Hillbilly Hot Tub

True...but I am of the opinion that only a fraction of quality tubs sold ever develop a leak in the plumbing, but every single non-insulated tub will cost a lot more money in the long run electric wise in the northeastern climate in which I operate. Why was the fitting 'loose'?...maybe because there was no insulation to keep it from vibrating apart? They are definitely easier to fix but I don't believe the slight possibility of a leak and the ease of repair is worth the operating cost in the long run. I know I am digging up old posts, but I have to say, a Clearwater is well insulated, if they were not, how did they pass the califoria energy tests? I own one and it only costs me on average $30.00 a month to run, lower in summer, higher in winter, and we have worked on many full foam including quality tubs that have developed leaks and they are a nightmare to repair. We have had 2 leaks on Clearwaters, both were the faulty light lens that waterway made, very simple to repair. Different story in full foam. Very nice set up for working on spas by the way...

I may be wrong, but I think he was trying to not put in piers, I'm Bad if I did not understand...

In Ryan's case, the high CH of 290 ppm means ........ Richard Richard, If he does not raise his CH as high (he said he raised it to that) would his ALK come up easier, would CH effect this?

Did the instructor mention the need for calcium carbonate saturation -- Richard Yes he did, I added this in the water chemistry section. I will see if it is ok with him to give his email to you.

This sounds good, it is esentially the same as a free floating cement pad, or spa pads, just a wood deck instead. You may want to place patio blocks under your wood that is touching the ground to help keep the wood from rotting.

Hardness Water hardness occurs as an indirect side effect of various chemical compounds. Calcium and magnesium are the two primary minerals that make up hardness in water. Like alkalinity and pH, hardness affects the tendency of the water to be corrosive or scale-forming. (Scale is a deposit that forms on pool walls and equipment when the mineral content of the water is too high.) By maintaining the ideal ranges for hardness and alkalinity, you can keep scale formation to a minimum. Low hardness levels require immediate attention! They can be very dangerous to your system. Water that is not properly saturated with hardness—water in which the hardness level is too low—will be very corrosive, causing significant damage to metal pipes and fixtures as well as plaster. You must be sure to balance hardness before adding any sanitizer to the water. Otherwise, the water will become even more aggressive (corrosive); it can cause severe damage in a short period of time. When the hardness level is low, increase the hardness immediately to limit the damage of corrosive water. You can increase the hardness level by adding a chemical like calcium chloride. When the hardness level is too high, excessive scale formation occurs, and the water may become cloudy or discolored. Elevated pH and warmer temperatures will increase scale build-up too. If the hardness level is too high, you can partially drain and refill with fresh water. The ideal level of hardness for your pool or spa water is from 200 – 400 ppm (mg/L). You should test hardness when adding fresh water, and re-test until you have balanced the water hardness properly. After that, test hardness a minimum of once per month throughout the season. If you use calcium hypochlorite as a sanitizer, you need to test more frequently to ensure that the level has not exceeded the upper limit. New thing I learned, I didn't think Calcium Hardness being low was real important in an Acrylic Spa...

Alkalinity Total alkalinity is the measure of the amount of alkaline buffers (primarily carbonates and bicarbonates) in your water. These alkaline substances buffer the water against sudden changes in pH. Total alkalinity is considered the key to water balance. It is the first parameter you should balance when making routine adjustments to your water. If you neglect to check the total alkalinity in your pool or spa, you may have trouble balancing the pH. You may also notice that pH fluctuates suddenly despite your best efforts to keep it in the ideal range. If the alkalinity is too low, anything introduced to the water will have an immediate impact on pH. Abrupt shifts in pH can cause scaling or corrosion of metal equipment and fixtures as well as other problems. When the total alkalinity is high, the pH has a tendency to drift upward, causing scale to form. Maintaining an ideal level of alkalinity will protect your pool or spa and its equipment from the harmful effects of sudden pH fluctuations. Think of the alkalinity as training wheels: it keeps the pH in balance without allowing it to tip too far to either side. Of course the pH can still drift upward or downward, but that change will happen gradually as long as the alkalinity falls within the ideal range. The ideal range of total alkalinity for pools and spas is between 80 and 120 ppm (mg/L). He went on in this discussion to say low ALK is aggressive, it will try to draw from other things, even in acrylic spas. He also said because it was more aggressive it would cause you to chew up more bromine etc. So my thoughts for Ryan with what I learned, is if ALK is to low, he introduces sweat and other contanimates in water, it would have an immediate impact on PH which could cause skin sensitivity. Just a thought and cheap and easy thing to try first. These classes to not get into the technical chemistry, we only have 4 hours and not time to do a whole college coarse, so I am sure it is "watered down" quite a bit. I have taken many, many classes and have always learned/heard new information.

At Atlantic City show we talked to the manufacture of some of these filters becasue some customers were complaining about increased foam issues and the fact that black mold would grow on them as they were drying after being cleaned. They told us they were working out some "bugs". Mold growing on filter media that you pay extra for to prevent this...how much better are they really?

At Atlantic City show we talked to the manufacture of some of these filters becasue some customers were complaining about increased foam issues and the fact that black mold would grow on them as they were drying after being cleaned. They told us they were working out some "bugs". Mold growing on filter media that you pay extra for to prevent this...how much better are they really?

3 flashing dots usually means a flow error, as said check everything that could restrict flow, filters, pressure switch, pump ect. We have seen a couple of Gulf Coasts in the field that everything was fine and they were still haveing the issue you areand they had to replace the control system(thye lucked out, it was under warranty still!) When you reset the tub, is the tub reading the tempreture of the water correctly? IE the topside reads 90 and the tub is actually 90 or is it reading incorrectly?

3 flashing dots usually means a flow error, as said check everything that could restrict flow, filters, pressure switch, pump ect. We have seen a couple of Gulf Coasts in the field that everything was fine and they were still haveing the issue you areand they had to replace the control system(thye lucked out, it was under warranty still!) When you reset the tub, is the tub reading the tempreture of the water correctly? IE the topside reads 90 and the tub is actually 90 or is it reading incorrectly?

I just had a class that we talked about the TA issue. I always thought not to worry about it much as long as the PH was ok. What we learned at this class is if the TA is low it makes the water aggresive. It will cause you to go through more chemicals trying to "raise itself" To raise ALK when PH is good, you have to use PH down to drop PH very low,(which will also drop the ALK) then use ALK first to rasie. The ALK will raise PH also. As you raise the ALK, watch the PH. Get your ALK up as high as you can without bringing the PH over. It is a hard game at times. Having ALK where it belongs helps keep the PH from bouncing around and makes foaming less of an issue. We were told that people with bromine systems use mostly ALK increaser, very rarely PH increaser becasue the ALK tends to drop in the tub. Bleach may also be an issue, it is being found in threads on the water chemistry site, that the PH will rise with people that use bleace due to airation of the water. Hot Tubs have a major amount of air going into the water, unless you have a 4 jet oldie. This is also a subject that has various viewpoints. So, as far as the itch, you may have to see the doc to see what it is from. Maybe low TA, since the water becomes aggresive can be causing an irritation in sesitive skin areas. Since you do not have issues for over a month, I would not think it is a sensitivity to one of the chemicals, that would happen right away. If your TA is good at start up and it is when the TA starts to drop that you have the itch, I would start there.

Thanks TB! It is fine in the basket, just make sure to check once and awhile to make sure larger debris has not covered or jambed up the N2 slots.

PH up and down, alkalinity increaser are the same...pool or spa, along with MPS(non chlorine shock) You can use the clarifier, just remember it will take a very small amount since a spa is many gallons less. Also, some pool clarifiers may cause a gunk on your spa filter, so watch for this.

Not in an Arctic it doesn't! Hillbilly clearly lives in a warm climate. Here in the Frozen North, we don't dare let water sit in the lines where it would promptly freeze in our outside storage yard. After an Arctic or Coyote Spa has been wet tested, the spa is hooked to a custom-designed vacuum system and rotated (I think it's 270 degrees and back) to remove water from the plumbing. I expect that other Canadian-made hot tubs (Coast, Aber, Beachcomber) also need to do this. Hillbilly is clearly from New Hampshire, as it says under my name, about 2 hours from Canada. One line we carry comes from Washington(pretty close to Canada) and are drained well, one line comes from Florida and we have had to deal with a couple of very minor issues from freezing water in transit. I was talking about the very small amount of water/moisture....it sometimes molds and black gunk comes out of the jets, or a floor model that has not been fully drained and vacuumed. We did look at Artic Spas....very nice tubs....but choose to go with Clearwater due to some off the other quality things they did we liked.(husband worked for a manufacturer for years, so we looked at tubs closley knowing what we did/did not want) We have seen nothing bad in the field as of yet about the Artics, although there are very few in the area. Thanks for the info on Gensis, Clearwater did not pass this info to their dealers. We are still a bit leary of the system becasue some other dealers have had issues with them. Have they seemed to be getting better over the past year?

PVC pipe under the spa will help you be able to move it around a little easier. Get a few pieces, get them under the tub and push...Be careful, many tubs will not tolerate you pushing on the cabinet or lifting on the edge of the acyrlic. And as said, depending on how it is built, and with what kinds of materials will determine weight.

Does the cord you got from the dealer have a transformer on one end that converts the electricity to 12 volts regulated supply? no i proberly will have to take it from 240 to 12 volts, i have contacted my dealer and they seem not to be so helpfull - they keep trying to sell me their version - which costs £1,500. they also tell me that the information is only avalible to them and they can not give me the information - this is why i came on here. any idea of transfermers, and best place to buy???? Have you tried a local Radio store? I am not sure of the money echange rates, but I am looking in our books and they are about $190.00 for the power supply box(transformer) here. do you have any web links for this product so i can look for the same over here????? I am looking in my dealer catalogs, so I don't have web links for them. You have to be a dealer to access them.Maybe if you check with other hot tub dealers in your area to see if they can get you a power supply box(trans former) for your radio. Are there independent spa repair people in your area? They would have access to this part also I would think.

I find it rude that you think only a couple of people give good knowledge in this forum. Because you use bleach and not another type of sanitizer does not mean the information others are giving about those sanitizers are not good. All that give info in this forum may have good information depending on the information they seek. Don't shoot them in the back. This kind of stuff is how part of the arguments start, when you are rude to other people. Chem Geek, I am also glad to see you back. As I stated before, we can all learn from each other. It takes all of us to give information to come to conclusions, as you have shown.

1. Is this a new tub? Sometimes because they have been water tested, the water left after draining sits in the lines and gets mold. Also being that the plastics are new, they may have had some oil left on them, which is why we suggest a water change the first month of new tub ownership. 2. Do you have well water that may have graphite in it? This waill cause a black sooty substance in the tub. 3. Did someone accidently bring a foreign substance in on their suits or body? With a clean papertowel, wipe off what you can on the sides of the spa. Clean the filter out. Use a clarifier that flocs and coagulates (such as Sea Klear) to help pick up the smaller particles.

LOL....they make nice fish ponds also I understand where you are coming from. My husband worked for a local manufacturer that went out of buisness, went bankrupt. They told all of their customers up until a week before they closed the doors that they would have a full warrenty, fully knowing that they were going out of buisness never to be seen again. Being that my husband worked for them and we took over their web site, customers exspect we will cover the warrenty. We did not even buy their buisness and had a tub of our own that was no longer under warrenty. You would think someone would step in to protect consumers, but how would they implement it if the company that sold the warrenty is gone. I guess that is the buyer beware thing. Good luck...if all else fails you could replace the major componets with retro fits and at least have a working tub. It may be cheaper than continually repairing the system you have.

Waters Edge Spas....Out of buisness 2 years ago....only thing they had for an owners manual is a copy of a gecko card and copies of the sheets provided by the pump and ozone manufacturer.

Does the cord you got from the dealer have a transformer on one end that converts the electricity to 12 volts regulated supply? no i proberly will have to take it from 240 to 12 volts, i have contacted my dealer and they seem not to be so helpfull - they keep trying to sell me their version - which costs £1,500. they also tell me that the information is only avalible to them and they can not give me the information - this is why i came on here. any idea of transfermers, and best place to buy???? Have you tried a local Radio store? I am not sure of the money echange rates, but I am looking in our books and they are about $190.00 for the power supply box(transformer) here.

Glad to hear, make sure you follow the directions on the bottle. Spa Time is a braand, read the chemical ingredients on the bottle and use the proper test strip for that chemical. Good luck...no more soups!