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Leaking gate valve in hot tub


AdamD10

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4 hours ago, RDspaguy said:

Going to have to do some plumbing, I'm sorry to say. Clean the insulation off of the fittings and a foot or two of pipe and replumb it. 

Yep, That T fitting scares me where does it go and what other rigid plumbing is attached to it we can't see. As we say in Canada...might snowball

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2 hours ago, CanadianSpaTech said:

Yep, That T fitting scares me where does it go and what other rigid plumbing is attached to it we can't see. As we say in Canada...might snowball

Do you think it’s just the t valve that needs replacing? I’m very new to any sort of plumbing like this so am  really unsure of the best approach! I’ll take another couple of pics in the morning to show what else it is connected to.

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5 hours ago, AdamD10 said:

Do you think it’s just the t valve that needs replacing? I’m very new to any sort of plumbing like this so am  really unsure of the best approach! I’ll take another couple of pics in the morning to show what else it is connected to.

A couple more pictures to show the inside and how the plumbing is set up. I don’t know where to start!

BE4F8BE3-0B1F-4183-9C8E-1424FF9299D5.jpeg

FC2D153C-8906-4ACF-94EC-4E5242E767FC.jpeg

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8 hours ago, CanadianSpaTech said:

Yep, That T fitting scares me where does it go and what other rigid plumbing is attached to it we can't see. As we say in Canada...might snowball

Why does it scare you? I’m scared now!!

Another couple of pictures to show how it is all plumbed in. Let me know if you need any more.

 

 

0137BC7E-9773-4BE0-85B5-9A4CBB4736D2.jpeg

54B3D427-8E95-4790-8F8A-F9C754DCE86A.jpeg

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Starting at the pump and working back you have a 45 degree pump union glued into the gate valve, The gate valve is glued into a 2" x 2" x 2" T fitting. You have soft plumbing on the far side of the T fitting and it can be cut where the soft plumbing goes into the T fitting. You will likely have to use a 2" coupler to add in a piece of 2" plumbing to reattach it back into the T fitting. Anytime you cut something you end up 1.5-2" short. Sometimes you get lucky and have enough slack in the soft plumbing to be able to reattach it but you will likely not so you have to use a coupler and a 3" bit of 2" soft hose. NOW the difficult part... where does the other "leg" of the T fitting go to... You can't cut rigid plumbing FITTINGS and reattach a new piece. You have to go to soft hose to soft hose to the pump union and replace everything that is a rigid fitting in between. On the pump side new union then new Gate valve then new T fitting straight through to Soft plumbing. You need to dig out the last side of the T Fitting and see where it goes and if you can get to a spot with soft plumbing that you can cut add a 2" coupler and a 3" piece of soft hose to rejoin the soft plumbing back into rigid pipe and rebuild it all. If that last "leg" of the T fitting goes directly into the pump return fitting in the foot well you will be replacing that as well.

You have to do all this AND get it all to line up so the pump union can sit flush up against the pump face so it doesn't leak. I attach the pump union first and work from there dry fitting everything first so you know it's flush up against the pump face. 

Side note.. you might have a straight section of 2" rigid plumbing that goes into the T fitting instead of soft plumbing and it could be cut and a coupler used just like with soft plumbing... cut it and add a coupler to the straight rigid pipe and use soft on the other side of the coupler to go into the T fitting. It doesn't have to be rigid pipe.

Dig out that foam and see where it goes. Post more pics and we can go from there.  

You can buy a serviceable gate valve that can be taken apart if ever needed in the future and if they had of used one you would not be in this situation. It has o-rings that can wear out but are cheap to replace ...but that would be to easy... and we all know nothing is easy...ever. Would love to take an spa engineer/designer out for a day and say here you fix it.

2" SXS Gate Valve - Gate Valves - Valves - Plumbing - Parts and Accessories  / Pièces Et Accessoires - Swim Spas and Hot Tubs | Hydropool Store - Shop -  Hydropool Hot Tubs, Swim Spas and Accessories

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Now bush fix... pull the T handle out of the valve and 2 part Devcon plastic weld epoxy the hole. Pack it in there and plug the hole. Epoxy is sticky and messy and you have a very short working time so have everything ready to go. I am assuming it is leaking thorough the handle and not a crack in the valve body. Downside.. you have to make sure the slice valve part of the gate valve stays in the up position so as to not block flow if it drops. It should stay up without the handle attached but...

Might have to remove the pump so you can get something inside the pump union and make sure the slice is held up. Get the epoxy deep enough it might hold the slice part up...forever. If you do a bush fix and it works great if it fails no biggy and go back to plan A... full repair. Let us know how it goes.

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10 hours ago, AdamD10 said:

Why does it scare you? I’m scared now!!

He's Canadian, and a bit of a drama queen as well. It's not his fault... 🤣

Seriously, the issue is where that other pipe that disappears into the foam goes. It might be simple, or it might be a nightmare. No way to tell without digging it out.

Or, you know, you can try the epoxy band-aid. I personally wouldn't waste the time and effort, but I'm a bit of a perfectionist and follow the motto "do it right or do it again". And I HATE to do it again...

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7 hours ago, RDspaguy said:

He's Canadian, and a bit of a drama queen as well. It's not his fault... 🤣

Seriously, the issue is where that other pipe that disappears into the foam goes. It might be simple, or it might be a nightmare. No way to tell without digging it out.

Or, you know, you can try the epoxy band-aid. I personally wouldn't waste the time and effort, but I'm a bit of a perfectionist and follow the motto "do it right or do it again". And I HATE to do it again...

Ha. He has provided excellent advice, although it is well out oF my diy skill set!

Is it ok to just remove that bit of foam in order to see what the issue is underneath? Presumably so as how else to fix it?!

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13 hours ago, RDspaguy said:

He's Canadian, and a bit of a drama queen as well. It's not his fault... 🤣

@RDspaguy I prefer Diva 💋 .... and it's NEVER my fault 

Want more drama... There is a 678% chance you will have to tip the spa on it's side and take the bottom off the make the full repair.

14 hours ago, RDspaguy said:

"do it right or do it again"

That's what she said... I'll let myself out

Bush fix $30... full repair by a Tech if you have to have movers in to stand up the tub and lay it back down again post repair... $1000 + But that's CDN $ so...

 

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 I have a 1988 CalSpa and it has two of the "serviceable type" gate valves; of course those also stopped sealing back in the 1990s.  I did buy replacement gate valves at Ace Hardware on the corner
(before I had Internet to find stuff) after one simply broke/stuck in the closed position, so the spa was unusable.  I transferred the guts from the new to the existing ones, the holes lined up perfectly.

Anyway, I never touch those gate valves nowadays. I routed the plumbing out of the cabinet to overcome the sucky CalSpa design, and use two new rotating valves on each side of the out-of-cabinet filter.

 

Pool filter Hayward DSC05153.JPG

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13 hours ago, CanadianSpaTech said:

There is a 678% chance you will have to tip the spa on it's side

There he goes again, being a DIVA. I'd say it's only a 362% chance. 🤣

20 hours ago, AdamD10 said:

He has provided excellent advice

Yep. Canadaguy knows his stuff. We've both been at this a loooong time, and I have alot of respect for my Canadian friend. We do like to joke around a bit more than strictly necessary, but we're volunteers so they won't fire us for slacking off.😉

Let us know how that epoxy patch goes.

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22 hours ago, CanadianSpaTech said:

@RDspaguy I prefer Diva 💋 .... and it's NEVER my fault 

Want more drama... There is a 678% chance you will have to tip the spa on it's side and take the bottom off the make the full repair.

That's what she said... I'll let myself out

Bush fix $30... full repair by a Tech if you have to have movers in to stand up the tub and lay it back down again post repair... $1000 + But that's CDN $ so...

 

Luckily there is no fixed bottom, just a based which it sits on. However, tipping it on its side is an issue as it is quite an old, round spa with a fairly weak facade (see picture). It was a real effort to get it out of the seller’s garden and into ours! The only time I want the thing moved again is when it has given up the ghost and it is going to the tip to be replaced by a shiny new one!

Bush fix sounds great, full repair by a tech sounds horrible, whichever currency we’re talking. Ultimately, it is a 15 year old (albeit in very good condition for age) hot tub so we need to be careful how much we spend on repairs. May have to try the bodge fix first of all! 

13782D60-D968-414C-A2EA-B3C81910AB89.jpeg

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On 8/25/2021 at 12:20 PM, CanadianSpaTech said:

Starting at the pump and working back you have a 45 degree pump union glued into the gate valve, The gate valve is glued into a 2" x 2" x 2" T fitting. You have soft plumbing on the far side of the T fitting and it can be cut where the soft plumbing goes into the T fitting. You will likely have to use a 2" coupler to add in a piece of 2" plumbing to reattach it back into the T fitting. Anytime you cut something you end up 1.5-2" short. Sometimes you get lucky and have enough slack in the soft plumbing to be able to reattach it but you will likely not so you have to use a coupler and a 3" bit of 2" soft hose. NOW the difficult part... where does the other "leg" of the T fitting go to... You can't cut rigid plumbing FITTINGS and reattach a new piece. You have to go to soft hose to soft hose to the pump union and replace everything that is a rigid fitting in between. On the pump side new union then new Gate valve then new T fitting straight through to Soft plumbing. You need to dig out the last side of the T Fitting and see where it goes and if you can get to a spot with soft plumbing that you can cut add a 2" coupler and a 3" piece of soft hose to rejoin the soft plumbing back into rigid pipe and rebuild it all. If that last "leg" of the T fitting goes directly into the pump return fitting in the foot well you will be replacing that as well.

You have to do all this AND get it all to line up so the pump union can sit flush up against the pump face so it doesn't leak. I attach the pump union first and work from there dry fitting everything first so you know it's flush up against the pump face. 

Side note.. you might have a straight section of 2" rigid plumbing that goes into the T fitting instead of soft plumbing and it could be cut and a coupler used just like with soft plumbing... cut it and add a coupler to the straight rigid pipe and use soft on the other side of the coupler to go into the T fitting. It doesn't have to be rigid pipe.

Dig out that foam and see where it goes. Post more pics and we can go from there.  

You can buy a serviceable gate valve that can be taken apart if ever needed in the future and if they had of used one you would not be in this situation. It has o-rings that can wear out but are cheap to replace ...but that would be to easy... and we all know nothing is easy...ever. Would love to take an spa engineer/designer out for a day and say here you fix it.

2" SXS Gate Valve - Gate Valves - Valves - Plumbing - Parts and Accessories  / Pièces Et Accessoires - Swim Spas and Hot Tubs | Hydropool Store - Shop -  Hydropool Hot Tubs, Swim Spas and Accessories

I won’t lie, you’ve lost me here! Sorry for being slow but I’m an accountant so hot tub plumbing is not my forte, Ha.

The leak is coming from the area with the arrow pointing at it. The circled area is the foam that i think I need to remove to understand the underlying issue, is it ok to just rip it off? Will that need to be replaced? What is it for?

80D9CB09-1C51-489D-BF71-67FDB9E9091F.jpeg

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Ok you need to use a spoon.. yes a spoon and dig away the yellow foam. Don't worry about replacing it when the repair is finished. Remove as much as you need to find the leak. You need to see the leak and trace where it is coming from then we can advise you from there. Let us know

From your earlier photos and description I was under the impression the water was coming up through the hole in the T handle where the red clip is.

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16 hours ago, CanadianSpaTech said:

Ok you need to use a spoon.. yes a spoon and dig away the yellow foam. Don't worry about replacing it when the repair is finished. Remove as much as you need to find the leak. You need to see the leak and trace where it is coming from then we can advise you from there. Let us know

From your earlier photos and description I was under the impression the water was coming up through the hole in the T handle where the red clip is.

Brilliant, thanks. I’ll do this later and report back 👍🏻
 

Ah no, nothing come out of there, all from underneath. See video here.

 

 

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11 hours ago, CanadianSpaTech said:

You need to see the leak and trace where it is coming from then we can advise you from there.

Yep, track it back to the water mark by the low spot in the collar around the metal shaft. Once we're all on the same page it will make more sense.

11 hours ago, CanadianSpaTech said:

From your earlier photos and description I was under the impression the water was coming up through the hole in the T handle where the red clip is.

Very PC, Canadaguy!  You know as well as I do that it is. I can see the water in the pic.

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