primo
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Posts posted by primo
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Thanks for your reply,
The pool is 24000 gallon inground concrete with hydrazzo finish, DE filter with hot tub and rock features and waterfall. I use liquid chlorine and bleach. The unsoftened water definitely has Calcium. Have to find out PPM. In the past I always used the regular water (not connected to water softener) and wanted to know if using the soft water was ok to do.
Thanks for your help.
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Hi,
I will be draining half of my pool (to lower CYA a bit). I have a Culligan water softner system in my house due to hard water. The question I have is:
Can I use soft water to refill the pool?
One hose bib is connected to the water softner and the other is not (regular hard water). What type of water is best to top off? Hard or Soft???
I apologize if this was asked before.
Thanks for your help!
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After you lower the pH, (leave your TA alone, it's fine) I would bring the FC up to around 30-35ppm just before you leave. With that CYA, I wouldn't be surprised if you still have some residual 7 days later and may come back to a clear pool.
Of course, if you have a cover, put it on and elevate your FC only to about 10-12ppm. You should be in good shape when you return.
Thanks DSC!
wish I had a cover as there are lots of trees around!
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My pool is approx. 24,000 gallons and is a hydrazzo finish with D.E. Filter. I have been using liquid chlorine and bleach to add chlorine to my pool over the summer due to high stabilizer (CYA) levels. I will be going away for seven (7) days and want to know what I should do/add to pool before I leave. I didnt have time this morning to test my water myself so I had water tested by pool store this morning & results currently are:
Satur Index 0.5
TDS 1400
TC 2.0
FC 2.0
PH 8.0
TA 145
Adj TA 105
TotHard 239
CYA 134
Salt N/A
I tested my CYA three times two days ago using Taylor 2006 test kit and I am showing CYA between 75-85 (Pool store CYA test is wrong) I will completely test water myself tonight using Taylor 2006 test kit. In the mean time pool store is telling me my total alkalinity is low and PH is obviously high.
How much should I shock pool assumig my CYA is between 75-85? I have not been using my chlorine feeder (holds the 3 inch pucks) due to the high CYA. Should I use the chlorine feeder (fill it) before I go away? Also, I will need to lower my PH before shocking. What should I do?
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Pool is approximately 24,000 gallons. I want to shock pool to bring chlorine level up. I have the muriatic acid to lower Ph first. I will use pool calculator to determine how much of the liquid acid to add to lower Ph to 7.2. Sound right?
Why not just use the acid demand test in your Taylor K-2006. That is what the test is for and it will be more accurate than the pool calculator can be. If you have the test use it. The pool calculator gives you a "guesstimate" recommended amount of acid to lower pH out of necessity. The author of the pool calculator is the admin of the forum owned by the manufacturer of a test kit that does not not include acid and base demand tests (TF100).
This kit is heavily promoted on said forum owned by the kit manufacturer, no surprise here.
Your Taylor kit (and most of the better LaMotte kits) do include acid and base demand tests so you can calculate the exact amount of acid you need to add to lower the pH to a specific point.
Thanks Waterbear!
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The Total Alkalinity (TA) test, as well as some others (such as the calcium hardness, CH, test), can develop static on the dropper tips. If the drops are not coming out as well-formed good-sized drops that hang before detaching, then wipe the dropper tip with a damp cloth or tissue. Static will make the drops squirt out and be too small. Odds are that the pool store testing is wrong, but you should make sure you don't have static, just in case.
Do you recommend the Aqua Chek Aqua Chek Trutest Digital Rdr?
I do not recomend Aqua Chek digital tester. I had one and returned it as i felt it was very unreliable if not inaccurate results! I read the directions and followed and compared every Aqua check test to my Taylor tests and they were not even close! Believe me...I did many tests with the Taylor and the Aqua Chek side by side. In fact the Aqua Chek reader even contradicted itself giving different results when an additional test was done soon after. Yes, i rinsed each test kit after every test. I cleaned Aqua Cheks scanner bar after each test with a new Q-Tip every time and was careful not to slide the strip but lower it on a 45 degree angle onto the scanner bar as instructed. A nice feature Aqua Chek had was that it could save several test results but it only served as a constant reminder to me of how contradicting their tests results only now look! Sorry! I love my Taylor test kit because it works!
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Not bad at all! Pretty pretty pretty good!! BULLSEYE! on the pool calculator! Shot for the 7.3 PH and used 24 ounces of muriatic acid. BULLSEYE 7.3 using taylor test kit! Using pool calculator again I shot for 10 FC added 167 ounces of liquid chlorine and later tested with the Taylor and BULLSEYE! FC 10. PH is now 7.5-7.6 This stuff really works!
Thus, "the importance of a good test kit!"
Thanks again! I am going to enjoy pool for the weekend!
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Pool is approximately 24,000 gallons. I want to shock pool to bring chlorine level up. I have the muriatic acid to lower Ph first. I will use pool calculator to determine how much of the liquid acid to add to lower Ph to 7.2. Sound right?
You didn't say the size of your pool. Low and Slow is sodium bisulfate. With your numbers and adding 3 pounds of dry acid and going from 7.9 to 7.6 I estimate your pool volume to be around 20,000 gallons though that's a very rough estimate since the pH tests are +/- 0.1 or so which could throw this estimate off and volume might be more like 15,000 gallons which would be more typical. The TA from such an acid addition would be only 9.3 ppm so probably not very noticeable in your tests.
You might consider using Muriatic Acid instead. If you want to reduce the amount of fuming, you can use half-strength Muriatic Acid which is 15-16% Hydrochloric Acid compared to full-strength which is 31.45% Hydrochloric Acid.
Your CYA level is high at 100 ppm so you need to keep a higher FC level to prevent algae growth unless you are lucky enough to have a pool poor in algae nutrients.
If you are going to shock the pool above 10 ppm FC then lower the pH first to around 7.2. With your high TA, the consumption of chlorine won't have the pH drop all the way down to 7.2. Also, why are you shocking the pool? Just get the FC level up to 10 ppm to start with and enjoy the party. You don't need to shock the pool unless your water is dull or cloudy or you have CC > 0.5 ppm or an overnight FC loss > 1 ppm.
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Just tested water myself with Taylor test kit.
7-16-10. 4:20 pm
Fc 3.5
Cc <.5
Ph 7.6
TA 175
CH 375
Look ok?
Swimming tomorrow and Sunday is pool party
Want to shock tonight with liquid chlorine. First I will bring my ph down a bit. I just picked up a gallon of muriatic acid. How much lower should I bring my ph first before I shock?Pool color is amazing clear and blue!
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Thanks Chemgeek! I will do that. FYI, I did have the water tested from the pool store this morning. Here are pool store results from this morning:
Temp 78
Sat index 0.5
TDS 1800
CYA 138
TC 3.2
FC 3.2
PH 7.9
Tot Alk 157
Adj. Tot Alk 116
Tot Hardness 260
Salt N/A
As you can see from there test yesterday there Total Alkalinity went from 116 to 157 and there Adj. Total Alk went from 71 to 116. I did not add any Alkalinity increaser (they said to add 16 lbs of Balance Pak 100 I did not). Last night I added about 3 lbs of low and slow and brought my PH down to 7.5-7.6 Later I added a little bit of liquid bleach (maybe 2 cups). I tested b4 i went to bed and my results were:
PH 7.6
FC 4
CC <.5
Tot Alk. 175
CH 275-300
What conclusipns can you draw from this?
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It is very important that every pool owner obtain a good test kit and test there water even if they are taking there water to pool store for testing. The pool store test can be wrong as I just experienced. I am using a Taylor K-2006 complete (fas-dpd chlorine) test kit (which this forum recommends) and I cannot say how glad I am using this to test my water. I tested my water today at 5:00 pm EST and then took a fresh sample to pool store to compare testings. My test revealed the following:
PH 7.7
FC 3
CC <.5
Alk 175 -180
CH 275-300
CYA 100
The pool store results:
Temp 80
TDS 1300
PH 7.8
FC 1.1
TC 1.1
Alk 116 ( too low!!! and advised me to add 16 lbs of Balance Pak 100)
Adj. Total alk 71
Tot hardness 325
Sat index 0.3
Cya 151
I disagree with the pool stores Alkalinity testing too low. In fact I just tested the alkalinity again (3 times today) and I am getting alkalinity coming up bit high at 175-180 every test I did! WTF?!! I can see being a little off either high or low one way but not a completely opposing reading saying alkalinity is low. So I am going with my reading on alkalinity and leaving it alone and just bringing down my PH a bit as I will be shocking with liquid chlorine later. I know CYA testing done at pool stores are difficult if not wrong most of the time. How true!! But how can they be so off with my alkalinity????
Salt n/a
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Anyone, using a mineral system? Comments about them?
I have been using the Nature2 cartridges for the past 6 seasons with no problems. However, after reading these posts and others regarding metals in the water from N2 and possible staining I have decided not to use N2 and was glad i was able to return my new (unused)N2 cartridge for a refund! I have been on the BBB method this season with great results and more money in my pockets! Thanks to all the great help here
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Seem to have hit a snag with a Nature2 cartridge I had purchased for another spa. My other spa had an open type filter where you can adjust the height of the cartridge and slip it down. I never installed it in my old spa since I noticed a crack in the shell so it had to be replaced by another model spa (long story). The new spa (IST) has a different system....square skimmer with a flap that opens. My question is....can I just place the Nature2 cartridge in the skimmer basket? The new filter is the screw on type and a little smaller than the other. Its a chore just to get the filter in their and screwed on (very limited space).I cannot for the life of me get it in their with the cartridge>
Be advised that the Nature2 Cartridges have 3 small slots in the bottom of their cartridges that line up with their cartridge holders "tabs" (work together).
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Very well said Sir.
Agreed! ChemGeeks word is gospel! Ha!
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Thanks again waterbear
Only posted in the forum to find out BBB method and how to initially get my pools free chlorine to increase using this method. I only keep pool open for 3 months June through August so I am buying one nature2 cartridge per year. Bear with me ( no pun intended ) it just aggravates me to find out all this wealth of info, now, and how the pool business tries to screw its customers.
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Thanks waterbear
It is a whole lot easier to use a feeder and not have to put chlorine in every day (if needed). Do they make chlorine tabs without stabilizer? What is the point in having a feeder? Just keep on lowest setting. I have been using my feeder and nature2 (came with pool) for the past 6 seasons with no water problems whatsoever. I keep my chlorine above .5 even though one can with nature2. I read the box and I noticed that they even guarantee no staining (very low amounts of minerals). I never had problems and my friends and neighbors with pools much older than mine use nature2 with no problems. I am not going to start worrying now after 6 seasons. Also talked with severeral different pool techs and they all say that my levels are fine and bioguard says over 200 is high. I grew up with a pool where you only tested CL AND PH. AND I HAD NO PROBLEMS THEN. TODAY ITS GETTING NUTS WITH CYA... WHAT IS NEXT THEY WILL BE TESTING FOR. I AM GETTING AGGRAVATED WHEN I SEE BEAUTIFUL POOL WATER AND THEN HAVE TO HEAR OTHERWSE.
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So I can shock using liquid chlorine or bleach without having anything in the chlorine feeder? How can this keep chlorine in the pool without anything in the feeder to react with?
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Thanks Polyvue!
Since I have a chlorine feeder I have been using the 3" chlorinating tablets (99% Trichloro). Is it ok to continue using the chlorinating tabs or should I use something else?
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Thanks Gavin... I just received my Taylor K-2006 FAS-DPD Test kit and it really is simple to use. My free chlorine is 4.6 total chlorine is 5.2. Ph is 7.5. The cya is over 100 as the black dot dissappeared long before water level got to 100.
Free chlorine is holding nice! Had not added bleach since the 15 gallons last Friday (5 days ago). It will be exciting (starting tomorrow!) to compare my results with pool store results to see how close we are.
I'm a bit late to this conversation...
Your report that the chlorine is holding overnight is good news but since the measured CYA is > 100 PPM you must endeavor to maintain a much higher Free Chlorine (FC) level on a daily basis. The FC/CYA ratio that Gavin refers to can be found in the Best Guess CYA chart. You should target a FC concentration that is comfortably above the minimum (5% of CYA for a SWG pool, 8% of CYA for a non-salt pool). If the black dot disappeared "long before the water level got to 100" there is too much CYA in the water. You can determine the level of CYA by diluting the sample water with tap water (50:50) and doubling the result. If the CYA is much more than 100 PPM I would drain off some of the pool water to reduce it to a maxium of 80 PPM (Salt Water Chlorine Generator SWG) or 50 PPM (no SWG).
Finally, TC 5.2 minus FC 4.6 = Combined Chlorine .6 PPM; this is a bit high and shows the need for elevated levels of chorine for a while until it gets down to around .2 PPM. If the CYA is very high (and seems to be) you may be better off draining some water and refilling before you add more chlorine.
Sorry to be the skunk at the dinner party... Throw me out if you find my dour message discomforting!
Thanks Polyvue, LOL! No skunks in this forum..HA!
I forgot to mention that for the past 6 seasons I always add BioGuard Algae All-60 (10-12 ounces per week) with great results (no algae). I saved my pool test water results from the last 2-3 seasons and I have noticed that my CYA range has always been anywhere from 57 to 151 (usually over 100) and I have never had algae. Is this because I am using BioGuard Algae All-60? Also, I have been using Nature2 cartridge and keeping my TC and Free chlorine well below 5 and not had algae problems. I want to use Nature2 this season since it has been great!
Last night I added water to pool to top off (couple inches)
I had my water tested from pool store this morning (did not have time to test water myself)and the results are:
Temp: 76
sat index: -0.4
TDS 1800
CYA 131 (pool tech told me my CYA is fine and ideal CYA is 30-200)
Tot Chlorine: 2.8
Free Chlorine: 2.8
Ph: 7
tot alk: 188
Adj. Tot Alk: 149
Tot Hardness: 236
salt: N/A
What do you suggest at this point? Can I begin to use my Nature2 now?
I am unable to drain pool water and refill. I will test water myself tonight.
Thanks for everyones help and suggestions
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Thanks Gavin... I just received my Taylor K-2006 FAS-DPD Test kit and it really is simple to use. My free chlorine is 4.6 total chlorine is 5.2. Ph is 7.5. The cya is over 100 as the black dot dissappeared long before water level got to 100.
Free chlorine is holding nice! Had not added bleach since the 15 gallons last Friday (5 days ago). It will be exciting (starting tomorrow!) to compare my results with pool store results to see how close we are.
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Thanks!! I put in 15 gallons of bleach Friday night and free chlorine tested at 10 and free at 9 Saturday. Still above 5 now free and total chlorine! Finally holding!
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Thanks for the quick reply Gavin!
The water tested at pool store was approx. 15 minutes fresh meaning I took the water sample and went straight to the pool store.
Are you saying I should wait to add the bleach? as I want to keep the chlorine levels high and the test kit probably wont arrive till Monday or Tuesday.
Thanks again!
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I ordered the Taylor K-2006 test kit "FAS-DPD" couple days ago and it is on its way
Last night @ 9PM I added 2 (76 ounce) boxes of 20 mule team Borax waited an hour then added 473 ounces of clorox bleach (6%)
I waited 15 minutes then tested water with strips and OTO. Results were: OTO Test: PH: 7.3-7.5 and Chlor: over 5.0+
strip test results:
PH: 7.3-7.4
Alk: 120-180
free C: 10+
Tot C: 10+
hardness: 200-300
I waited another 3 hours and tested water again last night around midnight with strips and OTO. Results were: OTO Test: PH: 7.3-7.4 Chl: over 5+
test strips @ midnight results:
PH: 7.5
alk 120-180
free C: 10
tot C: 10
hardness: 200-400
This morning, today @ 9AM I tested with strips and OTO and results were: OTO test was PH: 7.3-7.4 Chlor: 1.5
strip test results:
PH: 7.3-7.4
Alk: 120
Free C: 1.5
Tot Chl: 1.5
Hardness: 120
I took a water sample to the pool store and the results were:
Temperature: 75
Saturation Idx: -0.3
TDS: 1400
CYA: 151 (i think CYA is wrong...i think it is lower)
Tot Chl: 0.5
free Chl: 0.5
PH: 7.3
Tot Alk: 122
Adj Tot Alk: 77 pool store is saying this is low again and to add 12 lbs Balance Pak 100. I will not unless PoolSpa Forum says so! HA!
tot hardness: 322
It looks like the free chlorine is continuing to rise slowly (yay!) so I am thinking of doubling up on the bleach tonight...That is add about 950 liquid ounces of the bleach tonight and keep an eye on it. How does that sound?
Thanks for all of your help!
`
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Based on pool store readings this morning of:
Temperature: 75
Saturation index: -0.6 ideal is -.3- +.3
TDS: 1400 ideal is <2500
CYA: 120 ideal is 30-200
tot Chlorine: 0.4 ideal is 1.5 - 3
free chlor: 0.4 ideal is 1.5 - 3
PH: 6.9 ideal is 7.4 - 7.6
tot alkal: 113
adj tot alkal: 77 ideal is 125 - 150
tot hardness: 325 ideal is 200 - 275
Using the pool calculator I determined that I need the following:
1) add 174 ounces of 20 Mule Team Borax to raise my PH from 6.9 to 7.4
2) add 473 ounces of Bleach (6%) to raise chlorine from .5 to 10
Unless advised otherwise... I will add this to my pool early tonight. Thanks again!
Total Dissolved Solids? Water Tested
in Swimming Pool Water Chemistry
Posted
When doing a pool drain for high CYA or high TDS would it work putting both a hose in pool on one side and putting pool pump on opposite side and leave them both run? Thus water level doesnt go down much yet still replaces water. Please advise. Thanks!