BlueSpa

We have the Aquacisor that I believe the OP was referring to. Had it for about 3 years now. Originally bought it as an exercise spa with the rowing attachment and exercise bands. These work great but evidently weren't designed for constant immersion in Chlorinated water - only the stainless carabiners haven't corroded, everything else becomes garbage even if you don't leave it in the spa after each session. We've gone thru two sets of the D-ring attachments which are bolted into the spa - the plating quickly comes off leaving a rusty corroded mess. The manufacturer replaced the first set, saying the original set had plating issues and have been improved, now they say it's my water quality (I use the Taylor kit and have had the water checked by several local pool dealers so I know better than that!) accessory attachment So it's no longer used as an exercise spa although you could jog in it quite comfortably. Probably will need a wetsuit top or something for jogging during the Maine Winters - once you're wet it gets VERY cold to be standing up. But I do LOVE the spa for soaking and the added depth of the water is WONDERFUL. Yes, I'd buy it again but would negotiate a little harder on the price - it's just like buying a car, you need to walk away from the deal a couple times to get a reasonable deal. Make sure you get delivery with a crane included in the price - don't buy the salesman's pitch that they'll just roll it in place, I think the empty weight is half a ton. Good luck!

Ops on 1&2 - another senior moment <G>, good I checked in with the forum, haven't been thinking chemistry for a while! I usually try to keep the SI between -2 or -1 but didn't know what effect a low pH / lack of Calcium would have on the spa hardware for the short time if I wait to adjust. Thanks for the help!! Time to pull out the Taylor kit and try to fire up my chemistry neurons.

How low is the CH in your fill water? You only need a CH of around 125 and not higher. My suggeston is to add the calcium first while the pH is low and then the next day add your borax and acid (gentle spa is just borax and dry acid--you can just use borax and acid yourself and save a lot of money.) Also, what is the TA of your fill water? You want it around 60-80 ppm before you add the borates so that might need adjustment first. Adjust one thing at a time, don't try and adjust multiple water parameters at once and give 24 hours in between for readings to stabilize. Thanks Waterbear! In the past when I've tested our fill water before any treatment the CH is basically 0 and TA is 10.

I'm about to do a refill on our spa and have had great luck with the 50ppm Borates helping to stabilize the pH. Because our well water has a low pH I was going to use a little Borax to raise the pH to about 7.6, then finish with Boric Acid (or Gentle Spa) to get to 50ppm Borates without having to add acid. Thought I'd do a little reading on what to expect with the Borax and I read Richard's comment about creating calcium precipitates - "Calcium should not be added within 12 hours of any pH or alkalinity raising product." I've never created any precipitates in the past and usually waited an hour or so between additions of the Sodium Bicarb alternately with Calcium Carbonate, but maybe I've just been lucky . . . Since our water has virtually no Calcium, I'm wondering if it's OK to wait till the next day to start adding the Calcium Carbonate?? (Our spa is 650 gallons if that makes a difference.) Thanks!!

I also had questions about the "order" of chemical additions after reading an older post that I believe recommended 12hrs between pH adjustments and Calcium additions, and was planning a refill in the next couple days. But raising the water temperature this high before I START balancing the water would mean that our spa will be circulating our well water (tap temperature 50ish degrees, pH about 6.8, no calcium, TA readings about 10) for many hours before getting to 90+ degrees. Not sure if it's correct but I've always started adding the Bicarb and Ca once it was full enough for the recirculating pump to run. I've always made final readings with the water up to temperature, but should I really wait to start balancing??? I was also wondering about the sequence for adding DiChlor and Borates. Have used GentleSpa in the past after adding the DiChlor and getting my pH readings adjusted, but have found that it tended to raise the pH a bit and not sure I liked the other fragrances and fillers. Have just ordered some Boric Acid from AAAChemical to try with this fill so will see what the addition does to the pH. (After adding the Borates I'd rather not have to adjust the pH too much so I've generally tried to have it near the end point that I was shooting for.) The borates do work wonderfully in keeping the pH more stable on a day-to-day basis, so will definitely keep using them!! Adding the DiChlor to 10ppm for the new N2 cartridge lowers the pH if done before the borates, but I really don't know the proper or if there is a recommended sequence to follow for adding everything (other than adding each chemical a couple ounces at a time and waiting 20 min or so between each addition). Thanks!!

Thanks Richard! I'd been using the Taylor watergram and keeping the SI at around zero but that Pool Calculator looks helpful too. I hadn't even thought about the temp at the heater element being higher, duh - will target a slightly negative SI in the future. We haven't noticed any scale in the tub but didn't know what to expect was going on at the heater element. Right now the pH has been pretty stable at 7.8, CH 120, TA 80, CYA about 20, and I think 50ppm Borates, and since the weather has gotten warmer we're keeping the water cooler, about 98F. At least now I'll not worry as the TA drops a bit and the SI ends up a -0.2. The Taylor kit and Watergram has been a lifesaver in relating all these values - I can't imagine using the dip strips reliably for anything but quick checks of our Chlorine levels. Seems I'm using the Taylor phenol red pH check at least once a day but the borates are doing a wonderful job keeping the pH stable even with our ozonator and bubblers. Thanks again!!

Many thanks to those that have recommended adding Borates (I used Gentle Spa) to help stabilize pH rise!! Used it on the last fill and this product is wonderful - pH stable and water does make the skin feel very silky. I haven't gotten the Borate test strips yet but added the amount recommended on the Gentle Spa bottle so think I have about 50ppm borates. Thought I read a post that said this would change my Taylor TA calculations but couldn't find the post. Right now I'm taking the TA reading, subtracting about 10ppm for the CYA content, and am wondering if I should also be subtracting for the Borate content?? Have been trying to keep the TA in the lower ranges 60-90, but didn't want it to go too low and wasn't sure how the Borates affect the system. Also have stayed away from the stain and scale and too much of the metals stuff with this fill, our well water has no metals or calcium, but didn't know if this would cause a problem in the future with the heater scale or something?? (also using a N2 cartrigde and ozonator). Thanks!!

One thing to watch when using Dichlor is your Cyanuric acid (CYA) levels will rise. Others on this list have more experience than I do and there are lots of great posts on the pros and cons of each method of sanitization. Just remember that for every 10ppm of Chlorine you're also adding 9ppm of CYA. This Cyanuric acid will stay in the water until you dump and levels over 20-30 ppm will reduce the effectiveness of the Chlorine so most folks switch to another sanitization method once there's about 20ppm CYA in the water. For us, our well water has no Calcium so after a refill I add some Calcium Chloride to get the level at the low side of OK, then switch to Calcium Hypochlorite as our sanitizer once we have enough CYA in the water. But of course it's not that simple because although the CalHypo does not add any CYA, it raises the pH and we have problems with pH rise too. Once our Calcium gets up there I was thinking about trying Lithium Hypochlorite as a sanitizer, will still raise the pH but adds no CYA or Calcium. Many on the list use regular bleach with good results. As many recommend, the Taylor test kit is great. You'll quickly find that their Watergram water balance calculator wheel will be invaluable in calculating the Saturation Index, making it easy to see the effect as the pH, TA, CH, and water temperature of your water change. Someone just needs to figure out how to add sanitizer to the wheel!!

I am also going through a second round of a rash. It does not appear to be folliculitis, in that it isn't presenting as the typical "bug bite" breadout. This is definetly more of a rash. I had been using Enhanced Shock (2tsp) daily as instructed by my dealer in conjunction with the Nature 2. I'm guessing a reaction/allergy to MPS is a real possibliity especially if you try to maintain a residual as the N2 program suggests. Anyone else have any info on sensitivity to MPS? As one that has experienced both of these rashes, I agree that it probably isn't Pseudomonas Folliculitis. The Pseudomonas itch produced larger, about 5mm or so, and very red bumps which for me were both itchy and sore and lasted for 7 to 10 days. This other itch (which is actually why I'm not out tubbing tonight) I think may be caused by the MPS as I'd been using it both as an oxidizer and to lower the pH. This itch is more of an aggravation with small, 1mm bumps, that seem to get really super itchy when rubbed by clothing but the bumps themselves aren't that red looking, sort of like little poison ivy bumps. They also stop itching and clear up fairly quickly, in a couple days if I'm not tubbing. I've tried moisturizer thinking it was dry skin affected by the jets, but that doesn't help much and I've had the mini-itch occur even when I'm not using the jets. We've always used Chlorine and the Pseudomonas was in our first week of new spa ownership when we weren't using enough Chlorine, the water became slightly cloudy, and yours truly developed folliculitis! I've since starting using unbuffered MPS both as an oxidizer after tubbing and to keep our pH rise in check and even though I'm only adding less than 0.25 oz after each soak I think there's something that the MPS contributes which is building up in the water. After two refills I've noticed that the itch seems to worsen as the water gets older. I'd read a post from someone here that the N2 cartridges help reduce the MPS sensitivity, so I've tried that with our most recent refill but it hasn't eliminated the mini-itch problem. (We have an ozonator, keep the FC levels at 1ppm or greater, have the N2 cartridge, and our tub is 700 gal). Hope this helps - guess I'll try the Gentle Spa borates and see if I can find some unbuffered Dichlor which may help to offset our pH rise, and only use the MPS as weekly shock. Good luck!

Thanks so much for taking the time to explain and correct this!! I wasn't able to find any sodium thiosulfate today so may give the peroxide a try. I just tested the water and our FC is still a bit too high at 8ppm, and our pH is around 7.7 so should work fine and I'm sure I have some peroxide around here. Should be enough to get it closer to 5ppm. Maybe we'll be tubbing in the snow tomorrow after all!!

Thanks Richard! Looks like I'll be heading out tomorrow for some sodium thiosulfate - didn't think I'd need to but I'm missing the nightly soaks after only 3 nights!!! (Plus we're due for some snow which will be perfect with the new water, glass of wine, etc.)

For those that are interested, searching "chlorine neutralizer" will bring up some suggestions, one of which is sodium thiosulfate. (I was searching but hadn't thought about using the term neutralize). Also regular hydrogen peroxide came up as working somewhat, 16oz would reduce the 10ppm Cl, but I wasn't sure of any byproducts of adding so will just wait for the Cl levels to come down on their own. Barb

Any suggestions for lowering the FC levels after superchlorinating?? After our refill yesterday I added Dichlor to superchlorinate and activate the N2 cartridge per the N2 instructions. Had the cover open and the jets on for a while to off-gas. But today is a cold, cloudy day and our FC levels are in the 15ppm range. A little too cold and windy to leave the cover open if there is any way to avoid it. With a clean system I'd imagine it'll take a while for the chlorine levels to come down. Any suggestions for getting the FC down around 5ppm so we can soak tonight?? The new water looks very inviting!!

Well with temperatures nearing 50 degrees today it's time to drain and refill!! I seem to remember reading a post that recommended a particular order for adding the chemicals, particularly the Calcium and Stain & Scale stuff but am unable to locate the specifics so any recommendations would be appreciated. The spa manufacturer says to add the Stain & Scale once the spa has 4" of water in it, then wait to balance till it's full and the water temperature is at least 80 degrees. I need to add about 8oz of Calcium and about 6 oz of Sodium Bicarb, and will have the jets bubbling to raise the pH. Then, I guess I'll add the N2 cartridge and superchlorinate since the N2 instructions say to wait till the water is balanced before adding the cartridge (would like to add the cartridge along with a clean filter while the spa is filling but guess I'll wait) Suggestions??? Thanks! Barb UPDATE - Refill done - but haven't done any balancing yet - I'm wondering now why I'd even want to add Stain & Scale if I'm also using an N2 cartridge - won't I just be removing the metal ions that I'm adding with the cartridge????? Any harm to add the cartridge BEFORE the water is balanced???? (our pH is low, TA is low and CH is none prior to treatment)

You just helped a lot of folks - thanks! I usually check ResellerRatings.com on stores I haven't heard about, but I found that SpaStore was not a member so I don't know if you can enter a review but may be worth the try! You also might be able to check on a store (or individual) by Googling "Judiciary Case Search" along with the state they're located. Many States give you access to all their records on-line these days. If I don't hear good things from other folks about an on-line store and if the prices are really good then I would only deal using my credit card and often will just go with a known retailer. The hassle factor is often greater than the price difference!! Hope the SpaStore comes thru with your order!!