Sundance Maxxus/aspen Cost

[jacobbencke]

I'm shopping for a hot tub and came across a 2008 Sundance Maxxus floormodel. The dealer said it's been at a few different stores but never filled with any water. They are asking $10900 for it, plus another $300 to install the new Clear Ray UV system (it currently comes with ozone). Is this a good price? Should I be concerned that a 2008 model has been sitting around for that long unsold? It is a bigger tub than many people can fit in a yard. The dealer says the warranty starts the day I buy it, so it's like a 2013. The cost for their 2012 Aspen floor model is $12700. Thanks for inputs.

[yellowdog]

First question to you. Have you done a wet test on either tub? This is so important to do. I bought a Sundance Optima after the wet test. My wife could not stay in the seats of the other tubs we tried from different manufactures. The Optima had the raised foot well for her to brace herself when the jets were on high. If we had not done the wet test I would have bought the wrong tub for her.

As far as what you are looking at they are both fantastic tubs. We did wet test the Aspen and we both loved it but the Optima was cheaper and had plenty of room for us and it fit better in the space I had for a tub. If I was buying the 08 Maxxus I would make a counter offer $10,300 (or what ever you think is fair) with the Clear Ray installed. All they can say is no. As far as it being a 2008 that does seem kinda strange. Does it have any cosmetic damage? You are getting the full warranty so that is a good thing.

Good luck on your decision.

[spatech (the unreal one)]

I'm shopping for a hot tub and came across a 2008 Sundance Maxxus floormodel. The dealer said it's been at a few different stores but never filled with any water. They are asking $10900 for it, plus another $300 to install the new Clear Ray UV system (it currently comes with ozone). Is this a good price? Should I be concerned that a 2008 model has been sitting around for that long unsold? It is a bigger tub than many people can fit in a yard. The dealer says the warranty starts the day I buy it, so it's like a 2013. The cost for their 2012 Aspen floor model is $12700. Thanks for inputs.

1) I wouldn't necessarily be concerned that it is sitting wound for that long if you can get it in writing that it still comes with the full warranty from the manufacturer (not just an in store warranty, make sure its still the full manufacturer warranty). If its just the store warranty then thats not really the same coverage and very much lowers what the spa is worth.

2) The clearray is fine if it comes already included with the spa but I seriously doubt it does much of anything for you so if you do go this route I would for sure save the $300 despite their story of how great it is. Thats expensiv for a UV system in the first palce and I question whether it does anything other than cause you to buy a new bulb every year or so.

3) If the 2012 floor model is $12,700 then I think $10,900 is too much for a 2008 that has been sitting around even if its covered as if its new. I'm very sure he's anxious to move this out of his store as no one wants a spa that old sitting around so if you're serious I would not hesitate to counter with something like $9000 and expect to meet in the middle but closer to the lower number.

[Spa_Guru]

1) I wouldn't necessarily be concerned that it is sitting wound for that long if you can get it in writing that it still comes with the full warranty from the manufacturer (not just an in store warranty, make sure its still the full manufacturer warranty). If its just the store warranty then thats not really the same coverage and very much lowers what the spa is worth.

+1

[jacobbencke]

thanks for all the feedback. To me it just sounds fishing having a 2008 still in stock. Why wouldn't it have sold any of the previous years as a floor model. It comes with Ozone, but not the new Clear Ray system. I found it intersting that Jacuzzi and Sundance make it sound like Clear Ray is the latest and greatest technology. But Hot Spring feel Ozone is better and that UV is old school. I couldn't really get a good answer on which is better from internet searches.

[Spa_Guru]

No UV, clear ray, or ozone generator/ion system is a good substitute for old fasioned water maintenence.

[yellowdog]

thanks for all the feedback. To me it just sounds fishing having a 2008 still in stock. Why wouldn't it have sold any of the previous years as a floor model. It comes with Ozone, but not the new Clear Ray system. I found it intersting that Jacuzzi and Sundance make it sound like Clear Ray is the latest and greatest technology. But Hot Spring feel Ozone is better and that UV is old school. I couldn't really get a good answer on which is better from internet searches.

I have the Clear Ray. I will not get into a pissing match with any one on which is better. I will only go off of what I have found.

I have now had my tub for 15 days. In those 15 days the tub has had an average of 3 adults per day in the tub for a total of 30 hours of use. I'm *** and keep a strict diary of everything I do to the tub and how much time it is used.

Here is what I have done chemically to the tub. One scope ( I think it's about 1oz) of Spa Boss for every person that is in the tub after we get out. Run the jets for 20 minutes after I put in the Spa Boss

Once a week (so twice so far) I put in 10oz of Aqua Finesse hot tub water solution.

I have cleaned the filter twice

i test the water every other day with test strips. I got concerned that the strips showed everything was spot on. I got so concerned I was doing some thing wrong in reading the test strips I took a sample to a different hot tub store. It is much closer to my house then where I bought the tub and I wanted a truly independent test. They took my sample ran a test on the water and came back and said "your water is perfect" that's all I needed to hear.

All bathing suits are washed with out soap and three times the wife did shower before getting in the tub. She is the only one to do this.

So to sum up. Some thing is working right for me. Is it the Clear Ray? No idea but I sure love how perfect the water is.

One thing i forget to mention. When the tub was filled the spa tech checked my water and it was right on target straight from my faucet except of course chlorine was 0.

[Spa_Guru]

I would be curious to know the upkeep cost with your clear ray system over a period of 3 months.

$149 for three months worth of Aqua Finesse?

Spa Boss = good old fasioned Chlorine.

There are a lot of sanitizing systems out there that work great, as for whether or not the cost justifies the result, that is an individual decision.

[yellowdog]

I would be curious to know the upkeep cost with your clear ray system over a period of 4 months.

i will let you know. i don't know what either of the products cost that i have put into the tub because it came with the tub. I will keep track as soon as I need to buy product.

[yellowdog]

I would be curious to know the upkeep cost with your clear ray system over a period of 3 months.

$149 for three months worth of Aqua Finesse?

Spa Boss = good old fasioned Chlorine.

There are a lot of sanitizing systems out there that work great, as for whether or not the cost justifies the result, that is an individual decision.

To me having a tub that I can have any one over and not worry about the water being harmful is priceless. If what I am using ( I'M assuming this is what you are saying. If I'M wrong and you are not saying this I'M sorry) cost a little bit more for the water quality I have I will pay the price and not even think about it twice.

Both my wife and I have been in to many friends tubs that have a Chlorine smell when you get in and we are always itchy after we get out and dry off. Not pleasant. Mine has no odor at all and we feel like we just got out of the shower when we get out of our tub. I take owning a hot tub very seriously. If it means spending more money to have the best water I can I will do it.

[jacobbencke]

This is the hot tub background the dealer gave me:

"The ‘08 Maxxus was a floor model at our other store. This was a two story building, and we hoisted spas up to the second story with sheer man power. Since the Maxxus didn’t change for quite a few years, we left it up there. When things started to change, we brought it down to another store. Just recently we had these sunrooms taken out, and had the chance to steal it from that store and sit it next to our Aspen, as we have wanted to do for a long time. But now its time to sell it! So we put it out for sale along with a couple other smaller models, 2010 & 2011’s for practically what we paid for them! "

This is my first time shopping for tubs so I'm not sure what red flags to look for. I know a car dealer would never have a vehicle in stock for so long unless it had a problem. I agree the price seems a little high for something 5 years old, even if it is good as new and comes with factory warranty. My biggest concern when spending this much money is getting a lemon.

[spatech (the unreal one)]

This is the hot tub background the dealer gave me:

"The ‘08 Maxxus was a floor model at our other store. This was a two story building, and we hoisted spas up to the second story with sheer man power. Since the Maxxus didn’t change for quite a few years, we left it up there. When things started to change, we brought it down to another store. Just recently we had these sunrooms taken out, and had the chance to steal it from that store and sit it next to our Aspen, as we have wanted to do for a long time. But now its time to sell it! So we put it out for sale along with a couple other smaller models, 2010 & 2011’s for practically what we paid for them! "

This is my first time shopping for tubs so I'm not sure what red flags to look for. I know a car dealer would never have a vehicle in stock for so long unless it had a problem. I agree the price seems a little high for something 5 years old, even if it is good as new and comes with factory warranty. My biggest concern when spending this much money is getting a lemon.

I've heard this scenario before with 4 or 5 year old floor models so I tend to beleive the story. Just know that 1) they REALLY want to move it, you can be sure of that, 2) You need to negotiate with the attitude that you'll only get it for the right price and I don't think $10,900 is it, 3) It has to have the full manufacturer warranty (get it written on the invoice and/or even call the manufacturer and ask if it makes sense that it will still be intact) and I'm not convinced it will, 4) Skip that $300 UV system and don't pay $250 either if they counter, it won't do much other than to cause you to have to buy a new $100 bulb every 12 to 18 months.

[yellowdog]

This is the hot tub background the dealer gave me:

"The ‘08 Maxxus was a floor model at our other store. This was a two story building, and we hoisted spas up to the second story with sheer man power. Since the Maxxus didn’t change for quite a few years, we left it up there. When things started to change, we brought it down to another store. Just recently we had these sunrooms taken out, and had the chance to steal it from that store and sit it next to our Aspen, as we have wanted to do for a long time. But now its time to sell it! So we put it out for sale along with a couple other smaller models, 2010 & 2011’s for practically what we paid for them! "

This is my first time shopping for tubs so I'm not sure what red flags to look for. I know a car dealer would never have a vehicle in stock for so long unless it had a problem. I agree the price seems a little high for something 5 years old, even if it is good as new and comes with factory warranty. My biggest concern when spending this much money is getting a lemon.

I've heard this scenario before with 4 or 5 year old floor models so I tend to beleive the story. Just know that 1) they REALLY want to move it, you can be sure of that, 2) You need to negotiate with the attitude that you'll only get it for the right price and I don't think $10,900 is it, 3) It has to have the full manufacturer warranty (get it written on the invoice and/or even call the manufacturer and ask if it makes sense that it will still be intact) and I'm not convinced it will, 4) Skip that $300 UV system and don't pay $250 either if they counter, it won't do much other than to cause you to have to buy a new $100 bulb every 12 to 18 months.

My question to you Spa Guru is " should I go out and shut off my Clear Ray and my water will remain perfect? I'm being serious. Two corrections ...the UV bulb is changed ever 12 months and my cost here is $79. The Clear Ray came with my tub so before I bought the tub I did a lot of research. In my mind it has merit to do what it was claimed to do. Is it the best system? I have no idea. Am I happy with it? Yes. One more question for you. If I took out the UV and put in the ozonator system would my water be cleaner using the same chemicals I'M using now? By the way I measured how much Spa Boss I put into my tub per person after each use and it is 1/3 of an oz. I have read many of your post and you are a person I respect a lot when it comes to hot tubs. I want to learn why some thing is good or bad with actual facts. .

[spatech (the unreal one)]

There is a chem expert on one of these 2 main sites whose opinion has been (wish I had bookmarked his post) this UV type system works in water municipalities where the water is a lower temp but in hot water it will do little if anything. I'm not saying it does absolutely ZERO for you but I question whether it does enough for you to even notice let alone warrant a $79 bulb every year but I'd certainly just let it run the first year and decide when its time to change the bulb. You could always unplug it and keep everything constant for a few weeks and see if you notice a difference if you're curious. A good chlorine routine does the trick but from experience with both I think a CD ozonator will do more for you than a UV bulb system and there is no bulb to change but I'm not saying go out and buy one of those either as they help but they're no cure all either and a good one is not cheap. Either one is nice to have if it comes with the spa but I'm not shelling out for a new bulb every year if I think its not doing much of anything for me (all my opinion of course). I'm a skeptic from years of seeing spas where the UV bulb has been out for years and the homeowner never even noticed or the bulb is illuminating but you explain that after about 18 months its not really effective anymore yet they are still on the original bulb that is maybe 4 years old and never noticed a change. BTW, I'm a big proponent of the "add after you exit" routine and think that its the chlorine thats working for you (I assume thats what Spa Boss is).

[jacobbencke]

The Hot Spring dealer told me that even the ozone system needs replacement after 5 years, about $300. So $80/yr for UV bulb x 5 years = $400. I would say about roughly the same cost for Ozone vs UV. The Jacuzzi dealer was going to add Ozone system for "free" (notice the parentheses, nothing is really free), because they feel UV and Ozone work differently at killing bacteria and the combination is better. I don't know enough about either system to say which one is better, seems like both have oponents and proponets. In most cases it seems like the dealer claim what they have is better than the other guy.

[yellowdog]

Spa Guru:
SpaBoss Chlor Aid is a Stabilized Granular Chlorine (Sodium Dichloro-S-Triazinetrione 99%)

I just wish I could find a reliable source that shows the UV does not work in hot water. I'm just the kind of guy that is not into what a "guy" says. I do know who you are talking about on the other forum. He is extremely well informed on chemicals. If he had data to back up what he says and the data can be found from a reliable source then I will be the first to say that certain hot tub companies are lying.

The thing that IM amazed at is how many "my hot tub water is terrible what do I do" threads. So it doesn't matter if you have an ozonator or Clear Ray if you don't do the chemicals right you are screwed.

While I was typing this up the door bell rang. A neighbor that lives 5 houses away said he saw my tub delivered and wanted to see it. Come to find out he has a very nice Hot Springs Vanguard that is 2 years old. I opened the cover and he said "hell don't you ever use this that water is sparkling clear" I showed him my little diary of how much the tub has been used and he was shocked. The next thing he said "how do you have a tub that is used that much and have no chlorine smell" I explained how I treat my water and that my tub has a Clear Ray system. He said he will try my way of treating his water and I told him don't use my system until you talk to his dealer. I have no idea if having an ozonator in his tub mean he needs to treat his water different then mine. So to sum all this up (3 hours in the making) I will stick with what I have and not worry if the Clear Ray is working. Time for a beer or two.

[spatech (the unreal one)]

"I just wish I could find a reliable source that shows the UV does not work in hot water"

Certainly keep it on and I never meant "does not work at all" because I'm sure there is theory and some reality that it does help somewhat, I'm talking about to what degree and would I buy a new bulb. Taking the mirrors off my car will increase my gas mileage for sure, I just wouldn't bother to do it based on how much it will help me.

I'm aware you're looking for more than an "IMO", same as on the other site and I'm fine with that. I would never expect/want anyone to take what I say as gospel necessarily, i pass on what i think and what I've expereinced. I don't think I can find if it was Chem-Geek or WaterBear or which other of the "chem experts" on this site that talked more about this subject but if I can find it I'll add the link.

[Spa_Guru]

Chlorine gets a bad rap, and I blame lazy or uneducated spa salesmen.

Mind you, there are good spa salesmen, but rather than get into that, let me tell you why Chlorine gets it's reputation.

Chlorine is the most over-used chemical, and when used in high enough quantities it becomes not only a germ killer, but a deodorizer, oxidizer and clarifier.

Most repairs I do come from excessive Chlorine levels.

Spa oxidizer or shock, (potassium peroxymonosulfate) is designed to deodorize and clarify.

Properly maintained Chlorine levels do not result in dry skin, red eyes, or odor.

It is an easy step for a salesman to demonize chlorine in one breath and explain to you how he is going to save you from it with his tub in the next.

[jacobbencke]

After some back and forth the dealer has offered to lower the price of the of the 2008 Sundance Maxxus floormodel down to $10900 out the door. They did not have a Maxxus or Aspen to wet test, but they had an Optima with similar jet setups which we tried. The tub will have manufacturer warranty starting the day it is bought, so in that sense it is good as new. The tub had never had water in it, and doesn't appear to have any cosmetic defects. The model has a built in stereo. The 2008 comes with CD ozone, and they will retrofit the tub to add the ClearRay and include 4 extra bulbs. Plus they throw in all the normal stuff: locking Cover, Covermate 1 lift, steps, chemical startup kit, and delivery. Any thoughts on the price?

My other options was a brand new Hot Springs Grandee for $11500 brand new, I could probably talk that down to $105000. I like the jets a little better on the Grandee, but I anticipate the tub might get more kid play time than adult time in the tub so I'm leaning towards the bigger tub so we can spread out.

thanks in advance for any feedback.

[Hot Spring Ace]

My other options was a brand new Hot Springs Grandee for $11500 brand new, I could probably talk that down to $105000. I like the jets a little better on the Grandee, but I anticipate the tub might get more kid play time than adult time in the tub so I'm leaning towards the bigger tub so we can spread out.

thanks in advance for any feedback.

The reason I like the Grandee (and have had one since 1998) is that its a big spa and it is VERY open. Its the spa my family grew up with and my 3 kids treated it as small pool due to the wide open seating with 6 full seats and a cool down spot.

The Maxxus spa is nice and while bigger than the Grandee it has a "bucket" seats and a lounge so it actually accomodates fewer people since its not very open and really more like a 4 seater with a cool down spot.

If you're looking for a spa for many people I think you're better off with a more open spa like the 6 seat Grandee or 5 seat Aspen.