Bbb Stats About Customer Satisfaction

[Veronica]

What may I do to get the 2 of you to hug??

Spa Man: You (and Amanda) are WAY too cute! I'm prepared to hug ANY TIME he is , (I'll even break out into a nice mushy tune, like....."What the (spa world) needs now is love sweet love"....or, "What's so funny 'bout Spas, Love and Understanding?".......any requests?

[spatech (the unreal one)]

Spa Man: You (and Amanda) are WAY too cute! I'm prepared to hug ANY TIME he is , (I'll even break out into a nice mushy tune, like....."What the (spa world) needs now is love sweet love"....or, "What's so funny 'bout Spas, Love and Understanding?".......any requests?

Spaman is getting hugs from 2 women? I'm jealous but I think I know how to get ahold of his wife if needed.

[Amanda]

It's so darned nice to see such comraderie amongst us! This is WAY better than the arguing that I've seen in the past in this industry.

That was funny!

Good environment to learn from each other isn't it?

[SpaMan]

Spaman is getting hugs from 2 women? I'm jealous but I think I know how to get ahold of his wife if needed.

GGGRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!

Just when I thaught everything was going just fine Spatech shows up!!! LOL

[Veronica]

Come on Spa Man...the more the merrier and he doesn't have a costume or cape so what are you worried about?

[SpaMan]

Come on Spa Man...the more the merrier and he doesn't have a costume or cape so what are you worried about?

Veronica,

Hey good news!!! My wife said she agrees the more the merrier, except she then followed it up by saying she was bringing Mr.Bennelli along and for me not to forget her recent marksman scores at the range and that she has recently finished snyper training! All I could say is GULP!!!!!!! LOL

[Veronica]

LOL!!!! Something TOLD me this was a fun loving crowd, please tell your wife, I meant NO disrespect WHATSOEVER, and could NEVER hope to compete! She's gorgeous!.....You better watch out SpaMan, I think some of the other guys here might fight ya for her!

[SpaMan]

LOL!!!! Something TOLD me this was a fun loving crowd, please tell your wife, I meant NO disrespect WHATSOEVER, and could NEVER hope to compete! She's gorgeous!.....You better watch out SpaMan, I think some of the other guys here might fight ya for her!

LOL! She knows you meant no disrespect, everyone needs hugs now and then! And dont worry I carry a Berretta of my own! And thank you for your compliments towards her! I tell everyone I must be one hell of a salesman!

I think Dr.Spa keeps a pic of her on his screensaver as he has pics from last season! LOL see ya next month Doc and yes shes coming too!

[Tom]

One observation though, your findings on Arctic were simply a retail store that carries their product, not the actual manufacturer.

Every once in a while I get some time to browse through past topics, and I'm bringing this up to the front, to say THANK YOU.

This thread contains information about the BBB and indicates some confusion in relation to our products. A search at bbb.org indicated why that might happen.

The manufacturer of Arctic Spas is Blue Falls Manufacturing of Thorsby, AB. However, the BBB search result gives our Type of Business as Spas & Hot Tubs - Dealers!!! The first listing for Spas & Hot Tubs - Rental - Wholesale, Mfg. is our Edmonton dealer store. And the very first listing, as just "Arctic Spas", is another dealer. I would never have known about this if it hadn't been for the forum, so thank you! I'll contact the BBB and see if I can get this straightened out.

Tom

P.S.

NONE of the five Arctic listings I checked at random had any more than a single complaint (resolved) but if I get some time I will review them all and also the thread to see where the high numbers cited there originated.

The BBB listing for the manufacturer, at http://www.spock.usshurdman.com/~edm/commo...html?bid=106215, says:

Based on BBB files, this company has a satisfactory record with the Bureau. A satisfactory record means a company has been in business for at least 12 months, and [has] properly addressed matters referred by the Bureau. The company does not have an unusual volume of complaints, or any government actions involving its marketplace conduct. The Bureau understands and has no concerns about the company's products, services and type of business.

The Bureau processed a total of 0 complaints about this company in the last 36 months, our standard reporting period.

[glfahlc]

Veronica,

For one hon heres a hug for you ((((((huggie squeezie))))))) today I promise to check out the information, after doing so, lets get to the point as your attack on the Doc has caught us off guard and I am sure you would defend your true friends as we do Doc. His track record here is impecable, so please dont feel anyones ganging up on you, lets calmly get to the reason we are all here. How Veronica can we help you with your problem or concerns and make you a happy person again???

i usually just read on these forums as i'm in no position to call myself an expert when it comes spas... but after reading veronicas posts, i've come to the conclusion that maybe if she had visited this forum and others like it before she made her first purchase, she wouldn't be in the fix she finds herself....just my .02

[Tom]

Can everyone please take a look at DRSPAS proposed BBB stats in the "6500"forum and explain to me how he came up with these numbers in good faith? My search indicates totally different results

Dr Spa said Arctic Spas - 10 complaints files in the last 36 months

One observation though, your findings on Arctic were simply a retail store that carries their product, not the actual manufacturer.

I wanted to dig into this because people see these old posts -- how accurate are they? This is for my own interest but I share the results because consumers visiting the forum may find them helpful.

A search ("Arctic Spa") at search.bbb.org turned up 22 listings as of the date of this post, with only 6 dealers having any complaint at all (two with 2 each, 4 with 1 each, total complaints 8 for all dealers, 7 resolved and one administratively closed). The vast majority-- 15 dealers and the manufacturer -- had no complaints.

Perhaps two or three years ago a single store had 10 complaints, but none recently that I could see in my quick search, which is good news for the consumer.

This is only a fraction of our dealer net (the ones with Arctic Spa in their name). Anyone wanting a report on a particular dealer should search for the dealer by store name.

I now return the thread to its previous quiet torpor...

[Jim_The_Jim]

I can't even find the bb you mentioned. Sorry, I spent just a few minutes looking over the rhtubs web board, home page, and reviews. I will look better later as time allows.

But I will say this: I have spoken with the good Doctor on many occasions, and I would also add to Spa Man's words of support for Dr. Spa and Robert's Hot Tubs.

Keep in mind that they sell wooden tubs and the support equipment for same, as well as insulated covers and the various supplies needed to run a hot tub.

They do not sell or rep any self contained portable spas. That is an important distinction - keep in mind that many folks who post so-called reviews or even so-called 'spa rating' pages either sell the items in question, or sell advertising, or may even sell the results of the ratings themselves.

Also, Robert's and Andy's insight into the spa industry is profound on many levels. By being in touch with as many spa dealers and manufacturers as they are, they have valuable information that can help us all. One thing I have heard him say over and over is, "there are no credible comparison tests of spas to be found on the Internet." As a spa dealer, that saddens me - obviously anyone who sells these things would love it if a consumber could click on a web page and get a 'Consumers Report' version of a 'Spa Off' or something like it, but it is not to be had.

Now, if Doc is listing number of complaints filed with the online BBB, I would say that consumers have every right to check those numbers - but the local BBB and any complaints against the actual local dealer they are thinking about buying from would be far more important. Keep in mind that HotSpring outsells all other comers, by a wide margin, so if they were a slip-shod organization, they should have many more complaints. If you see a couple of bad stories about a company which only puts out a hundred spas a year, you have a reason to run away.

My plans are to do exactly that and force manufacturers to submit spas for testing. As soon as I retire, I will be putting full efforts into this side by side testing and evaluation. I plan on having the tests on 24 hours a day on web cam.

[Trigger]

My plans are to do exactly that and force manufacturers to submit spas for testing. As soon as I retire, I will be putting full efforts into this side by side testing and evaluation. I plan on having the tests on 24 hours a day on web cam.

Well from what we've been told by owners of your failing company, "retirement" maybe here sooner than you think, as in weeks.

Jim, I wish you a good retirment from the spa industry.

[Brulan1]

Well from what we've been told by owners of your failing company, "retirement" maybe here sooner than you think, as in weeks.

Jim, I wish you a good retirment from the spa industry.

Good luck on your new endeavors jim. I wish you the best

[spatech (the unreal one)]

Good luck on your new endeavors jim. I wish you the best

Is it officially over?

[Jim_The_Jim]

You guys can official give up the idea that we are going out of business.

We have 16 spas to deliver and as usual we are working to get them finished and delivered.

All the dirt and disgusting crap that you guys spread, only reflect your ethics, as I have been trying to teach

you all about.

You will reap what you sow. If you can't make a decent hot tub, and you are still selling them as the "best", you will continue to ruin the industry.

Most spas stores are folding and that is because of the poor record that the spa industry has.

[Chas]

Jim,

I am very curious: exactly how are you going to force these large manufacturers to do anything? Anything at all?

The biggest pressure on any manufacturer of consumer goods is the consumer. HS is the leading seller of Portable Hot Tubs in the world, and there are well over a hundred other makers in line between HS and you as you move down the food chain.

I would think that any one of those other makers would be in a position to exert far more pressure than you.

[Jim_The_Jim]

Jim,

I am very curious: exactly how are you going to force these large manufacturers to do anything? Anything at all?

The biggest pressure on any manufacturer of consumer goods is the consumer. HS is the leading seller of Portable Hot Tubs in the world, and there are well over a hundred other makers in line between HS and you as you move down the food chain.

I would think that any one of those other makers would be in a position to exert far more pressure than you.

It is because of the loss of sales if they don't. The only thing they understand is money, because they certainly don't understand engineering. It is really very simple. I won't be doing this testing and making spas in the future. That would be a conflict. I will set up a testing company that is supported by consumers who have been ripped off by you guys. There are lots of those people now.

All of the millions of dollars in advertising will not offset an empirical test of spas in a laboratory done by professional engineers.

[Trigger]

You guys can official give up the idea that we are going out of business.

We have 16 spas to deliver and as usual we are working to get them finished and delivered.

All the dirt and disgusting crap that you guys spread, only reflect your ethics, as I have been trying to teach

you all about.

You will reap what you sow. If you can't make a decent hot tub, and you are still selling them as the "best", you will continue to ruin the industry.

Most spas stores are folding and that is because of the poor record that the spa industry has.

Jim Gruver Arjuna

As long as you keep making false posts claiming the most reputable makers in the industry are disgusting and as long as you keep pushing your "insult and steer towards me" agenda, I'm well within board guidelines to comment back. Additonaly you arer posting conflicting information, and it's wrong to give potential buyers the impression that you will be able to service and sell a spa. In fact I find it downright dishonest.

Here's what YOU, James Arjuna told a familly member., These are your words:

I have not taken any wages in 4 years. Four years of hard work for no money. I can't do that any longer, because we have no more of our equity left to do that with. We have been living off our personal real estate investments and getting nothing from this stupid company. We laid off all the employees in Dec of 05 and now only have part time help from two people and I do all the hard work myself. It sucks. So, John is actually doing me a favor.

I would like to see you have that sort of dedication while all your assets are used up just trying to stay afloat from month to month. We are in debt up to way over our heads, because of this stupid company. Just on Credit cards alone is over 160K. There is no money. I have been telling Sandy that I am tired of it for the last two years of hard work for nothing. The spa industry is never going to turn around and I need to face that fact. It is never going to be like it was in the 90's.

... That is not a good reason to keep on going with something that is this screwed up. The whole hot tub industry is in decline and will probably keep going that way, because, nobody can afford to buy them. ...

I spend most of the day trying to figure out how to pay the mortgage one more time. How many times do I have to tell you that. ..... It doesn't matter, because the entire industry is down to 1/3 in sales. The property is in dire need of repairs so we can sell it and move to some place we can afford.

There were Zero hot tub sales in Jan and two in Feb. We need a minimum of 50K per month just to keep the bill collectors at bay. We have been paying over $10,000 per month to credit cards all, company debt. I never get to see any money. I wear Salvation Army clothes, except for my boots and winter coat

You've admitted you are going out of business to many people. Why do you continue to lie here? It's taking this board of track. Please stop it. You are the reason people are distrustful of the industry. Any new consumer reading this should take Jim's posting with a grain of salt (and some prozac). Do your own research, check out the dealer yuo are working with, and ask questions, compare and wet test.

[Jim_The_Jim]

Jim Gruver Arjuna

As long as you keep making false posts claiming the most reputable makers in the industry are disgusting and as long as you keep pushing your "insult and steer towards me" agenda, I'm well within board guidelines to comment back. Additonaly you arer posting conflicting information, and it's wrong to give potential buyers the impression that you will be able to service and sell a spa. In fact I find it downright dishonest.

Here's what YOU, James Arjuna told a familly member., These are your words:

I have not taken any wages in 4 years. Four years of hard work for no money. I can't do that any longer, because we have no more of our equity left to do that with. We have been living off our personal real estate investments and getting nothing from this stupid company. We laid off all the employees in Dec of 05 and now only have part time help from two people and I do all the hard work myself. It sucks. So, John is actually doing me a favor.

I would like to see you have that sort of dedication while all your assets are used up just trying to stay afloat from month to month. We are in debt up to way over our heads, because of this stupid company. Just on Credit cards alone is over 160K. There is no money. I have been telling Sandy that I am tired of it for the last two years of hard work for nothing. The spa industry is never going to turn around and I need to face that fact. It is never going to be like it was in the 90's.

... That is not a good reason to keep on going with something that is this screwed up. The whole hot tub industry is in decline and will probably keep going that way, because, nobody can afford to buy them. ...

I spend most of the day trying to figure out how to pay the mortgage one more time. How many times do I have to tell you that. ..... It doesn't matter, because the entire industry is down to 1/3 in sales. The property is in dire need of repairs so we can sell it and move to some place we can afford.

There were Zero hot tub sales in Jan and two in Feb. We need a minimum of 50K per month just to keep the bill collectors at bay. We have been paying over $10,000 per month to credit cards all, company debt. I never get to see any money. I wear Salvation Army clothes, except for my boots and winter coat

You've admitted you are going out of business to many people. Why do you continue to lie here? It's taking this board of track. Please stop it. You are the reason people are distrustful of the industry. Any new consumer reading this should take Jim's posting with a grain of salt (and some prozac). Do your own research, check out the dealer yuo are working with, and ask questions, compare and wet test.

Trigger; You are such a baby. You act like like a two year old child throwing a tantrum over what.

Friggin fantasy.

Do you really think I am going to give any of my brother any real information? This guy is absolutely nuts.

He has to take handful of pills several times a day just so he can cope and not put his fist through his computer. My brother has been on drugs for 45 years. Self medicated most of those years by shooting up speed, meth and anything else he could take.

You are pretty funny. The reason why people are distrustful of the industry is, obvious. All the bull crap they use to fool people out of their money, then the products don't perform anywhere near as well as the sales pitch.

You are one of their victims. Just wait and you will understand from personal experience.

We get calls from people who own that crap asking for help.

That is how I know they are destroying their own reputation.

My site which is full of facts has been read by over 1,000,000 people in depth. There are 40 people a day who read 30 pages or deeper as well, those are our customers.

Our tune was heard over 7,000 times yesterday.

http://www.soundclikc.com/havenhead

[Trigger]

It wasn't from your brother, and it wasn't taken from a comunication from your brother.

I do have the letters you wrote to your brother too. Many people have those letters... And they are available to anyone who asks.

[Jim_The_Jim]

It wasn't from your brother, and it wasn't taken from a comunication from your brother.

I do have the letters you wrote to your brother too. Many people have those letters... And they are available to anyone who asks.

Yes, Ha Ha Ha! and if you can't tell he is nuts, I guess that makes you .......? Well aaahhhh NUTS!

Everybody who is sane reading that crap, is the type of customer I want. If you want to share that stuff that my brother who is bonafide insane is publishing that makes you look so screwed up in the head?

It has been working in our favor, because it just shows the desperation in the spa sales people. They think they have a meaty bone to chew on, but it is a dry one and the only thing they are tasting is their own blood when the bone slivers cut their mouth.

Do you think you can stop the truth with a bunch of my brother's insane writings?

LOLFOFLMAO

[Trigger]

Yes, Ha Ha Ha! and if you can't tell he is nuts, I guess that makes you .......? Well aaahhhh NUTS!

Everybody who is sane reading that crap, is the type of customer I want. If you want to share that stuff that my brother who is bonafide insane is publishing that makes you look so screwed up in the head?

It has been working in our favor, because it just shows the desperation in the spa sales people. They think they have a meaty bone to chew on, but it is a dry one and the only thing they are tasting is their own blood when the bone slivers cut their mouth.

Do you think you can stop the truth with a bunch of my brother's insane writings?

LOLFOFLMAO

No.

I was refering to things YOU wrote. So you don't have a problem with publishing it here? The moderators are hesitent, and out of respect for them, I haven't published the drival, BUT if you want me to, and give me permision, I will publish what YOU Wrote. The mods would be fine with that. I mean, it's pretty insane stuff YOU wrote. If it's been working in your favor, then you should be fine with me doing that.

How's that Jim?

[D.P. Roberts]

"I want to thank all of our customers for being so patient with all of this. I know that we are weeks behind, but it is worth the wait. I have not felt good with a virus and then having to deal with THIS MUCH SNOW!"

This quote was taken from the "Still Snowing!" thread on your own board, on January 8th 2007.

So, if you were already weeks behind in early January, then the spas were probably due to be delivered no later than early December. It's almost March, so your tubs are THREE MONTHS behind schedule???

A piece of advice- you might spend less time on the music, and less time on the internet, and more time delivering those spas.

[spatech (the unreal one)]

A piece of advice- you might spend less time on the music,

Your other points were certainly valid but having had the misfortune to hear it, I hardly think Jim has spent much time on his music.