Big Box Store Tubs May Be All Some People Can Afford

[Saskman]

Had the Costco Hydrospa it went back now waiting for a Pacific. During my searching I found a gap in the market. Where are the in between tubs. When Walmart came to town everything was going to go out of business. A few mom and pop shops did but most survived. I think the spa industry needs to see this. Sooner or later a box store will build a tub that is well insulated and have there own inhouse techs. Hot tubs are starting to become a common item. When I had friends over in my Costco tub all they saw were led lights everywhere and a stereo. What would happen if Sears had a tub. You know that a service guy will be there fast. I think the industry need to find the middle ground and build a line of tubs that people with the house payment, car payments and tuitions. People will always want a higher end tub if they can afford it. If this tub existed I could sell 3 this week to friends who would fit this market. I think this is the case where I live.

[104 Degrees]

. I think the industry need to find the middle ground and build a line of tubs that people with the house payment, car payments and tuitions. People will always want a higher end tub if they can afford it. If this tub existed I could sell 3 this week to friends who would fit this market. I think this is the case where I live.

There is such a tub The new Nordic tubs . There new web site should be up and running Monday(i was told that 6 months ago). There sold with dealer backing,great company. you can get the square tubs Full Foam. most now come standed with the Led lights and chrome jets or you can have these as an option.

John 104 Degrees

[jmendoza17]

During my searching I found a gap in the market. Where are the in between tubs. ...When I had friends over in my Costco tub all they saw were led lights everywhere and a stereo. ... I think the industry need to find the middle ground and build a line of tubs that people with the house payment, car payments and tuitions... If this tub existed I could sell 3 this week to friends who would fit this market. I think this is the case where I live.

I definitely agree that those big box store will reshape the industry in some fashion. Like your friends, I was a hot tub newbie and was wowed by the lights stereo and all the externals of the tub I bought. I agree that a good tub in the $4-7K range would do well with the average consumer, but that would probably force the independent dealers out of business because it probably lacks a good profitability at low volume. This is why they are sold at big box stores while dealers sell the mid to high end units.

You and I shared a similar experience with the tubs we bought, but you returned yours while I --maybe stupidly--stuck it out. We basically saw the major selling point that the big box retailers have over the independent guy; the ability to force a manufacturer to take back an underperforming or defective product. But even COSTCO is cutting back on their liberal return policy and that perk may be gone for hot tubs in a few years.

In my experience , while the big box stores are best at one thing --moving high volumes of goods-- they fall down on service and installations. So unless they somehow get that act together, an ethical, intelligent and honest independent businessperson will always have an edge in customer service orientation. In this instance, I really learned that you get what you pay for.

Keep us posted on your new tub.

[jwillard]

I disagree...big box stores sell cars also but it isn't going to remove the need for dealerships. They sell grocery's....but it isn't going to change the way grocery chains stay in business.

If you had purchased your legend from a dealer and had the same problems...as people do and the dealer wouldn't fix/replace your tub you would be on here complaining (rightfully) about that experience also. Costco can sell these tubs because it is a tub with no options...you don't get to pick the color, if it has a stereo or any other option...it is what it is. The manufacturer can provide big box stores with this type of tub at a much cheaper cost and Costco passes some savings on to the consumer.

Costco doesnt have to have just a showroom for hot tubs, doesnt have to sit on just a hot tub inventory and they dont have to pay a salesman his commission. Can you get a bad tub from costco...by all means...YES...can you get a bad tub from a dealer....YES....correct, the dealer if he is concerned about his business will do everything he can to make it better. Costco does what it can to make it better......RETURN POLICY!!

Costco doesn't service or install tubs...so they can only offer a return policy....SOME NEED TO UNDERSTAND THIS. Costco doesn't help with your chemicals the way a dealer would...SOME NEED TO UNDERSTAND THIS. Saying Costco falls down on service and installation is a complete lack of understand what you are buying and who you are buying it from!!!

With Costco's return policy being what it is...to say "you get what you paid for" is a complete lack of understanding what you paid for...you paid for a product...that was suppose to be defective free...use the return policy to get a new tub...and continue your happy journey in life. Yes, you may have to pay to move it....but you knew this going in...so now you have but one choice...deal with the decision you made to buy from Costco!!

It really isn't that hard to comprehend.....or at least its not for me.

[jmendoza17]

With Costco's return policy being what it is...to say "you get what you paid for" is a complete lack of understanding what you paid for...you paid for a product...that was suppose to be defective free...use the return policy to get a new tub...and continue your happy journey in life. Yes, you may have to pay to move it....but you knew this going in...so now you have but one choice...deal with the decision you made to buy from Costco!! It really isn't that hard to comprehend.....or at least its not for me.

Sorry JW, I don't get your point. My point was simply that when all is said and done, there is a lot of room for dealer service and suport that is not currently offered by the big box stores.

[Roger]

Had the Costco Hydrospa it went back now waiting for a Pacific. During my searching I found a gap in the market. Where are the in between tubs. When Walmart came to town everything was going to go out of business. A few mom and pop shops did but most survived. I think the spa industry needs to see this. Sooner or later a box store will build a tub that is well insulated and have there own inhouse techs. Hot tubs are starting to become a common item. When I had friends over in my Costco tub all they saw were led lights everywhere and a stereo. What would happen if Sears had a tub. You know that a service guy will be there fast. I think the industry need to find the middle ground and build a line of tubs that people with the house payment, car payments and tuitions. People will always want a higher end tub if they can afford it. If this tub existed I could sell 3 this week to friends who would fit this market. I think this is the case where I live.

There has been inexpensive low end tubs around alot longer than Costco or Home Depot or whoever is selling them. Hydro has been making, and several other companys have been making and selling low end inexpensive tubs for a long time. There are several middle of the road manufacturers that make a decent tub for 4-6 grand. Every price point is covered and has been for a long time. You just have to look. Nordic as mentioned, Great Lakes, Emerald just to name a few. Tiger River, @ Home and several others made by the major tub manufatcurers are price point tubs. I think the list of manufacturers is over a hundred and alot of them make several lines to fit price points. So I'm not sure where your going, A inexpensive GOOD VALUE can be had for 4-5 grand other places than the big box stores. It may not have the flash but it WILL have the value. After all we are just chasing a box of hot water big enough to sit in.

[jwillard]

Sorry JW, I don't get your point. My point was simply that when all is said and done, there is a lot of room for dealer service and suport that is not currently offered by the big box stores.

BINGO! That is just my point...to expect dealer service or support from a big box store is ridiculous. If you want/need dealer service and support why on earth would you buy from a big box store??? That was my point...I think you got it...I just don't think you can wrap your head around it.

[Saskman]

I think its safe to say Sears is the original big box store. They buy products from a manufacturer and stamp Kenmore on them. In turn they sell them to you. I think they have a top notch service department that would be hard for any shop owner to compete with. I suspect that is a few years down the road but a hope that they don't miss the boat. Take a look at KIA. The auto industry said they were junk cars that wouldn't last. Now they are the worlds largest automotive manufacturer. I can think of one small business that was faced with the big box stores moving into its market area. In fact 3 diffenent companies in two years. The business was aligned with a buying group that gave it the buying power of the larger stores. It expanded into other cities and more than doubled its sales volume and profit. It was able to match pricing and offer superior customer service. Take a look at the number of hits on any Infinity topic. There are alot of backyards that are empty and could use a tub.

[D.P. Roberts]

Sorry JW, I don't get your point. My point was simply that when all is said and done, there is a lot of room for dealer service and suport that is not currently offered by the big box stores.

BINGO! That is just my point...to expect dealer service or support from a big box store is ridiculous. If you want/need dealer service and support why on earth would you buy from a big box store??? That was my point...I think you got it...I just don't think you can wrap your head around it.

I think you're exactly right. Big Box stores are not interested in having a service department, or an installation department - they just want to get the product out the door.

I just heard a report that stated that "big box" retail growth is slowing or stopped - just look at Wal Mart. The biggest growth in retail over the next few years is expected to be smaller, customer-service oriented stores, selling goods that you have to buy from a real person who knows what he/she is talking about. I think spas fit in that category, especially considering how important a wet test is.

[104 Degrees]

Sorry JW, I don't get your point. My point was simply that when all is said and done, there is a lot of room for dealer service and suport that is not currently offered by the big box stores.

BINGO! That is just my point...to expect dealer service or support from a big box store is ridiculous. If you want/need dealer service and support why on earth would you buy from a big box store??? That was my point...I think you got it...I just don't think you can wrap your head around it.

I think you're exactly right. Big Box stores are not interested in having a service department, or an installation department - they just want to get the product out the door.

I just heard a report that stated that "big box" retail growth is slowing or stopped - just look at Wal Mart. The biggest growth in retail over the next few years is expected to be smaller, customer-service oriented stores, selling goods that you have to buy from a real person who knows what he/she is talking about. I think spas fit in that category, especially considering how important a wet test is.

This is very true. wet test that tub.

john 104

[jmendoza17]

BINGO! That is just my point...to expect dealer service or support from a big box store is ridiculous. If you want/need dealer service and support why on earth would you buy from a big box store??? That was my point...I think you got it...I just don't think you can wrap your head around it.

Actually I get most things just fine, so there's really no need for your insolent tone. For the record, as a newbie, I was pretty impressed by what I thought was a lot for a little, and therefore did not fully consider the need for support when I bought my tub. Turned out to be not such a good idea. As for your snotty comments about what I am capable of comprehending, I find that people who lack substantive reason quickly resort to bluster and insults as a replacement for legitimate argumentation and discourse. Happy trails.

[jmendoza17]

I think you're exactly right. Big Box stores are not interested in having a service department, or an installation department - they just want to get the product out the door.

Well put. Looks like I'm not the only one who sees the obvious.

[Pathfinder]

I disagree...big box stores sell cars also but it isn't going to remove the need for dealerships. They sell grocery's....but it isn't going to change the way grocery chains stay in business.

If you had purchased your legend from a dealer and had the same problems...as people do and the dealer wouldn't fix/replace your tub you would be on here complaining (rightfully) about that experience also. Costco can sell these tubs because it is a tub with no options...you don't get to pick the color, if it has a stereo or any other option...it is what it is. The manufacturer can provide big box stores with this type of tub at a much cheaper cost and Costco passes some savings on to the consumer.

Costco doesnt have to have just a showroom for hot tubs, doesnt have to sit on just a hot tub inventory and they dont have to pay a salesman his commission. Can you get a bad tub from costco...by all means...YES...can you get a bad tub from a dealer....YES....correct, the dealer if he is concerned about his business will do everything he can to make it better. Costco does what it can to make it better......RETURN POLICY!!

Costco doesn't service or install tubs...so they can only offer a return policy....SOME NEED TO UNDERSTAND THIS. Costco doesn't help with your chemicals the way a dealer would...SOME NEED TO UNDERSTAND THIS. Saying Costco falls down on service and installation is a complete lack of understand what you are buying and who you are buying it from!!!

With Costco's return policy being what it is...to say "you get what you paid for" is a complete lack of understanding what you paid for...you paid for a product...that was suppose to be defective free...use the return policy to get a new tub...and continue your happy journey in life. Yes, you may have to pay to move it....but you knew this going in...so now you have but one choice...deal with the decision you made to buy from Costco!!

It really isn't that hard to comprehend.....or at least its not for me.

Awesome post I wish we would had this post a months ago

[Saskman]

I don't think that the shop owners have alot of room to move. My views are more directed at the factory. Wouldn't it be nice to offer a tub with nice led lights, crome jets and a stereo for a good price. People are making trades in there head when are going through the buying process. I think 1 in 20 people use the extended warranty that they buy for there tvs. I guess I thought odds are that I won't need service before the warranty expires. I suspect that in volume on the factory floor a stereo could become standard for only a few hundred dollars. I suspect that if a few manufacturers got together and said hey lets do a deal with sony on a stereo that we will offer in all three makes. Dealer service will win hands down in most cases and people know they will have to pay more for that. I was the guy who said I'll take a chance and there are alot more like me. I think I would have skipped the box store experience if a few flashy lights and a stereo was included from the factory. Its ok to argue who has the best insulation but the average joe doesn't care a whole lot. Dealers will win on service but the box stores are making there ground on options. I think that every person who buys from a box store walks through a dealers shop first. I did.

[D.P. Roberts]

I don't think that the shop owners have alot of room to move. My views are more directed at the factory. Wouldn't it be nice to offer a tub with nice led lights, crome jets and a stereo for a good price. People are making trades in there head when are going through the buying process. I think 1 in 20 people use the extended warranty that they buy for there tvs. I guess I thought odds are that I won't need service before the warranty expires. I suspect that in volume on the factory floor a stereo could become standard for only a few hundred dollars. I suspect that if a few manufacturers got together and said hey lets do a deal with sony on a stereo that we will offer in all three makes. Dealer service will win hands down in most cases and people know they will have to pay more for that. I was the guy who said I'll take a chance and there are alot more like me. I think I would have skipped the box store experience if a few flashy lights and a stereo was included from the factory. Its ok to argue who has the best insulation but the average joe doesn't care a whole lot. Dealers will win on service but the box stores are making there ground on options. I think that every person who buys from a box store walks through a dealers shop first. I did.

Things like stereos will probably always be options, as there will always be people (like myself) who don't want them.

I think one of the inherent problems here is that lots of people want to spend $4000 or so on a good quality tub, and they have it in their heads that such a thing "ought" to be available. This is similar to thinking that one "ought" to be able to walk into a car dealership and buy a nice new car for $10,000. For the most part, neither of those things exist. If you want a real, quality item, you have to spend more.

[Saskman]

I just want to restate that I am looking forward to my dealer backed spa and think we made a fair deal based on current market conditions. I think I should have paid more in the first place and skipped the problems. Just that i can see both sides

[jmendoza17]

Can you get a bad tub from costco...by all means...YES...can you get a bad tub from a dealer....YES....correct, the dealer if he is concerned about his business will do everything he can to make it better. Costco does what it can to make it better......RETURN POLICY!!

Awesome post I wish we would had this post a months ago

Not sure I'd go so far as to call anything from JW awesome, but there are some unintended nuggets in there. One is the "COSTCO" gang's admission that it is possible to get a dud tub from the best big box store around. The other is that while a liberal return policy is great for toasters, small appliances and other totable gadgets, it SUCKS as a mechanism to satisfy a hot tub consumer. Ask SILVER how much fun it was bringing back his turkey and how many hours he spent trying to correct the "mistake." Wonder if he ended up $300 poorer in returning the dog or if at least they paid his return expenses.

[jwillard]

Can you get a bad tub from costco...by all means...YES...can you get a bad tub from a dealer....YES....correct, the dealer if he is concerned about his business will do everything he can to make it better. Costco does what it can to make it better......RETURN POLICY!!

Awesome post I wish we would had this post a months ago

Not sure I'd go so far as to call anything from JW awesome, but there are some unintended nuggets in there. One is the "COSTCO" gang's admission that it is possible to get a dud tub from the best big box store around. The other is that while a liberal return policy is great for toasters, small appliances and other totable gadgets, it SUCKS as a mechanism to satisfy a hot tub consumer. Ask SILVER how much fun it was bringing back his turkey and how many hours he spent trying to correct the "mistake." Wonder if he ended up $300 poorer in returning the dog or if at least they paid his return expenses.

jmendoza...you take the cake! All the points in my post were intended! I never said it wasnt possible to get a dud tub from anyone, dealer or big box stores...if you gathered that from any of my postings then I really do need to question your comprehension.

Once again when you purchased your tub through costco I dont think you full understood what you were getting yourself into. To even bring in service and support knowing your tub was purchased through costco shows me you didn't full grasp the concept under which you purchased your tub.

Just like there are many types of tubs...there are many types of people...If I bought a tub and it was bad, neither hell nor high water would have kept me from dropping that POS tub right back on the doorstep of where I bought it. I would rather be out $300 than have a pos tub sitting in my backyard, I would rather have a return policy than be stuck with a tub that didnt work. Some things in life arent fun...returning a hot tub I am sure isnt...but sometimes you got to do what you got to do! Sorry if you feel I insulted your reading comprehesion but I am just trying to get you to understand...if you want service and support...go with a dealer....but dont come and say it is lacking when buying a tub from costco.......

.....Its not lacking....because.....here it comes......they don't HAVE SERVICE OR SUPPORT!!....

[104 Degrees]

Wouldn't it be nice to offer a tub with nice led lights, crome jets and a stereo for a good price.

Most Nordic spas now come standered with the led lights and the chrome jets..

john 104 Degrees

[jmendoza17]

..If I bought a tub and it was bad, neither hell nor high water would have kept me from dropping that POS tub right back on the doorstep of where I bought it. I would rather be out $300 than have a pos tub sitting in my backyard, I would rather have a return policy than be stuck with a tub that didnt work. Some things in life arent fun...returning a hot tub I am sure isnt...but sometimes you got to do what you got to do!

Exactly. Anyone who wants to avoid the hassle of self-service should consider service and support before they buy.

[104 Degrees]

..If I bought a tub and it was bad, neither hell nor high water would have kept me from dropping that POS tub right back on the doorstep of where I bought it. I would rather be out $300 than have a pos tub sitting in my backyard, I would rather have a return policy than be stuck with a tub that didnt work. Some things in life arent fun...returning a hot tub I am sure isnt...but sometimes you got to do what you got to do!

Exactly. Anyone who wants to avoid the hassle of self-service should consider service and support before they buy.

Just make sure your dealer has been in buisness for a long time and has good relations with there customers. make sure thay know there line. our first dealer would change brands like we do socks. they went belly up.

[Roger]

I would rather be out $300 than have a pos tub sitting in my backyard, I would rather have a return policy than be stuck with a tub that didnt work. Some things in life arent fun...returning a hot tub I am sure isnt...but sometimes you got to do what you got to do! Sorry if you feel I insulted your reading comprehesion but I am just trying to get you to understand...if you want service and support...go with a dealer....but dont come and say it is lacking when buying a tub from costco.......

Give it some time, you WILL have a POS in your yard and you'll get to use that return policy and find out how much trouble it is.

[104 Degrees]

if you want service and support...go with a dealer....but dont come and say it is lacking when buying a tub from costco.......

So whos the dealer for Costco???

[soakerman]

I would rather be out $300 than have a pos tub sitting in my backyard, I would rather have a return policy than be stuck with a tub that didnt work. Some things in life arent fun...returning a hot tub I am sure isnt...but sometimes you got to do what you got to do! Sorry if you feel I insulted your reading comprehesion but I am just trying to get you to understand...if you want service and support...go with a dealer....but dont come and say it is lacking when buying a tub from costco.......

Give it some time, you WILL have a POS in your yard and you'll get to use that return policy and find out how much trouble it is.

Here is the deal boys! I just got back from Costco and I asked about the returns on the Legend, Platinum I and the Platinum III for that store that I go to.....

No returns in the three years they have sold them!

She also stated that she knows of no returns or RTV...return to vendor notes on her computer in all of seattle.....

So basicaly you are all full of crap about a low end spa or people are alot more satified then you might think in the three years they have been selling the Platinum line of spas.

Time to step up to the plate and admit they are quality tubs that no dealer can compare unless you want one jet, one 1/16 hp pump one speed and a 110 heater that holds two people.

[D.P. Roberts]

Does Costco sell different spas in their stores than they do online? I usually don't read these Costco threads, but in trying to follow this one I can't see mention of Platinum or Legend on their web site.