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Hot Springs Spa Powerless After Refilling


DannyB5683

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Two days ago, I drained and refilled my 2016 Hot Springs Grandee spa. I’ve done this a few times before in warmer months, with no issue. This time- after refilling with cold water - I flipped the breaker back on- and there was no response. No lights, noises, etc. The spa seems completely dead. The hot tub manual suggested the spa may be in “High Limit Protection Mode” and that warming up the sensors in the heater with a blow dryer may fix the issue. I assumed that I may have tripped the high limit switch- but i attempted the “blow dryer” fix, and no change. After countless attempts at heating the area up, I eventually drained again and refilled the spa with warm water this time to avoid that issue- but still no change. I’ve tried changing the fuse on the circuit board and I tested the electric to make sure power was indeed going to the spa from the breaker. I am out of ideas - has anyone encountered this issue before??? I’ve checked and there is definitely power in the wires going to the circuit board- but there is zero response. I even checked the heating mechanism-and there is no reset switch on there. I’ve attached a pic of the circuit board. Any help would be greatly appreciated!

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I am NOT a hot springs guy... Do you get power at the red and black wires on the relay board? Also see top right the pressure switch jumper wire looks half disconnected... again not a hot springs expert.

Follow the power.. White to black 120V white to red 120 black to red 240V

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Hi thanks for the reply- so when I tested for power, I was able to confirm that I had power going into the circuit board at those 4 white wires supplying the board. With the multimeter- I didn’t get any other power at all coming off of the board.

I checked the pressure switch jumper wire last night as well. The wires are connected and it is  plugged in.

It just seems strange to me that whatever tripped would completely shut things down to the point where I have zero power or response anywhere. 

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I removed the left side circuit panel and took a picture of the back. Posted it below- didn’t notice any unusual brown spots.
 

The only thing I noticed was when I was testing the red black and white wires that were connected from the left to the right side- I got 120 volts with my multimeter on the red and black wires. The white read zero. I pulled the wire off and took a pic of the two prongs that have white labeled below it. I’m an amateur with electric work so I’m not sure if this is normal or not.

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15 hours ago, DannyB5683 said:

The white read zero.

??

On 1/7/2023 at 9:01 AM, CanadianSpaTech said:

White to black 120V

 

On 1/7/2023 at 9:01 AM, CanadianSpaTech said:

white to red 120

 

On 1/7/2023 at 9:01 AM, CanadianSpaTech said:

black to red 240V

What V do you get going black to red on the relay board in the bottom photo? 240?

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@castletonia, I know you aren't a watkins guy anymore, but WTF is that? It's disguised as an IQ pack, but I've never seen that board. Were they always made in China? I don't recall seeing that before either. Do they still have the LEDs on the board?

On 1/7/2023 at 8:01 AM, CanadianSpaTech said:

I am NOT a hot springs guy..

🙄 Uh-huh... of course not... we believe you... 😉🤣

19 hours ago, DannyB5683 said:

white read zero

Test voltage with a 2-lead meter from one leg to another (black to red, black to white, red to white), never to ground. 

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6 hours ago, CanadianSpaTech said:

??

 

 

What V do you get going black to red on the relay board in the bottom photo? 240?

So I went back to the relay board and you are correct- black to red is reading 240 volts. The other ones are reading 120 volts. I am completely baffled at how I can have power to the spa, power in the wires on the relay board- and then have absolutely no response on any aspect of this spa. No lights, movement, noises or anything. I appreciate all the help btw so thank you for your assistance. 

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1 hour ago, tjr said:

If you are getting 230v red to black and 120 red/black to white going to the main circuit board on the right it's probably the power supply on main circuit board under the red, back and white wires. Hotspring p/n 78841

 

Ok thank you- so it’s possible I might not have to switch out the entire control board?? I just didn’t want to spend the $600 and labor costs to make that change. So there’s a chance it could just be the power supply that needs changing?

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18 hours ago, RDspaguy said:

@castletonia, I know you aren't a watkins guy anymore, but WTF is that? It's disguised as an IQ pack, but I've never seen that board. Were they always made in China? I don't recall seeing that before either. Do they still have the LEDs on the board?

🙄 Uh-huh... of course not... we believe you... 😉🤣

Test voltage with a 2-lead meter from one leg to another (black to red, black to white, red to white), never to ground. 

Yeah, that's the current IQ2020 control box, code named "Eagle".  Been in use since Q3 2012 on Hot Spring and probably a similar time with Caldera.  To my knowledge, have always been made in China, but I can only verify back to 2017 when I first became a dealer.  

Those electronics were pretty darn reliable.  I think I only had one relay board fail and cannot recall any of the main boards failing in 5+ years as a dealer.  I wasn't a service tech so this is getting beyond my knowledge level, but if there is power going to the hot tub and relay board isn't fried, I would have to assume main board.  If that is the case, you have to buy the entire IQ2020 control box and you would then need software installed and software jumpers set.  

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So a bit of a bizarre update- a Watkins spa tech emailed me and asked me to check for voltage across the 5 and 7 terminals. As I was poking around with the multimeter and checking, I heard a clicking noise and the motherboard along with the spa just turned on suddenly. After being completely dead for 4 days- the spa just came to life. My assumption is there is an issue with the terminal block on the relay board and poking around made some sort of connection that was loose? I have no idea, but this is what the motherboard currently looks like.

My current issue is that I can not for the life of me insert the heater wires back into the H1 and H2 terminals. Are we thinking it’s best I replace this relay board? That will solve my issue getting those wires in and whatever was causing the spa to play dead for 4 days 😂.

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My brother in law is an electrician and he has been walking me through things- and I’ve been trying to get this wire back in and it doesn’t seem to be happening. I will try that method- thanks for your help. Any guesses though as to how I went from nothing to the whole thing lighting up from prodding around?

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1 hour ago, CanadianSpaTech said:

insert a small screwdriver in the hole above where the wire goes in. Point the screwdriver towards the top of the pack and go in as far as it will go and then press downward to open the hole for the wire to go in. Shitty set up.

So I did as you instructed and the wires went in- so thank you! However, when I shut the power off to safely make thee connections- turning the power back on rendered the motherboard “dead” again. So I have to assume the issue is this relay board? For it to magically turn on when testing the terminals, and then to not turn back on after inserting the heater wires?

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Now that you know how to insert the wires go back through all of them and see if perhaps one is not making a good connection. Might explain why it suddenly came back to life. Also might be a break in a circuit on the board or a loose solder connection on the terminal block. Try gently pressing on the board and terminal block with the back of a screwdriver to see if it clicks back into place/makes connection. Would likely be short lived but might give you a clue to follow.

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On 1/8/2023 at 8:50 PM, tjr said:

If you are getting 230v red to black and 120 red/black to white going to the main circuit board on the right it's probably the power supply on main circuit board under the red, back and white wires. Hotspring p/n 78841

 

So thank you for your suggestion TJR- this part actually helped bring my spa back to life. I finally have power to the spa. My water is around 50 degrees and the heater does not seem to be working. I’m not sure what the issue could be- I’m getting the solid red light on the circuit board, so I’m kind of confused as to why it’s not heating up. Could the water be too cold?? Do I need warmer water to get it going?

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On 1/8/2023 at 8:50 PM, tjr said:

If you are getting 230v red to black and 120 red/black to white going to the main circuit board on the right it's probably the power supply on main circuit board under the red, back and white wires. Hotspring p/n 78841

 

Hi Dave- I ordered it on backyardplus.com. They have been the most reliable place that has all the needed parts- they also have technicians who are very reliable that will help you on the phone when you need assistance.

Now I thought it would be that easy- it was NOT. 😂. The old power supply looked slightly different than the one I purchased. Regardless- I was going to attempt this install and avoid spending $600 on a new box. I could not for the life of me get the old supply off after unscrewing the 4 screws. So I instead placed the new power supply box in front of the old one and went to make the two wired connections. It was odd because the old box seemed to have no wired connections, whereas the new one I bought has two wires coming off it. There were slots on the right on the circuit board for one set of wires to install but on the left- there were no open holes to make a connection. It seemed as if I had an old circuit board and the holes were filled with solder. I attached a pic. Anyway- I used a small drill bit, drilled out the solder and made the connection. So now I have power to the circuit board- all my proper lights are on, but it is not heating up. I’m hoping I just have to fix a connection or two, tighten things up- would rather not have to splurge for a new heater at this point. Hope you find the answers you are looking for on here- the community has been very helpful. If you have any questions about all the troubleshooting I’ve done, feel free to message me or reply here- hope you fix your issue as well.

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