stl-rex

Arctic has switched from AO Smith motors/Waterway pump to a different brand of motor that is made in Italy. I've "heard" the new pumps and they are quieter and vibrate less than the AO Smith. They appear to have a higher flow coupled to the same waterway pump. It's a noticeable difference both on noise and flow. The only noise complaint I have is with the diverters which can make a noticeable gurgling sound. My understanding is Arctic is designing their own to alleviate the problem but the dealer doesn't have an estimated availability at this time.

No bypass is irrelevant to the grand scheme of water quality. It makes a nice sales pitch but isn't what some imply ie HS water is cleaner than others. HS owner board members get cruddy water also. If you're the only person primarily using the tub and you've been using it for some time, you're already "clean". You may be able to reduce the filter time. I had crystal clear water until we had guests over that must have shed 5 layers of skin and clouded the water. I used easy clear and it was back to perfect and has stayed that way. I'm on a paper filter now. You'd have to swap a paper filter in for the micropure filter if you want to use easy clear. I'm back to micropure at the next waterchange.

Easy target.......

Yep 3/36 warranties for minor stuff that can drive you nuts is irritating. If you haul and drive alot, a diesel pays for itself. Down here, diesel is 20% higher than regular unleaded (2.40 vs 2.00) so the cost of the diesel engine plus the fuel makes for a long payback. At the 10K per year that she puts on the truck, it wouldn't add up for us. I think the Cummins adds around 6K to the price.

Nah no arguement. 94 was 4x2, 97 was a 4x4, 2000 was an extended cab 4x4 and we just wanted the 2005. I rather enjoy wasting money on new vehicles. I've never been into running anything to death. The worst vehicle, was a 98 Tahoe. Ate brakes and rattled something fierce. Dumped it for an Acura TL which was then the wife started driving the trucks. She wanted to sit high and I didn't want two vehicles getting crappy mileage.

Yep, a Dodge. 94, 97, 2000, 2005. Pulled ski boats with the first three. Nary a problem. The '94 transmission went out about 1500 miles out of warranty and Dodge covered it. Can't ask much more than that. Can't get the wife out of the 2005. Lead foot Annie loves it.

While a FF tub will carry some pump heat through the water, considerable heat is wasted through the pump housing. If it was not, they wouldn't be forced to put it outside of the insulation to keep it from burning up. But, not trying start yet another debate. Just pointed out the Arctic design allows for a very accelerated heat pattern. (and by the way - I just save a bunch of money on my car insurance..........LOL) I know you think Arctic is just OK. I will still submit that based on wet testing, they had the best combo of jet power, comfort and in-model configuration options. Unlike some who may be content with weak and limited numbers of jets merely swirling the water around, or jets that dig and itch, I actually use mine to massage knots out of my traps/shoulders.

Roger will love this, because he loves Arctic's heat marketing so much......... Because the pumps contribute significantly more to the heat of the water in an Arctic, you can push it to ~10 deg an hour, give or take, depending on how diligent you are in keeping the two pumps on high that are allowed to run in conjuction with the heater. Unfortunately, after 20 minutes, the pumps shut off and just the heater runs. So you have to keep going out and turning the pumps on. But.........if you need it heated sooner than later............the option exists and it works. I know, all 540 gallons worth. And no I'm not drinking Kool-aid. Right now I have a little Crown on the rocks working.

So I own the Arctic Tundra Legend Ex. 61 jets with 3 pumps. I’ve had it since October. Please allow my observations in response. The insulation isn’t worth discussing. Our highest bill change was our first month which had a fill and everyday 40 minute usage. It was up $15 from previous year. Other bill deltas have been lower. I can’t feel the jets protrude when the water is on. I don’t think you can on most spas. Most spas jets protrude and are not recessed. Arctic’s is no different. I don’t recall seeing many recessed jets unless it’s a specific feature like HS Motomassage. I love having the number of jets I have. Every corner seat is a basically a full massage. If you don’t like the placement, you obviously didn’t wet test so don’t complain after the fact like it’s Arctic’s fault. They have something like 9 models from which to choose. I don’t care for every one. My tub could be quieter, but not only am I moving more water, nearly every jet rotates which in my mind creates more turbulence and perhaps a bit more noise. Small price to pay for better feeling and more powerful jets. The Arctic jets don’t needle you and the orifice of the few static jets is a decent size diameter that penetrates without causing that itchy feeling. The only noise complaint I have are the large water diverters that sound like they can’t decide on the air/water mix. It varies based on diverter placement. Hearing it is seat and position dependent. We chose the Tundra over other models due to the wet test. The Arctic Frontier is the only lounger that I tested in any brand that I remotely cared for and in which I did not appreciably float. However it wasn’t enough for me to buy it. Lounges are very person dependent both in preference and fit. Not only are the controls intuitive and clearly detailed in the manual, they are conveniently placed and easily accessible within the spa unlike some other brands. I’m not sure how you can get much simpler or easier to use. As a side note, the temperature readout is the water temp, not the set temp. That is quite convenient and not every manufacturer sets it up that way. The filtration cycle time and number of cycles is adjustable. It is clearly outlined in the manual and easy to change. I upgraded to the 24 hour high output ozone. I keep my Bromine floater set on 1 and have no trouble maintaining good Bromine levels even with everyday use. I attribute that to the ozone. Perhaps this person really owns that spa and is dissatisfied. But the rhetoric, particularly the insulation jabs, speaks of a bash Arctic piece. Bring the $100 increase in electric usage and then complain about the insulation. The other “stuff” shows a serious lack of either pre-purchase research or a general lack of intelligence/common sense. We own a Dodge Ram 4x4 (with Hemi). I would liken it to me complaining that it gets less than ideal gas mileage (true) and the seats are uncomfortable (not true). Both characteristics readily known before purchase.

We were not looking specifically at the Sarena Bay but others in the reflection line. When she sat dry and looked at the pending water level, it was about halfway up her face. I actually wet tested the Californian and Nautilus and found them to sit "deep" and since she is 5" shorter than me, she sat dry and said "no way" since I had already somewhat struggled. D1 sat deeper overall in all seats more than any other brand wet tested. Those brands include Master, Caldera, Hot Springs, Sundance, Arctic and Cal Spas. The deep seat in our Arctic Tundra is a bit too deep for her, but she is able to use a ridge in the center as a brace and still use it just fine. A wet test will tell you if you can accomodate yourself as she does in ours. I strongly urge you wet test. If it works for you, it will be a great spa. If not, you probably won't get the use out of it you envision.

Kahuna is correct. You really need to wet test. When were were shopping, D1 got cut because in general, their larger models were too deep. My wife at 5'2" would have drowned. You also need to see how much you will float out in the recliners. While not a true lounge where you are totally extended, float can still be an issue. If you are spending that kind of $, make sure you can use the primary seats.

My dealer orders only the forever floor. It's going to be good against rodents and other pests also, making is useful regardless the surface on which you place your spa. I'm bromine, not Baqua. Too much negative press on it. If you have it and like it, you should spread some good about it. I know some people develop the "Baqua cough" and that it's more expensive and I'm not sure as effective than bromine or chlorine. Other than that, no experience with it.

Congrats! After we pop a few fireworks off a midnight, we're going for a quick soak. It's warm here in Missouri now (40 - 50F). Our December was cold (for us) and we had snow. I'm approaching three months, so it get's drained either tomorrow or Monday. Ahhhhhhh fresh water - can't wait.

Somehow someway, you really need to wet test. The motomassage in the HS is a personal preference thing. We did not prefer it. To me it's underpowered and gimmicky. HS has to have five filters to make the marketing claim of 100% FILTERED WATER. In my opinion, that is the reason their spas feel underpowered. They can only pull so much water through the filters. To get any power at all to any one position, you've got to crank the diverter to direct the flow of water to that one position, robbing the other positions serviced by that pump. That was something not acceptable to us. The sundance polypropylene based filter filters down I believe to some number less than 10 microns which in theory means it will remove smaller particle size contaminates than the HS filter. Does that make it better? For spa use, I don't really know. But it is expensive to replace. Given these are $10K+ range spas, I wouldn't want to buy one without wet-testing first. Also don't be too sold on the foot dome in the Max. I can sit in my spa for 20 - 40 minutes and use the foot jets for only a few (I don't have a foot dome). The foot dome is nice because it provides a brace to help prevent float. EXCEPT, in the Maxxus, unlike the Optima, it's not positioned such that shorter people can really take advantage of it. So your shorter wife could use it in Optima for support, but probably would struggle in the Maxxus. If I've confused you more, I apologize. But since I own neither brand and have no agenda for or against either, I offer my opinion.

You mean the one where he didn't take a free shot at D-1 and Sundance, but could have because there was a question that did involve those brands? I figured it was an impersonator since it didn't have the 14 point cut and paste of the last 14 things people should be concerned with when buying a spa.

Something else to keep in mind is that you can go from Chlorine to Bromine without emptying the spa. To go from Bromine to Chlorine, you would need to drain it to get the Bromine residual down. If you start with Baqua, from what I've read, you have to thoroughly drain it and use other chemicals to completely rid the spa of Baqua. For that reason alone I would suggest you start with Chlorine or Bromine simply because to switch between the two is easier than if you start with Baqua and later want to switch.

The method you choose to sanitize your tub is independent of ozone. Ozone is a supplement. It can make your water a bit easier to keep clear and can perhaps cover for occasional mistakes, but it is not a substitute. Chlorine and Bromine are the top two sanitizers. I believe Baqua is a distant third. You must choose one of the three regardless if you have ozone or not. Baqua is the most expensive and not necessarily the most effective. You certainly can effectively use Chorine or Bromine whether you ozonate or not. If you are being told otherwise, your dealer is not being truthful.

Congrats on the purchase. The frontier is a great design in a double lounge. We got to wet test it and it was one of the few lounges we didn't fight the float. We went away from the lounge and got the Tundra instead for other reasons. If I recall, the Frontier also has the raised shell. The headrests and seats all are designed such that the headrests are about 3 inches or so below the top of the shell. This helps keep the wind off of you even in the shallower seats. It's the same in the Tundra. I am guessing Arctic will keep that trend in any newer designs.

You haven't mentioned if you wet tested. Those two spas are going to "sit" very differently and there will be a substantial difference in the feel of the jets. The wet test should decide it for you. Given the price point, make sure it's the one you really fits you well, and has jets you like, not the one with the stereo, or the one with 5 filters or......you get the point. You are fortunate. You should be able to test them back to back and know right away which you prefer. Good Luck.

I own a Tundra Legend EX. I didn't even pay $10K for it and that's with basic Northern lights and Peak Ozone. The dealer with whom you are dealing in my opinion is too high. I know a Tundra Ultra just went out in St. Louis for ~$8500. It did not have either variant of Northern Lights but I believe it had Arctic Ozone. Check the 2004 model. Does it have the big 5" rotating jets in the deep seat? If it does not, I'd pass and work on the 2005. Arctic reworked the design a bit and it was a vast improvement. You won't find a better feeling jet package than in that deep seat with the 7-5" jets. Sounds to me like the dealer is inflating the 05 price to try to move the 04. Basic Northern lights is all you need. The Deluxe adds a few more lights, but not $400 extra worth. The mark-up on the accessories is high and very negotiable. 2005 Tundra Ultra with ozone and Northern Lights, with Fiberglass Floor, Cover, Lifter, Normal Delivery and start up chems should be $8500 give or take but certainly not over $9K. Roger doesn't like Arctic. That's his opinion. But the Tundra is a great tub - fits a lot of different people and there's nothing like that inverted triangle seat. I wet tested several brands, Hot Springs, Sundance, D1, Master, Caldera to name a few. Arctic blew them away which is why we chose them. Don't give up.

I looked at the footprint. It's smaller than ours and our 2 1/2 year old can't really "swim" across, so I wouldn't count on using it for that. I would strongly suggest you go to a few dealers and wet test, meaning putting on a suit and getting in. D1 and Sundance seem to be well respected in the industry. I know nothing about Catalina other than there is a dealer here but I did not examine them. You mentioned the warranty. You may want to see if they prorate sections that others do not. Enjoy shopping for a spa. Oh and CR has never reviewed spas. Any rating such as Consumers Digest, Pool and Spa etc is purchased with marketing dollars. Unfortunately I don't believe there are any truly unbiased ratings anywhere. Wet test. Be comfortable with your local dealer. You'll probably be OK.

Given your climate, I'd stick to the Arctic and skip the Coyote. Examine the construction and insulation; the Arctic to me appears to be made better. The jets used in the Arctic have a superior feel also. All around, it is a much nicer spa. Blue Falls Manufacturing, which makes Arctic and Coyote is located in Edmonton. When comparing the spas, I would focus on the wet test. That was what drove me to select the Arctic. I have a Tundra Legend Ex.

We're still keeping it around 100F so we can stay in it longer. I couldn't make 20 minutes in any of the deeper seats at 104F. It feel too good to have to get out so quickly. Probably down the road, when the newerness wears off (or as it gets colder), we'll bump the temp up.

It's not legit. It is managed by a third party who makes it next to impossible to claim the rebate with detailed requirements. The intent of course is never to pay out. I think the 1050 with TV straight up is around $12K. My wife's boss got burned on this deal but not to the tune of $9K. If you like the spa negotiate straight up. If you don't like the dealer, find another brand spa. There are many viable alternatives.

A wet test slid us over to Granite, literally. Those pearl finishes are gorgeous, but are slicker than the granite which with it's slight texture provides a little more friction. The friction aids in moving around the spa and helping to brace yourself when preventing float. We also have a young child and were concerned about him slipping a falling. Just a different perspective/opinion.