2012 Sundance Optima Vs 2012 Jacuzzi J-365

[jandowood]

Hi All, (sorry for the long post )

My wife and I are about to get our first hot tub. We are located in Edmonton, Canada. I am quite diligent in doing my research and have been reading up a lot in this forum; you guys have been a TON of help!

First off, we have wet tested an Arctic Spa Norwegian (stroke that one off the list VERY quickly, real bad experience, tub was over chlorinated and stung our eyes, too many motors, retarded volcano foot jet), a Beachcomber 580 (stroke that one off after testing the Jacuzzi and Sundance, didn't feel as good..... great sales guy, but too pricey for not as good of a tub IMO), a Jacuzzi J-365 , and a Sundance Optima (these two we will be discussing). **WET TEST IS EVERYTHING!!** Note that there is a Hot Springs seller in Edmonton, but they aren't a dedicated hot tub place... their core business is Plumbing and Lighting and they change hot tub brands like I change my socks; so we didn't even look. Polar Spas was a joke (ozone and don't need any chemicals at all... WTF? ?), and we didn't get around to KoKo Beach (Coast spas). Catalina had a great sales guy, but felt the tubs weren't as good quality as the Jacuzzi and Sundance (but they were quite a bit cheaper).

I will assume if you are reading this, you know the difference between a Jacuzzi J-365 and a Sundance Optima, so I will condense what I have determined are the key differences, and key similarities that I find important. Note that what is important to me is i) good for -40C Canadian winters (-45 in Newfoundland ), ii) construction & quality, iii) insulation, iv) efficiency, v) bang for your buck (don't need no fancy stereo and lights and TVs and waterfalls), vi) hydrotherapy / relaxation / hot water / strong jets

SUNDANCE OPTIMA (dealers "Floor Model Special", grey colour)

• has 15 more jets (different type of jets when compared to the jacuzzi... i think?)
  
• has stereo (don't even want it, it'll probably just break anyway)
  
• better filtration with the MicroClean Ultra Filter (is it better?? is it really necessary?)
  
• better waterfall (but who cares, would be ok if it didn't have one)
  
• bigger foot dome /w more jets
  
• ISO 9001 certified company (but doesn't Jacuzzi own Sundance, and aren't Jacuzzi tubs made in Sundance manufacturing facility?)
  
• Status Indicator Light (i kinda like this... don't want to have to go out and open the Jacuzzi tub to see if there is a problem at -40C.
  
• Slipstream Floating Skimmer (is this better then what the Jacuzzi J-365 has???)
  
• SilentAir Injection System (SunScents Aromatherapy Delivery system)
  
• i-touch controls (better then Jacuzzi?)
  
• 30% deposit ($3900), and only until noon Aug 7th to decide
  
• $3500 more than the Jacuzzi
  
• 
  

JACUZZI (dealers "Truckload Sale")

• is the shell color we prefer more (white)
  
• $500 deposit, have until Aug 17th to decide.
  
• $3500 less than Sundance
  
• 
  

BOTH

• same UV Clear Ray system
  
• same size and # of motors
  
• both tubs have one circ pump
  
• about the same size of tub
  
• same warranty
  
• same cover
  
• both good company's (maybe Sundance a bit better)
  
• both titanium heating element, energy efficient
  
• full foam insulation
  
• wet-tested both, liked both (maybe Sundance a bit better)
  
• Jacuzzi has the "Tri-Fusion System Shell" while Sundance has the "Rigid Bond System Shell". After reading up on both of these I have determined that these are the exact same (same manufacturing facility?)
  

PRICE BREAKDOWN (in CDN $, Edmonton, Canada location)

• Jacuzzi J-365 9999, regular 13,599.00 ("truckload event")
  
• Cover Lifter 199, regular 299
  
• Stainless Steel Jets 0, regular 519
  
• Chlorine / Spa Foundation 0, regular 249
  
• Two extra filters 0, regular 150
  
• Clear Ray 0, regular 899
  
• SUBTOTAL 10198.00
  
• TAX (5%) 509.90
  
• GRAND TOTAL 10707.90
  
• $ Less then Sundance 3,504.90
  

• Sundance Optima 12,998.00 ("floor model")
  
• Covermate III 385, regular 500
  
• Extra MicroClean Ultra Filter set 153.00
  
• SUBTOTAL 13,536.00
  
• TAX (5%) 676.80
  
• GRAND TOTAL 14,212.80
  
• $ More then Jacuzzi 3,504.90
  

SO, what do you think? Any comments from any of you? How does Jacuzzi compare with Sundance for quality of tubs? Is the Sundance really worth the extra $3500? Will these survive the -40C winters? Can anyone comment on if these prices are overpriced? Any negotiating tips?

The Jacuzzi dealer through in two extra filters, and gave the lifter for a discount. My initial price negotiation with the Sundance dealer failed; was quite firm not to reduce.... I may have not been very convincing thou.

Spa foundation will be 6" - 8" of compacted crush rock with a pressure treated wood frame (see link, This good for the tub?)

).

Would apprechiate your input. Sorry for the essay

[TheFanger]

Hi

I'm from montreal and priced an Optima for $11500 tax included .

Included in price : stereo

cover

cover lifter

steps

GFCI 60amps

starter kit and delivery . (UV lamp included with 2012 model)

Then i priced a Beachcomber 578 hybrid model $10 379 tax included . It comes with cover , steps (because of hybrid, all motors are located under steps for ease of access and greater R-value of tub) and GFCI . The plus is the bottom drain for filtration . The store doesn't recommend UV lamp , saying it's a waste of $$ .

I know for a fact the beachcombers are great in winter , my bros has one for over 10yrs and never had a problem . The sundance on the other hand don't know how they compare in winter ...

[TheFanger]

Sorry got side tracked there....

From what i've read somewhere the Jacuzzi is made in Mexico while the sundance is made in chino california

[jandowood]

Thanks for the feedback TheFanger. How recent is your Optima pricing?

I looked into a bit and found some info out on Jacuzzi / Sundance:

http://www.jacuzzihottubs.com/hot-tub-manufacturers/

http://www.jacuzzihottubs.com/about/press-releases/energy-efficient/

http://www.jacuzzihottubs.com/about/press-releases/corporate-background/

http://www.sundancespas.com/about-us/press-room/ss-corporate-backgrounder/

I think they are both headquartered in Chino California. Not sure about where they are manufactured thou.

[manwgoldengun]

According to my research, you are comparing Sundance's top of the line vs. Jacuzzi's midline. Correct? Anything in the 400 Series you like? The Optima is an amazing tub and my first choice. I do admit the price tag hurts it!!! Have you looked at the Chelsee? That's more of an even comparison. The Clear Ray is a standard feature on all Sundance tubs--not Jacuzzi? I thought it was. I agree--forget Beachcomber. Absolutely NO comparison. Good to know about Arctic. Can you not get the Sundance dealer to include the lifter? Have you asked the Sundance dealer to justify the difference? If you do, please share!! I'm in California and here they wheel and deal. Thanks!!

[TheFanger]

Pricing for the Optima was 2 weeks ago .july 19 2012

[spawn]

I think both the Optima and J-365 are very nice tubs - they were in our top 3-4 tubs when we were shopping.

Everyone has a different opinion and mine is that i would not pay $3500 more for the Optima. With the pricing that you have been given it would be a very easy decision for me to choose the J-365 and never look back.

You might find that the $3500 you save would be more pleasurably spent to escape the Edmonton winter on one or two trips to the Caribbean.

[jandowood]

Thanks Spawn. How about a $300 difference between a Sundance Chelsee and the Jacuzzi J-365?

[hjames710]

For $300, I'd get the Sundance, I personally like the cabinet better. However, wet test both, take which one suits you better.

[Kenny W]

Sundance Jacuzzi are in fact the same company. Both are manufactured in CA. I don't think you could go wrong with either