Need An Intervention :) I Am An Over Thinking Idiot

[rwilkerson]

I am deep into the process of paralyzing myself by over analyzing. I have a couple of other threads going but wanted one more set of opinions.

I accidentally found out about Maax Spas and Artesian today and went to look at the Maax 480 and Artesian Island Captiva. In addition I got an email from a dealer telling me that he is getting in a new Strong Madrid 64.

Previously I had ruled these out and started testing Hot Spring Vanguard, Jacuzzi J355 and a Caldera Geneva. All great solid premium spas.

Would I be a fool to consider the lower line spas when I can afford the higher line spa/

Thanks

Roger

[Roger]

I am deep into the process of paralyzing myself by over analyzing. I have a couple of other threads going but wanted one more set of opinions.

I accidentally found out about Maax Spas and Artesian today and went to look at the Maax 480 and Artesian Island Captiva. In addition I got an email from a dealer telling me that he is getting in a new Strong Madrid 64.

Previously I had ruled these out and started testing Hot Spring Vanguard, Jacuzzi J355 and a Caldera Geneva. All great solid premium spas.

Would I be a fool to consider the lower line spas when I can afford the higher line spa/

Thanks

Roger

You have the whole spectrum here. Strong on the value end, Maxx in the middle, Artisian above that and Hot Springs, Jacuzzi Caldera at the top. If you want a value tub buy one, if you want a top of the line tub buy one. If you cant see the difference in fit and finish and quality or feel the difference when you wet test (I know I can) Then what difference does it make. Longer lasting higher quality is important to some but not to others. If you go value end 3 years from now you likely won't know the difference except in your electric bill. 6 years from now you may be looking for a new tub.

[rwilkerson]

I am deep into the process of paralyzing myself by over analyzing. I have a couple of other threads going but wanted one more set of opinions.

I accidentally found out about Maax Spas and Artesian today and went to look at the Maax 480 and Artesian Island Captiva. In addition I got an email from a dealer telling me that he is getting in a new Strong Madrid 64.

Previously I had ruled these out and started testing Hot Spring Vanguard, Jacuzzi J355 and a Caldera Geneva. All great solid premium spas.

Would I be a fool to consider the lower line spas when I can afford the higher line spa/

Thanks

Roger

You have the whole spectrum here. Strong on the value end, Maxx in the middle, Artisian above that and Hot Springs, Jacuzzi Caldera at the top. If you want a value tub buy one, if you want a top of the line tub buy one. If you cant see the difference in fit and finish and quality or feel the difference when you wet test (I know I can) Then what difference does it make. Longer lasting higher quality is important to some but not to others. If you go value end 3 years from now you likely won't know the difference except in your electric bill. 6 years from now you may be looking for a new tub.

I plan for this to be my last tub (at least here at this house) I guess with the Maax and the Artesian being right around 7k and the Jacuzzi and Caldera right around 8k, that kind of make my decision for me. Ultimately the massage is the important thing and not so much the bling (nice but not necessary). I can definitely see and feel the difference but I have been weighing the difference in quality vs. the difference in cost and I am not sure how to factor that.

[spatech (the unreal one)]

I can definitely see and feel the difference but I have been weighing the difference in quality vs. the difference in cost and I am not sure how to factor that.

I basically mirror roger's comments but if you can definteily feel/see the difference in quality (not counting energy efficiency which you can't see) then think of the cost difference as being spread out over the life of the spa, not just the difference at point of purchase.

[rwilkerson]

I can definitely see and feel the difference but I have been weighing the difference in quality vs. the difference in cost and I am not sure how to factor that.

I basically mirror roger's comments but if you can definteily feel/see the difference in quality (not counting energy efficiency which you can't see) then think of the cost difference as being spread out over the life of the spa, not just the difference at point of purchase.

I can see the difference in fit and finish between the maax and Artesian and the Strong as well as the Ecco. These are all value line to mid quality tubs in my opinion. There is a local manufacturer here called Aspen Spas. I like the idea of dealing with a local manufacturer that will jet the tub as I ask for it to be done. I haven't found any negative feedback on them. I can get a very nice, seemingly high quality spa in the 8 ft size for what I can get a 7 ft Jacuzzi for. The Aspen has 2 two speed 56 frame pumps as well as a single speed 56 frame pump and a circ pump. They use waterway jets and balboa controls, the tub is sprayed with 2# foam and the conections are all exposed for ease of repair, it has a full abs pan on the bottom, wood frame, duble sided reflective insulation mounted to the inside of the cabinet panels and under the tub. Warranty is comparable to the big companies.

[Roger]

I can definitely see and feel the difference but I have been weighing the difference in quality vs. the difference in cost and I am not sure how to factor that.

I basically mirror roger's comments but if you can definteily feel/see the difference in quality (not counting energy efficiency which you can't see) then think of the cost difference as being spread out over the life of the spa, not just the difference at point of purchase.

I can see the difference in fit and finish between the maax and Artesian and the Strong as well as the Ecco. These are all value line to mid quality tubs in my opinion. There is a local manufacturer here called Aspen Spas. I like the idea of dealing with a local manufacturer that will jet the tub as I ask for it to be done. I haven't found any negative feedback on them. I can get a very nice, seemingly high quality spa in the 8 ft size for what I can get a 7 ft Jacuzzi for. The Aspen has 2 two speed 56 frame pumps as well as a single speed 56 frame pump and a circ pump. They use waterway jets and balboa controls, the tub is sprayed with 2# foam and the conections are all exposed for ease of repair, it has a full abs pan on the bottom, wood frame, duble sided reflective insulation mounted to the inside of the cabinet panels and under the tub. Warranty is comparable to the big companies.

Do you think the management at Aspen know what a quality built tubs sells for? And they can build quality tubs and sell them for less? Or do you think they know what a quality tub sells for and have decided to build a cheaper tub by cutting a few simple corners (under Insulate) and sell them for less?

[rwilkerson]

I can definitely see and feel the difference but I have been weighing the difference in quality vs. the difference in cost and I am not sure how to factor that.

I basically mirror roger's comments but if you can definteily feel/see the difference in quality (not counting energy efficiency which you can't see) then think of the cost difference as being spread out over the life of the spa, not just the difference at point of purchase.

I can see the difference in fit and finish between the maax and Artesian and the Strong as well as the Ecco. These are all value line to mid quality tubs in my opinion. There is a local manufacturer here called Aspen Spas. I like the idea of dealing with a local manufacturer that will jet the tub as I ask for it to be done. I haven't found any negative feedback on them. I can get a very nice, seemingly high quality spa in the 8 ft size for what I can get a 7 ft Jacuzzi for. The Aspen has 2 two speed 56 frame pumps as well as a single speed 56 frame pump and a circ pump. They use waterway jets and balboa controls, the tub is sprayed with 2# foam and the conections are all exposed for ease of repair, it has a full abs pan on the bottom, wood frame, duble sided reflective insulation mounted to the inside of the cabinet panels and under the tub. Warranty is comparable to the big companies.

Do you think the management at Aspen know what a quality built tubs sells for? And they can build quality tubs and sell them for less? Or do you think they know what a quality tub sells for and have decided to build a cheaper tub by cutting a few simple corners (under Insulate) and sell them for less?

Not sure but from the conversation we had it seems that they look at things from an ease of service perspective. I would imagine that the insulation is no better of worse than any other non-fully foamed tub. I really haven't even visited that debate but I know there are staunch supporters on either side of the discussion. My wife got sold on the two 70 gpm tornado jets so I am not sure how to get her off of that but should be wet testing the Jacuzzi J365 late this week and that may tell the tale

[Hot Spring Ace]

Everyone who sells a partially insulated spa is going to tout the servicability as a big sales factor. I don't doubt theirs is as effective as others who also go with that method to save on manuafacturing costs (IMO that is the reason they do it, certainly not becaue of how effective it is vs foam or how muich they want to make it easier for you to repair it). Its just that many of us think the best choice is to buy a quality made spa that shouldn't have leak issues in the first place and get it fully insulated with foam so you can save $40-100 a month in energy useage.

[Roger]

Not sure but from the conversation we had it seems that they look at things from an ease of service perspective. I would imagine that the insulation is no better of worse than any other non-fully foamed tub. I really haven't even visited that debate but I know there are staunch supporters on either side of the discussion. My wife got sold on the two 70 gpm tornado jets so I am not sure how to get her off of that but should be wet testing the Jacuzzi J365 late this week and that may tell the tale

So she liked the feel of the 70GPM tornado jets huh?

[rwilkerson]

Everyone who sells a partially insulated spa is going to tout the servicability as a big sales factor. I don't doubt theirs is as effective as others who also go with that method to save on manuafacturing costs (IMO that is the reason they do it, certainly not becaue of how effective it is vs foam or how muich they want to make it easier for you to repair it). Its just that many of us think the best choice is to buy a quality made spa that shouldn't have leak issues in the first place and get it fully insulated with foam so you can save $40-100 a month in energy useage.

I have a tendency to agree and I am going to be wet testing the Jacuzzi on Thursday so that will let us know. Unfortunately my wife and I are a ways apart in stature. She is slight and I am big with a longgg torso and that kind of limits the choices

[rwilkerson]

Not sure but from the conversation we had it seems that they look at things from an ease of service perspective. I would imagine that the insulation is no better of worse than any other non-fully foamed tub. I really haven't even visited that debate but I know there are staunch supporters on either side of the discussion. My wife got sold on the two 70 gpm tornado jets so I am not sure how to get her off of that but should be wet testing the Jacuzzi J365 late this week and that may tell the tale

So she liked the feel of the 70GPM tornado jets huh?

I didn't measure the output but that is what we were told and they were pretty darn strong

[spatech (the unreal one)]

I can definitely see and feel the difference but I have been weighing the difference in quality vs. the difference in cost and I am not sure how to factor that.

I basically mirror roger's comments but if you can definteily feel/see the difference in quality (not counting energy efficiency which you can't see) then think of the cost difference as being spread out over the life of the spa, not just the difference at point of purchase.

I can see the difference in fit and finish between the maax and Artesian and the Strong as well as the Ecco. These are all value line to mid quality tubs in my opinion. There is a local manufacturer here called Aspen Spas. I like the idea of dealing with a local manufacturer that will jet the tub as I ask for it to be done. I haven't found any negative feedback on them. I can get a very nice, seemingly high quality spa in the 8 ft size for what I can get a 7 ft Jacuzzi for. The Aspen has 2 two speed 56 frame pumps as well as a single speed 56 frame pump and a circ pump. They use waterway jets and balboa controls, the tub is sprayed with 2# foam and the conections are all exposed for ease of repair, it has a full abs pan on the bottom, wood frame, duble sided reflective insulation mounted to the inside of the cabinet panels and under the tub. Warranty is comparable to the big companies.

Do you think the management at Aspen know what a quality built tubs sells for? And they can build quality tubs and sell them for less? Or do you think they know what a quality tub sells for and have decided to build a cheaper tub by cutting a few simple corners (under Insulate) and sell them for less?

Not sure but from the conversation we had it seems that they look at things from an ease of service perspective. I would imagine that the insulation is no better of worse than any other non-fully foamed tub. I really haven't even visited that debate but I know there are staunch supporters on either side of the discussion. My wife got sold on the two 70 gpm tornado jets so I am not sure how to get her off of that but should be wet testing the Jacuzzi J365 late this week and that may tell the tale

I'd imagine their insulation may be just as good as the others who use that method but then again I think Mike Tyson is a good singer for a heavyweight boxer.

Did they really say the jet was 70 GPM? Thats more than 1 GPM per second lol! Somebody flubbed their sales script!

[rwilkerson]

I can definitely see and feel the difference but I have been weighing the difference in quality vs. the difference in cost and I am not sure how to factor that.

I basically mirror roger's comments but if you can definteily feel/see the difference in quality (not counting energy efficiency which you can't see) then think of the cost difference as being spread out over the life of the spa, not just the difference at point of purchase.

I can see the difference in fit and finish between the maax and Artesian and the Strong as well as the Ecco. These are all value line to mid quality tubs in my opinion. There is a local manufacturer here called Aspen Spas. I like the idea of dealing with a local manufacturer that will jet the tub as I ask for it to be done. I haven't found any negative feedback on them. I can get a very nice, seemingly high quality spa in the 8 ft size for what I can get a 7 ft Jacuzzi for. The Aspen has 2 two speed 56 frame pumps as well as a single speed 56 frame pump and a circ pump. They use waterway jets and balboa controls, the tub is sprayed with 2# foam and the conections are all exposed for ease of repair, it has a full abs pan on the bottom, wood frame, duble sided reflective insulation mounted to the inside of the cabinet panels and under the tub. Warranty is comparable to the big companies.

Do you think the management at Aspen know what a quality built tubs sells for? And they can build quality tubs and sell them for less? Or do you think they know what a quality tub sells for and have decided to build a cheaper tub by cutting a few simple corners (under Insulate) and sell them for less?

Not sure but from the conversation we had it seems that they look at things from an ease of service perspective. I would imagine that the insulation is no better of worse than any other non-fully foamed tub. I really haven't even visited that debate but I know there are staunch supporters on either side of the discussion. My wife got sold on the two 70 gpm tornado jets so I am not sure how to get her off of that but should be wet testing the Jacuzzi J365 late this week and that may tell the tale

I'd imagine their insulation may be just as good as the others who use that method but then again I think Mike Tyson is a good singer for a heavyweight boxer.

Did they really say the jet was 70 GPM? Thats more than 1 GPM per second lol! Somebody flubbed their sales script!

Sure did, I don't really know but they were extremely powerful

[Roger]

Powerful is not necessarily a good thing. Forceful/good jet feel is hard to do. Anyone can throw water at a jet with a pump and water spits out. Making that water feel good on your muscles and not itchy is another thing. Hydrotherapy is not as simple as a thousand low/value end tub manufacturers make it, and this is part of the reason a quality engineered tub cost more. To some people it's not important, swirling hot water is all they need. Hydrotherapy can only be measured from a wet test and whats right for you may not be right for her.