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Breaker tripping after 10 seconds, it's not the heater. What to do next?


NickyBeef

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Hello! 

I have a Hot Spring Spa that is no longer working. The breaker used to trip every few days, which I'd reset manually. It was annoying but an easy bandaid fix. Now, the breaker trips roughly 10 seconds after I flip it on. 

I've disconnected all sensors and the power supply from the circuit board for the heating element, but the problem persists. I do not know how to fully disconnect the hot tub from my sub panel as the line is trenched underground and appears to be hardwired in--no 220 plug. Only the GFCI breaker trips. AFAIK nothing has gotten wet--the subpanel is covered and under an overhang, as is the tub. Any suggestions or pointers greatly appreciated. Thank you! 

 

(attached is pic of the board with the heater and heater sensors disconnected)

IMG_3671.jpg

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54 minutes ago, RDspaguy said:

Disconnect each component, one at a time, until it stops tripping.

On that spa there are 2 breakers. The 240v 30 amp is the heater, and the 120v 20 amp is everything else. Which breaker trips?

Thanks RD! I ran out of time earlier but can definitely give disconnecting each component a try next. 

The left breaker in the picture attached is the one that trips. Since the 30A breaker stays on regardless of what I do, it seems like I can rule that one out. I replaced the circulation pump two years ago--its issue was causing the panel lights to flash. Replacing that nipped that issue, but the subpanel would still trip every 3-4 days (before and after that replacement, IIRC), and would sometimes go for weeks on-end without tripping.  Since (I think?) that's the first thing to kick on when the tub is powered up, maybe it's already worn out? 

If it continues to trip after I disconnect each component, should I assume a bad breaker is at fault? It's weird that it runs for 10 or so seconds before it trips, which leads me to believe some component is trying to power on and telling the GFCI to pop). 

 

IMG_F0959B04606A-1.jpeg

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Gfci breakers can and do go bad. They can be difficult to diagnose, as they could be reacting to faulty equipment or a bad breaker, but disconnecting equipment can make a bad breaker stop tripping leading you to think it's the equipment when it's not. 

On your spa, the 30 amp is the heater, so you can rule that out.

The timing suggests a bad breaker, or perhaps ozonator.

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Thanks for the help. I have an update:

I began pulling each component off of the circuit board to determine what was causing the trip. Turns out it was the circulation pump. When I took the back cap off of the pump to see if the wiring became disconnected, a bunch of water came out--the connections were submerged in water. Now that the new circulation pump is installed, the breaker no longer trips! Horray!

However....

I now have a red flashing light on the front panel. The circulation pump runs, but the flashing red light prevents me from turning on the pumps, heater etc. The heating element does not get warm to the touch, so I know it's not hitting the 118F overheat thing.

Any ideas on what to do next?

 

Edit: I disconnected the ozonator a couple years ago--can't remember why, but the tub did run fine for two years without it being hooked up.

 

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15 hours ago, NickyBeef said:

wiring became disconnected, a bunch of water came out--the connections were submerged in water.

That'll do it. Did you find the source of that water? 

15 hours ago, NickyBeef said:

now have a red flashing light on the front panel.

Are you using the pressure switch or is it jumpered?

Did you connect the thermistors (sensors) correctly?

Test thermistors.

15 hours ago, NickyBeef said:

but the tub did run fine for two years without it being hooked up.

Yeah, it's not necessary, just nice to have.

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Hey Rd, 

I did not find the source of water--but I'm assuming something happened in the pump assembly itself since it's dry everywhere down there. I didn't look into it further.

I am not sure if i'm using the pressure switch or if it's jumpered, but below is a photo of the control board as I have it currently set up. I fiddled with it a bit this afternoon and feel like I'm getting closer?

The tub now powers on, and the red light stays solid, but the green light begins blinking after 10 seconds and I get no heat. The thing that got the tub to power on at all was moving over the far upper right thermistor so that only one of the pegs makes a connection (out of 3). I'd assume the tub would do the exact same thing if I unplugged it entirely. With it plugged in on all three posts, the tub just blinks red. 

Does this point to that specific thermistor needing replacement, or something else?

Thank you so much! It's flipping cold outside and my bones are aching, so I'd love to get this thing fired up soon! 🙂

 

IMG_3987.JPG

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Figured it out! 

The (circled above) thermistor to circuit board connection was staggered. 

When I was diagnosing the tub issue, I thought I saw the thermistor staggered when I unplugged it, but I must've been misremembering.

When I was trying to get everything back up and running, I tried it both staggered and fully connected on all pins, and had the flashing green lights both times. 

In the hot spring spa manual I saw that a 30 second reset was necessary when doing any electronics work. When I was fiddling with that thermistor connection, I was only shutting off the breaker for long enough to move the connection around, which was definitely under 30 seconds.

Moral of the story: turn it off and back on again (and always take lots of pictures before unplugging anything)!

Thanks for the help. Hopefully the circulation pump won't have issues for a long time now. 

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