R and R Posted February 20, 2006 Report Share Posted February 20, 2006 We are looking into our first spa and have a few ?'s. 1)Is it possible to bring the water temperature down to 80 for an extended period of time in the summer without a problem. We would prefer not to get into a swim spa since we are not big swimmers and would like to be able to cool down in the heat. 2)There are 5 dealers in our area we are going to look into. Caldera-Marquis-Hot Spring-D1-Sundance. Any input on which are the better options and why? 3)What would be the average price investment range with all the basics included? 4)What is the average annual cost of upkeep? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spatech (the unreal one) Posted February 21, 2006 Report Share Posted February 21, 2006 We are looking into our first spa and have a few ?'s. 1)Is it possible to bring the water temperature down to 80 for an extended period of time in the summer without a problem. We would prefer not to get into a swim spa since we are not big swimmers and would like to be able to cool down in the heat. 2)There are 5 dealers in our area we are going to look into. Caldera-Marquis-Hot Spring-D1-Sundance. Any input on which are the better options and why? 3)What would be the average price investment range with all the basics included? 4)What is the average annual cost of upkeep? 1) Yes, you can lower the spa temp to around 80º. 2) Caldera-Marquis-Hot Spring-D1-Sundance are 5 of the best spa makers out there IMO and you'll undoubtedly find a couple of them to do the trick for you after checking them out. 3) No way to answer that, way too open ended of a question. They all sell spas ranging from $3.5k to $10k or more depending on size, options, etc.) As far as basics to include, I would defintiely get steps and a lifter and I highly recommend ozone. 4) Cost to run the spa varies greatly depending on $kw/hr rate, usage, climate, etc. but if you really need a number I'd assume about $20 to $35/month on a well insulated spa (the ones you've named are good at that). Visit all that you've ementioned, get to know the dealer, see who does their service, ask lots of questions and by all means, wet test the spas you like (esecially if you're inclined to get a spa w/lounge). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amanda Posted February 21, 2006 Report Share Posted February 21, 2006 We are looking into our first spa and have a few ?'s. 1)Is it possible to bring the water temperature down to 80 for an extended period of time in the summer without a problem. We would prefer not to get into a swim spa since we are not big swimmers and would like to be able to cool down in the heat. 2)There are 5 dealers in our area we are going to look into. Caldera-Marquis-Hot Spring-D1-Sundance. Any input on which are the better options and why? 3)What would be the average price investment range with all the basics included? 4)What is the average annual cost of upkeep? You hunt for information will be an interesting one for sure! I hope that you enjoy your researching! A couple of helpful hints: 1) most spas have a range from 80-104 degrees so you shouldn't have to sacrifice your play time because of getting a spa instead of a swimspa. 2)You'll find as you visit each of the five showrooms that each one will tell you their spa is the best because..."yadayadayada". In the forum, most will try not to "bash" another comany or promote their own, but give you the information to help you make a better and informed decision. I'd say allow yourself enough time to hear the whole story they have to tell and do NOT make a fast decision based on a fast sale approach. Take notes and do some comparing. If it's possible (many others in the forum will agree) wet test! Or at least stick your hands in the water and feel the jets! Bring your suit and towel in the car just in case they have one with water in it that you can test out. That's the really fun part! To prepare yourself for this shopping adventure... take a couple of moments and ask yourself/your family "What is the three most important reasons for us to get a spa?" and "What are our biggest concerns with getting one?" You will be better prepared and be able to process the wealth of information you will recieve. If a company has any bad reports in the better bus. B., ask the company directly... what has happened with this particular customer and how would I be protected from the same thing happening to me? 3) Average for a good quality spa can range between 6k-8k. But it completely depends on what options you are interested in, how big of a spa you want, how many jets your looking for and how the company presents it's information. Some have "negotiating room" abnd some don't... most of them will have some kind of sale going on. 4) Annual cost of upkeep has a few factors as well. You may hear anything from 12 to 20 bucks a month. And there is always a wonderful debate about full foam insulation VS thermally insulated. Take it all with a grain of salt! Most places will say it costs ("$X" per month to operate). Find out the statistics on how they came up with that number. Most mean just the cost of electricity. Ambient air temperatures or your environment, amount of usage all have an effect on these costs. then there is the cost of chemicals, filters that need to be replaced, possible "hidden" service trip charges or pro-rated warranties... you can see there may be a few more things considered when finding out how much it REALLY costs to operate. I'd take ALL of things into consideration. Since you are computer savy.... before going to each place, check out their web-site. You can "Google-it!". Each web site usuall explains how the spa is constructed so you'll be more informed and can have some note-ready questions prior to entering the sales zone. Not to be confused with the "Twilight Zone". Once you've gotten your info from each place and weeded through all the "sales jargon"... you'll be able to make a much more informed decision and relax in your spa at home knowing you made the right decision for your family, lifestyle, and environment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Kahuna Posted February 21, 2006 Report Share Posted February 21, 2006 We are looking into our first spa and have a few ?'s. 1)Is it possible to bring the water temperature down to 80 for an extended period of time in the summer without a problem. In fact, most sanitizers work best in the mid to high 80's for temperature, so no problem there. As for dropping it down to 80, i don't think you'd really want to go that low. Keep it within a few degrees of body temperature if you plan on sitting in it for any length of time. I've been in a tub that was 95 during a heat wave here (37C . . . i think that's around 95 - 100 F??) and it was very comfortable. Water takes heat away 5 times faster than air, (or is it 20 times, can't remember from my scuba instructor days . . . think sound moves 20 times faster . . . no wait . . . oh watever, it cools ya down quicker than air) so a few degrees will make a big difference after longer periods of time. How many times have you been in an indoor pool where water temps are usually around 85, and if you are not active, you cool down pretty quick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Posted February 21, 2006 Report Share Posted February 21, 2006 In fact, most sanitizers work best in the mid to high 80's for temperature, so no problem there. As for dropping it down to 80, i don't think you'd really want to go that low. Keep it within a few degrees of body temperature if you plan on sitting in it for any length of time. I've been in a tub that was 95 during a heat wave here (37C . . . i think that's around 95 - 100 F??) and it was very comfortable. Water takes heat away 5 times faster than air, (or is it 20 times, can't remember from my scuba instructor days . . . think sound moves 20 times faster . . . no wait . . . oh watever, it cools ya down quicker than air) so a few degrees will make a big difference after longer periods of time. How many times have you been in an indoor pool where water temps are usually around 85, and if you are not active, you cool down pretty quick. Yea about 95-97 was comfortable for me to cool off in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rika Posted February 21, 2006 Report Share Posted February 21, 2006 If you are in an area that get's hot in the summer by might have a problem getting it to cool off that much. You will have to run some kind of pump to filter the water. Either 24 hours circ pump or programmed cycles for filtration are standard strategies. Anytime the pumps are running you have the possibility for temperature creep. In other words the heat from your pumps will heat the water. If ambient temperature is above 100 it will be hard to get it to 80 degrees. We set ours at 97 in the summer and it stays between 97 and 100. This seems to be a good temp for us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spalover Posted February 27, 2006 Report Share Posted February 27, 2006 We live in Florida and turn down our tub in the summer with no problem. Another thing you might want to look into is misters, although I'm not sure if all brands of hot tub offer them (we have a Vita). They hook up to your hose, so they put out fresh, cool water in a mist over the tub. We got them because our tub is not screened in, and we wanted to keep bugs away at night. I thought they would be annoying, but we've grown to like them and our guests LOVE them on hot days. We use them a lot more than I thought we would. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brulan1 Posted February 28, 2006 Report Share Posted February 28, 2006 We are looking into our first spa and have a few ?'s. 1)Is it possible to bring the water temperature down to 80 for an extended period of time in the summer without a problem. We would prefer not to get into a swim spa since we are not big swimmers and would like to be able to cool down in the heat. 2)There are 5 dealers in our area we are going to look into. Caldera-Marquis-Hot Spring-D1-Sundance. Any input on which are the better options and why? 3)What would be the average price investment range with all the basics included? 4)What is the average annual cost of upkeep? Check out therma spa and Coleman spa with the thermal lock or thermal pane wich is an energy saver!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Kahuna Posted February 28, 2006 Report Share Posted February 28, 2006 Check out therma spa and Coleman spa with the thermal lock or thermal pane wich is an energy saver!!! ***Theoretically, and not independantly proven yet (tests done by companies paid by manufacturers, at least from what i've found so far . . . i would love to see a totally independant study done as i do own a TP style tub . . . Arctic Spa). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Posted February 28, 2006 Report Share Posted February 28, 2006 ***Theoretically, and not independantly proven yet (tests done by companies paid by manufacturers, at least from what i've found so far . . . i would love to see a totally independant study done as i do own a TP style tub . . . Arctic Spa). I used to think this was important, and don't get me wrong paying 50 bucks a month average versus 30 is 20 bucks a month we all could do something with but..............After a while you realize that if the few bucks a month difference that most top brands have between them really don't mean squatt. If it is something a person is worried about then maybe hot tub ownership is not for them because after all, they are expensive to own, a treat that cost us alot of money over the life of the tub. Think about it, you go and buy a 8 thousand dollar tub that last for 10 years that's 8 hundred dollars a year plus, 30 bucks a month about for hydro thats 1160 per year plus lets say aprox. another 20-30 bucks a month for our time and our chemicals thats a grand total of 1400-1500 bucks a year to own a tub. Now I know these are some very raw numbers but if your worried about even 100 bucks or even more a year in energy savings, maybe this hot tub ownership thing is not such a good idea. I have decided I can get alot more enjoyment out of my little hot water retreat by myself and with friends then I can going out to a local pub (and now with drinking and driving being such a big issue) And god knows I like my drinks!! I figure I am saving money by owning a hot tub because I spent 50-100 bucks or more every other week going out for dinner and drinks which relates to twice as much as hot tub ownership or 2000-3000 a year. Does anyone see the logic in this? Or am I just trying to justify my spoiling of myself and my wife.....LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunny Posted February 28, 2006 Report Share Posted February 28, 2006 ***Theoretically, and not independantly proven yet (tests done by companies paid by manufacturers, at least from what i've found so far . . . i would love to see a totally independant study done as i do own a TP style tub . . . Arctic Spa). Pacific Spas have done an independent test on their hot tubs for electricity consumption and they show the results on their web-site. This was done to prove the effectiveness of Icynene full foam insulation against non full foamed tubs. Their web link is http://www.pacificspas.ca/equipment.htm Look under Energy Efficiency. Regards Sunny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Kahuna Posted February 28, 2006 Report Share Posted February 28, 2006 I used to think this was important, and don't get me wrong paying 50 bucks a month average versus 30 is 20 bucks a month we all could do something with but..............After a while you realize that if the few bucks a month difference that most top brands have between them really don't mean squatt. If it is something a person is worried about then maybe hot tub ownership is not for them because after all, they are expensive to own, a treat that cost us alot of money over the life of the tub. Think about it, you go and buy a 8 thousand dollar tub that last for 10 years that's 8 hundred dollars a year plus, 30 bucks a month about for hydro thats 1160 per year plus lets say aprox. another 20-30 bucks a month for our time and our chemicals thats a grand total of 1400-1500 bucks a year to own a tub. Now I know these are some very raw numbers but if your worried about even 100 bucks or even more a year in energy savings, maybe this hot tub ownership thing is not such a good idea. I have decided I can get alot more enjoyment out of my little hot water retreat by myself and with friends then I can going out to a local pub (and now with drinking and driving being such a big issue) And god knows I like my drinks!! I figure I am saving money by owning a hot tub because I spent 50-100 bucks or more every other week going out for dinner and drinks which relates to twice as much as hot tub ownership or 2000-3000 a year. Does anyone see the logic in this? Or am I just trying to justify my spoiling of myself and my wife.....LOL Pacific Spas have done an independent test on their hot tubs for electricity consumption and they show the results on their web-site. This was done to prove the effectiveness of Icynene full foam insulation against non full foamed tubs. Their web link is http://www.pacificspas.ca/equipment.htm Look under Energy Efficiency. Regards Sunny How can it be independant if a spa company did it? It's independant on thier part, but not that of other companies. But like Roger said, does it matter? It would be interesting, though, to see results. I totally agree. Even a night out at the movies, which used to be a nice cheap date, can run you up over $50 for a couple (especially with many theatres having places like Kentucky fried chicken, Taco Time, etc located along with the popcorn vendors, and movie prices have gone up, here anyways there aren't any theatres for under $7 a move). And a night of drinking? Let's not even go there. My problem is, i go to the bar and don't want to be the only drunk among my friends, so i make sure to get them good and drunk (this way, i'm not the only one doing stupid things, no embarrassing dirt on me because everyone else is right along side me). I've had $700 nights at the bar . . . OUCH! Now, it's a case of beer or bottle of vodka (for some reason i love "silver wolf" vodka made in your area Roger, cheap stuff (got a 40 for $5 once with a $2 mail in rebate, lol) but i love that stuff) and a night in the tub. Or taking the family out for dinner . . . a decent restaurant and dinner for 4 is around $200 with a beer or two during and a nice after dinner coffee (with booze, of course). And then the entertainment value of a tub . . . but don't tell the ladies this part . . . cute women, no suits, hehehe (hey, it doesn't matter where you get your appettite, so long as you go home to eat, right?). Yup, it may save a few bux owning a tub, or maybe not, but look at what you've got and how much you get out of it if you enjoy it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunny Posted February 28, 2006 Report Share Posted February 28, 2006 How can it be independant if a spa company did it? It's independant on thier part, but not that of other companies. But like Roger said, does it matter? It would be interesting, though, to see results. I totally agree. Even a night out at the movies, which used to be a nice cheap date, can run you up over $50 for a couple (especially with many theatres having places like Kentucky fried chicken, Taco Time, etc located along with the popcorn vendors, and movie prices have gone up, here anyways there aren't any theatres for under $7 a move). And a night of drinking? Let's not even go there. My problem is, i go to the bar and don't want to be the only drunk among my friends, so i make sure to get them good and drunk (this way, i'm not the only one doing stupid things, no embarrassing dirt on me because everyone else is right along side me). I've had $700 nights at the bar . . . OUCH! Now, it's a case of beer or bottle of vodka (for some reason i love "silver wolf" vodka made in your area Roger, cheap stuff (got a 40 for $5 once with a $2 mail in rebate, lol) but i love that stuff) and a night in the tub. Or taking the family out for dinner . . . a decent restaurant and dinner for 4 is around $200 with a beer or two during and a nice after dinner coffee (with booze, of course). And then the entertainment value of a tub . . . but don't tell the ladies this part . . . cute women, no suits, hehehe (hey, it doesn't matter where you get your appettite, so long as you go home to eat, right?). Yup, it may save a few bux owning a tub, or maybe not, but look at what you've got and how much you get out of it if you enjoy it. Hi, You misunderstand, it wasn't done by the spa company, it was done by an independent company called Warnock-Hersey, this a well respected testing company who do all sortds of testing for the US government. Regards Sunny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Kahuna Posted February 28, 2006 Report Share Posted February 28, 2006 Hi, You misunderstand, it wasn't done by the spa company, it was done by an independent company called Warnock-Hersey, this a well respected testing company who do all sortds of testing for the US government. Regards Sunny Very well, but the read-outs still show comparison between a pacific spa tub and those of, and i quote, "Non Insulated". Of course a tub with any kind of insulation is going to be better than a tub with no insulation. There is no comparison of a FF vs TP style tub, which seems to be the main debate, of which everyone has agreed that there should be some type of insulation either way. Why would they compare thier tub to one that is "Non Insulated". To me, "Non Insulated" says there is no insulation in the tub they compared thiers too. Why would a company need to do this? In this manner, any spa company can make thier tub look more efficient, regardless of the testing company. Arctic spa also did testing utilizing a third party source, but i'm sure there is room for debate in this area as well. Results are here: http://www.arcticspas.com/index.php?data=Y...iIxMiI7fQ%3D%3D I would still love to see a completely independant study, this done purely for science, and not by a spa company having a "third party" do it, because results can be made to be in thier favour depending on how and what tests are done and other variables that the spa company does decide. I really don't care, i love my tub and would still own it if it were a little more expensive to run, i'm just interested in the scientific aspect of it, no matter what the results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brulan1 Posted March 23, 2006 Report Share Posted March 23, 2006 Very well, but the read-outs still show comparison between a pacific spa tub and those of, and i quote, "Non Insulated". Of course a tub with any kind of insulation is going to be better than a tub with no insulation. There is no comparison of a FF vs TP style tub, which seems to be the main debate, of which everyone has agreed that there should be some type of insulation either way. Why would they compare thier tub to one that is "Non Insulated". To me, "Non Insulated" says there is no insulation in the tub they compared thiers too. Why would a company need to do this? In this manner, any spa company can make thier tub look more efficient, regardless of the testing company. Arctic spa also did testing utilizing a third party source, but i'm sure there is room for debate in this area as well. Results are here: http://www.arcticspas.com/index.php?data=Y...iIxMiI7fQ%3D%3D I would still love to see a completely independant study, this done purely for science, and not by a spa company having a "third party" do it, because results can be made to be in thier favour depending on how and what tests are done and other variables that the spa company does decide. I really don't care, i love my tub and would still own it if it were a little more expensive to run, i'm just interested in the scientific aspect of it, no matter what the results. There is nothing like knowing your own tub to a T Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharkman009 Posted March 24, 2006 Report Share Posted March 24, 2006 There is nothing like knowing your own tub to a T ?????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Spa Posted March 24, 2006 Report Share Posted March 24, 2006 all I see is some chart?????????? This constitutes a test? At least Arctic went to the trouble of publishing a complete explanation of the test they did, regardless of how flawed it is compared to real world usage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Kahuna Posted March 24, 2006 Report Share Posted March 24, 2006 all I see is some chart?????????? This constitutes a test? At least Arctic went to the trouble of publishing a complete explanation of the test they did, regardless of how flawed it is compared to real world usage. Like i said, any test can be flawed. Like the test that was done to show how sugar does not affect ADD and hyperactivity in kids (Learned about this from Kevin Trudea's book . . . interesting read). They had two groups of kids. Each group on the same *** with the exception of one group having 30% more sugar in thier ***. It was shown that there was no significant difference between the two groups in regards to ADD and hyperactivity. HOWEVER, they also didn't say that the group with the "regular" *** didn't have a "regular" ***, but it was EXTREMELY high in sugar as well, and with the limits we're talking about, another 30% probably wouldn't make much of a difference. So, same can be done for any tub, or anything, all depends on how you perform your tests and what exactly you tell people they were based on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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