Price Check :d Tiger River Caspian (new '07) In Northern California

[JohnInSJ]

Hi all.

I'm getting ready to buy a new 7' sq. 4-6 person tub, midline, in the bay area (CA).

Did the online shopping drill, googled, read all the posts in the world (phew) and actually went to a dealer or three to look at the various options, and got a bid for one tub that fits the desired specs and also meets the spouse test.

It's a Tiger River Caspian, dealer is HotSpringSpas in Cupertino CA (only other hot springs dealer is in Santa Cruz)

Price offered was $8000 ($8600 w/tax) for

Caspian and

+ Cover lifter (non-hydrolic, but the kind that slings the cover all the way over the side)

+ ozone system (the optional one from Tiger river)

+ steps (ooo, steps )

+ stater chemicals

+ the electrical bits GFIC? on the hot-tub side of the connection

+ delivery and setup

I'd still need to pay for the electrician to do the actual hookup, but pretty much that's it.

I've seen several posts out there saying the caspian should come in between $6-7k with the above - this price includes a $1000 "discount" though, so man does it seem way out of line, maybe still $500-$1000 high. The salesman was very low pressure and did take the time to learn what we were looking for in a tub, and didn't push one model over another or ask "how much do you want to spend", which was nice.

I've not even tried to negotiate this price, and I'm comfortable with them as a dealer for the tub based on the experience so far.

There is a Jacuzzi dealer in the area as well, and it seems like the J-345 is comperable to the Caspian, so that's my other option. Oh, and a local-brand spa (Saragoga spas) seems like it would also be in the ballpark $8k price for the same size tub, but I'd rather go with one of the main brands.

Any suggestions? I like the Tiger River Caspian, seems like a solid tub, just wondering on the price and the process - can I make a counter-offer? Is this like buying a car where I could be paying way more (or less) then the next guy? How do I negotiate a better price, if that's possible?

Thanks in advance.

[Trigger]

Hi John,

did we talk over at WTBHT? If so, I apologize for repeating my thoughts, if not...here ya go...

I have a 2005 Tiger River Caspian. It's a good tub and I like it. I paid $6900 + tax for the same set up as you 2 years ago. I am MA (Prices MAY vary greatly from one region to the next). I spoke to my dealer the other day and was told that an 07 Caspian is going for $7.5.

All Watkins tubs (Hot springs, Caldera, Tiger River) come with the Sub panel and breakers that your electrician will install. Don't get me wrong, it's a good deal to get that, and worth about $100, but don't let the dealer lead you to belive that the sub panel is a specail deal "Just for you" .

The start up chems that all dealers offer are just enough to get you by for a few weeks. It’s an introductory sample pack. Once again, this is for the most part a standard item that * any* dealer will give you.

All tubs that I now of come with the insulating cover. Lifters seem to be an item that dealers may or may not through in. The dealer included a Cover mate 1 lifter with my tub and it works fine. I strongly recommend that what ever tub you purchase, don’t try and save $150 bucks by forgoing the lifter. Get one.

I think your price is a bit high. I think low 7's is a fair price for the Caspian, but then again, I am unfamiliar with prices and costs in the San Francisco, CA area.

The best way to see if you are getting a square deal is to look around at other quality dealers and see what else you can get for your money.

The Caspian is a decent tub, but I always felt one it's better selling points was a excellent quality tub, with a few nice features, but at a price lower than the other name brand tubs. It's got a few nice seats, and a bit of open seating. Which I think is a nice variety. The foot dome is FANTASTIC. But, the tub does have a lot of smaller jets, where more expensive tubs usually give you a bigger and better variety. The lighting is fine, but once again, on the more expensive tubs, you might get something a bit fancier (don't waste your money if you are on a budget). The water fall is neat, but as just about EVERYONE says, the novelty wears off, and never pay extra or chose a tub because of the water fall.

Wet test the Caspian. Some folks find it perfect, others find it too shallow. Wet Test ANY Tub you are thinking on buying.

The Filtration is decent; straight forward and simple. More expensive tubs have more complicated systems involving multiple filters, special filters and what not, but the bottom line is the filtration works fine.

I have had good luck with the Freshwater III ozinator and while other folks debate if O3 units do anything, the FWIII and the Caspian seems to be a great match and I would recommend it.

Other tubs makers to look at would be Caldera, Hot springs, Sundance, and Jacuzzi to name a few.

Good luck.

Oh...you said you were just about all set...don't forget you'll need a solid area to set the tub. (Poured concrete, Pavers, a reinforced deck....)

[JohnInSJ]

Hi John,

did we talk over at WTBHT? If so, I apologize for repeating my thoughts, if not...here ya go...

Nope, just here Can only follow one forum at a time and this one seemed to have good people and good info on it. Thanks for the feedback, indeed I understand that the "bundle of discounts" was mostly freebies or typical bundles for tubs in this price range, and I feel like the price might be just a hair high - possibly 10% high (ie, 500-800 high) for what I'm getting. Just be be clear (as I now have the quote in front of me) it was $7945 before tax for the bundle, the spa itself was priced @ 7695, and $250 for the lifter, with "$700" in freebies - this after a special $1000 discount. Man, does that ever feel like buying a new car (oooo special dealer incentives!)

However, could just be the "bay area effect" - *every* is 10% higher here, even the people

Anyway, I've tracked down a jacuzzi dealer and will get a quote on that J-345 - depending on where that falls we'll either try to talk this TR dealer down a bit or, if it looks like we'll like the jacuzzi, just go with that. Or we'll just eat it and pay it. Sigh.

[Trigger]

Nope, just here Can only follow one forum at a time and this one seemed to have good people and good info on it. Thanks for the feedback, indeed I understand that the "bundle of discounts" was mostly freebies or typical bundles for tubs in this price range, and I feel like the price might be just a hair high - possibly 10% high (ie, 500-800 high) for what I'm getting. Just be be clear (as I now have the quote in front of me) it was $7945 before tax for the bundle, the spa itself was priced @ 7695, and $250 for the lifter, with "$700" in freebies - this after a special $1000 discount. Man, does that ever feel like buying a new car (oooo special dealer incentives!)

However, could just be the "bay area effect" - *every* is 10% higher here, even the people

Anyway, I've tracked down a jacuzzi dealer and will get a quote on that J-345 - depending on where that falls we'll either try to talk this TR dealer down a bit or, if it looks like we'll like the jacuzzi, just go with that. Or we'll just eat it and pay it. Sigh.

JohninSJ,

sounds like you have your head screwed on right. Look around - Know what you are getting and not getting for that price. Wet test it and compare it to other tubs. Tiger River is quality, but was sold as a budget alternative to the higher priced Hotspring line.

I assume you are in San Jose? Nice town. It's been years since I've been there, but really enjoyed my time there.

Good uck.

[hottublady]

JohninSJ,

sounds like you have your head screwed on right. Look around - Know what you are getting and not getting for that price. Wet test it and compare it to other tubs. Tiger River is quality, but was sold as a budget alternative to the higher priced Hotspring line.

I assume you are in San Jose? Nice town. It's been years since I've been there, but really enjoyed my time there.

Good uck.

Caspian here in washington is $8795 plus $225 for lifter. So $9777.68 including tax, so I say you got yourself a good deal.

Hottublady

[Trigger]

Caspian here in washington is $8795 plus $225 for lifter. So $9777.68 including tax, so I say you got yourself a good deal.

Hottublady

I think that's higher the MSRP and seems waaaay out of line.

If I can walk in off the street, buy the tub here in MA and ship it to you and have a grand in my pocket, something is wrong. And I'm also open for Business!

And just a few weeks ago, a poster said he was quoted 7000 for the Caldera Niagra Utopia (A $10K tub) So I guess it only makes sense that they are now selling $7000 tubs for 10K.

[looking_for_spa]

I am in the bayarea and just bought a Sundance Cayman for $6.5k.

I also visited my friendly neighborhood HS spa dealer ;-) Decent dealership, low pressure but they wont budge much in price which is higher than the nataional avg I would say!

I found the Sundance Spa dealer excellent (on Almaden Expy) - you should check that one out as well ...

[Roger]

Caspian here in washington is $8795 plus $225 for lifter. So $9777.68 including tax, so I say you got yourself a good deal.

Hottublady

Caspian here in Northern Minnesota goes for 6800. I called CCX and they will freight it to ya for 1100, but ya gota unload it yourself at a place of business, with a loading dock.

[JohnInSJ]

I am in the bayarea and just bought a Sundance Cayman for $6.5k.

I also visited my friendly neighborhood HS spa dealer ;-) Decent dealership, low pressure but they wont budge much in price which is higher than the nataional avg I would say!

I found the Sundance Spa dealer excellent (on Almaden Expy) - you should check that one out as well ...

Thanks! Looks like the Sundance Chelsee would be closer to the Caspian size/seating-wise, but it's got plastic jets (silly I know, but the wife thinks chrome jets == better tub....) - otherwise was your bundle more or less the same (ie, ozone + cover + cover lift + install, not incl taxes) for $6.5k? If so that's 1500 less and that would buy a lot of chrome

I'll add them to the list of people to check... so you must have been at the same HS dealter unless you drove to santa cruz?

Thanks all for the feedback - It seems like the prices do range all over for this spa, from

$6800 (MN)

$7695* (My offer in CA, but that's with a -1000 "sale" off $8695)

$8795 (WA)

*Not including the lifter, but with the ozone and whatever freebies everyone tosses in.

Looks like if I do want the Caspian I should take this deal, maybe try and get them to toss in a "free" umbrella or something )

[looking_for_spa]

I would think Sundance Chelsee is more expensive than Cayman which was a '06 model. It was $6.5k including all those & tax is seperate. Yes, I went to the same HS dealer but he told me the $1000 rebate (I was looking at Prodigy then) runs out on April 16th!

I have another post regarding permits in SJ http://www.poolspaforum.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=5852

if you get a chance let me know your thoughts regarding permits and feel free to email me at neogi@yahoo.com.

[JohnInSJ]

Well, I stopped off at the sundance place on the way home from getting the kid from school, and they had a "sale" running where he could get me (just for today mind you - sigh) into a Chelsee for the same $8k (with all the usual stuff) as the tiger river - but after today it would be $750 or so more then the TR Caspian.

They have a new model/line (forgot the name) they're getting in a few weeks that's the same 7' square w/o recliner (we don't want the recliner seating pattern) with a smaller filter then then Chelsee (which is also 7'4" square) and I think also a tad lower, for around 6800, so looks like 07 prices are up a bit in general anyway.

I'm guessing if push came to shove I could get the Chelsee for the $8k price even after today. Ugh. I'm planning on swinging by the jacuzzi place wednesday, then I guess I gotta choose.

Thanks again for the suggestions/help/comments!

Re: SJ permits - I have been in SJ for 7 years, we've done a lot of work on the house, most of it permitted - permits are getting expensive, and we punted on a permit for our gas fireplace conversion and kitchen remodel, but got it for the window/slider changeout and exterior porch, both of which had elec. components.

Re "up to code" that would only be an issue when you sell, and all houses are sold as is around here - heck they're all 60 years old and way out of code anyway.... no house would ever sell if you had to rewire it (no ground wires) replumb it (galv. plumbing) and heaven knows what else. I have no idea if we'll pull a permit for the wiring job.

[looking_for_spa]

Thanks again for the suggestions/help/comments!

Re: SJ permits - I have been in SJ for 7 years, we've done a lot of work on the house, most of it permitted - permits are getting expensive, and we punted on a permit for our gas fireplace conversion and kitchen remodel, but got it for the window/slider changeout and exterior porch, both of which had elec. components.

Re "up to code" that would only be an issue when you sell, and all houses are sold as is around here - heck they're all 60 years old and way out of code anyway.... no house would ever sell if you had to rewire it (no ground wires) replumb it (galv. plumbing) and heaven knows what else. I have no idea if we'll pull a permit for the wiring job.

JohnInSJ,

Question on the permit (sorry to detract) ... my electrician initially was sort of pushing me into not getting the permit/inpection but I decided to go ahead with the permits. Now his response is he will do that provided I pay $100 an hour to cover his time spent with the city. AND he is pointing out the inspector may find other problems existing in the house which I will have to fix.

Is this reasonable situation? In SJ, does the inpector go out of the way to find issues in the house (its 40 yr old house)?

Greatly appreciate your response.

Thanks!

[JohnInSJ]

JohnInSJ,

Question on the permit (sorry to detract) ... my electrician initially was sort of pushing me into not getting the permit/inpection but I decided to go ahead with the permits. Now his response is he will do that provided I pay $100 an hour to cover his time spent with the city. AND he is pointing out the inspector may find other problems existing in the house which I will have to fix.

Is this reasonable situation? In SJ, does the inpector go out of the way to find issues in the house (its 40 yr old house)?

Greatly appreciate your response.

Thanks!

Hmmm... sounds a bit odd

inspection may find other issues - yeah, but generally only relating to the work - if you have major elec issues (with your box, or your service to the house is 100amp vs 200 amp) then that may come up. For example when I did my windows I had to put in three more smoke detectors - silly but not much $. And even though my hose is ungrounded 2 wire (typical for 40+ yr old houses) we only had to pull ground wire for the new outlets, not the whole house. Basically everything new, or touched by the work, has to be up to code.

The elec. should not have to deal with the city - you can do all that - he just needs to do the work to the point that the inspector can see the work and do the inspection, sign off on it, and then finish up... don't know when that would happen or even if its in the middle of the job, it's probably not in the middle of it.

You should be able to get the permit online yourself, and schedule the inspection, and get the inspection signed off (as long as there are no issues, if there are the inspector will note them and then you just schedule a followup insp. when they're fixed.)

https://www.sjpermits.org/permits/permits/

[JohnInSJ]

I'm planning on swinging by the jacuzzi place wednesday, then I guess I gotta choose.

The saga continues!

Hit the Jacuzzi place todat, found yet another SALE! (oh, am I lucky to find all the sales, this one ends Sunday) so the J-345 comes in at.... you guessed it!

$8200

So to recap:

Tiger River Caspian: $8000

Sundance Chelsee: $8000

Jacuzzi J345: $8200

all have ozone, cover & lifter, step, delivery - basically everything but the elec. wiring hookup.

Nice to see such unified pricing

So, since the price is basically identical, and the three tubs are within spitting distance of each other on the feature checklist, any thoughts on which one I should choose?

[looking_for_spa]

So to recap:

Tiger River Caspian: $8000

Sundance Chelsee: $8000

Jacuzzi J345: $8200

So, since the price is basically identical, and the three tubs are within spitting distance of each other on the feature checklist, any thoughts on which one I should choose?

John - thanks for the permit info, will follow your advice!

Regarding the tubs, as many have said - time to get your "feet" wet, well, maybe a little more than that ;-)

I am sure that will help you decide ... by the way, the Jacuzzi & Sundance dealership is the same (paradise valley & spa)

[spatech (the unreal one)]

So, since the price is basically identical, and the three tubs are within spitting distance of each other on the feature checklist, any thoughts on which one I should choose?

I'd try to wet test all three and use that along with my comfort level with the indiviaul dealers to make the choice. I would also mention to all 3 dealers that you are considering the other 2 spas as well and want to know what their BEST offer is so you can make your final decision.

When you are convinced they are fixed at a final price one way to try to sweeten the deal a bit further is to ask them to include one year of free chems (or something similar, it is no drop in their firm price yet it is something you do need/want).

BTW, all see similarly equipped but are all the ozones they are adding the CD type, (defintiely preferred over UV)?

[JohnInSJ]

BTW, all see similarly equipped but all all the ozones they are adding the CD type, (defintiely preferred over UV)?

Yes, thanks for the suggestion, I have done my best to make sure all had the same features as much as possible, so they've all got the CD ozone, none have music systems or extra options above the basics for the model, all lifters the same, all steps the same, etc.

I was looking for apples, and I got three We've dry tested them all, need to get wet now.

[JohnInSJ]

By chance, I happen to be by a Coast Spa dealer today (buying flooring - don't even ask...)

So I saw their 7' offering - nice basic tub, with CD Ozone, cover, lifter, step, $6500...

It did seem different, in some subtile, some not so subtile ways

- no circ pump, which all of the $8k spas had

- "clunky" styling, for want of a better word - just more boxy...

- no idea under the hood, but jetting while ok was just, well, ok

- louder... clearly louder.

So yeah, is it $1500 less good then those 8k spas? Dunno. Still, good to finally see a 7' tub under $8k

[looking_for_spa]

So yeah, is it $1500 less good then those 8k spas? Dunno. Still, good to finally see a 7' tub under $8k

If you are looking for 7'x7' - you may still get the one I got Sundance Cayman '06 at $6.5k!

My tub gets installed this Sat - I can't wait :0)

[JohnInSJ]

I just bought the Tiger River Caspian, got a few minor consessions out of the dealer for a few hundred more off the price, so the spa came in at $7495 vs $7695. I think he did it to make me feel a little better - but since I can charge it on a Discover card, that gets me another 3% off (including taxes too!) for another $250 or so savings. I can live with it, esp. sitting in the tub. Now I just have to wait for it to get built. Should be installed and running in June.

Thanks again for the help all!

[spatech (the unreal one)]

By chance, I happen to be by a Coast Spa dealer today (buying flooring - don't even ask...)

So I saw their 7' offering - nice basic tub, with CD Ozone, cover, lifter, step, $6500...

It did seem different, in some subtile, some not so subtile ways

- no circ pump, which all of the $8k spas had

- "clunky" styling, for want of a better word - just more boxy...

- no idea under the hood, but jetting while ok was just, well, ok

- louder... clearly louder.

So yeah, is it $1500 less good then those 8k spas? Dunno. Still, good to finally see a 7' tub under $8k

I'm not sure what to say about Coast but in the end, I know you want to save some $$ but this purchase will be in your yard for the next 12+ years (if its a Quality spa that is) so make sure you get something you TRULY want and are comfortable with that it is truly a quality spa. Saving is great but ammortize it over 12 years and look at it as $125/yr. You'll find that it pays to buy quality in the long run. Take your time.

I just bought the Tiger River Caspian, got a few minor consessions out of the dealer for a few hundred more off the price, so the spa came in at $7495 vs $7695. I think he did it to make me feel a little better - but since I can charge it on a Discover card, that gets me another 3% off (including taxes too!) for another $250 or so savings. I can live with it, esp. sitting in the tub. Now I just have to wait for it to get built. Should be installed and running in June.

Thanks again for the help all!

Oops, I see you bought what you originally wanted so ignore the previous post LOL.

Congrats and stick around for any help you need.