contact634 Posted October 12, 2020 Report Share Posted October 12, 2020 Hi I hope someone here can help I got a 2001 sundance altamar for free this spring it needed work had 2 leaks which we fixed and enjoy it twice a day I had noticed water level dropping about 1.5-2 inch per week but chalked it up to us using it so much. I had the sides off and poked around and noticed the foam is wet on the bottom nearer the middle a lot of the foam was removed on the sides of tub due to rodents (previous owner said) I repacked it with roxul insulation the roxul is bone dry we left the tub off for 48 hours after making water level it did NOT drop we ran recirculating pump for 24 hours NO drop we ran the 2 speed filtration pump for 12 hours NO drop we ran the 1 speed pump (message seat and footwell jets) for 12 hours water level dropped (i had diverter in the middle now I will pick chair then footwell jets to figure out which side) this "circuit" has the message seat jets which were dry when i opened it and the 2 foot well and one side jet side jet was also dry there are also 3 suction lines I have tried fix a leak 3 times no luck its getting cold here (Toronto Canada) so I want to try and fix before winter I plan on tunneling into the foam where its wettest as there is a suction line a foot or so in anyone dealt with this tub any plumbing diagrams? I would prefer not to tip it up but I may have to if leak is on bottom middle this thing weighs a ton! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDspaguy Posted October 13, 2020 Report Share Posted October 13, 2020 The footwell jets are notorious for leaks, and a huge pita to fix. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
contact634 Posted October 13, 2020 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2020 4 hours ago, RDspaguy said: The footwell jets are notorious for leaks, and a huge pita to fix. you mean the two under the lounge seat? see pic is the actual jets or the lines/fittings or the jet gasket in your experience? because I would need to order parts that can take me weeks to get. looks to me that the ONLY way I can get to it would be to tip it up again and tunnel in from the bottom.... My concern is that while tipped up I cant have water in it to see the actual leak(s) do you happen to know the part numbers of those jets or what they call them I would like to look them up in a parts diagram so I can see what's involved the pic is when i got the tub its currently down and being used Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cusser Posted October 13, 2020 Report Share Posted October 13, 2020 Try leak seal liquid, no joke. I have a 1988 CalSpa and have had a leak at the side 8" from my home's wall - of course; so I have used leak seal up to twice a year for over a decade, it does work. I've used both these brands, and I buy online. https://www.spadepot.com/Seal-a-Leak-Spa-Leak-Sealer-16oz-P790 https://www.amazon.com/Fix-Leak-Pool-Sealer-32/dp/B003K1E99Y/ref=pd_lpo_86_t_1/144-0995182-2396007?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B003K1E99Y&pd_rd_r=39b2dfe5-db08-4b52-9671-295b07d7f95f&pd_rd_w=Et8gQ&pd_rd_wg=OwFVs&pf_rd_p=7b36d496-f366-4631-94d3-61b87b52511b&pf_rd_r=W0R1H5ANZSH93Y19AYP3&psc=1&refRID=W0R1H5ANZSH93Y19AYP3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
contact634 Posted October 13, 2020 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2020 41 minutes ago, Cusser said: Try leak seal liquid, no joke. I have a 1988 CalSpa and have had a leak at the side 8" from my home's wall - of course; so I have used leak seal up to twice a year for over a decade, it does work. I've used both these brands, and I buy online. https://www.spadepot.com/Seal-a-Leak-Spa-Leak-Sealer-16oz-P790 https://www.amazon.com/Fix-Leak-Pool-Sealer-32/dp/B003K1E99Y/ref=pd_lpo_86_t_1/144-0995182-2396007?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B003K1E99Y&pd_rd_r=39b2dfe5-db08-4b52-9671-295b07d7f95f&pd_rd_w=Et8gQ&pd_rd_wg=OwFVs&pf_rd_p=7b36d496-f366-4631-94d3-61b87b52511b&pf_rd_r=W0R1H5ANZSH93Y19AYP3&psc=1&refRID=W0R1H5ANZSH93Y19AYP3 thanks tried it 3 times this one http://www.fixaleak.com/ it did not even slow it down last time i ran pumps for 8 hours drained tub and left it empty for 6 days I used 3-4 more ounces then recommended 2nd time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted October 13, 2020 Report Share Posted October 13, 2020 I am West of Milton. If you can't get at it from the sides while down and in place you might want to flip the spa completely over. The Sundance and Jacuzzi bottoms are part of the structure and if stood up without the bottom on the frame work might flex off square and you could have trouble getting the bottom back on depending on how old and rotted (if rotted) the wood is. Remove the foot well jets and pump return covers and try and get a good look at the seal in between the jet body and acrylic to see if the seal/o-rings are deteriorated. As a hail mary run a bead of marine grade silicone around the gaps in between the acrylic and jet bodies, pump returns and around any lights. I would try this before standing/flipping the spa. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
contact634 Posted October 13, 2020 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2020 5 hours ago, CanadianSpaTech said: I am West of Milton. If you can't get at it from the sides while down and in place you might want to flip the spa completely over. The Sundance and Jacuzzi bottoms are part of the structure and if stood up without the bottom on the frame work might flex off square and you could have trouble getting the bottom back on depending on how old and rotted (if rotted) the wood is. Remove the foot well jets and pump return covers and try and get a good look at the seal in between the jet body and acrylic to see if the seal/o-rings are deteriorated. As a hail mary run a bead of marine grade silicone around the gaps in between the acrylic and jet bodies, pump returns and around any lights. I would try this before standing/flipping the spa. the spa controller and that black plastic its attached to is in the way for side access and its a LONG reach! I redid all the wood when I got this spa as it was rotted so it supports itself fine on its side I'm not convinced its the seals between the tub and jets as it 100% leaks when I run the footwell jets When the tub is left idle the water level does NOT drop I'm in Ajax can you recommend anyone out this way? be a long drive for you! if I cant get this fixed myself Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted October 13, 2020 Report Share Posted October 13, 2020 1 hour ago, contact634 said: I'm in Ajax can you recommend anyone out this way? Sorry no Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDspaguy Posted October 14, 2020 Report Share Posted October 14, 2020 If it only leaks with the pumps on it is a pressure leak, which is not the gasket. I would stand it up and see, the leak point will be discolored. Plan to replace, not repair with epoxy or some flex seal stuff. Unless you want to do it again next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
contact634 Posted October 14, 2020 Author Report Share Posted October 14, 2020 5 hours ago, RDspaguy said: If it only leaks with the pumps on it is a pressure leak, which is not the gasket. I would stand it up and see, the leak point will be discolored. Plan to replace, not repair with epoxy or some flex seal stuff. Unless you want to do it again next year. Thanks you wouldn't happen to have a pic of what discoloration of the leak looks like exactly I'm off next week so weather permitting I plan on probing from the sides with some dowel to find the wettest area(s) and if possible tunnel in from the side what would you recommend I replace the spry foam on the bottom of the tub with? a small hole I can re-foam but if the areas large the foam kits are expensive here I have pretty good side access due to previous owners rodent problem pics from reconstruction long completed this was a test frame and fill bottom corners are round Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted October 14, 2020 Report Share Posted October 14, 2020 You could re insulate with Rock Wool insulation. If worried about it getting wet bag it in Contractor garbage bags and Tuck tape it tightly. The discolouration will be a reddish brown colour. Look closely at the air injection lines. Critters will just nip a hole in these lines enough to drip/leak so they have a nice warm safe place with a water source. Turn on the air injection valves when testing. Another way to test instead of standing it up is to have the bottom off and place the spa up on blocks or jack stands with enough support to fill it up a bit or even full and run it. Then you can see under the spa to tell exactly the area it is dripping and leaking. Make sure to have a block or a jack stand with a wood block/2x4 under the foot well to support it there. Quite the project you have going. Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
contact634 Posted October 14, 2020 Author Report Share Posted October 14, 2020 1 hour ago, CanadianSpaTech said: You could re insulate with Rock Wool insulation. If worried about it getting wet bag it in Contractor garbage bags and Tuck tape it tightly. The discolouration will be a reddish brown colour. Look closely at the air injection lines. Critters will just nip a hole in these lines enough to drip/leak so they have a nice warm safe place with a water source. Turn on the air injection valves when testing. Another way to test instead of standing it up is to have the bottom off and place the spa up on blocks or jack stands with enough support to fill it up a bit or even full and run it. Then you can see under the spa to tell exactly the area it is dripping and leaking. Make sure to have a block or a jack stand with a wood block/2x4 under the foot well to support it there. Quite the project you have going. Good luck. Thanks you guys have been very helpful! we got the tub for free cost me $300.00 to have it moved from guys house to my backyard a $400 in wire and disconnect $200.00 in lumber to reframe we were willing to risk $1000.00 the pics above were bare bones frame just for a fill and test run. had a snl3 error (i think it was) thought we were dead in the water I found a loose wire fixed it. it ran we used it for a few days. I fully reframed it built new sides and its been good all summer our plan is if were still using it after a year is to buy a new one when this one starts acting up. it was a lot of work gave me something to do since we couldn't travel this year I do have some jackstands 6 I think I can always buy some fence posts to stand it up on now I just need to talk some guys into helping me lift this thing.... Quote Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted October 14, 2020 Report Share Posted October 14, 2020 Really just need to get it high enough to see under it to see where the leak is...then call some friends to stand it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
contact634 Posted October 14, 2020 Author Report Share Posted October 14, 2020 53 minutes ago, CanadianSpaTech said: Really just need to get it high enough to see under it to see where the leak is...then call some friends to stand it up. it has to go up first as it has a very thick black plastic sheet on the bottom ill need to remove that to have any hope of spotting drips. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
contact634 Posted October 18, 2020 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 well it was a long day drained tub stood it up removed plastic sheet on bottom plastic was DRY patio stones underneath DRY foam WET over approx 1/2 bottom area we put it onto 6x6 refilled hooked power back up and ran it for 6 hours water lever dropped but NO drips at all drained it tipped it back up and foam still wet.... so i took dowel and probed wettest areas NO luck bottom inch or so of foam is wet above that is dry 3 of us tried incase one of use overlooked something we did find some lines that felt wet (see pic of line(s) confirmed by all 3 of us put plastic back on lowered tub onto ground ran for 2 hours lines we felt wet are accessible from sides we just checked they are now dry..... I will continue my search if weather says rain next few days.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted October 18, 2020 Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 So you want to be a service tech...lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
contact634 Posted October 18, 2020 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 8 hours ago, CanadianSpaTech said: So you want to be a service tech...lol that's a hard pass I'm too old to sore! ill keep plugging away at it today! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted October 18, 2020 Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 28 minutes ago, contact634 said: ill keep plugging away at it today! All you can do. Good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDspaguy Posted October 18, 2020 Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 15 hours ago, contact634 said: lever dropped but NO drips at all ??? So, where did the water go? Something had to be dripping. I remove the plastic sheet and set it up on cinder blocks so I can get under it. Be sure it is well supported under the footwell as well as the edges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
contact634 Posted October 18, 2020 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 2 hours ago, RDspaguy said: ??? So, where did the water go? Something had to be dripping. I remove the plastic sheet and set it up on cinder blocks so I can get under it. Be sure it is well supported under the footwell as well as the edges. loose about 2-2.5 inch every 7 days foam is wet for about 1/2 the bottom surface area its wet approx 1 inch deep from bottom. we removed plastic it was dry as were patio stones underneath refilled and ran it we ran it NO dripping stood it back up and poked and felt around dug into wettest area and found some lines that were wet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
contact634 Posted October 18, 2020 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 May have found the leak the lines we felt wet yesterday were NOT wet today but im sure they were leaking so i felt around and when moved a pin hole opens up either dripping or misting the drip was steady enough that it would be a lot of water they are AIR lines when I turn the bubbler off the lines fill with water and I guess depending on vibration and such the pin hole would leak or not I could only see the leak with my very bright spotlight it showed the discoloration on the hose where the pinhole is located Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted October 18, 2020 Report Share Posted October 18, 2020 On 10/14/2020 at 7:20 AM, contact634 said: Look closely at the air injection lines. Critters will just nip a hole in these lines enough to drip/leak so they have a nice warm safe place with a water source. Turn on the air injection valves when testing. Yep... pretty easy fix once found. Just cut it at the hole and add one of these 3/8" line couplers https://www.poolandhottubdepot.com/pvc-coupling-3-8-barb-x-3-8-barb/ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
contact634 Posted October 21, 2020 Author Report Share Posted October 21, 2020 Got this fixed on Sunday found two small leaks same line same area cut out and put new hose about 6 inches wrapped entire are in kleenex and used the tub as normal. checked yesterday NO water on Kleenex put my hand under tub as far as I could between plastic and foam and so far foam is dry I have marked the water level and will keep an eye on it what's "normal" water loss from use per week? tub kept at 38 with cover on outside temp low of 8 high of 16 lots of steam coming off when you use it recirc pump runs 12 hours filtration pump runs about 4 per 24 hour 2 adults using it approx 1 hour per day total (morning and night) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianSpaTech Posted October 21, 2020 Report Share Posted October 21, 2020 Shouldn't lose much with normal use. Only whatever is on your bathing suit when you get out so very little Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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