Pool Drain

[brownsburg]

Hi,

we're in the middle of restoring an old cement pool and I would like to get opinions on whether or not we should have a main drain. There is currently one that functions, but it's a 50 year old galvanised pipe that I fear at the very least will affect my water quality. We need to pour a cement patch in the deep end of the pool anyhow, so the new/safer drain would go there.

The local pool guy says that a main drain is better but not necessary.

I read online that a main drain is not only not necessary for circulation, but is potentially dangerous. Appearently we only need skimmers. (I would presume two)

The pool is atleast 50 years old and is 12' x 30'

Thanks for any help.

[Pool Clown]

If you get an approved main drain (VGB) you should be OK on the safety issue. It's hard to sweep sand or dirt to the main drain when you don't have one! May not be necessary, but it sure is convenient to have, in certain cases.

12' X 30', you can get away with 1 skimmer just fine.

[quantumchromodynamics]

I would eliminate the main drain and get an automatic pool cleaner.

[Pool Clown]

With todays VGB codes in place, there is no good reason to eliminate an existing main drain.

[quantumchromodynamics]

With todays VGB codes in place, there is no good reason to eliminate an existing main drain.

50 year old galvanised pipe

[dalehileman]

Hi,.....we're in the middle of restoring an old cement pool and I would like to get opinions on whether or not we should have a main drain..............Thanks for any help.

burg yours is a good question indeed. If you use a vf pump at a very slow rate the bottom drain might promote circulation. Ålso if you should elect a bottom tab dispenser, arguably touted to be 5 x as effective as one at the surface

...although a sweeper such as the Polaris 380 etc probably would provide enough bottom circ

[Pool Clown]

With todays VGB codes in place, there is no good reason to eliminate an existing main drain.

50 year old galvanised pipe

Thats a good reason...

[waterbear]

First to address the question about the main drain. A pool can be designed to operate properly with one or without one but to eliminate the drain from a pool designed for one can cause problems in some cases. You might need to consider redoing the returns also to provide proper circulation if you eliminate the drain.

As far as the galvanized pipes, i am sure they have been used for more than the drain so unless you are planning on replacing all the plumbing you will still have them. Good news is that they should have minimal impact on your water chemistry. Copper pipes would be more problematic.

As far as safety goes, the new drains are designed to be anti-entrapment and you can also add an anti-entrapment suction cutoff to your pump, if it does not already have one.

Finally, main drains are the ideal location for the hydrostatic relief valve (although they can be located elsewhere). Not all pools have these but if you live in a area where the water table can rise they are a good idea to help prevent your pool from popping out of the ground.

Now on to the nonsense:

If you use a vf pump at a very slow rate the bottom drain might promote circulation.

Base on what criteria? Why would you need a variable speed pump at a slow rate to do this? You do not have clue as to what you are talking about, do you?

Ålso if you should elect a bottom tab dispenser, arguably touted to be 5 x as effective as one at the surface

What are you babbling about here? You REALLY don't have a clue as to what you are talking about! You just post to see yourself in print since you failed at getting your book published as documented in some of the links below.

(FWIW, he is referring to a Pentair 320 trichlor/bromine feeder that can either inlet at the top of the ersoion tube or at the bottom. He does not realize that most other erosion dispensers on the market are bottom feed and not top feed. He also does not realize that he has it backwards and a top feed dispenser is more efficient, it allow more sanitizer to dissolve in the same amount of time

http://www.pentairpool.com/pdfs/rainbow300DS.pdf)

This person is an internet troll and only posts to get attention. His advice on pools is bad, his knowledge of pools is minimal and he has ignored advice given to him on this and a few other pool forums for the past two years. He only likes to create discord. His username has ended up in the Urban Dictionary as "an irritating, repetitive message board poster." and he seems to be proud of this. the first link is to that page.

Read this. (If you wonder why keep checking out the links)

and this (thread was locked)

and this

and this

and this (This one is a must read!)

and this (This also, he got banned on this board for three days in this thread)

and this

and this

and this (thread was locked)

and this

and this

and this (this is a good example, the thread got locked. Be sure to read the second page also!!)

and this

and this (be sure to read down to the last three posts on page one and the posts at the top of page two, they say a LOT. This thread was locked also!))

There are many more examples.

do NOT feed the internet troll.

Unfortunately he has invaded this board and refuses to go away. He continues to post nonsense and plain bad advice.

Do not feed the troll.

[dalehileman]

.............. A pool can be designed to operate properly with one or without one but to eliminate the drain from a pool designed for one can cause problems in some cases. You might need to consider redoing the returns.........Copper pipes would be more problematic.........the new drains are designed to be anti-entrapment..........for the hydrostatic relief valve (although they can be located elsewhere). Not all pools have these.........

Now on to the nonsense:

If you use a vf pump at a very slow rate the bottom drain might promote circulation.

Base on what criteria?

*******The idea that flow into a bottom drain might promote circulation in its vicinity

Why would you need a variable speed pump at a slow rate to do this?

********You wouldn't. But most folk who switch over from the older less economical model replace it with a vf pump. There are some advantages of being able occasionally switch back to the higher rate: For instance after a windstorm the higher flow might more efficiently deposit flotsam into the skimmer

You do not have clue as to what you are talking about, do you?

********I apologize if my style offends or if in some cases I'm not perfectly clear

Ålso if you should elect a bottom tab dispenser, arguably touted to be 5 x as effective as one at the surface

What are you babbling about here?

************Though apocryphal a report by advertisers of the bottom tab dispenser claim it to be 5 x as effective as a surface dispenser

You REALLY don't have a clue as to what you are talking about! You just post to see yourself in print since you failed at getting your book published as documented in some of the links below.

********I am flattered by all your attention but surely the emotional state of mind required for such research and detailed response to posts meant essentially neutral if not sometimes helpful will surely curtail your longevity

(FWIW, he is referring to a Pentair 320 trichlor/bromine feeder that can either inlet at the top of the ersoion tube or at the bottom. He does not realize that most other erosion dispensers on the market are bottom feed and not top feed. He also does not realize that he has it backwards and a top feed dispenser is more efficient, it allow more sanitizer to dissolve in the same amount of time

********Perhaps I had misunderstood suggestions by various pool-board participants who had suggested the use of a surface dispenser. Certainly one would expect the flow at the surface to be faster than at the bottom, especially if there's no bottom drain. To this end, incidentally, for any tab user interested in increasing his FC that an even higher rate of dissolution might be achieved by placing tabs instead in the skimmer basket

http://www.pentairpool.com/pdfs/rainbow300DS.pdf)

This person is an internet troll and only posts to get attention.

*******To the contrary I have no such intention. Incidentally forgive the sudden loss of "quote" blue halftone. Admittedly I'm not good at this sort of thing and no doubt will be roundly taken to task by Javert for this unforgivable breach of protocol

His advice on pools is bad, his knowledge of pools is minimal and he has ignored advice given to him on this and a few other pool forums for the past two years.

***********I apologize profusely if my occasional skepticism upsets the occasional participant but I've found opinions proffered on pool boards pretty cut-and-dried and have often been disappointed at the lack of controversy therein

He only likes to create discord. His username has ended up in the Urban Dictionary as "an irritating, repetitive message board poster." and he seems to be proud of this. the first link is to that page.

********Sorry I can't comment on this owing to a pending lawsuit

[font="arial, verdana, tahoma, sans-serif"]Read this. (If you wonder why keep checking out the links).................(be sure to read down to the last three posts on page one and the posts at the top of page two, they say a LOT. This thread was locked also!))

There are many more examples.

do NOT feed the internet troll.

[/font]

Unfortunately he has invaded this board and refuses to go away. He continues to post nonsense and plain bad advice.

*********Regret any hard feelings but if it agrees with Javert above Admin is welcome to ban me

Do not feed the troll.

**I agree one shouldn't feed trolls. However I'd define a troll as someone who purposely sets about a task of annoyance, not the participant whose style inadvertently inflames the pent-up anger of the occasional board "authority" figure

*****Incidentally the visitor interested in linguistic aspects of this sort of personality are invited to the following link

http://www.freeratio.org/showthread.php?t=290676

Sorry Javert I just couldn't resist

[waterbear]

I rest my case. He has once again wasted time with useless garbage that has NOTHING to do with the OP's question.

DO NOT FEED THE TROLL!

I apologize to the OP.

[waterbear]

http://www.freeratio...ad.php?t=290676

Sorry Javert I just couldn't resist

From this link in yet another thread you started on an internet forum:

You can probably find a fitting term from this list: http://redwing.hutma...mreed/index.htm

LOOK UP TROLLER AND THEN LOOK IN THE MIRROR! Amazing how many of these definitions describe you.

You might also want to add Artful dodger, Artiste, and (my favorite for you) Profundus Maximus.

It's amazing how many internet sites describe what you do on forums to a T. Guess you need to start more "impending lawsuits"

For now I am ROFLMAO! and you need to get a life and RTFM for netiquette!

You are truly a troll among trolls and that is nothing to be proud of. Why not just stick to the other forum you posted since they have not caught on to you yet. You know nothing of pools and have proven that time and again and your posts on here are dangerous to people trying to get legitimate info.

You are not amusing, cute, or any of the other adjective you fancy yourself. You need to take a long, hard look in the mirror and ask yourself how you got the reputation that you did and why you have had problems on so many different internet forums. Or can't you because of "impending lawsuits" which seem to have replaced your "impending Alzheimer's" that you used to post about. Also, it is interesting that you have put your age as low as 55 and and high as 80 on different forums in various posts. I know this because I am a member of several of the forums you post on (and am not always under the name of waterbear).

Get a life.

[waterbear]

***********I apologize profusely if my occasional skepticism upsets the occasional participant but I've found opinions proffered on pool boards pretty cut-and-dried and have often been disappointed at the lack of controversy therein

So you admit you are looking for controversy. Perhaps the reason for the lack of controversy is that proper pool care is a science and is not a controversial subject. Things either work or they don't. If you pool is green (which you have stated that is in other threads) then you are doing something wrong. Period. End of Story. However, you would rather debate about that what you are doing which allowed your pool to turn green is fine instead of taking the expert advice offered to you time and again on this and other pool forums since, as you admit above, you are looking for controversy and disruption instead of pool advice.

Perhaps the advice is cut and dried because pool care is pretty cut and dried if you are doing it properly. Then again, that might be a foreign concept to your obviously damaged brain. (a nod to the "impending Alzheimer's" you have mention before on different forums and not a personal insult)

Rather sad that someone has so empty a life that they live to stir up controversy on internet forums.

[Pool Clown]

Well put!

He must be very proud to finally be in print (Urban dictionary). You can tell that he is trying to be some kind of writer with all the big words he uses in his posts. One would think he is trying to loose us with his "big word" literary scribblings.

I'm sure that he will come back here and tell all us "heathens" that those are his everyday words. And offer that we are beneath him for thinking that.

[waterbear]

Well put!

He must be very proud to finally be in print (Urban dictionary). You can tell that he is trying to be some kind of writer with all the big words he uses in his posts. One would think he is trying to loose us with his "big word" literary scribblings.

I'm sure that he will come back here and tell all us "heathens" that those are his everyday words. And offer that we are beneath him for thinking that.

Big words do not an educated man make! FWIW, I have a college degree and am a member of MENSA and eligible for membership in Intertel (google them if you don't know) yet I have no reason to use words that make my writing unintelligible (must be my journalistic and broadcasting background). It is totally coounterproductive to good communication and sharing of ideas.

I have found that those who feel the need to use words that others cannot understand are usually trying to cover up their own lack of knowledge and education, not to mention their need to try and make themselves sound important.

Even his calling me Javert is a symptom of this. Javert is a character in the book Les Mirserables by Victor Hugo. His weak attempt at a literary reference is completely out of place in a forum devoted to pools and spas, don't you think?

Sad indeed!

[dalehileman]

Wow Javert, your credentials are truly impressive

Though forgive me all once again for another totally OT remark to the effect that the Internet boards appear rife with the participant seemingly angry at all times about almost everything, grasping at any opportunity to disparage and criticize, mercilessly dragging his fellow contributor across the spectrum, thereby satisfying a felt lack of power is his everyday humdrum existence just as Javert barbarically pursues his prey Jean Valjean athwart the countryside

"Nothing is more unpleasant than a virtuous person with a mean mind"

--Walter Bagehot, English editor and economist (1826-1877)

I do hope however that Admin will terminate this thread, thereby sparing Javert from his endless plight of despair but nonetheless most profusely thanking PSF herewith for its heroic indulgence

[waterbear]

***********I apologize profusely if my occasional skepticism upsets the occasional participant but I've found opinions proffered on pool boards pretty cut-and-dried and have often been disappointed at the lack of controversy therein

I think this says it all.

Once again I apologize to the OP that dalehileman seems to care about nothing but only his own ego.