have you looked at the difference in a real Hot Spring from Jon Watkins and the junk they make now. Not even close to the same quality. Masco is a huge sociopath corporation and they don't give a darn about you as a human being. You know what I find funny? I bought my first tub over eight years ago, and Jim had already been around and pestering everybody for years - and saying "tubs aren't made the way there were 10 or 20 years ago." Now, almost 10 years later, when people talk about the Hot Spring, Sundance, or D1 tubs they've had for a decade, you're still saying "they don't make them the way they made them 10 years ago." Yet another contradiction in your long, long, list of them.

Each duck is mono, sure. That's why you need at least 5 or 7 for true Ducky Digital surround sound. There are tubs designed to swirl the water in such a way that each duck stays perfectly placed for optimal sound. Of course, such tubs are expensive, since their pipes are made from Adamantium, moonbeams, and the distilled essence of the sound of one hand clapping. I'd like to point out I've lived in snowy Ohio for decades, and never lost power for more than a few hours. So, my decision as to which hot tub to purchase will not depend in any way on which one appears to be Freeze Proof. I have also never had a wooden structure that was eaten by beavers, so I will not need to buy a tub that's Beaver Proof. I have also never had anything busted open by Geraldo Rivera in search of Al Capone's Tomb, so I will not buy a tub that's Geraldo Rivera Proof.

Wow, you've made some pretty strong statements there. If you have dealer prices on specific models, I think many people would be interested in seeing those. I do question your "sale" prices. I've been to my local Sundance dealer several times lately, and I haven't seen any models in the $14,000 to $16,000 range. Are those Canadian dollars? Even the highest ones I've seen were around $10,000, maybe $12,000.

Okay, I just found some info on Hydro Spas, which I believe is the manufacturer in question for these Costco spas. Personally, I look at two things when evaluating a manufacturer: 1) the warranty, and 2) user reviews, especially over on Doc's site. The warranty is usually a good indicator of how much faith a manufacturer puts in their product. The user reviews are obviously a good indicator of how a tub works over time. First of all, the warranty. The shell warranty is 10 years (pretty standard), but the rest of the components are only warranted for 2 years. Most spa companies have warranties of 3 or 5 years, so that's not a good sign. Costco's return policy seems to extend the warranty for longer than that - the life of the purchase? That's a pretty good benefit offered by Costco, and should undoubtedly be a good reason to buy from Costco. Still, I'd say in terms of evaluating the product, a 2 year warranty is not great. Secondly, the user reviews. Here is where I would say Hydro Spas start looking like a bad deal. Most of the reviews from people who just purchased their spas are good- initial impressions of the Hydro Spas seem good. However, if you read the reviews from people who have owned a Hydro Spa for several years, they're almost all bad. Here are some quotes: "I have spent more time trying to figure out how to troubleshoot than I have sepnt in the tub. The pumps go into air-lock without rhyme or reason and very little seems to change that. Calling Hydrospa is worse than calling Dell Computers. They rarely answer the phone and even when they do, the advice is vague. The tell me to loosen the connections and bleed the air from the system. I hate to bitch too much, but taking apart the thing is a pain in the rear. I did not pay $4000 to be a mechanic five times a week. If it was a TV, I would pick it up and bring it back. If it was a lemon auto, I'd have it towed, but its a 1000 lb box that has to be moved by crane. " "Our first spa had 3 circulation pumps replaced and developed a leak in the shell(bubble). Hydrospa replaced it at no charge. We got the same model and now after having it for 10 months the circulation pump sounds like a 747! Bottom line is THESE SPAS ARE CHEAP FOR A REASON! They just are not made well ....period. Service is terrible with my dealer wanting $98.00 just to come out and look at the spa under waranty. I spend more time trying to fix this thing instead of using it. BUY AT YOUR OWN RISK!!!!! My advice is spend the extra $s and get a quality spa not this garbage. " "My main issue with this tub is the mode and the cost of operating the thing. I'd like to see this dollar a day operation. Sleep mode shuts the thing down completely. I live in Ontario and placed it in sleep mode when I went on vacation. I came home to a tub at 56. Needless to say, more hydro to heat it to 102. So I kept it on standard mode to maintain the heat at 102. My hydro bill jumped from $60/month to $160. I chalked it up to heating from 58 to 102 and ample usage. Same bill the next month so I went and put some more insulation in the cabinet to keep the heat in better. Not sure if this has really helped. So I called the company and asked to speak to a technician. The secretary decided she could help me. She said put it on economy mode, crank the heat to 104, and close all diverter valves. So I did that. Went away for a day and I found my tub at 85. The temp over the past 2 days has averaged -14 celcius and high of -9C. So now I am back to Standard Mode cause tonight I can't get in it as it's too cold!! " I should point out that this particular user is very happy with his tub, and does not mind the higher electric bill. Personally, I cannot imagine having a tub that costs $100 per month to run in standard mode. "The electric bill is not $1 dollar a day to operate. In Standard mode (it keeps the temperature at your desired temperature all the time) it cost anywhere from $100 to $120 a month. In Economy mode (it heats the spa to your desired temperature twice a day- every twelve hours) it cost about $60 to $100 a month. In Sleep mode (heater only turns on and heats the water to 20 degrees below your set temperature) it costs $30 to $50 a month. Keep in mind I live in Southern California and it is not that cold in the winter." Here's another person who's happy with the spa. Again, $100 per month - especially in Southern California - sounds like way too much to me. This is the first - and probably last - time I'll look at Hydro Spas. Based on what I've read here, there's no way I'd buy one. It sounds like it's much more prone to breaking, and more complicated to repair (based on not having a local dealer) when it does have issues. You can return it to Costco, but it seems like for many people there's a good reason not to (i.e. crane deliveries, building them into your deck, etc.) Last of all is the electricity issue. I have only owned one spa, so I'm far from an expert on spas. But the one spa I owned had an almost negligible impact on my electric bill- when I compared my electric bills for the months before and after buying the tub, I saw no noticeable difference. I cannot and would not pay $100 or more per month to run a tub. If there are people out there who have owned Hydro spas for 3-5 years or more, or who have gone through cold winters and not seen the huge electrical costs, I'd be interested in hearing about it.

Does Costco sell different spas in their stores than they do online? I usually don't read these Costco threads, but in trying to follow this one I can't see mention of Platinum or Legend on their web site.

Things like stereos will probably always be options, as there will always be people (like myself) who don't want them. I think one of the inherent problems here is that lots of people want to spend $4000 or so on a good quality tub, and they have it in their heads that such a thing "ought" to be available. This is similar to thinking that one "ought" to be able to walk into a car dealership and buy a nice new car for $10,000. For the most part, neither of those things exist. If you want a real, quality item, you have to spend more.