Newb And Very Confused

[bart6453]

Well I dumped in 17 oz clorox yesterday - 1/2 later got a good FC reading. Great! This morning NOT! Looks like it is back to 0! I know it is going to need a refill, but I don't see me attempting that until I get a warmish day in January (snowing right now). Any other recovery tricks?

After adding the Clorox....what was your FC reading???

That is an insane amount of chlorine to be burning through...are you or have you in the past used any peroxide products? The reason I ask is that peroxide does neutralize chlorine and vice versa.

My only suggestion would be to add 17oz again, and test in 30 minutes, record that FC reading and test in another 30 minutes, then I would add the calculated amount of chlorine to get you back to where you should have been after adding 17oz. I would continue to do this until I saw no measurable change in 30 or so minutes....or until my chlorine demand was at about 25% per day. I might keep my tub at the shock level for a day or so just to make sure its all dead.

Another question, are you running an ozonator? If so, that can contribute to overzealous chlorine demand.

30 minutes after I put the clorox in I took a reading (again with strips) and in my guesstimation FC was probably between 4 and 5

How's the FC battle going???

I don't know what EZ spa is, but it sure could be an MSP Shock.

I would seem to have the best luck with just a pure MSP shock product....that way I know exactly what is going in my tub.

Just as a guideline, in my 375 gallon tub, I need to add about 1oz of bleach per day to keep my FC at 5ppm without any tub usage. Of course this changes if we get in.

[NewB@Spa]

Haven't attacked it...yet. The 2+ feet of snow put a crimp in my soaking/chemical balancing! This afternoon I am going to the store and load up on economy sizes of 6% bleach and try your suggestion. Still don't have a drop test kit and probably won't have the opportunity to aquire one until after the holidays...which creates another issue. Going away the week of Christmas, any recommendations to keep FC from crashing? Can you recommend a good MPS shock?

[NewB@Spa]

I think it might make sense to just wait until I get back, do a drain and fresh fill and implement the "Nitro method". The thought of draining in January isn't very appealing!

[Mikey_in_NY]

If you use the tub a lot, an Ozonator does reduce chemcial use as it eats up bacteria and such. However, if you do not use the tub a lot, the Ozone has noting to eat/destroy, so it turns on the chlorine and consumes that.

So, for frequent users, an ozanotor is good. For occasional spa users, an Ozanotor can be so-so (nice to have as a back up, but you will use more chemicals).

Thanks - understood!

[Nitro]

NewB, IMHO your tub is not safe, because you've let FC drop to zero for too long. You have a VERY high Cholrine Demand, so that makes it even harder to keep FC up. I seriously recommend doing a Decon, preferably with Spa flush. However if you don't want to (can't) change your water twice you can just do this.

Add 1-2 Cups MPS, then 1 Gallon of bleach.

Let jets/air run for an hour, and let sit for a few more.

Wipe down spa (and cover) with super chlorinated water.

Check FC.

At this point I recommend refilling. However, if you don't want to refill yet, you can add Hydrogen Peroxide to lower your FC. It will take approx 1 cup to lower your FC by 10 ppm. I would lower FC to around 50 ppm if not already there, then let sit overnight. Check FC again to see what your CD is. If CD is 50% or below, you're good to go. Then do a refill ASAP.

[bart6453]

Mikey, IMHO your tub is not safe, because you've let FC drop to zero for too long. You have a VERY high Cholrine Demand, so that makes it even harder to keep FC up. I seriously recommend doing a Decon, preferably with Spa flush. However if you don't want to (can't) change your water twice you can just do this.

Add 1-2 Cups MPS, then 1 Gallon of bleach.

Let jets run for an hour, and let sit for a few more.

Wipe down spa (and cover) with super chlorinated water.

Check FC.

At this point I recommend refilling. However, if you don't want to refill yet, you can add Hydogen Peroxide to lower your FC. It will take approx 1 cup to lower your FC by 10 ppm. I would lower FC to around 50 ppm if not already there, then let sit overnight. Check FC again to see what your CD is. If CD is 50% or below, you're good to go. Then do a refill ASAP.

That sounds like a very, very good way to super sanitize your water....I would definitely listen to Nitro's advice.

Get yourself a good test kit before you start.

[Mikey_in_NY]

Mikey, IMHO your tub is not safe, because you've let FC drop to zero for too long. You have a VERY high Cholrine Demand, so that makes it even harder to keep FC up. I seriously recommend doing a Decon, preferably with Spa flush. However if you don't want to (can't) change your water twice you can just do this.

Add 1-2 Cups MPS, then 1 Gallon of bleach.

Let jets/air run for an hour, and let sit for a few more.

Wipe down spa (and cover) with super chlorinated water.

Check FC.

At this point I recommend refilling. However, if you don't want to refill yet, you can add Hydrogen Peroxide to lower your FC. It will take approx 1 cup to lower your FC by 10 ppm. I would lower FC to around 50 ppm if not already there, then let sit overnight. Check FC again to see what your CD is. If CD is 50% or below, you're good to go. Then do a refill ASAP.

Hey Nitro,

I think you mean NewB@spa, and not myself?

[Nitro]

I think you mean NewB@spa, and not myself?

Yes I did. Thanks for the correction.

[NewB@Spa]

Nitro, I am definately going to take your advice. Who am I to swim upstream against the experts. One question however - in step 11 of your Decon instructions you state to shock with Dichlor to 10ppm. How do I calculate 10ppm? Use the pool calculator? Of course this comes after balancing right? I have hear/been told that the correct way to balance is in this order 1) CH ~150ppm, TA ~80ppm and finally PH ~7.2?

[NewB@Spa]

Okay aside from recommendations to decon here is where I sit now...this afternoon I "shocked" with ~16oz 6% clorox @~6PM reading for FC was ~10ppm (15 minutes later). One hour (7 pm) later took reading (again with strip) still ~10ppm. At 9:15 reading is steady at ~10ppm. Will test again in the morning to see where I am.

[Nitro]

Nitro, I am definately going to take your advice. Who am I to swim upstream against the experts. One question however - in step 11 of your Decon instructions you state to shock with Dichlor to 10ppm. How do I calculate 10ppm? Use the pool calculator? Of course this comes after balancing right? I have hear/been told that the correct way to balance is in this order 1) CH ~150ppm, TA ~80ppm and finally PH ~7.2?

The Pool Calc will do it for you. It takes approx 1 oz Dichlor to raise FC 10 ppm in a 400 gal tub.

A CH over 100 is ok, just make note of it. Bring your TA down to 80 ppm for the first week while using Dichlor. After you build up 30 ppm CYA, switch to using bleach as your sanitizer, and lower TA to ~60 ppm. Read my top link below for full details.

[NewB@Spa]

Well this is where I am...shocked yesterday with ~17oz of 6% and read ~10ppm before I went to bed, this morning it reads ~3ppm so my CD is ~70%? I just "supershocked" again and will check when I get home from work. Maybe I got a breakthrough?

[NewB@Spa]

Before I do a re-fill would it be beneficial to pre-test my water before I put it in to determine a BL? I should be able to get accurate readings for CH, TA and PH. I am certain I will need to adjust CH up (tap water is typically ~50ppm). I should only take a reading once water gets to > 80?

[bart6453]

Well this is where I am...shocked yesterday with ~17oz of 6% and read ~10ppm before I went to bed, this morning it reads ~3ppm so my CD is ~70%? I just "supershocked" again and will check when I get home from work. Maybe I got a breakthrough?

wow, that is just an incredible amount of CD.

It will be interesting to see what happens, I would think that whatever was affecting your tub is pretty well dead.

This is the first time you have had measurable amounts of chlorine in your tub overnight, so maybe you did get to a break point.

I would still do Nitro's decon procedure and/or drain asap...unless I suppose a miracle happened and your CD went to 15% or something like that.

Since you burnt through so much FC overnight, I would consider adding a few ounces of MPS soon to help oxidize the waste.

[NewB@Spa]

Any recommended MPS? My dealer gave me EZ Spa and I think that exacerbated my startup issues. I am going to check my FC level when I get home. Unfortunately (or fortunately...) I am going on vaca 12/14 and returning 1/1 - any recommendations for trying to maintain the breakthrough (if it that) I acheived?

[bart6453]

Any recommended MPS? My dealer gave me EZ Spa and I think that exacerbated my startup issues. I am going to check my FC level when I get home. Unfortunately (or fortunately...) I am going on vaca 12/14 and returning 1/1 - any recommendations for trying to maintain the breakthrough (if it that) I acheived?

For MPS I use Pro-team's shock. You can get it online or at a pool/spa store.

I wouldnt get too hung up on brand, just make sure it's MPS and go from there.

[Nitro]

Two things. First, your CD is actually higher than 70%, because you didn't wait ~24 hours to test the second time. Second, just because your CD is normal doesn't mean your tub is free of biofilm, which can cause problems. I recommend doing a Decon (bringing FC up to 100 ppm) regardess.

[NewB@Spa]

Well I guess I am a little lucky. Got home from work today ~24 hours after I shocked yesterday and took a reading and it is ~3 to 4ppm the same as it was this morning. Just for good measure I dropped 2 oz in and will measure before I soak tonight. I appreciate all the help. I am sure I will be back for more...later

[bart6453]

Well I guess I am a little lucky. Got home from work today ~24 hours after I shocked yesterday and took a reading and it is ~3 to 4ppm the same as it was this morning. Just for good measure I dropped 2 oz in and will measure before I soak tonight. I appreciate all the help. I am sure I will be back for more...later

You still may want to decontaminate via superclorination and MPS.

Also, remember that after you soak your FC will dip. You will want to add bleach to compensate. Usually a half an hour soak for the wife and I requires about 2-3 ounces to keep the FC at 5ppm in a 375 gallon tub with an initial FC of 4-5ppm. Your mileage will vary, just don't let your FC drop below 3ppm or so...or even maybe 4ppm due to your higher CYA.

[NewB@Spa]

Well I am back...Just purged with Spa Flush and drained (it was way too cold the last few weeks). Now refilled and started balancing. As with Nitro's instructions I started with CH. Measured ~70ppm with drop kit (man I don't know why I did not get one earlier!). Added 4oz of Calc Chloride and will retest for CH shortly then move onto PH. Just as a benchmark I tested my PH (before the Cal Chloride was added) and it was ~8.2. I assume that will change once the CH rises?

[chem geek]

The calcium chloride will not affect the pH (or at least not enough for you to notice). You'll need to lower the pH with acid.

[NewB@Spa]

Added about 1 capful of Ph Down and it still seems a little high ~7.8

Should I add more Ph Down and re-measure in a couple hours?

I am waiting until I get my Ph balanced before moving on to my T/A and Dichlor

[NewB@Spa]

Well I just shoked to 10ppm using Nitro's method. My plan is to test tonight just to ensure I have sufficient. Next I will test tomorrow to establish CD. I don't plan to use the tub until I get a few days into the chlorine adding

[chem geek]

7.8 isn't bad, but doesn't give you much room to go up so bringing it down to between 7.5 and 7.7 would be better -- the TA may need to be lower to get the pH stable near 7.7 or below.

[quantumchromodynamics]

What is your Total Alkalinity?

That is the first thing I would address on a new fill. If it is high when you add calcium, you could get cloudiness and scale, especially if your pH is also high.