Sun Guy Posted November 11, 2009 Report Share Posted November 11, 2009 We have owned our Caldera Utopia Geneva for two years, and the previous owners put the spa in three years before - in 2004. The spa has been working fine until recently. In the past couple months, I would find the 30A GFCI breaker tripped. Thinking we might have had power outages (common here) or some other glitch, I was able to reset both 20A and 30A breakers and resume operation. That was then. A couple weeks ago, the 30A circuit started immediately tripping upon reset. In all my messing around, I figured I fried that breaker, so I bought and installed a new one. That seemed to work OK; power came on, the temperature was coming up. When I hit the CLEAN button, it tripped the 30A breaker. Again, I did a reset - this time leaving things alone. Temperature came up to 98; but next morning the 30A breaker again is tripped. Now, the new breaker is exhibiting the same behavior as the first one - immediate trip on re-set. I've looked at the sub-panel, and it is wired per Caldera's specifications. (I wonder about the usefulness of a 20A GFI that does not use either neutral or ground to the load... but that's not the breaker in question.) We do live in a humid area, near the ocean. The spa is protected in a solarium room with no water leaks. Does anyone have any suggestions as to how to troubleshoot this? I've taken a look inside the spa control box, and don't see anything obvious, nor do I smell any toasted electronics. The closest dealer is 150 miles away. I've done a lot of DIY in the past, so am willing to roll up my sleeves on this if anyone has any suggestions... Thanks in advance! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigDfromTN Posted November 11, 2009 Report Share Posted November 11, 2009 As I understand it............. The 20 amp runs the Heater only. The 30 Amp runs everything else. I would go into the control panel and disconnect all the pumps, blower, lights, Ozone etc. and then try it. If the breaker holds then... Reconnect each item one at a time (turning off the power each time for safety). You should be able to narrow down the problem in this manner. Good luck and keep us updated. There are some very good techs that will help more than I can on here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sun Guy Posted November 11, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2009 (edited) As I understand it............. The 20 amp runs the Heater only. The 30 Amp runs everything else. I would go into the control panel and disconnect all the pumps, blower, lights, Ozone etc. and then try it. If the breaker holds then... Reconnect each item one at a time (turning off the power each time for safety). You should be able to narrow down the problem in this manner. Good luck and keep us updated. There are some very good techs that will help more than I can on here. Thanks for the advice! Yes, the 20A is heater; 30A everything else. I did as suggested, and found that the Blower is the culprit! With the blower plugged in, it's an immediate trip of the GFCI. Now what? Is this a problem with the blower itself, or the control board? And how can I tell? At least at this point I can have a hot tub; no air, though. The jets do work. Since we never really use the air, does it matter? Pushing the Air button gets a click of the relay kicking in - obviously no blower - but no tripped breakers, either. So... I'll have to pull another panel to see if I can locate the blower itself and see if there is anything obvious. Do these motors just go bad like that? Thanks again for the tip! OK, so I pulled out the old VOM, put a new battery in it, and checked the resistance on the blower leads. Hot -> Neutral (black -> white) is around 0, as expected. Hot -> Ground is not infinite - something like 200K. So I would think this indicates the blower motor itself is bad. I don't have a very good VOM, but I think it is accurate enough to make this call. I checked the Jet circuit just for grins, and the Hot -> ground did not move the needle at all (i.e.- infinite). I'm busy the next couple weeks, so can't spend any more time with the blower - now that at least the tub is usable again! Thanks again! Edited November 11, 2009 by Sun Guy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigDfromTN Posted November 13, 2009 Report Share Posted November 13, 2009 As I understand it............. The 20 amp runs the Heater only. The 30 Amp runs everything else. I would go into the control panel and disconnect all the pumps, blower, lights, Ozone etc. and then try it. If the breaker holds then... Reconnect each item one at a time (turning off the power each time for safety). You should be able to narrow down the problem in this manner. Good luck and keep us updated. There are some very good techs that will help more than I can on here. Thanks for the advice! Yes, the 20A is heater; 30A everything else. I did as suggested, and found that the Blower is the culprit! With the blower plugged in, it's an immediate trip of the GFCI. Now what? Is this a problem with the blower itself, or the control board? And how can I tell? At least at this point I can have a hot tub; no air, though. The jets do work. Since we never really use the air, does it matter? Pushing the Air button gets a click of the relay kicking in - obviously no blower - but no tripped breakers, either. So... I'll have to pull another panel to see if I can locate the blower itself and see if there is anything obvious. Do these motors just go bad like that? Thanks again for the tip! OK, so I pulled out the old VOM, put a new battery in it, and checked the resistance on the blower leads. Hot -> Neutral (black -> white) is around 0, as expected. Hot -> Ground is not infinite - something like 200K. So I would think this indicates the blower motor itself is bad. I don't have a very good VOM, but I think it is accurate enough to make this call. I checked the Jet circuit just for grins, and the Hot -> ground did not move the needle at all (i.e.- infinite). I'm busy the next couple weeks, so can't spend any more time with the blower - now that at least the tub is usable again! Thanks again! Im no PRO. but would say your on the right track. We seldom use our blower as well. Looking at some online parts suppliers...... The whole unit is not much more than just the motor. You may want to buy it all, or check a local supply house of some sort for the motor. My luck I get the motor in and it dont fit right and then have to buy the whole unit....... good work and enjoy your soaks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dnepr Dave Posted November 13, 2009 Report Share Posted November 13, 2009 It sounds like a bad blower motor. Get a new one, or don't , if you don't use it anyway. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigDfromTN Posted November 5, 2013 Report Share Posted November 5, 2013 Sorry to dredge up OLD items here, BUT... Had this exact problem and did a search. This was first thing to pop up and was exactly my problem. Read this and then went out and removed the outer cover, then the control panel cover and saw nothing burned or obvious. unplugged the Ozone and the blower. Breaker held. Then reconnected the Ozone and it still held. I just taped off the terminals to the blower and covered it all back up to see how well it will continue to hold. I think thats it! Mostly due to the fact that as OP stated it would pop now and then but as of this AM it would not hold at all. Instant pop. Now it holds even after going through the auto clean cycle. Great site here!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
electra53 Posted June 29, 2015 Report Share Posted June 29, 2015 I have a Caldera Martinque hot tub and every time I turn on Jet 1, Jet 2 or clean my 30 amp circuit breaker trips. I disconnected the wires for the ozone, jets, pump, and blower to troubleshoot this issue. The circuit breaker held for everything expect Jet pump 1 and Jet pump 2. Can someone help me out please on what the next steps are to fix this issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hot Spring Official Posted June 29, 2015 Report Share Posted June 29, 2015 Hi electra53, It sounds as if you may want to thoroughly inspect the GFCI breaker and the connections in the subpanel in addition to the spa components. It is unusual for multiple components like pump 1 and pump 2 to both cause the 30 amp GFCI breaker to trip. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dartdart Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 Apologize for the thread hijack but I am just now getting my 2008 Caldera Aquatic Melodies Aspire reconnected. It has been a couple years since it was used (we were overseas). I purchased two Double Pole GFCI breakers (30A and 20A). I had a spare 50A Double Pole breaker in the panel in the garage. I only had to run it like 10 feet. I used the same wire we had from the previous set-up. Everything wired up easily. The 30A breaker will not stay on. I unlpugged everything from the circuit board. It still threw the breaker. Finally, I pulled the red, white, and black lines off the circuit board from where they come across from where power comes in and the breaker stayed on. Does that mean the circuit board is bad? Any help is greatly appreciated. -- d'Art Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PreservedSwine Posted November 5, 2015 Report Share Posted November 5, 2015 At the subpanel that houses the 30 AMP and 20 AMP breakers, do you have the neutral wire that runs to the spa, hooked up to the neutral bar in the sub-panel, or to a terminal on the 30 AMP breaker? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dartdart Posted November 6, 2015 Report Share Posted November 6, 2015 PreservedSwine, in the main panel with the 50 A breaker, there was both natural ground and a neutral. I ran both to the subpanel with the 30A and 20A breakers. I connected the neutral from the 50A panel to the neutral bar on the subpanel with the 30A and 20A breakers. I then took the squiggly white wires that came on the GFCI breakers and connected them to the neutral bar as well. The subpanel had the option of connecting the neutral bar to the box (with a supplied bar and screw) or not. At first I did, and the breaker tripped. Then, I removed that bar for the remainder of the troubleshooting. Do I have it wired right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Spa Posted November 6, 2015 Report Share Posted November 6, 2015 The white wire runs from the spa, to WHERE in the panel? (this was all that was originally asked, nothing in your response addressed this)) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dartdart Posted November 6, 2015 Report Share Posted November 6, 2015 Dr. Spa, thanks. The white wire runs from the SPA to the neutral bar in the subpanel with the 30A and 20A breakers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PreservedSwine Posted November 6, 2015 Report Share Posted November 6, 2015 If wired to the neutral bar, it will trip the breaker instantly. It needs to go to the neutral terminal on the 30 Amp breaker. Look closely at the breaker, there are three screw terminals, and one attached pigtail. 4 wires will be attached to the 30 amp breaker. (2) hot wires at the Hot terminals on the breaker, (1) neutral wire at the neutral terminal on the breaker, (1) PERMANENTLY attached pigtail that goes to the neutral bar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dartdart Posted November 7, 2015 Report Share Posted November 7, 2015 PreservedSwine, it was the neutral wire coming from the hot tub. I put it on the breaker and all is well. Many thanks, now tomorrow morning I will get it all buttoned back up, and see what all *really* works on it. Cheers! d'Art Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ezdraftcohibas Posted April 13, 2018 Report Share Posted April 13, 2018 HI I returned from a business trip to india to find my spa not working and the breaker tripped. I would be happy to disconnect the blower which i never use and go on my merry way. My spa repairman wont be here until next week so if i can fix it i would want to, how hard is it to disconnect a blower on a tahitian? thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spa2500 Posted July 22, 2022 Report Share Posted July 22, 2022 Hi. I had an issue with my Caldera Utopia Geneva about a year ago where the 30A breaker would instantly trip and it was one of the pumps that was replaced. It worked fine for a little over a year. Now, it intermittently trips the breaker, maybe once a week. I can’t recreate it in any fashion. No idea what it could possibly be and how to investigate. Watkins is not forthcoming with information. From experience, if the tech comes out and they can’t recreate it, they will tell me all is fine and charge me the service fee. Any ideas how to troubleshoot and figure this one out? I’m very handy and have no issues doing it myself. Thank you for your help in advance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cranbiz Posted July 22, 2022 Report Share Posted July 22, 2022 Please start a new thread. This one is 7 years old. In your new thread, post up pictures of the spa pack, the wiring diagram usually found on the inside cover and of the equipment area. The 30A breaker on a Watkins tub is usually the heater breaker. It could be a faulty heater and it could also be the breaker itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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