Ok To Use 220v For A/c Unit?

[Nelson]

Hi everyone, I am thinking about getting a hot tub and place it in my backyard. It would be right next to the A/C unit. Does anyone know if I could share the 220V setup currently in place for the A/C? The breaker is 40AMP. I would not use both units at the same time. My panel is full so I would either need a sub-panel or a new larger one all together. Last time I checked with an electrician they wanted close to $2000.

I was also thinking I could make it a single 220V outlet and just plug in the tub in the winter and the A/C in the summer.

Should I consider getting a 110V instead? I am in Anne Arundel County, Maryland and do not plan to use it for longer than an hour at a time so heat loss may not be an issue?

Also, I can't find information on how far the tub needs to be from the A/C unit in order to pass inspection. Does anyone know?

Appreciate any advice you can give me.

Nelson

[hrustar]

Hi everyone, I am thinking about getting a hot tub and place it in my backyard. It would be right next to the A/C unit. Does anyone know if I could share the 220V setup currently in place for the A/C? The breaker is 40AMP. I would not use both units at the same time. My panel is full so I would either need a sub-panel or a new larger one all together. Last time I checked with an electrician they wanted close to $2000.

I was also thinking I could make it a single 220V outlet and just plug in the tub in the winter and the A/C in the summer.

Should I consider getting a 110V instead? I am in Anne Arundel County, Maryland and do not plan to use it for longer than an hour at a time so heat loss may not be an issue?

Also, I can't find information on how far the tub needs to be from the A/C unit in order to pass inspection. Does anyone know?

Appreciate any advice you can give me.

Nelson

You can not do that where I live. Code requires a dedicated circuit. Also, it needs to be a GFCI breaker, which the A/C breaker is most likely not. Lastly, 40 amps is probably too low. Most hot tubs seem to take a 50 amp or 60 amp if they require 220. Other things to ask, is it within 25 feet but not less than 5 feet from the hot tub and have a clear line of site form the hot tub? Those are also code requirements.

[Mikey_in_NY]

Agree with Hrustar - you cannot simply 'plug in' a 220v hot tub, it must be on a dedicated circuit, protected by a GFCI and, in my area at least, with an outside disconnect more than 5 feet away from tub. There are some tubs that will work on a 40A GFCI circuit - I know Sundance have these available, possibly Hot Spring and others also. Don't know how far tub needs to be from A/C - have you tried calling your town inspector?

Lastly, $2,000 seems a lot for a new sub panel, $1,000 seems more realistic? Try shopping around for a better quote.

[freezin]

Lowes sells the sub panels for around 100 dollars......more like 89 dollars...with the 50 amp GFCI breaker in it....you have to look on line...but like Mikey said....1000 seems more like it installed....depends on how far you have to run the wire from

[Nelson]

Thank you all. I think I'll go this route then. I need to get more estimates. Appreciate all your help.

Nelson

[wkearney99]

I am in Anne Arundel County, Maryland and do not plan to use it for longer than an hour at a time so heat loss may not be an issue?

Tubs require power pretty much all the time in order to keep the temperature at a ready-to-use level. Warming up that much water takes a lot of power. I'm in Bethesda, MD with a 220V tub. When I refilled it at 69F it took about 12 hours to bring it all the way up to 104F. If it goes without power for more than about an hour the temp will start dropping (during the winter, that is). So don't plan on being able to "turn off" the tub.

[pkillur]

Agree with Hrustar - you cannot simply 'plug in' a 220v hot tub, it must be on a dedicated circuit, protected by a GFCI and, in my area at least, with an outside disconnect more than 5 feet away from tub. There are some tubs that will work on a 40A GFCI circuit - I know Sundance have these available, possibly Hot Spring and others also. Don't know how far tub needs to be from A/C - have you tried calling your town inspector?

Lastly, $2,000 seems a lot for a new sub panel, $1,000 seems more realistic? Try shopping around for a better quote.

If you can deal with cold and/or a screwdriver, here is what I did:

1 - Hire an electrician to come disconnect the main panel and make sure your feeder lines from the meter are adequate, and that your main feed is adequate (Any home over 30 years old might not). Then, disconnect from your current panel and move into the new one. Have electrician on standby to come over and hook up new panel and verify you are not on crack and can use a screwdriver (this is what I did also). They should NOT charge you for a quote and checking it out, if they say they do charge for a quote, I would not use them (this is just my personal mantra, and I'm not an electrician...) I like to find subs from Yelp or servicemaster.com

Pre stage your wiring and GFI for the hot tub, including but not limited to the internal/external wiring to the GFI (if you use Romex it has to be stripped before going into liquitite (sp?) and TAKE OFF THE PAPER!!). For me here in Colorado, any external wire had to be in liquitite and have the external sheathing (the black stuff) removed, anything inside did not. My equipment (electrical) consisted of a new panel, GFI, and 6 GA electrical cable. You will most likely find that the cable is ridiculously heavy and expensive, and that a 125' roll of pre-cut is the cheapest route (homedepot was cheapest in my area, plus I used a Lowes 10% off coupon - you can get them in US postal offices usually). My GFI and whip came from the tub's previous owner, so I didn't have to puchase them. If I were buying a new one, I might get one like they have on spadepot.com (I think it's connecticut electrical) because they claim it gives you a 110 outlet. Not sure if you can use it when you're using the tub though, I would think you can't but I'm not an electrician, so I don't know. I have a SquareD GFI. Most places seem to require that you use individiual 6 GA wires from the GFI into the liquitite for the whip into the tub, so you can take the romex, strip it or buy new hot+hot+neutral+use copper from romex. GFI for the tub and the breaker for the panel are agnostic I believe, so you aren't limited to the same brand for GFI that you have in your panel (which is good if you have something expensive in your panel).

Have all of this done and screwed in and secured before the electrician shows up. They then will run the lines from the meter into the new panel, test, fixodent and forget it. I went this route and my quote went from $2500 (cheapest of 3) to $250. The other question is that is your time (probably at least a day if not two) is worth the grand or two you will save. I'm trying to be completely debt free (the free hot tub, was DEFINITELY NOT free!) so the choice was simple for me.

I probably would not have done it if I hadn't watched the flash-demo thing on Spa Depot's website - SO FREAKING HELPFUL!!! and the fact that were a more "crazy" people like me that did their own wiring.

Check your local laws first, I had to bury my whip for 2 feet where it comes up to the pad (completely stupid IMHO), but laws are laws. The electrical inspector in Parker (where I live) was REALLY helpful and recommended some local electrical guys to have come disco/reconnect the stuff.

[freezin]

Just remember if you don't feel you have the cohonnas to wire 220v/240v or even 110 v......Don't do it. the laws are there Yes some are stupid as all get out....but they are there to keep people from getting KILLED.....

[HockeyKat]

I agree with pkillur.

What we did was find an electrician that was willing to work with us. Even with a new construction, we still had to run a dedicated line to the tub, about 30 feet from the electrical panel. The electrician gave us a list of parts and we bought them at Lowes and did all of the manual labor ourselves... digging a 30 ft trench, burying conduit, installing the GFI panel, etc. All he had to do was wire the breaker box, and wire the hot tub control pack. Shaved TONS off the estimate.

[gman]

You need to follow the code in your area. I would be a bit reluctant not to have a qualified electrician do the installation. Not only are there safety reasons, but your homeowners insurance may not cover losses if they occur because of improper installation, particularly when it is discovered that part or all of the installation was performed by someone other than a licensed electrician.

I, too, had to install a new electrical line and GFCI breaker and sub-panel for my new hot tub. While doing my tub search, I thought I'd take care of the electrical work so that, except for the final hook-up to the tub, it would be ready to go. I was initially going to install a 50 amp breaker because I was led to believe, by the local Hot Springs dealer, that 50 amps would be sufficient for most hot tubs. In my area, this is probably somewhat true since the local Hot Springs spas use 50 amps and the local dealer is very popular. Most of the electricians I spoke with confirmed that 50 amps should be adequate. Had I acted on that initial information alone, I would have had to replace that 50 amp breaker with a 60 amp breaker. Fortunately, I waited until I made my final tub choice before I did the electrical work. I ended up buying a Sundance Optima. Now, the Sundance Optima can run on multiple amps, i.e., either 40, 50, or 60 amps. But with the 50 amps set-up, the heater will not run while the both water pumps were operating. The Sundance Optima requires a 60 amp GFCI breaker if I want the heater to keep running when the other pumps are operating. Had gone with just the 50 amp set-up as I was initially led to believe was satisfactory, I would have been very disappointed during my winter soaks because the water's temperature would not be kept where I like it.

As has been mentioned, most tubs will run on 40, 50, or 60 amps. I believe some of the swim tubs require even more. But just because the tub will run with a lower amp set-up doesn't mean it will function the way you think it will or the way you want it to. You need to look at the specific electrical requirements for the tub you intend to buy and then install the appropriate electrical requirements to operate the tub the way you need it to operate. If you don't know yet what tub you intend to buy, I would recommend you wait until you've made a final decision on the tub before you begin the electrical the set-up.

Good luck and happy tubbing.

[Nelson]

Thank you all for your feedback. I am having an electrician come over tomorrow and give me an estimate. We'll see what the quote is. Thanks again!