Canadian Kahuna Posted November 18, 2005 Report Share Posted November 18, 2005 I have a tub of my own, just new to this, using bromine and no problems. But my father in-law has had a tub for a while now and uses bromine as well. He mentioned he is constantly battling alkalinity. All other readings are normal. Any suggestions to help him from constantly working with his alkalinity problem? Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Posted November 19, 2005 Report Share Posted November 19, 2005 I have a tub of my own, just new to this, using bromine and no problems. But my father in-law has had a tub for a while now and uses bromine as well. He mentioned he is constantly battling alkalinity. All other readings are normal. Any suggestions to help him from constantly working with his alkalinity problem? Thanks. I to was constantly dealing with lowering ALK (which drove my PH down) when I was using Bromine, MPS as a sanitation routine. My water comes from the tap at 6.9-7.0 PH with an ALK reading of 50-60. So a little baking soda (4 OZ's) brings my level to 7.5 PH and 100 ALK perfect right? Well after a few weeks or month using bromine MPS the readings would drop again to 7.0 PH driven down I suspect by an ALK reading of 60-80. Little more baking soda to gather them into range, and a few weeks later again below optimum. This is why I no longe use this as a sanitation routine. Now same starting point but after 3-4 OZ's baking soda and dichlor to sanitize I have to adjust once more in a 3-4 month water cycle. Again back up. So I now adjust to 7.8 PH and 120-130 ALK at the begining with 4-5 OZ's of baking soda and it will almost make it 4 months. My point is to me it seems Bromine, MPS drives or drove my readings down faster than dichlor. Are your fathers readings getting driven down or up and what are the starting readings? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Kahuna Posted November 22, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 22, 2005 Roger, thanks for the reply. I haven't had a chance to talk to my father in-law to ask him of his initial readings, etc but will post once i find out. He mentioned all his readings are normal, with the exeption of higher alkalinity readings that he is constantly battling to bring down, and i've noticed this has caused his water to be somewhat cloudy. His bromine levels are all fine, withing the 3-5ppm range. And i know he does not want to switch to chlorine, although easier, he (like myself) prefers bromine. Once again, thanks for the reply and when i get more info i'll post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drprwnap Posted November 22, 2005 Report Share Posted November 22, 2005 I have the opposite problem. I've had my Marquis Epic for a little over a month now. It uses the in-line frog system, bromine and minerals. I shock with MPS. I have a low alk. problem. I've been adding about 1/4 of alk. increaser every week. I've read in other forums that baking soda will RAISE alk. with little impact on pH. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim_The_Jim Posted November 24, 2005 Report Share Posted November 24, 2005 I have the opposite problem. I've had my Marquis Epic for a little over a month now. It uses the in-line frog system, bromine and minerals. I shock with MPS. I have a low alk. problem. I've been adding about 1/4 of alk. increaser every week. I've read in other forums that baking soda will RAISE alk. with little impact on pH. The Total Alkalinity is not the same as "Alkalinity" which is another name for pH. Total Alkalinity is a background base (base and in acid versus base) that fights against the acids we are adding to the spa water. Bromine is typically a pH of 4.7 which is about 800 times more acid that spa water. MPS shock is about a pH of 2 in pure MPS compound and in some of the buffered shocks about 6.0 pH. When you adjust the TA (Total Alkalinity) you are working to buffer the water against the effects of acids. The TA will continually raise the pH as you put in acids to allow for a weekly testing and adjusting. If you find the pH is too low over a week, then start with a higher TA and see if that holds the pH from falling. If you have a low pH after a week, then again start with a higher TA until you get a very slight rise in the pH over a week. It is much better to have the pH rise than to have it fall, because when it falls it falls way to low. Total Alkalinity is adjusted with baking soda which is sodium bicarbonate. pH up is sodium carbonate and does not work the same way as Total Alkalinity increaser. I only recommend using pH UP when the TA is high and the pH is low, which sould be a rare occurance if you are testing and adjusting the water correctly each week. Baking Soda will raise the pH and the TA. Typically you would raise the TA and LOWER the pH weekly. If you try to get the spa water pH to be perfect, you will need to adjust both the TA and the pH at the same time. If you adjust them separately, you will lower the TA with the pH down, and raise the pH with the ALK up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Kahuna Posted November 25, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 25, 2005 Thanks for the reply to all, and the education, Jim. I'm sure my dealer would have been more than happy to explain anything to me as they have answered any questions i've had, but just haven't had the time to get by there lately (hmm, guess i coulda called, seem to forget about phones with everyone having internet now). Once again, thanks for the explanation Jim. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Kahuna Posted December 2, 2005 Author Report Share Posted December 2, 2005 Just out of curiosity, when adding baking soda to raise the TA, how much baking soda should be added (i know this has to do with how low the TA is and how much water the tub holds, but is there a ratio?). Seems my father in laws tub has LOW alkalinity constantly, and i've now just run into adding increaser regularly, but that only works for a few days and my alk. is back down again (was fine for a few weeks when i first filled my tub, but now it's harder to maintain after a few weeks). Thanks to all that can help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Posted December 2, 2005 Report Share Posted December 2, 2005 Just out of curiosity, when adding baking soda to raise the TA, how much baking soda should be added (i know this has to do with how low the TA is and how much water the tub holds, but is there a ratio?). Seems my father in laws tub has LOW alkalinity constantly, and i've now just run into adding increaser regularly, but that only works for a few days and my alk. is back down again (was fine for a few weeks when i first filled my tub, but now it's harder to maintain after a few weeks). Thanks to all that can help. My water starts at about 70 TA I add 4-5 oz's to 375-400 gallons to bring the level to 110-130. From there it falls slowly as the PH holds at 7.5 a couple times betwen water changes I have to add a bit more (1-2 oz's) to bring it back into shape. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim_The_Jim Posted December 3, 2005 Report Share Posted December 3, 2005 Just out of curiosity, when adding baking soda to raise the TA, how much baking soda should be added (i know this has to do with how low the TA is and how much water the tub holds, but is there a ratio?). Seems my father in laws tub has LOW alkalinity constantly, and i've now just run into adding increaser regularly, but that only works for a few days and my alk. is back down again (was fine for a few weeks when i first filled my tub, but now it's harder to maintain after a few weeks). Thanks to all that can help. The charts in the Taylor kit give you the amounts in dry ounces. A tablspoon is about .71 ounces, of TA up. Typically .90 ounces raises 10 PPM in 400 gallons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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