Theojt
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Posts posted by Theojt
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I have a 500 gal Hotsprings Grandee w/ACE. I have dumped it in the yard with no bad results but it sits on a deck so I am having a regular drain line (2") installed under the deck with an access panel from above. I also bought a Flotec Swimming Pool Cover pump (submersible, auto-shutoff). It's reasonably priced and empties the tub in about 1 hour - the same amount of time it takes me to fill it.
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rsc92 - per Watkins - they know they have an issue! Your problem will not go away - so waiting as they suggested is a waste. Call customer service back and get this fixed. Some of the reps may not know about this issue = you may need to speak to a customer service manager.
When I called my dealer - they also did not know if the issue! They also informed me that I should always call them first! Kinda ironic because I (the customer) was the one who brought this issue to you (the dealer)!
If I would have called you first - I probably would have gotten the run around as others on this forum have rec'd.
Hog - not sure what the deal is with Jacuzzi - but you having the same issue! I would call your dealer before it gets worse! I actaully had one night where the temp was set at 101 or 102 and it was reading 105! I wouldn't let the kids in! Too hot!
Good luck!
Did they happen ot give you a Tech Bulletin number or any reference like that?
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Call me fussy, but in my opinion when you set the tub temperature, that is what the temp should be regardless of time of year and I don't see this as a difficult goal to achieve. Somehow other tub manufacturers have been able to engineer energy efficient tubs to do so. Sounds like Hot Springs has figured out the problem and is taking care of it. I am sure McGee will report back that with the new control panel, the problem has been solved.
I'm anxious to hear the update. I am starting to notice a pattern - it seems to definitely vary with ambient temperature. During the late summer (new install), it was dead on. Then we had a cold spell and I noticed a 2, sometimes 3 degree variance. Last weekend when the temperature was back in the mid-70's, it read okay again. Today it's in the upper 50's and I see a 1 degree temperature difference.
So in rough terms of ambient temps (I'm guessing at the exact thresholds):
- 70 or higher = same
- 58-69 = 1 degree difference
- 48-55 = 2 degrees difference
I wonder if the trend will continue and the delta will grow larger as the weather continues getting colder - that would be bad.
Something to watch. I'd be interested if others have noticed a similar pattern.
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Not 100% - but I think they may be replacing my entire control panel!
I can update everyone after the service call!
As someone else mentioned in an earlier post! When I am in my tub - it seems like very very very hot water is always coming thru the bottom of the tub - almost to the point where it is too hot and you can not keep you foot over this area! Thinking this should fix this issue also!
Stay Thirsty!
I think that's normal - its the heater return. Ours is usually hot there too.
I just spoke to Watkins, they will look into it. I should have gotten his name (my bad). He did not seem to know about the problem, or the fix. He took my name and number, and my dealers name and said someone would get back to me. I mentioned this forum/post to him also.
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Yesterday morning, I called the Hot Spring toll free number that 'Dan The Spa Man' supplied us. I informed the lady in service of the issue and that it appears as though many others are also experiencing this issue. She stated she was not aware of this issue and wanted to talked with her supervisor. She would get back with me ASAP!
I still have not hear back! I sure hope they do not try to cover up an issue that they are well aware of! I would hope they tell customers that are aware of issue and a fix is in the works!
I will be plenty upset if my tub is off 2 degrees for the life of the tub! Unacceptable on a $10K product
When I am happy with a product - I am very vocal!
When I dissatified with a product - I am more vocal!
Hopefully I get a call today! Stand by!
Did you ever hear back from HotSprings?
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The silver ions alone are not sufficient to kill bacteria fast enough to pass EPA DIS/TSS-12, but when silver ion is used in conjunction with MPS then this does kill bacteria quickly at hot spa temperatures. Metal ions not only kill bacteria much more slowly than chlorine (10-40 times more slowly) but are mostly ineffective against viruses at the levels used in pool/spa water. So if you truly want to use a mostly chlorine-free system, then Nature2 plus MPS in their "low chlorine recipe" which only uses chlorine "as needed" would be sanitary, but much more expensive than the Dichlor-than-bleach method.
Thanks for the info. I am fine with using chlorine, and planned from the start on using the Dichlor to bleach method but then the hot tub store rep said NOT to use chlorine on a usual basis so that is what spawned the question in the first place.
Cheers,
Scott
I was curious about this position from your retailer so I downloaded the Jacuzzi 2010 manual. Page 1 is the front cover. Page 2 states very clearly that the FC level must be between 2-4ppm (like most spas).
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It sounds like you have done right and have the system adjusted perfectly for your normal use level. Ace does take a while to build a residual in the water at initial fill up. (something to keep in mind when you initially get the spa, the excitment level is usually at the highest so you will be using it more than normal most likely. I had one customer who called and said the Ace system wasn't working,well come to find out, once it was filled up and ready to use, the kids were using it constantly 12 or more hours a day and the Ace system was not able to keep up with that kind of demand right off the bat. So my recommendation is to keep an eye on the FC level in the few weeks of start up, especially if you will see that high of use level and manually add some chlorine if needed to bring the FC up to a safe level. It is perfectly fine (and desired to be safe) to manually add chlorine with the Ace System in situations like that. )
The boost function makes the Ace system work continuously for a 24 hr period, then drops back to your normal setting automatically. If your FC is in the recommended range before your party, I would just boost after the party and you should be fine.
You only need to test and balance the water every 30 days as per the owners manual. (no weekly shocks)
I hope you enjoy your hot tub. Happy Soaking.
Thanks for the input. Sounds like it really will be minimal maintenance, My water looks crystal clear since refilling, despite significant use. I also learned how worthless those strips are once I got my Taylor kit. Some are close, others are so far off, I'm sure it would play havoc with a user's water chemistry if they trusted them at all.
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Same experience here with a 2010 Grandee. Had it running for about a month set at 101 and it read exactly 101 all the time. Then I had a repair call for which I had to drain/refill and now the temp reads exactly 2 degrees higher than set temp. Thermistor was replaced but no change in behavior. I have verified the water temp matches the displayed temp with a good (human) thermometer - both are exactly 101, though my set temp is 99. The Service Manager from the dealer followed up with HS, who explained that "this is normal".
It's odd, especially after it seemed so accurate with the first fill but it doesn't seem to be anything to lose sleep over though.
Jeff
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I'm no expect but low frequency sound waves aren't felt within a the first few feet, it usually takes 15-20ft plus before they are noticed. It might be possible that they aren't lying. You know how it is when you hear a noise in your car but no one else can because it's so slight, well this might be the case here, your neighbours are now tuned in to the vibration.
It might be worthwhile considering lifting the tub when it's next time to drain it and setting it on something up 2"~3" polystyrene. It's cheap as chips and get the right one it won't even compress that much.
This is correct. Lower frequencies have longer waves. And you (actually "they") could be in the unfortunate situation where the peak of the wavelength happens to coincide with their physical distance from the vibration source. I'd work to determine the source first - by visiting their home and then testing weather it's jets or pumps (and which ones) through the process of elimination.
Once the source is identified, you can investigate solutions - repairing shock mounts, replacing pumps, isolation pads etc.
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I am about to purchase a Vanguard with the ACE. I am very interested in your thoughts on the ACE system. Please keep us posted on your likes and/or dislikes. Is your electrician footing the repair bill? I think I would have gone nuts on him.
Yeah, I had a few words with his installer but he is footing the bill for all required repairs. I later found out that the installation electrician had also pulled aluminum wire from the Service Panel to the spa panel. This is against Hotsprings recommendation and I beleive against NEC code - so he's doing that over with copper on Monday. I guess the lesson here is that you need to check up on everybody's work, regardless of their reputation or the dealer's recommendation to use them.
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I'm about 2 weeks post delivery of my Grandee with the ACE system. I filled the tub and followed the directions per the dealer:
(1) Put ACT bag over the spa drain for 24 hrs (flip it over at 12 hrs).
(2) Check TA and pH, adjust if necessary.
(3) Add salt (6 cups)
(4) Set Spa Size = 8, Use Level = 3 (ACE should be running now)
(3) Bring FC up to 3-5 range using Dichlor
Everything went pretty well but the ACE system took a while to "catch up" with chlorine production. The FC would fall off each day to 1-2ppm until about the 4th day when everything finally seemed to be stabilzied. The Ace system is now keeping the water pristine and soft. With my Use set at 3, the FC is stable at 3ppm; TA and pH are not drifting, at least not noticably (my Taylor kit isn't here yet so I'm just using strips). I guess this is similar to the Dichlor/Bleach method except that it's the Dichlor/Salt method and the salt/ACE is maintaining the FC levels.
Here are my questions:
(1) Do I still need to do 'pre-dosing' with Dichlor or MPS if (significant) higher use is expected (like a party)? I know the ACE system has a boost if you know 24 hrs in advance of the higher usage but what if you don't know ahead of time? I don't think the ACE system measures anything other than the salt level, so it doesn't actively monitor or adjust sanitation. Would it be better to just shock it after the higher use?
(2) What about weekly shocks to 12 ppm - are these still necessary or advised?
Any other advice from those with more experience than me?
Thank you.
I get to start all over again in a week or two when the dealer comes to do my first repair - the electrician drilled a hole right through a drain line on the tub. What an idiot! At least I have a working temporary patch on it.
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Has anyone had any experience with the Insta-Link system?
Is this a just a gimmick or a usful basic tool?
My wife works for a spa/pool service company during the summer and can nail the chemistry down without thinking twice.
So I really don't need one BUT I'm a total geek and like gadgets, I was looking for a electronic tester when I came across the LaMotte Insta-Link.
It's an iPhone app ($6.99) that takes a picture of the test strip and gives you the chemistry adjustments based on the size of your spa and chemicals you use (you enter these in a profile). It keeps limited history. You can sign up for the advanced version (annual fee) which links the iPhone into a website that has more features such as more tests, support for the most popular test strips, unlimited history and more online help.
Dave
ps what I was originally looking for was a electronic tester that I could link into my home automation system, so I could keep a history of tests/water quality or better yet test my spa remotely.
I would be interested in how they assure consistency across the cameras in the iPhone and the lighting conditions. I guess it works kind of like the AquaChek Test Strip Reader?
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Spa God said:
Ok so lets get this right... it makes chlorine... called natural chlorine, which really means non stabalized chlorine... a product that is by definition more suseptable to breakdown by UV and well... less stable... especially compared to lets say a good old stabilized chlorine, which is cheap, readily available and works real well... then it makes ozone.. like what an ozone generator makes??? which is, well, what every spa in the known universe already makes??? and then it makes hydrogen peroxide which we all know is very aggressive... so aggressive that most people dont use it anymore, (where were you in the 80's???)and many manufacturers actually recommend not using to the point where it actually voids the warranty on many brands (remember the Baqua nightmares where everybody's plastic parts started getting brittle and failing???) (and what about the Hydrogen peroxide fun... people complained of their hair turning funny colors???, hell get it to make Silver Ions and we will be rich!!!) and then it makes MPS as well...WOW (what is MPS??? :-( ) I missed that class.) and it uses a diamond!!!! Christ I'm in... anything that uses a diamond must be the bees knees... and how much is this system that does so many things using a diamond cost? and will my wife like it???
These are good points. I knew it made chlorine and ozone, but I missed that it generated hydrogen peroxide. Do any of the HS dealers here have access to engineering at Hot Springs for clarification? Not looking for marketing answers - just the technical answers.
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Glad to hear that - I just purchased a Grandee with ACE. Won't be installed until early July though. I travel fairly frequently, so the salt system was part of my decision due to the ability to extend time between maintenance. Hope it holds up to the hype long-term.
Jeff
<!--quoteo(post=105618:date=Apr 20 2010, 01:15 AM:name=Markee)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Markee @ Apr 20 2010, 01:15 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=105618"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Everyone I've talked to who has one has had nothing but problems. Great for pools, not great for spas.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Markee is right on, as this is the same thing I've experienced as well. Salt Chlorine systems have been used in swimming pools successfully for years. Hot tubs however, have different obstacles chemistry wise that have made integration of such a system very difficult.
However, as a dealer I'm having huge success with the new ACE Salt Sanitizing System that Hot Spring released this year. Of course, the technology in it has changed compared to "other salt systems". There's a new diamond technology used in the ACE system that seems to be a large part of the difference between working and not working.
We're loving it so far. <img src="http://www.poolspaforum.com/forum/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="
" border="0" alt="smile.gif" /> I have a 500 gallon Hot Spring Grandee in our showroom that's been filled for over 2 months now. After test soakers and lots of hands feeling the water, I've yet to add Chlorine to it. I've tested the pH twice (once a month) as recommended, and so far it's still crystal clear, soft and comfortable. -
2010 Sundance Optima with Intellisound stereo, sunpurity purifier, CD Ozone, cover lifter, stairs, delivery, set up, chemicals, extra set of filters...etc.
$10K.
is this a fair price for this model It is on the floor of the showroom and filled currently. SHould I be concerned about that? Please let me know any thoughts.
I am in Western Pennsylvania and I was quoted 10.3K for a 2010 Optima, no stereo, std stuff included. I was also looking at a gazebo so could probably get them to be slightly more agressive on pricing.
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I am shopping for a spa and while browsing a separate topic I found (and immediately ordered) the following. I thought I'd post it here in case anyone is interested. I plan on installing it ASAP so I can get some kind of before and after pciture of usage. One nice things with these is that you can buy extra sensors for the spa sub-panel. It also works with Google Powermeter and there's even an iPhone app to remotely monitor. Way kewl. I am not affiliated in any way, just thought it interesting.
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right, these that I purchased say 150 feet, but in reality it's closer to 50 feet for quality sound.
That'll still work for me - I have a Sirus XM home rcvr in my office and it's within 50 ft. of where my spa will go. Too bad I can't change channels remotely though.
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Noob selecting my first spa. Me and my S.O. live with two growing (teenage) boys in our house. My sister/bro-in law live next door and my two nieces are same age as the two boys. They all hang out together (plus a couple of neighborhood friends) Other family members parents, (sister, brother, spouses, kids) live 10 minutes away.
Other than wet testing, the big consideration right now is "how many people will concurrently use the tub, on average"?
I am looking at the HS Envoy (5 person) and the Vista (6 person). I figure 4 of us on a regular basis. But I wonder if it might be more.
What has your experience been? Do teenagers use spas much (not considering "spa parties") or far less? Do your family members tend to visit more often once you got your tubs?
Price difference isn't that great, just concerned about estimating usage so I don't get the Envoy and then wish I'd have gotten the slightly larger Vista. Conversely, I don't want to go with a Vista only to find that it's just me and the S.O. most of the time.
Thanks,
Jeff
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Thanks for your input Tony. One guy I spoke with at a dealer suggested an exhaust fan to remove the condensation.
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have you considered a Covana
www.sterlingcovana.com
I did see the Covana - cool idea. I worry though (maybe needlessly) about the kids playing with it and lowering it when someone is in the tub. Maybe that could be resolved with a keyed switch.
Thanks
Jeff
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Hi,
I am looking into a full enclosed building to put our (to be ordered) spa in and I'm looking for some input from those with experience (ideally owners of such buildings).
Are they worth it? We imagine getting a little more winter use by having a small social area around the tub. Also hope to reduce people walking across our hardwood flooring in the house by providing a changing area near the tub.
Any considerations we should be aware of? The downsides could be moisture/freezing on the inside of the enclosure, or perhaps water freezing on the concrete floor.
Any thoughts?
Thanks in advance.
Jeff
Grandee With Ace System - Maintenance Best Practices
in Portable Hot Tubs & Spas
Posted
I went through the same consternation when I got my tub (its the same as yours). The ACE system really does a good job and even reminds you when its time for monthly maintenance. And get the Taylor kit, you won't be sorry.
As others have stated - you will ultimately have way less work and issues if you spend the time after (re) filling to get the chemistry right. Each time I fill my tub, I record the Taylor results, the amount of chemicals I added and then the results of the follow up testing to assure the chemistry is right. By doing this work and recording all results, I now have a really good handle on what I need to do. I fill the tub, measure it with Taylor kit (it doesn't really vary much from fill to fill), estimate how much chemical(s) I need to add (based on my collected data and test results) and then I just dump them in and do a cursory follow up check (usually 24 hours). While this was an initial PITA, it means I now spend less time maintaining and more time enjoying the tub. I probably spend 20 minutes every two weeks and a bit more right after filling it.
Other comments:
- I would note that while the ACE has a "boost" function, I don't find that as useful since it is slow to react (like 24 hours). I just go with some non-chlorine shock immediately before or immediately after a peak use (party).
- Get yourself a sump pump/pool cover pump (submersible). It takes me about 1hr 15 mins to fill the tub and about 1 hour 20/25 minutes to drain it this way - faster than gravity drain.
- Use ACT to remove Calcium Hardness
- I get all the chemistry into the proper ranges, and only then do I add the salt and start the ACE system
Enjoy your new tub!