yellowdog

Hi Salty D, We are happy to hear you are looking at a hot tub purchase. We are happy to help you find a hot tub that is perfect for your new deck (and help you design that deck too)! You can reference our deck design tool to help you place your spa in the perfect spot outdoors (http://www.hotspring.com/planning-tools/hot-tub-deck-design-tool). Here is a link to find a Hot Spring dealer near you: http://www.hotspring.com/find-a-dealer If you have any questions please don't hesitate to call our customer service team and they can help point you in the right direction: 1-800-999-4688, extension 8432. Thank you! The Hot Spring Hot Tub Team I hope all hot tub companies come on here to advertise for free. Sweet deal.

I bought a 2013 Sundance Optima for just about what you are looking at. The 2012 and 2013 are almost identical but the 2013 comes with the new sound system if wanted. I did get the Bluewave sound system in mine. Now here is how I was able to get it at that price with the sound system, I'm giving the store owner and two employees golf lessons for the better deal.

I have a Sundance Optima and I can set my circ pump from how many hours to be on for and what time to come on. I have mine on 24/7 because of how much use the tub is getting right now.

Using the hot water from the house is a good idea if you want to get things up to temp fast. You have to be careful if you have any kind of a soft water system for the inside water. Using straight soft water for the tub is not a good idea.

Congratulations on the new tub. When my tub was delivered and filled for the first time it took 9 hours to go from a water temp 52 degrees to 100 degrees. Outside air temp was 30 degrees. It will get up to temp soon and then you can dive in.

When I got my new tub, filled it with 52 degree water it took 9 hours to get to 100 degrees. Outside temp was 34 degrees. I have 220v.

What hot tub do you have?

You guys have made some great points and I have learned a little.....sorry not much on anything showing the UV doesn't work but that is OK. I haven't showed much if any that it does work. I really do hope it does work because I own it. If my first three weeks with an avg of 3 people in the tub for a total of 31 hours of tub time is any indication of what is in store for the water condition I see in the years to come then I think I made the right choice for me.

You guys have made some great points and I have learned a little.....sorry not much on anything showing the UV doesn't work but that is OK. I haven't showed much if any that it does work. I really do hope it does work because I own it. If my first three weeks with an avg of 3 people in the tub for a total of 31 hours of tub time is any indication of what is in store for the water condition I see in the years to come then I think I made the right choice for me.

So if I have this right, every one is saying you don't need any of these extras that the hot tub companies put in their tubs ACE system, ozonator. All you need....I am new to this but learning fast......good filter system, good circulation pump, and using the right chemicals at the right time. Oops forgot and a good heater or it would just be sitting in cold water. All the other stuff to help the water is just fluff. My point is if the UV is just all smoke and mirrors then a lot of people are proving all the rest of the fluff is not needed. I still need this question answered. Why would a multi multi million dollar company owned by Apollo management put their reputation on the line with a product "Clear Ray" that did nothing as some are saying? I think I saw 0.0000001 in the amount of chemicals saved by the system would still be OK because it is not 0.0000000. Very true statement. The definition of neutralize is "render (something) ineffective or harmless by applying an opposite force or effect" I know I'M a pain in the back side but I want to learn and to bring to here what I learn. My play job is with Ping Golf. One thing I love about this company is they will not bring out a new product if it is NOT better then what it is replacing. I have seen this first hand with a product they were going to be release but it just didn't approve what it was replacing. So I guess I just have a big problem with a company that was using what is considered the best thing out there at the time, the ozonator and change to a product that DOES NOTHING. Just makes no sense.

You are missing my point. If a company knowingly misinforms the consumer about a part of their system and this system is a vital part of the hot tub there will be repercussions. It then has to be pulled off the market because of these false statements no matter how many austerest they have there could be a class action lawsuit. This I know for a FACT. As far as the company doing test and not publishing them....I have no idea. They put out what they thought was relevant. Go on their website and ask them that question and see what they say. I got a very fast response on my question I asked if any of the tubs were manufactured in the US. As with anything, time will tell and I will still be sitting in crystal clear water with a smile on my face. You have to admit this has been fun and maybe something good will come from it.

So again a lot of comments by me and others that has no proof. I did bring up that the expert on the UV system said "it does have a dimension return after 95 degrees" He also said in his professional opinion the system would have a positive affect for what it is being used for in hot tubs. So we all agree to disagree. He is my major concern. Sundance, Jacuzzi are in the top 5 in hot tubs in most eyes in America. Can we agree on that? If Jacuzzi is so arrogant that they can bring out a system that is "one" of the most important parts of the tub without doing extensive testing to make sure it does what they say it can do.....then in a couple of years the Jacuzzi Corporation will have one large class action lawsuit from people claiming that they were put into an unsafe situation because of miss information by Jacuzzi Sundance. Being married to an attorney for the Department of Justice I do have insight to what can and will happen from giving miss information to the public that "can" put a person in harms way. Before some one says "well then the company can say it was because the person used the wrong chemicals" That has noting to do with the class action because it has to do with miss leading the public on what they say in their advertising. So time will tell and I will keep anyone who is interested in how the system is performing.

You make great points. One thing I have learned is some times it is hard for people to except new changes. Funny the first thing I was asked in my FedEx interview way back in the stone age....1981 was " how do you handle changes" You see it all the time things change and people want it the way it was. They say it is proven to work just fine don't change it. New technology comes out and is tried in a different way and people are up in arms because there is no way it can work. They may be right. But what IF it does work and it makes are lives a little easier. For some of you that weren't on the planet yet, when the microwave came out all you would hear was you will get radiation from the darn thing. Don't use it. (Sorry my food in the microwave just got done time to eat. OK I'M back) How did that one turn out. For every new thing that worked there are the ones that didn't, Time will only tell if the UV systems works. To say something don't work because you heard it from some one who heard it from some one ....come on just show why it doesn't work. I just hope I'M still alive to find out the real answer on the UV system because I do eat a lot of things out of the microwave. Every one have a great Saturday I'm off to do a golf demo.

I knew I would get responses like this. Say anything you want..You are right I did talk to only one person that has NOTHING to do with any hot tub company and is not trying to sell me anything. I did talked to a person that knows more about UV systems then any one I have found on the forums. (unless they also work in the field) and he was fine with what the spa companies were saying this system would do again with the right flow rate. You are absolutely correct I didn't have the answer on the flow rate but in his OPINION by the clarity of my water and never seeing any cloudy water the UV was doing what it was designed to do. Hot water with human body waste will cloud up a lot faster then cooler water....his words not mine. I'm not here to sell anything or say any system is better then another. I do know Ford trucks are better then Chev trucks. I'M just tired of people saying that one system is so far superior or one system does nothing but cost you $79 a year with out having any real proof beside what their feeling is. Now if that person worked with the UV system everyday for a living and said the system is just a placebo then I would have some decisions to make. This whole thing was for me and me alone. I posted what I learned for others to take with their own research to help with their decision. I'm not telling anyone to buy the Clear Ray or that it will solve their water problem. It makes no difference what you believe we can all agree if you don't use the chemicals right your water will suck. An absolutely huge thing for me was to have a tub with zero chlorine smell and this is what I have. So I'm happy and really (not to hurt any feelings) is all that matters to me. Neither you nor the person you spoke with can conclude the UV system has ANYTHING to do with your good results with your water care. If it was the only thing you were using then you'd have more of a point. I have never had cloudy water issues and have never had a UV system. Granted I've been at this a long time but I've seen hundreds of people with very good water results that don't have UV system. All of us have one thing in common, use of chlorine in the water care routine. Chlorine is amazing at keeing water clean and clear. Prove to me it doesn't work with hard data. I did my research that helped me understansd more what UV does and doesn't do. The forums have some misinformation and some data backed information. I DO NOT HAVE THE DATA (I did caps to help you ) to prove anything. I wanted to talk to a person who knows more about UV then any of us to find things out. So that is exectly what I did. If you want to take the time and post the place you spoke to and you find something out different then please post it. This is how we all can help people make informed decisions. I do have to agree 100% with you that there really is no hard data saying the Clear Ray works better or as good or does anything as good as other systems. As you say the UV doesn't do anything to help with the water then I can say my tub must have one heck of a great filtration system. And for a rookie I have this chemical thing down perfect. I say get rid of all ozonators and Clear Ray because they are not needed. I have hard proof of that by how good my water is staying with out any help from anything but chemicals and a filter. I will keep trying to find actual data to prove or disprove the UV system.

I knew I would get responses like this. Say anything you want..You are right I did talk to only one person that has NOTHING to do with any hot tub company and is not trying to sell me anything. I did talked to a person that knows more about UV systems then any one I have found on the forums. (unless they also work in the field) and he was fine with what the spa companies were saying this system would do again with the right flow rate. You are absolutely correct I didn't have the answer on the flow rate but in his OPINION by the clarity of my water and never seeing any cloudy water the UV was doing what it was designed to do. Hot water with human body waste will cloud up a lot faster then cooler water....his words not mine. I'm not here to sell anything or say any system is better then another. I do know Ford trucks are better then Chev trucks. I'M just tired of people saying that one system is so far superior or one system does nothing but cost you $79 a year with out having any real proof beside what their feeling is. Now if that person worked with the UV system everyday for a living and said the system is just a placebo then I would have some decisions to make. This whole thing was for me and me alone. I posted what I learned for others to take with their own research to help with their decision. I'm not telling anyone to buy the Clear Ray or that it will solve their water problem. It makes no difference what you believe we can all agree if you don't use the chemicals right your water will suck. An absolutely huge thing for me was to have a tub with zero chlorine smell and this is what I have. So I'm happy and really (not to hurt any feelings) is all that matters to me.

So I have been told by a few that the Clear Ray system doesn't work as advertised. I have asked for any one to give me proof that the system does not help in keeping the water in my tub clean. Notice the word "help". No system, as in an ozonator will keep your water clean without chemicals. They are there to "help". I talked to ultraviolet.com. I asked about my situation and they told me for "drinking water" the UV system would not work cleaning the water to pass the stringent test if the water being treated was above 95 degrees. I was then told the UV working in water about 95 will still do the same thing just at lower intensity. If the water had to pass for drinking water then he would not recommend the system. He then told me the key for using the UV system in the hot tub is the flow rate of the water past the UV system. He asked me what that rate was and I didn't know the answer. He said if you want drinking water in the tub don't buy a hot tub because no hot tub system can come close to doing that. I asked how I can tell if my system is working right. I told him how much use my tub was getting (which is a lot) and how the water looked and the amount of chemicals I was using. He told me by what I had told him and the water clarity it is working perfectly. I asked how he could say that and he said I would notice my water getting cloudy before I put my chemicals in. I asked if I would notice a big difference if I turned off the UV. He said I would in a day or two with the amount of use my tub sees. He said the problem with turning off the system, he felt I would have to add a lot more chemicals to get the water back to where it was before the shut down. The last thing he told me was he was in no way shape or form a hot tub expert in fact he has never had a tub. He does deal in water and UV every day and understand how it works and what it can and can't do. So for me I did do my research and I did get my questions answered by a person that is in the field. Is the UV system the end all system? Heck no! It is another choice that the consumer has in picking a hot tub. I can now say "IN MY OPINION" the Clear Ray works. Hope this helps others that are confused on the Clear Ray.

Spa Guru: SpaBoss Chlor Aid is a Stabilized Granular Chlorine (Sodium Dichloro-S-Triazinetrione 99%) I just wish I could find a reliable source that shows the UV does not work in hot water. I'm just the kind of guy that is not into what a "guy" says. I do know who you are talking about on the other forum. He is extremely well informed on chemicals. If he had data to back up what he says and the data can be found from a reliable source then I will be the first to say that certain hot tub companies are lying. The thing that IM amazed at is how many "my hot tub water is terrible what do I do" threads. So it doesn't matter if you have an ozonator or Clear Ray if you don't do the chemicals right you are screwed. While I was typing this up the door bell rang. A neighbor that lives 5 houses away said he saw my tub delivered and wanted to see it. Come to find out he has a very nice Hot Springs Vanguard that is 2 years old. I opened the cover and he said "hell don't you ever use this that water is sparkling clear" I showed him my little diary of how much the tub has been used and he was shocked. The next thing he said "how do you have a tub that is used that much and have no chlorine smell" I explained how I treat my water and that my tub has a Clear Ray system. He said he will try my way of treating his water and I told him don't use my system until you talk to his dealer. I have no idea if having an ozonator in his tub mean he needs to treat his water different then mine. So to sum all this up (3 hours in the making) I will stick with what I have and not worry if the Clear Ray is working. Time for a beer or two.

I've heard this scenario before with 4 or 5 year old floor models so I tend to beleive the story. Just know that 1) they REALLY want to move it, you can be sure of that, 2) You need to negotiate with the attitude that you'll only get it for the right price and I don't think $10,900 is it, 3) It has to have the full manufacturer warranty (get it written on the invoice and/or even call the manufacturer and ask if it makes sense that it will still be intact) and I'm not convinced it will, 4) Skip that $300 UV system and don't pay $250 either if they counter, it won't do much other than to cause you to have to buy a new $100 bulb every 12 to 18 months. My question to you Spa Guru is " should I go out and shut off my Clear Ray and my water will remain perfect? I'm being serious. Two corrections ...the UV bulb is changed ever 12 months and my cost here is $79. The Clear Ray came with my tub so before I bought the tub I did a lot of research. In my mind it has merit to do what it was claimed to do. Is it the best system? I have no idea. Am I happy with it? Yes. One more question for you. If I took out the UV and put in the ozonator system would my water be cleaner using the same chemicals I'M using now? By the way I measured how much Spa Boss I put into my tub per person after each use and it is 1/3 of an oz. I have read many of your post and you are a person I respect a lot when it comes to hot tubs. I want to learn why some thing is good or bad with actual facts. .

Hopefully you have a few different hot tub dealers you can visit. Set up times that you and your girlfriend can go do a wet test on some different tubs. This is in my eyes one of the most important thing you can do. As far as which is the best. Ask five people on here and you may get 5 different answers. In my area I had Hot Springs, Sundance, Arctic Spas, Jacuzzi and Bullfrog. I went to all of them and narrowed it down to two, Hot Springs and Sundance. Again it was just the best for what i was looking for. I ended up buying a Sundance hot tub. Is it the best? It was the best for what I wanted. I would have had no problem owning a tub from any of the five companies I looked at they all had good points. You need to find a couple of tubs you like after looking and hopefully wet testing them and then come on here if your still not sure which one will work for you the best. then we can give you our opinions on which would be better for what you are looking to have. I really enjoyed the shopping experience and learned a lot about hot tubs. The best part is every night getting to jump into a nice hot tub and just relax. If you could post the companies you could go look at I'M sure you could get a lot of help from people on what they think is the best.

To me having a tub that I can have any one over and not worry about the water being harmful is priceless. If what I am using ( I'M assuming this is what you are saying. If I'M wrong and you are not saying this I'M sorry) cost a little bit more for the water quality I have I will pay the price and not even think about it twice. Both my wife and I have been in to many friends tubs that have a Chlorine smell when you get in and we are always itchy after we get out and dry off. Not pleasant. Mine has no odor at all and we feel like we just got out of the shower when we get out of our tub. I take owning a hot tub very seriously. If it means spending more money to have the best water I can I will do it.

i did read all of that complaint and all I can say is Coast did a heck of a nice thing replacing the persons hot tub. i will put money on the problem was caused by the owner of the tub wiring it wrong but we will never know.

i will let you know. i don't know what either of the products cost that i have put into the tub because it came with the tub. I will keep track as soon as I need to buy product.

I have the Clear Ray. I will not get into a pissing match with any one on which is better. I will only go off of what I have found. I have now had my tub for 15 days. In those 15 days the tub has had an average of 3 adults per day in the tub for a total of 30 hours of use. I'm *** and keep a strict diary of everything I do to the tub and how much time it is used. Here is what I have done chemically to the tub. One scope ( I think it's about 1oz) of Spa Boss for every person that is in the tub after we get out. Run the jets for 20 minutes after I put in the Spa Boss Once a week (so twice so far) I put in 10oz of Aqua Finesse hot tub water solution. I have cleaned the filter twice i test the water every other day with test strips. I got concerned that the strips showed everything was spot on. I got so concerned I was doing some thing wrong in reading the test strips I took a sample to a different hot tub store. It is much closer to my house then where I bought the tub and I wanted a truly independent test. They took my sample ran a test on the water and came back and said "your water is perfect" that's all I needed to hear. All bathing suits are washed with out soap and three times the wife did shower before getting in the tub. She is the only one to do this. So to sum up. Some thing is working right for me. Is it the Clear Ray? No idea but I sure love how perfect the water is. One thing i forget to mention. When the tub was filled the spa tech checked my water and it was right on target straight from my faucet except of course chlorine was 0.

First question to you. Have you done a wet test on either tub? This is so important to do. I bought a Sundance Optima after the wet test. My wife could not stay in the seats of the other tubs we tried from different manufactures. The Optima had the raised foot well for her to brace herself when the jets were on high. If we had not done the wet test I would have bought the wrong tub for her. As far as what you are looking at they are both fantastic tubs. We did wet test the Aspen and we both loved it but the Optima was cheaper and had plenty of room for us and it fit better in the space I had for a tub. If I was buying the 08 Maxxus I would make a counter offer $10,300 (or what ever you think is fair) with the Clear Ray installed. All they can say is no. As far as it being a 2008 that does seem kinda strange. Does it have any cosmetic damage? You are getting the full warranty so that is a good thing. Good luck on your decision.

I did a little research because I have no good answer for you. My tub went on a cement patio. Type in google search "how deep must the gravel be for a hot tub" You will find tons of answers that will help with your decision. By the way two nice tubs you are looking at. I have the Sundance Optima and love it. Good luck.