MileHghSpaGuy

I didn't say the tubs falling apart were 20 years old. Your deck dries in the sun and with airflow and I am sure you seal it, the framing of tubs gets wet and stays wet....you should stop buying cheap grills. As you mentioned before maybe Maax is ok for Halifax, Niagara Falls, Denver or 95% of the world...ill stop arguing with you, so if someone is looking in northern Minnesota go with something else because hot springs and d1 the only tubs that should be sold there apparently. People with "30 years experience" generally have hard times adjusting to new and improved technology...I remember when nature 2 came out and I was calling it voodoo.

Spoken like somone who hasn't done it before. Maybe I will post a couple pictures of how easy its not. That "soft" foam is open cell, which actually has far less r value then closed cell...kind of catch 22.

I'm pretty sure the tubs I see Breckenridge and other mountain towns are subject to enough snow and cold weather to justify my point. We average 50-70 calls per week and 10+ are digging foam. Some more severe then others... we also average 2-3 in shop replumbs every month... we also get bad rodent problems in foam. I've never met a service tech in my life that wasn't jaded to foam.... weird.

Add cool water and try and get temp down and see if it raises back up. Is it very hot or in direct sun where you live? Heater light on? No oh code on topside?

The reason to the jet packs is reducing plumbing and giving you more options for seating. But the original design was done to eliminate plumbing...yes it's a great innovation and kudos to them! You cannot swap size of jets, only same sized inserts and many times changing them often will cause jet clip to break or you can cross thread the thread in kinds like master, Catalina and a few other companies use.

Lol markee, why not open the entire front? That's a picture of a dealer ripping apart the front to run 110v to turn on lights and maybe stereo. Your picture is a picture of your equipment pack. How many inches of insulation down the sidewalls does the spirit have...keep in mind framing and plumbing take up space...maybe 2-4 inches? You get the same or more thickness of insulation on a Maax. Do I need to post pictures of marquis on their side ripping out foam? Don't worry I won't because I'm not going to try and scare people from buying your tubs because they are nice and if I liked their jetting more would have been in MY tier 1. Btw I hope you aren't selling those celebrity tubs marquis came it with...just buy a Laguna bay. Rodger the largest pool builder in Minneapolis is a Maax dealer, i dont think they would risk their reputation so they could sell poorly insulated hot tubs. I don't know about northern Minnesota but I also know the dealer in Halifax and Niagara Falls Canada that tell me their customers don't notice much change in electric bill. Guess growing up with sundance and thinking nothing could touch them then going out on my own i try to teach customers i talk to their plenty of good brands...it's unfortunate that some of the older traditional companies can't help but bad mouth the ones with newer techniques. If you really do service, you must be sick to death of ripping out foam like i am?

Rodger I am very confused...you are worried about steel framing rivets and not the staples that hold together wood framing? Maybe I just have more experience with older tubs then you...but have you not ever seen tubs (including jacuzzi) falling apart at the frame while trying to transport them? I have a jacuzzi at my shop from 99 i am rebuilding the frame on as the entire spa looks warped, same with a 2003 marquis and a late 90s cal. Your post bashing Maax makes me think they are more of a direct competitor because I might not have more experience on this forum as you but I now know I have more real life experience and would drastically disagree. I am 6'0 220 and don't find the Maax uncomfortable or restrictive, maybe you just a much bigger guy then me. I'm going to end this conversation on the principal i don't think you have any real life experience with both products, no offense, not many people do. Me fixing and selling tubs used, as well as other things I dabble in just gives me more access to all the brands. I am not saying jacuzzi is a bad product and not even saying Maax is better, but I am saying they are very similar in qualities and nothing I've seen from pumps, electronics, plumbing (why did jacuzzi remove all their gate valves btw? drives me nuts) shows me any differently. What jacuzzi has in aspects Maax makes up in others and vice versa. Tj I am surprised the Maax was louder, I haven't noticed those being very loud...since their pumps are insulated and jacuzzi pumps are not that is surprising to me. You might ask the dealer if they put the insulation back in the spa after wiring? Rodger is right though...the wood is stronger then the steel...today. Just like foam is great...today....but neither last.

Caldera does make some cool tubs. I love that new 8x10 they have...those waterfalls are sweeeeet.

Lol isn't Boyd the Catalina engineer? I am excited to see the new 21'er they have coming out. But I don't think endless pool hits even 6mph and that thing is a beast at top speed.

Ok dr ill go first. To your reply about the wheel...do our car wheels look like Fred flinstones or are their designers and engineers redesigning their performance while keeping same concept of being a wheel? Things can always benimproved IMO...spray foam has little r value per inch, can generally only hold a couple inches down the walls until it gets under the seats. I will group my favorites in tiers because their is no "best" spa...please keep in mind these my favorites, not claiming they the best for everyone, but I like them. Tier 1:arctic, Maax, bullfrog, jacuzzi (3-400 series). I am jaded towards repairing leaks, I think arctic and Maax are best thermo lock insulating tubs. These companies have shown good efficiency while almost eliminating problematic leaking issues. Bullfrog and Maax offer non wood frames which is cool and they all use plastic bottoms. I really like maaxs jets in neck and shoulders and foot in loungers. Jacuzzi may have best back jets and even though I hope someday they change their insulation and don't like they built in Mexico now their product is still good and feels great. I also prefer balboa equipment, easiest to use, diagnose etc and not expensive to fix down road. I haven't tried bullfrog since new jet packs out but heard their performance has suffered. Tier 2: marquis, hot springs, sundance d1 I think every tub should have a plastic bottom, Id have all these companies but marquis in tier 1 if they changed. The sundance cameo is my favorite hot tub to sit in. I also think sundance corrected their ozone problems with clear ray even though I think their sales people are over selling it. Tier 3 I think those tiers covered most spas being sold. Artesian, master, dynasty, Catalina probably belong here.

That's not right Rodger, you would need to use that almost daily without help. Reason:Biofilm...it produces bacteria and is the reason you need daily sanitizer...without it you can get away from using it until needed. Maybe this doesn't work for Snow's needs, but I have seen it help a lot of people including my mother.

LOL did Dan just say that Catalina pushed 8-9 MPH? Come on bro. http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_many_miles_per_hour_does_Michael_Phelps_swim What specific model to you recommend? I swam in the Marathon 18/5 and was not impressed at the swimming aspect. Also how are you getting it in your walkout basement? What kind of access do you have in? I know I would recommend a endless pool for inside like that and a separate hot tub for either down there or outside.

Endless Pool is the best swim system IMO, but I am not sure they have anything you can keep outside all year in a cold climate. I think Master Spa is more popular then Hydro and that's why you read so much about that...if you think Hydro has the better swim go with that. I haven't used either but would love to one day. I think D1 was about my favorite, Maax was really close, didn't like Catalina nearly as much as those.

Hello, I haven't been on this forum for years...I think my name was SpaGeek but I couldn't seem to find my old log in information so I started a new name. I see everyone has their favorites, so without anyone fighting or much arguing, what do you like and why? Maybe rate a couple tiers of hot tubs, I don't think you can say "this brand is the best" or even "this brand over this brand" (ie:sundance over hot springs) because its all matter of opinion and they probably more similar in being higher end spas then they are different...maybe certain small things but same principals. But tiers...I don't think many people would agree with mine so I will just let everyone else talk if they want. I seriously am not looking to start a war, most people on here will be biased to what they sell, but I am curious why you like what you like not why you don't like others. People make their livings on these products so lets not try and bash anyone else..unless a traveling sales team in town or a big box store comes up that is! Coming from the service side I prefer the couple companies that have good efficiency while thermo locking for future accessibility. I don't think many companies do a good enough job of thermolocking but some do. I like plastic bottoms and larger more comfortable jetting. I do not mind the companies that spray in foam but think spray foam wont even be around in 10 years as its too old fashioned, low R value per inch and just call out to be infested with rodents (at least where I live). I do not think a circ pump matters one way or another, I do think circ pumps fail often but don't think they make much difference. I don't think framing is a huge deal unless you plan on moving and taking the hot tub with you. Thanks for taking any time....Cheers!

If you are going with the aqua finesse system, AF makes a "spa clean puck" I believe its called. Its great for purging hot tubs and should be run for a couple days then drained. AF kits come with dichlor included, you only need to add a couple teaspoons after use depending on size of tub. Maybe just buy the starter kit instead of the larger box so you can make sure you are not wasting your money.

I say try Aqua Finesse...it is only product that proves to remove BioFilm and even though you still need a sanitizer you use less. It also softens the water. I am not a chemist, but I have recommended it to other customers with problems and they liked it. Worst case scenario it doesn't work and you try something different? I think its far easier then a baqua system.

I like D1 a lot...I don't know much about Hydro. Maax also uses a steel frame. I have not seen many 10 year old swim spas but have seen 10+ year old hot tubs to have seen wood framing rot. I also recommending wet testing before buying, there are huge differences and I try and use them anytime I get a chance. I have swam in a D1, Maax, Catalina, Endless Pool, Tidal Fit and maybe a couple others and D1 and Maax were my two favs. I don't like the "swim jets" much because I think the circle jets push out much more water. I would like to try the master spas phelps series but generally you can only buy those from road shows and get no service.

So the pump is running, the water is cool and the heating light is not activating? I do less on hot springs then the other brands but most common error is a flo problem. If the small circulation pump is running and pushing water I would first check the pressure/flo sensor would be most common. You might also pull the filter that it is pulling from circ pump and see if maybe its just pulling less water then the sensor likes. Right now the controls are not telling the heater to turn on for a reason, that generally means you are not getting flo through the heater properly...once you have proper flo the indicator light should come on. If we find its not those sometimes it can be a board issue, but sensors, pump and filter most common reasons.

A higher end used hot tub is better then a lower end new one. Maybe start shopping CL or find a dealer who specializes in used tubs.

My company does service and used spas and we will fill any tub and let anyone sit in it. We also allow appointments 365 24/7, but I am the owner and would never ask an employee to come in on his day off or holiday so that might be different. Wet testing with them is a problem probably because higher end hot springs require different electrical then their lower end hot spots, they might just not have the proper electric in the store to wire the tub. Keep in mind if you open the front panel on a Grandee and on a Hot Spot they are not the same tub, don't think you are getting the hot springs quality with a hot spot tub, they are different animals. The Hot Spots use smaller less comfortable jetting and don't offer the exact same equipment...which for 4000 less price you probably knew that. I am happy they are honoring their territories...I don't understand why people take negotiating price as a full time job. People don't want the company they buying from to make money, unless the company just ripping you off I don't understand why people cant just understand if a price is fair everyone should be happy.

SpaGuru you are a veteran poster on this site, I am also a tech and sell used hot tubs. I am curious why you are saying Maax is less quality? I used to post on this forum years ago and would have agreed in the Coleman days thinking their insulation and framing was junk but now I think they are very much improved. I guess I am curious to what specific reasons you say the others are better? I prefer Balboa controls as do most service techs, Maax is the only one of the three with them, for a long time I recommended Arctic to people and I really think Maax and Arctic are on even playing field and think most would agree Arctic is just as good as anyother brand...do you think I am wrong in these assumptions?

I like the cover rockit because you don't need to drill into the paneling, this way you can change it if needed, don't ever worry about rot or holes in your spa. But Marquis>Master no doubt.

I might be wrong but I think Allied sells after market sundance parts, I get some things from them when I need parts and am not a dealer. I do not believe they make it for Sundance as when I visited the plant 10 years ago that was not the case.

I am confused when you say it shows the LED Light is dark...are you saying there is no power to the controls? Have you tested to make sure you are getting current to the spa and checked your fuses? Do you have a meter?