Costco Won't Take Back My Spa

[jtravel]

The return policy offers complete satisfaction with no time limit. Your previous post said that Costco backs their products 100%. Not true, maybe 99%, but not 100. If their policy is 100% satisfaction for a "reasonable timeframe" then what that is needs to be specified in fine print. Heck there's enough unemployed lawyers around. They do market their , so they are beholden to it. Whether you think I'm a jerk for trying to return the tub or not is your opinion.

As for my responsibility, Costco's return policy absolves me of any. As written, if I am not satisfied, they take it back. I was thoroughly unsatisfied with the spa, and should have taken it back years ago, but I didn't know I could.

Its a customer satisfaction policy that allows you to return a purchase your not sastified with,

Its not a lifetime Guarentee. I think alittle common sense in order here but beyond that

It is just ethically wrong to believe its ok to exploite the policy in this manner.

You do what you think you have to do. Bring a lawsuit against Costco if thats what you feel is the right thing to do.

[spatech (the unreal one)]

Its a customer satisfaction policy that allows you to return a purchase your not sastified with,

Its not a lifetime Guarentee. I think alittle common sense in order here but beyond that

It is just ethically wrong to believe its ok to exploite the policy in this manner.

You do what you think you have to do. Bring a lawsuit against Costco if thats what you feel is the right thing to do.

If there is no time limit then, there is no time limit.

To return it after that many years may seem like a stretch UNLESS it truly has been a PITA spa and in that case why not use the return policy based on how the spa has operated. Again, Costco would be wise to either revamp the policy to have a time limit or start offering quality made spas. Until then this owner shouldn't feel bad about talking to Costco about using the policy they openly market as a reason to buy the products the resell.

[hot_water]

>> "It is just ethically wrong to believe its ok to exploite the policy in this manner."

With due respect, I disagree completely. Costco's established their policy as part of the value proposition they offer their members. They did this deliberately. It was not an oversight on their part. Returning an item that a member is unsatisfied with is not exploitation, it is simply taking advantage of a protection offered by a merchant. Costco CHOSE to make the policy have *no time limit*. One can logically conclude, then that they expect there to be SOME level of returns for aged products. They have added time limits for specific items, but were careful to leave the unlimited satisfaction guarantee for all other items as-is. Unlike a lot of retailers these days, Costco is willing to do this sort of thing to protect its members from getting a lemon or other poor product.

It's part of the deal with Costco, and if ggsteve truly isn't satisfied, he should not be judged as unethical or anything else for pursuing the return. It's Costco's own policy, after all. I'm quite sure they understand what it means, since they even report the cost of returns against their earning per share. BTW, most returns go back to the manufacturer - it's part of the deal for manufacturers that want to sell at Costco. If a manufacturer goes under, then Costco eats the returns.

It's not unethical, it's business. Costco is a unique retailer, and their willingness to backstop their members is a big reason why it's one of my favorites.

[jtravel]

Whether you think I'm a jerk for trying to return the tub or not is your opinion.

Sorry if my Posts came across that way.

I don't know your character as a person or the real hard facts behind your experience with the Spa.

I apologize if I judged you wrongly. If you truly suffered with this Spa for 8 years and feel you

Are owed a refund then by all means escalate your case to Costco corporate for review.

[jtravel]

It's not unethical, it's business. Costco is a unique retailer, and their willingness to backstop their members is a big reason why it's one of my favorites.

I agree, it depends on the specific person and situation.

It’s a Fact of life however that some people will try and exploit every loophole in a policy and every courtesy a business offers their customers. It’s the Few that ruin good things for the many.

Costco will likely be forced to define the specific details of their satisfaction policy with terms and limits in the future.

It seems that Manufactures are the ones actually taking the Hit when a customer returns a product to Costco. They should insist on limits in their contracts with Costco if they don't already have them.

[hottubdan]

It's not unethical, it's business. Costco is a unique retailer, and their willingness to backstop their members is a big reason why it's one of my favorites.

I agree, it depends on the specific person and situation.

It’s a Fact of life however that some people will try and exploit every loophole in a policy and every courtesy a business offers their customers. It’s the Few that ruin good things for the many.

Costco will likely be forced to define the specific details of their satisfaction policy with terms and limits in the future.

It seems that Manufactures are the ones actually taking the Hit when a customer returns a product to Costco. They should insist on limits in their contracts with Costco if they don't already have them.

Typically Costco calls the shots with their venders. If you want to sell through Costco, you play their game. A smart manufacturer will not have a majority of their sales go through a single vender such as Costco or Walmart. Unfortunately in the spa industry weaker venders have thought Costco is the golden goose.

[hot_water]

It's not unethical, it's business. Costco is a unique retailer, and their willingness to backstop their members is a big reason why it's one of my favorites.

I agree, it depends on the specific person and situation.

It’s a Fact of life however that some people will try and exploit every loophole in a policy and every courtesy a business offers their customers. It’s the Few that ruin good things for the many.

Costco will likely be forced to define the specific details of their satisfaction policy with terms and limits in the future.

It seems that Manufactures are the ones actually taking the Hit when a customer returns a product to Costco. They should insist on limits in their contracts with Costco if they don't already have them.

Not wanting to beat a dead horse, but I do sometimes anyway....

I want to mention that one of the things that makes me a great fan of Costco is their business model. Many people claim that they understand this retailer, and characerize it as just another "big box store". Nothing could be further from the truth. Costco has a *very* different approach to their business. They actually DO operate in accordance with their mission statement, which says that they endeavor (among other things) to take excellent care of their members. As a matter of fact, Costco, despite the fact that their warehouse is always jammed full of people with overflowing shopping carts, doesn't make outrageous profits. Wall Street is NOT a fan of Costco, and the stock price, which should be through the roof based on the amount of customers that they cycle through the place, isn't all that high. The reason for this, and you can verify this with a call to your broker, is that Wall Street believes that Costco's operating policies severely limit their ability to generate profit.

Say what?? How many businesses do you know that could make a lot more money and CHOOSE not to? Well, in the USA, short-term profit is the holy grail. Costco has a different model completely. They keep overhead very low, and they generate the largest amount of their net earnings from MEMBER FEES. To justify the charges, they run the business so as to maximize VALUE to the members. It's a long-term strategy, not a short-term profit strategy.

The unlimited return policy is a strategy that Costco uses to help ensure that suppliers put good products into Costco stores. As a manufacturer, you would have to be NUTS to put junk in a Costco store, since the odds are you will be buried in returns. Having said this, it's also true that some manufacturers are apparently nuts or perhaps just don't have any idea how to manufacture good stuff. But in any case, understand that the policy is an important strategy for Costco. Not only does it backstop the members directly, but it applies pressure to perform to the manufacturer where it matters most - their wallet.

Folks that comment on Costco's price point spas and their emphasis on margin (totally wrong) have no idea what they're talking about. Costco follows a successful strategy of providing value. If any item, spa or whatever, doesn't measure up and if that manufacturer (Hydrospa or Infinity being examples) can't perform, then that is the fault of the manufacturer, NOT Costco.

BTW, I own Costco stock. Not because I expect to get rich quick on it, but because I'm a fan of long term sound business practices and the value of emphasizing value over short-term numbers.

[spatech (the unreal one)]

Folks that comment on Costco's price point spas and their emphasis on margin (totally wrong) have no idea what they're talking about. Costco follows a successful strategy of providing value. If any item, spa or whatever, doesn't measure up and if that manufacturer (Hydrospa or Infinity being examples) can't perform, then that is the fault of the manufacturer, NOT Costco.

BTW, I own Costco stock. Not because I expect to get rich quick on it, but because I'm a fan of long term sound business practices and the value of emphasizing value over short-term numbers.

Some of your points are right on but Costco is not doing their customers a great favor when it comes to spas and that doesn't meet their obligation to the customers IMO. Part of the reason for that return policy is their way of showing that they sell quality products and will back it up because the products most likely won't need to be returned. People don't want to actually use that policy, they just want to know its there for the occasional hiccups that any product has but they have a TERRIBLE track record on spas. If customers knew this they'd be pissed that Costco continues to put the same level spas out there.

FAR too many of their customers have had to use that return policy because Costco doesn't seem to understand/care about the low level of quality they're reselling on spas and while their customers do have the policy to fall back on its not like returning a camera that doesn't work properly. You want to praise the return policy and I understand that but at the same time I think customers would be pissed having to return one the those Hydrospa, Keys, Infinity or Tatum faulty spas if they were to realize that Costco has been seeing these returned at a high rate for years and just keeps putting them out there. I wouldn't want to have to return a spa, it's a PITA. If they truly care about their customers they'd sell a spa that is quality made. THAT is what I want, not a low level spa that I can return (and very likely may) but one that is priced well AND shouldn't need to be returned!!!!!!!!!!!!!

BTW, I just as big of a Costco fan as you on every other item in the store and I shop there just as regularly as you. I only have issue with this one item because I have insider info on what they're selling, what the results have been and what the customers have had to deal with. Shame on them for their spa history but kudos on their approach in general.

[Shaamus]

Great post hot_water. I am a huge fan of Costco too. But spatechTUO is right on point about their spas. They're playing both sides against the middle with hot tubs. They have to realize that their target spa buyer is in the $3000-$5000 price point. But the problem comes in when you start looking at what you typically get for that money. You get a spa that may be serviceable and be good for 4-6 years. But good spas last longer than that. So if you combine the return policy with the lower end of the spectrum on spas, you get what they have experienced. They sell a ton of spas at $3000-$5000 that because it's Costco people think they are comparable to the higher end models (because with a lot of products sold in bulk you get great value). But spas can't be sold bulk. It's a single unit. So you end up getting a $3000-$5000 tub for $3000-$5000. Then the comparisons begin (i.e. the ongoing holy war).

When those tubs fail in 4-6 years, most will realize what they really got. They decide that they really didn't pay top dollar anyway so they'll move on quietly, maybe even buy another one with the right idea of what they are getting. But some people truly think they are getting an $8000 tub for $4000 and will want to return it when it doesn't perform like an $8000 tub. That's the problem with Costco's business model on spas. They are NOT delivering VALUE to their members that buy spas and one of these days they'll realize it and either stop selling spas entirely, sell better ones, or ammend the return policy on the spas.

I agree that the guarantee should have some power over manufacturers to put only the best products in Costco. But I think funneling your entire argument toward that underestimates who really holds the power in the Costco/vendor relationship. Keep in mind that if you want to sell to Costco, you have to pay them $3000 to gain access to their purchasing systems BEFORE they buy one thing. Costco tries to eliminate any cost associated with doing business with a vendor. God bless them for trying to eliminate cost for their customer, but trying to say that Costco doesn't control most aspects of what you put in their store as far as spec/price points/etc is a little naive.

Hammacher Schlemmer has the same return policy. The difference is that you won't find entry-level products or non-one-of-a-kind products in their catalog. Also, Hammacher Schlemmer also pays for its return policy by charging a little more than 15% in average margin. When you mark things up as much as they do, you can afford to eat the returns. I prefer the value that Costco delivers, but I really think they need to rethink their spa program.

[hot_water]

>> "FAR too many of their customers have had to use that return policy because Costco doesn't seem to understand/care about the low level of quality they're reselling on spas and while their customers do have the policy to fall back on its not like returning a camera that doesn't work properly."

From this statement, can I assume that you have numbers on how many spas have actually been returned? As a percentage sold? You make these statements but I would like to know what percentage are actually coming back. I don't know that you're wrong but I also have NEVER seen any sort of source data for such claims... so I don't know if you're right, either. I do in general have a problem with "information" that has no informational content. For the record, I do believe that Keys is junk and acknowledge the problems with the other brands you mentioned, but your post makes it sound like huge numbers of these things are going back, the problem rivals global warming and the end of life as we know it is at hand.... just kidding, but I would like to know how much of a problem it REALLY is.

A spa is an expensive item and the Costco spa shopper (especially one that reads this board) may returns the spa when it starts to give trouble. Costco members have that option. A dealer won't take it back, period. And dealer spas have problems, too... let's not delude ourselves.

Costco certainly doesn't have expertise in spas, nor do they have particular insight into vacuum cleaners, toasters or lawn mowers. They endeavor to provide value to their members, anyway. You may not like the result, but unless you have some statistics, you can't conclude that the spa sales have been a disaster. You can't really believe they are completely STUPID at Costco, can you?

>> "I think customers would be pissed having to return one the those Hydrospa, Keys, Infinity or Tatum faulty spas if they were to realize that Costco has been seeing these returned at a high rate for years and just keeps putting them out there. I wouldn't want to have to return a spa, it's a PITA. If they truly care about their customers they'd sell a spa that is quality made. THAT is what I want, not a low level spa that I can return (and very likely may) but one that is priced well AND shouldn't need to be returned!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

First off, Costco hasn't sold ANY of the brands you mentioned for very long. They sold them for a year or two (Hydrospa got three years). But the MEMBERS want spas, because the damn things are overpriced from dealers (uh-oh, I feel the flames already) and so Costco keeps trying to market the product.

You have brands you like. I don't think any of them will agree to market through Costco. And I think that a big reason for that is that they fear that they would get killed by the returns. It's not price.... Costco sells tubs for $7K right now. Considering Costco's low margins, any of your favorite manufacturers SHOULD be able to compete, given the quantity Costco an guarantee.

>> It's a single unit. So you end up getting a $3000-$5000 tub for $3000-$5000. Then the comparisons begin (i.e. the ongoing holy war).

Well yes. Costco can't work miracles. The difference is that Costco does maintain lower margins than dealers. Much lower. And, Costco does guarantee a quantity - which most dealers con't do - so they can negotiate a better price. Am I able to get a $10k spa for $5k at Costco? No. But I bet those Calspas they're selling (equivalent dealer model) cost 20% more at a Calspa dealer.

>> "Costco tries to eliminate any cost associated with doing business with a vendor. God bless them for trying to eliminate cost for their customer, but trying to say that Costco doesn't control most aspects of what you put in their store as far as spec/price points/etc is a little naive."

I didn't say that they don't control specs, pricing, etc. What gave you that idea? All I said was tht the return policy was a powerful lever to "encourage" delivery of quality products.

By the way, it's popular to refer to Costco spas as "price point" spas. Hmmm. On the planet I come from, EVERY product is a "price point" product, no matter how or where it's retailed. Products are always "designed to cost". Well, unless we're talking nuclear weapons, I guess. Anyway, OF COURSE Costco sets a target price for the spa. That's what they do... understand their demographic, etc and put things in their warehouse that their people want to buy. You'll notice that the price of Costco spas has been increasing dramatially (as a percentage) in recent years, although they do try to maintain some less expensive models.

>> "...I really think they need to rethink their spa program."

Well, I would agree that it would be great if I could buy an Arctic at Costco. But I can't. I don't like some of the spas that are popular with the industry folk here, but, no matter, I can't buy those at Costco either. In the meantime, Costco has moved from Infinity to Calspa. Personally I'm not a big Calspa fan, but the uppermost model looks decent. In any case, better than Infinity, so I would say that they are getting better.

[Roger]

And dealer spas have problems, too... let's not delude ourselves.

Costco has moved from Infinity to Calspa. Personally I'm not a big Calspa fan, but the uppermost model looks decent. In any case, better than Infinity, so I would say that they are getting better.

Two comments, otherwise good post. One, here dealers will take a spa back if you are not happy with it. Maybe not after 90 days but they almost all will and they will also handle any repair set up or delivery needed a whole lot differently than Costco, and to allot of folks that is well worth the extra markup.

They have moved up no dout as the Cal's are much better that the previous brands carried. They are still no top end products and there prices are going up to closer to the prices a fair dealer charges. And the Cal dealer here in MPLS probably sells thousands of tubs a year. I wouldn't be suprised if his prices aren't pretty close and would be interested in a comparision to the models he carrys that are comparable to the models made specificly for Costco??

[Pool Clown]

If you want your thread to go 4+ pages, Just put costco in the title and sit back and watch it go nuclear!

[Trigger]

Bull!

Costco should be held to what they advertised. If they ment "You can return it only if we deem it a reasonable time" then that's what they should have written. If Costco wanted to put a time frame on the warrenty they should have.

Do you think for a second that Costco doens't have an Army of legal experts on hand reviewing thier ads, policies and statements? Gimme a break. Costco's main selling point was the no hassle return policy and now they reject it? They profited for years off of that selling point and now someone wants to actaully call them on it and they deny them? That's B.S.

Costco offered a lifetime no hassle return policy. They should honner it

Merchandise: We guarantee your satisfaction on every product we sell with a full refund. Exceptions: Televisions, projectors, computers, cameras, camcorders, iPOD / MP3

http://www.costco.com/Service/FeaturePageL...ductNo=11204333

Seems like they thought about limiting the return on specific items and took the time to state which items were restricted. It's not like you are weasling thier words (Ie some computer-ish product that is in a grey area.) I would take the hot tub back.

Now, here's another company that has a similliar policy:

From kayaks to slippers, fly rods to sweaters, everything we sell at L.L.Bean is backed by the same rock-solid guarantee of satisfaction. It's been that way since our founder sold his very first pair of Bean Boots in 1912. Today we're proud to continue the tradition – by offering quality products and standing behind them.

Of course, we want you to be the final judge of quality. If you're not satisfied with your purchase, we'll replace it or give you your money back. It's that simple.

"I do not consider a sale complete until the goods are worn out AND the customer is STILL satisfied." L.L. Bean 1916

http://www.llbean.com/customerService/abou...t=ln&nav=ln

LL Bean talks the talk and walks the walk. They will take back something if the customer says they're not satisfied. They'd rather loose a bit on the sale, than tarnish thier reputation.

Coscto? not so much. They want to claim they will,but when it comes time to put thier money where thier mouth is, it seems they're all talk.

[hot_water]

>> "Do you think for a second that Costco doens't have an Army of legal experts on hand reviewing thier ads, policies and statements? Gimme a break. Costco's main selling point was the no hassle return policy and now they reject it? They profited for years off of that selling point and now someone wants to actaully call them on it and they deny them? That's B.S.

.

.

.

Coscto? not so much. They want to claim they will,but when it comes time to put thier money where thier mouth is, it seems they're all talk."

We've been through this for two pages now.

Anyone that knows Costco knows that they do in fact honor returns.

If ggsteve calls Customer Service, he will likely get his refund with no further issue..

You're just engaging in Costco bashing based on ONE instance of a negative experience, that hasn't even fully played out yet.

[Trigger]

We've been through this for two pages now.

And your point is....?

Anyone that knows Costco knows that they do in fact honor returns.

Really? I'm not feeling the love.

If ggsteve calls Customer Service, he will likely get his refund with no further issue..

Sounds like he already has, and they told him it was beyond a reasonable time. So much for "no hassle".

You're just engaging in Costco bashing based on ONE instance of a negative experience, that hasn't even fully played out yet.

I'm commenting on the post and the facts pressented.

What strikes me as very odd is that despite a poster specifically making matter of fact statments that are directly at odds with what you want to be true, you claim otherwise. It sounds to me that you are a bit over protective and perhaps have your ego wrapped up in this?

What's up with that?

[hot_water]

>> And your point is....?

My post makes my point, and is one of the few of mine that is somewhat concise in so doing.

I'll reiterate. Costco is on the hook for the return and will likely honor it if ggsteve presses a bit. Even the OP, ggsteve, agrees with this. The tone of your comments seem to already be concluding that Costco is dishonoring their policy. ONE warehouse seems to be giving info that is contrary to the Costco policy, and this doesn't constitute the corporate entity dishonoring their policy. The issue isn't fully played out yet, so your conclusion is premature.

>> "Really? I'm not feeling the love."

I haven't personally returned used, aged items but I have friends that have, and a son that has, and without hiccups, not a single one. So my experience says that they honor their policy, yes, really. Do you have any negative experience with Costco's return policy or other reason to believe that they don't honor it? Other than this thread, that is... which represents an issue that isn't settled yet. If you do, or if ggsteve comes back and says that Costco CS gave him a flat refusal after he escalates the issue, then I will FULLY agree that Costco has dropped the ball. But so far, in my experience, they are very very good about honoring their policy.

>> "Sounds like he already has, and they told him it was beyond a reasonable time."

I got the impression he went to the warehouse and asked about the mechanics of the return. If he did call Costco CS, then I am wrong, but in that case ggsteve needs to escalate. Costco CS is pretty consistent in what they say regarding the return policy. I've called CS myself on this very issue of spa returns, so I do have some firsthand experience with Costco CS.

>> "I'm commenting on the post and the facts pressented. What strikes me as very odd is that despite a poster specifically making matter of fact statments that are directly at odds with what you want to be true, claim otherwise. It sounds to me that you are a bit over protective and perhaps has thier ego wrapped up in this?

What's up with that?"

The matter of fact statements in this thread say that ggsteve, the OP, had ONE negative and disappointing experience and hasn't yet pressed the issue with Corporate. The OP has posted that even he believes that he will get a refund if he pursues the issue. You are commenting, yes, and that is the point of the forum. My comment is that YOUR comment constitutes a harsh judgement on this retailer, made prematurely since the case isn't closed. I'm not being protective, I'm just pointing out that the issue isn't over, so condemnation of Costco doesn't make much sense.

It *is* unfortunate that ggsteve got the response he did. I do consider this to be a failure on the part of Costco, but it's a failure of one employee, not at this point the Costco policy - just one isolated instance, nothing more or less. I would bet that Costco CS will treat this as a complaint, and that someone at ggsteve's warehouse will get a talkin'-to. Just a hunch.

How could ego play into this? You don't know me and I don't know you. I simply don't like the anti-Costco rhetoric on this board because I think it's unfair, incorrect and in some cases a manifestation of an agenda from industry people to denigrate a strong competitor. I don't know if you're one of those or not. Some people don't like the way Costco conducts its spa business, and I respect their views and even see their points -- although I don't have quite the negative perspective that some do.

What I don't respect at all is when someone turns a discussion into a personal attack. So with your permission I will conclude that you didn't intend to do that.

[Trigger]

here's one from a while ago .I msut say, you do have quite the posts on all thing Costco.

I did ask about returning something that I've had for about 7 years that I coudn't get parts for, and they said, "Yup, we'll take it back".

I'm gald we agree. I hope ggsteve can get his money back. It's just a shame that Costco is giving him a hassle. That's not good for business.

[hot_water]

here's one from a while ago .I msut say, you do have quite the posts on all thing Costco.

I did ask about returning something that I've had for about 7 years that I coudn't get parts for, and they said, "Yup, we'll take it back".

I'm gald we agree. I hope ggsteve can get his money back. It's just a shame that Costco is giving him a hassle. That's not good for business.

I presume from this quote that you're saying that I have in fact returned an old product, and am therefore not being honest when I said I haven't?

You should post the full context. Here it is, from the original post you cited, just for grins:

"I did ask about returning something that I've had for about 7 years that I coudn't get parts for, and they said, 'Yup, we'll take it back'. I made a part for it and decided to keep it."

So, no I have never returned an aged product, although this is an example of a direct experience that says they stand behind their policy. BTW, that item was a large rollaway tool chest and it's still there in the garage, right next to another, newer, stainless steel one, purchased from Costco.

I do try to be a reasonable person and a reasonable customer. I also try not to post out of context.

And, yes, let's hope it works out positively for ggsteve.

[Trigger]

here's one from a while ago .I msut say, you do have quite the posts on all thing Costco.

I did ask about returning something that I've had for about 7 years that I coudn't get parts for, and they said, "Yup, we'll take it back".

I'm gald we agree. I hope ggsteve can get his money back. It's just a shame that Costco is giving him a hassle. That's not good for business.

I presume from this quote that you're saying that I have in fact returned an old product, and am therefore not being honest when I said I haven't?

You should post the full context. Here it is, from the original post you cited, just for grins:

"I did ask about returning something that I've had for about 7 years that I coudn't get parts for, and they said, 'Yup, we'll take it back'. I made a part for it and decided to keep it."

So, no I have never returned an aged product, although this is an example of a direct experience that says they stand behind their policy. BTW, that item was a large rollaway tool chest and it's still there in the garage, right next to another, newer, stainless steel one, purchased from Costco.

I do try to be a reasonable person and a reasonable customer. I also try not to post out of context.

And, yes, let's hope it works out positively for ggsteve.

Sigh. I wasn't tyring to quote you out of context. I wasn't tyring to make a liar out of you. I appologize.

I was simply trying to illustrate your positioning w/Coscto. Specifically, that here in this thread your are more than happy to defend costco, admonish us for judging them too quickly, state that returning a 7 year old hot tub might be inappropraite, and suggest that our fellow poster must be more aggresive with costco.

Yet a few months ago you were more than happy to acknolowged and sing the praises of the no hassle warrenty and that Costco would indeed accept a return on a 7 yr product. . Guess what? Some folks are getting the run around with it. That was the point of the reference.

I think it's all BS and that Costco is out of line to even suggest that tub shouldn't be returned.

It's been documented that the tubs at Costco are typically lower end tubs. If they be Infintly, Keys, or what have you. It's been documented that these class of tubs suck when it comes to insualtion. TIt's been documented that there's minimal service and support . You yourself have stated in many posts "Well I've got my wonderful warranty to always back me up!"

Guess what? Maybe not so much.

The only remaining saving grace to these things was Costco's famous warrenty, they sold tubs on it. However is now being questioned. Since it's been a *huge* issue in this forum across many postings, I don't think we should let it slip under the rug.

I think Costco is a horrible place to buy a tub for the reasons above.

I think our poster will get his tub returned, but only after he makes a stink. And when a mega corporation claims to have a no hassel warrenty and then fumbles it on a fairly pricey purchase? I find that unacceptable.

[hot_water]

>> "Sigh. I wasn't tyring to quote you out of context. I wasn't tyring to make a liar out of you. I appologize. "

OK, no prob.

>> "Specifically, that here in this thread your are more than happy to defend costco, admonish us for judging them too quickly, state that returning a 7 year old hot tub might be inappropraite, and suggest that our fellow poster must be more aggresive with costco.

Yet a few months ago you were more than happy to acknolowged and sing the praises of the no hassle warrenty and that Costco would indeed accept a return on a 7 yr product. . Guess what? Some folks are getting the run around with it. That was the point of the reference."

I never made any comment regarding the return being inappropriate. Read my posts again. I specifically said that he should return the thing if he felt he didn't get the value he expected or was otherwise unsatisfied. I even defended the ethics of his returning the spa.

As far as I can tell from this thread, "some folks" are NOT getting the run around. One fellow, ggsteve, is. One instance. ONE.

I'm still singing the praises of the return policy. It's a great policy. What we have here is ONE isolated, though admittedly unfortunate, action that is most likely due to ONE employee and ONE Costco warehouse. It's hardly fair to decry Costco as failing to live up to their policy when you, me or anyone else can call CS and get COMPLETE WILLINGNESS TO TAKE THE STUFF BACK. You're over reacting, at least until the issue is resolved one way or the other. I'm sorry, but ONE instance of problem, which hsn't even been played out yet, compared to 20-plus years of accepting member returns on all manner of stuff, does not make Costco a "horrible place" to buy a spa or anything else. But clearly you don't have to buy there, it is strictly and solely up to you.

What would you say of ggsteve called CS and they apologized and told him to return his spa? Would they still be horrible? Personally, I think that is most likely what will happen. Maybe not... policies do change sometimes, and Costco is not compelled to do what I think they should do. We shall see.

Peace. This horse is long dead, and I'm tired of beating it.

[Dr. Spa]

"One instance"?? NO, we have one instance, so far reported, on this message board. If you can convince me that every person that ever bought a spa at costco posts and/or reads this message board, I might go for it

So, one instance, out of how many people that have bought a spa from costco, AND have posted on this board? Ad to that, the number of people that are too ashamed or embarrassed to to tell the world costco wouldn't take the spa back

[XtremelyTropical]

While the return policy is in question, I don't think that returning something after 8 years and expecting a refund is the answer. You probably should have went three years ago when you said it stopped working right anyway. Instead of a refund see if they will "maintanence" it and fix the problem.

[hot_water]

>> "One instance"?? NO, we have one instance, so far reported, on this message board. If you can convince me that every person that ever bought a spa at costco posts and/or reads this message board, I might go for it "

First, I have no interest whatsoever in convincing YOU of anything. Your mind is made up. Costco is a strong competitor to the traditional spa dealer, and offers a silver bullet in their return policy. Even if they limited returns to two or three years (no evidence of any time limits yet) this is STILL something that dealers can't even approach. Industry people see Costco taking sales away from them. Therefore, *nothing* will EVER change their position.

Second, you've laid out a completely absurd condition, as you must clearly recognize. At least the anti Costco posts are consistently absurd

Fortunately, I think most people recognize your nonsense for exactly what it is.

>> "Ad to that, the number of people that are too ashamed or embarrassed to to tell the world costco wouldn't take the spa back"

People wouldn't be embarrassed or ashamed. They would be seriously ticked off, and more likely to report it... just as ggsteve did.

[Dr. Spa]

There are very sound numbers on the number of people that one can assume have a problem based upon the number of people that actually report it. Embarrassment and shame, as well as self-blame are the biggest reasons for something like this to go unreported.

Come back when you have some actual knowledge on this type of thing.