Spasearching Posted April 20, 2012 Report Share Posted April 20, 2012 Hello, We live in Alabama and we are looking to purchase a spa. We are in the beginning stages and know nothing about spas and I didn't realize there are so many different models. In searching the internet for local dealers so far I like Caldera, Hotsprings and Master Spas. Which one is a better model is your opinion. Looking for all suggestions. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spatech (the unreal one) Posted April 20, 2012 Report Share Posted April 20, 2012 Caldera and Hot Springs would make my personal short list of good brands to check out at your local dealer. Master would make my short list of brands I personally would not consider. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spasearching Posted April 20, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 20, 2012 The dealer that sells Master spas also sells Bullfrog? What is your opinion on that one? Also let me share what I am basically looking for and maybe you can direct me to what I need. My husband needs a spa for his arthritis but I want one large enough and nice enough for the entire family to enjoy. I would like for it to be large enough for my daughter to enjoy as a smal (mini) pool of sorts in the summer. Any suggestions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hjames710 Posted April 20, 2012 Report Share Posted April 20, 2012 HotSprings, Sundance, Jacuzzi, Marquis, and Dimension One are all top tier. Caldera is made by HotSprings, so it's also good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hjames710 Posted April 20, 2012 Report Share Posted April 20, 2012 I've only seen one Master Spa in my life, and it looked okay, but I know that they (a family friend) have put a lot of money into in the past few years. It's only about 7 years old. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hot Spring Ace Posted April 20, 2012 Report Share Posted April 20, 2012 Also let me share what I am basically looking for and maybe you can direct me to what I need. My husband needs a spa for his arthritis but I want one large enough and nice enough for the entire family to enjoy. I would like for it to be large enough for my daughter to enjoy as a smal (mini) pool of sorts in the summer. Any suggestions? My youngest learned to swim pretty much in our Grandee when he was 2 years old so I think I get the general idea of what you're looking for. Get yourself a spa that is open seated spa that is decent sized (just my opinion but I'd skip those with a lounge for more room in your case). The good news is that should leave you with multiple options at multiple price points. For instance, at your local Hot Spring dealer I think you'd want to check out a Hot Spot Rhythm, a Limelight Bolt or Glow and a Hot Spring Vanguard or Grandee. http://www.hotspring.com/ At your Caldera dealer the models I think might fit what you're looking for would be Caldera Vanto, Salina or Niagara. Of course the Caldera dealer will also have a Cantabria and while it does have a lounge its so large that there's still plenty of space for the kids to roam around. http://www.calderaspas.com/Spa_Showroom_Hot_Tubs/index_spas_hot_tub.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spa_Guru Posted April 21, 2012 Report Share Posted April 21, 2012 HotSprings, Sundance, Jacuzzi, Marquis, and Dimension One are all top tier. Caldera is made by HotSprings, so it's also good. That pretty much nails it. Wet test to see if the model you like actually gives you relief, otherwise it is a waste of money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spasearching Posted April 21, 2012 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2012 What about Vita Spa? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spa_Guru Posted April 21, 2012 Report Share Posted April 21, 2012 http://www.rhtubs.com/cgi-bin/reviews/reviews.pl?page=1;md=read;id=9519 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wozzy Posted April 24, 2012 Report Share Posted April 24, 2012 I agree with both spa tech and hjames. Not a fan of master. And I think hot springs are the best. They make caldera but usually cost the same so I would just go with a hot springs. Also jacuzzi and sundance ( also same company ) are great. D1s are up there too. But not at the top of my list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spawn Posted April 25, 2012 Report Share Posted April 25, 2012 I would like for it to be large enough for my daughter to enjoy as a smal (mini) pool of sorts in the summer. Any suggestions? My youngest learned to swim pretty much in our Grandee when he was 2 years old so I think I get the general idea of what you're looking for. Just wanted to throw in a word of caution to be very careful about the temp and the amount of time that the wee ones are in the tub... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spa God Posted May 8, 2012 Report Share Posted May 8, 2012 You can certainly tell who the paid bloggers and local dealers who have been hammered by the Master spas Spa expo are So the Hot springs are good spas? But look through the discussions at the number of people looking for help on broken Hot Springs... 35%-40%of the posts i looked at on the next 10 pages for service requests are for Hotsprings, a company that at best has 10% of the market share and that's being generous... Talk is cheap the truth of a trouble spa is how many people are posting to get help getting it fixed... I serviced them for ages, they are full of no name components and riddled with service issues (Duck here come the other paid bloggers Yikes!!!) Master has dumped over 150 spas in my market with their spa expos, and hammered the hell out of my sales, but i deliver them and capture the delivery money, filters, and chemical sales because we rock the customer care end of our business and have managed to mitigate their damage to our bottom line but the truth is they are a top of the pile spa... The build quality is solid. The component list is the top of the top, Balboa control and heating systems (the most expensive int he world) Waterways jets pumps and fittings and water controls... This forum drives me nuts, almost more than the master spa road shows do, The master spa is solid spa, with a great independent energy audit and very little service. Unless yer a fool who bought from an expo and are unlucky enough to have no local support then you cant do much better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spatech (the unreal one) Posted May 8, 2012 Report Share Posted May 8, 2012 You can certainly tell who the paid bloggers and local dealers who have been hammered by the Master spas Spa expo are Its real convenient to say that anyone who sees Master as a questionable brand and/or company is a paid blogger or simply out to get them but its not true. You're not the first to try the "they're just jealous" explanation but if that were true then those same people would knock every other brand they don't represent/sell as well but they don't. You are certainly free to disagree and its not like anyone is knocking Master spas dealers but the product and company don't get a poor reputation on these boards out of spite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Posted May 8, 2012 Report Share Posted May 8, 2012 Master Spas does a great job..................getting their bad rap all be their own self. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spa God Posted May 9, 2012 Report Share Posted May 9, 2012 Spatech, what you say is not really correct... The brands that traditionally get hammered are the ones hitting our pocket books. Master is hammering loads of markets and costing lots of dealers lots of sales through their traveling pony show. That is why they are getting hammered. the truth is you cant fault the build quality, component list, factory support, or the product itself, its just a high profile target. Wait awhile... Marquis, and others are duplicating these dog and pony shows soon, so we will all have more high profile targets to hurl abuse at What boggles my mind is how stupid people are, they go to these events and believe whatever the sales guys say and spend their money with companies that are based hundreds of miles away from them and think they will get backup. The really stupid part is they end up paying more at these spa expos than they would from their local retailer because the events cost a fortune to run... $30k-$50k in advertising, $8 k in venues fees, 7% commissions, etc etc... How can anybody think these are good places to buy spas... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
n1oty Posted May 9, 2012 Report Share Posted May 9, 2012 Spatech, what you say is not really correct... The brands that traditionally get hammered are the ones hitting our pocket books. Master is hammering loads of markets and costing lots of dealers lots of sales through their traveling pony show. That is why they are getting hammered. the truth is you cant fault the build quality, component list, factory support, or the product itself, its just a high profile target. Wait awhile... Marquis, and others are duplicating these dog and pony shows soon, so we will all have more high profile targets to hurl abuse at What boggles my mind is how stupid people are, they go to these events and believe whatever the sales guys say and spend their money with companies that are based hundreds of miles away from them and think they will get backup. The really stupid part is they end up paying more at these spa expos than they would from their local retailer because the events cost a fortune to run... $30k-$50k in advertising, $8 k in venues fees, 7% commissions, etc etc... How can anybody think these are good places to buy spas... If you really believe this nonsense, send me your email address and I will forward a copy of a photo I took the other day while servicing a Master Spa on Cape Cod. The metal frame is completely rotting away!! John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PreservedSwine Posted May 9, 2012 Report Share Posted May 9, 2012 You can certainly tell who the paid bloggers and local dealers who have been hammered by the Master spas Spa expo are So the Hot springs are good spas? But look through the discussions at the number of people looking for help on broken Hot Springs... 35%-40%of the posts i looked at on the next 10 pages for service requests are for Hotsprings, a company that at best has 10% of the market share and that's being generous... Talk is cheap the truth of a trouble spa is how many people are posting to get help getting it fixed... I serviced them for ages, they are full of no name components and riddled with service issues (Duck here come the other paid bloggers Yikes!!!) Master has dumped over 150 spas in my market with their spa expos, and hammered the hell out of my sales, but i deliver them and capture the delivery money, filters, and chemical sales because we rock the customer care end of our business and have managed to mitigate their damage to our bottom line but the truth is they are a top of the pile spa... The build quality is solid. The component list is the top of the top, Balboa control and heating systems (the most expensive int he world) Waterways jets pumps and fittings and water controls... This forum drives me nuts, almost more than the master spa road shows do, The master spa is solid spa, with a great independent energy audit and very little service. Unless yer a fool who bought from an expo and are unlucky enough to have no local support then you cant do much better. I'd disagree with the 10% part- but spa sales are surley regional as well. But in Hot Springs defense- one of the reasons people post issues with them- they're worth fixing after 10 or 15 years. The same cannot be said of many other brands... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spa God Posted May 9, 2012 Report Share Posted May 9, 2012 John I have seen frame degradation on wood frames and metal frames and we all know that it is down to the frame being wet all the time... so a loose union not noticed, or a poor install site... any tech worth his salt knows this is not product related... lets keep it relevant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dnepr Dave Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 I bought a Caldera spa used, I've had it five years, it has been trouble free. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BinaryBob Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 Spasearching, You're on the right track. Follow the advice of those that service these brands for a living. For 'Average Consumer' like us, it's highly valuable information - even more so when they disagree! I would also recommend you study the "hot tub water chemistry" forum here. From your first fill onward, you'll be miles ahead of the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spa God Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 I buy a pile of spas each year, After 24 years in this game, Manufacturing, retailing, and supplying the mass merchants my short list of suppliers had to have three things, Balboa Controls and heating systems- expensive but they hold all the key patents... The reliability is far and away the best out there. Waterways Jets, pumps and fittings (diverters etc) Minimum 25 years continuous building history---- obvious reasons, if they have survived this long they doing it right. There is only one reason manufacturers do not use this component list. It is to save money on the build, but you the customer pay down the road replacing inferior components... Then---- EXPERIENCED LOCAL DEALER ---- that is the recipe for success. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PreservedSwine Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 Balboa Controls and heating systems- expensive but they hold all the key patents... The reliability is far and away the best out there. Then---- EXPERIENCED LOCAL DEALER ---- that is the recipe for success. Odd, I would consider the majority of Balboa product as affordable, economical, and middle of the road... I'm disappointed with Balboa legacy support for many of their boards manufactured for proprietary purposes. After just a 3 years- some of their boards (made for proprietary shaped top sides with proprietary features) are simply unavailable. Don't get me wrong, I am a strong proponent of Balboa, I just wouldn't classify the M-7 boards as top of the line. I consider Waterway product similar to Balboa- perhaps a step down in QC... certainly not the highest quality- but not the lowest- more of a value product. And with pump prices what they are these days, I typically sell more Waterway pumps than other brands. And I've seen over a dozen "Experienced Local dealers" come and go in my area in the last 15 or so years- which is quite large. To be fair- quite a few retailers of national franchise chains have gone under during the same time frame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trigger Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 I'm not a dealer, or a paid blogger. Just a regular guy who has enjoyed hot tubs. I've owned 3 different hot tubs and have been an active member in the hot tub on line community for many years. Over the years from listening to others, reading revews, learning about what's out there, several manufactuers always seem to raise to the top for customer satisfaction and quality. Master never has made that list. Most everyone will agree thier sales tatics are high pressure, and somewhat questionable. Their prices seem to be high, and I've read several articles that make me question thier build quality. Personaly I wouldn't buy from them simply because of the fraudentlent traveling spa show that corporate turns a blind eye to. That, and I still chuckle about Terminators photos that he posted a few years ago at the What's the best hot tub site. The Watkins tubs seem to rate very well. Watkins makes the Hotsping,Caldera, Tiger River, Hotspot and Limelight tubs. I don't think you can go wrong with any of thier tubs. Hotsprings are the flag ship tubs, but can be a bit pricey. I and my friends have found you get more bang for the buck with the Caldera line vs the Hotpsing line. I've also owend a Tiger River which is now 7 years old and still running great at my sister's house. Good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spawn Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 You can certainly tell who the paid bloggers and local dealers who have been hammered by the Master spas Spa expo are Well, I guess that I am not as perceptive as some. Spa God, could you please help me by pointing out who the paid bloggers and hammered dealers in this forum are? As a consumer, I have concerns about the ethics of the company. I am referring to the deceptive, high pressure travelling shows in which consumers are mislead, in multiple ways. Yet it seems to be an important foundation of their sales approach. I suppose it is fair to say "buyer beware" and people are, in your words, "stupid" and "fools" to buy at these travelling shows. Similarly, I suppose that people are "stupid" and "fools" to buy through the website that the Master dealer created that appeared to be an independent broker and reviewer of spas. Interestingly, the Master spas were all the most highly rated and the prices they posted of competing spas were much higher than people actually paid. So maybe "a fool and his money are soon parted" and "there is a sucker born every minute" but I would rather not support one who engages in such practices. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
n1oty Posted May 10, 2012 Report Share Posted May 10, 2012 John I have seen frame degradation on wood frames and metal frames and we all know that it is down to the frame being wet all the time... so a loose union not noticed, or a poor install site... any tech worth his salt knows this is not product related... lets keep it relevant. This is not leak related, but rather it seems to be unable to survive the salty air environment of the coast. Yet, I have a ton of customers with properly constructed wood frames who also have tubs outside on their beach front property with no issues. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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