kengorman

Well, it's been two years. I celebrated the 5 year anniversary of my Infinity Hot Tub recently after installing it Labor Day weekend in 2007. Not much has changed over the last 2 years. The novelty has somewhat worn off and we don't use the tub as often as we did when we first got it. I did, however, enjoy a nice long soak last weekend after spending all day in windy, cold weather watching my son's football game. I did see Sandi's post where, after 3 1/2 years of Infinity Hot Tub ownership, she sold hers after realizing she didn't use that often. Truth be told, I might end up going the same route. Perhaps my tub will end up on CraigsList some day. I don't know if Sandi and I were lucky - there were many prognosticators on this board that foretold of doom and gloom with Infinity tubs. After 5 years, I guess I dodged that bullet. Regards, Ken

Hi Sandi, It's been quite some time since I've frequented this board and posted a message. Glad to hear your Infinity spa is still up and running. I purchased my Infinity Spa in July 2007 and it was setup and installed Labor Day weekend of September 2007. Like you, I to am celebrating the 3-year anniversary. After 3 years, the novelty has somewhat worn off and we don't use it as much as we used to. We used to use it several times/week and now we use it several times/month. I'm glad I didn't spend thousands more. The spa continues to run and the one problem we had with it was rectified quickly under warranty (when Infinity was still in business). Like you, I'll probably post again in another year. Regards, Ken

I chronicled my experience with the local Sundance dealer quoting $9k for a Chelsee in September 2007 on this board. The short story is I went with an Infinity tub for $2999 - about 1/3 of what the dealer was charging for a similarly spec'ed Sundance tub. I don't frequent this board as often as I once did, but I see the same folks are keeping the Costco bashing alive. Unfortunately, Infinity went out-of-business, but not before I got a great deal on my tub. Incidentally, the local Sundance dealer who quoted me $9k went out of business as well - this economy is definitely pinching the hot tub market. Good thing I didn't purchase a local spa for the local support - that support evaporated. Anyone who suggests buying from a local dealer because the dealer will stand by their product should consider that dealers can go out of business. I've previously documented on this board the difference between the Sundance Chelsee and the Infinity tub I got. Without rehashing everything, the tubs are virtually equivalent. I know some will have issues with this statement, but hot tubs aren't complex pieces of machinery. They are simply a shell, control pack, a few motors, and some jets. Sundance and Infinity get their parts from the same suppliers (Waterway, Balboa, etc.). The fit and finish on my tub was top-notch. My tub runs today as well as it did when I got it in September 2007. I'll check in again in year or so to provide another update. Regards, Ken

Sandi asked a few questions: I haven't added any insulation to the floor. I didn't observe anything that would lead me to believe the pumps were overheating. The long term exposure to higher temperature inside the cabinet could possibly shorten the lives of these motors, but this, in my opinion, is outweighed by the lower utility bills. I have the plastic wrapped the same way the reflectiv is wrapped. It starts and stops in front of the equipment bay. I only needed to get into the equipment bay once since installing it (when my circuit board fuse blew last January), and it was trivial to get access to the equipment bay. Regards, Ken

Hi Biz, Wow - only heating 3 degrees per hour? No wonder you're concerned about energy bills and insulation. My tub heats about 1 degree every 7 minutes (about 7-8 degrees/hour) on colder days. Last winder, my Infinity tub was out of commission without power during one of the coldest weeks of the winter. Day time temps (if I recall correctly) didn't climb out of the teens. After 1 week, the temp on my tub dropped to a cool 65 degreess (about a 5 degree drop per day). I would advise against the spray-on foam insulation. It may cause more problems than it solves. It may make finding and repairing leaks down the road more difficult. I, like Sandi, used 2 inch foil backed rigid foam panels that I cut to size and wedged in between the framing members of my tub. I faced the foil inwards towards the warm side even after the warning from Sandi about having 2 vapor barriers. I also wrapped the entire tub with 4 mil plastic before securing the side panes again. The plastic barrier is to cut down on convective heat losses. Hope your spa tech is able to help solve your problems. Ken

Biz quoted an email message which stated: I see that she indicated they used 2 pound foam insulation and not 2 inch of foam insulation. 2 lb. foam insulation refers to the type of spray on foam insulation and is called "2 lb." because when fully expanded it weighs 2 pounds per cubic foot. It doesn't, however, refer to the thickness of the applied insulation. My Infinity tub has 2 lb. (pound not inch) foam insulation, however, its thickness is nominal - perhaps 0.25 inches. The design of the Infinity tub is a "thermopane" (aka TP) design - it relies on the warm air cavity between the cabinet and the shell to provide an insulation barrier. Some companies TP designs are extremely good (for instance, Arctic), however, some aren't as efficient. Other manufacturs use the "full foam" method where a thick barrier of foam is applied to the tub's shell. There are pros and cons to these methods and they have been hashed out on this board many times. My reading of your post suggests that you were expecting a full-foam tub with 2 inches of thick foam applied to your tub. My reading of the original ad, Infinity's web-site, and Infinity's email response to your query doesn't indicate to me that that is what was advertised. Regards, Ken

I had archived the original Costco ad for the Sun Peak when I was shopping for my spa. The costco ad that I have doesn't mention anything about 2 inch foam insulation. The specifications pertaining to insulation were: *High-density foam insulation *Double-sided Artic wrap insulation The spa I received did have a thin layer of spray on insulation, however, it wasn't 2 inches of foam. I don't know of any Infinity spas that were ever advertised specifying 2 inch foam insulation. Regards, Ken

Ditto. Roger mentions Sandi's name and now Sandi mentions mine. I think if you carefully review everything that's been written about Infinity Spas, most of the negative posts come from the same 3 posters. My Infinity spa was delivered near Labor Day weekend 2007, so I've had it for a little over a year now. I had one repair done on the spa in January 2008 when the spa shut down and kept blowing a fuse. Infinity sent a spa technician out who diagnosed and fixed the problem. Some independent spa technicians have stated on this board that they charge the customer who then has to follow-up with Infinity for reimbursement if the repair was under warranty. The technician that Infinity sent out didn't have this policy. I got home from work when Jim from Ever-Clear Pool and Spa (Telford, PA) was finishing up the repair. I simply signed a work order and off he went. I didn't have to pay for the repair and deal with reimbursement - Jim handled everything. As far as electric usage goes, I really can't make any definitive statements without having the tub actually metered. I do, however, track my electric usage and a more thorough posting can be found here in another thread started by Biz. I'll concur with Sandi. I'm a little north of Sandi in suburban Philadelphia - the air temps are about the same for southern Delaware and suburban Philadelphia. Even in economy mode, the water temp didn't drop much at all during non-filtering times. My tub will raise the temp of the water 1 degree in about 7-8 minutes. We have our economy mode timed to periods of peak tub usage which is usually 8 or 9 pm so the tub is often at set temperature when we get in. I put my tub in Sleep mode this past summer - the summer-time air temps combined with the heat of the pumps was more than enough to keep the water heated all summer long without the heater ever kicking on. There is definitely a trade-off between Standard and Economy mode. In Standard mode, the tub will be at Set temperature anytime you want to use the tub. The downside is, your electric usage will be higher. How much higher? I don't know. Using Sleep mode in the winter may make it inconvenient to use the tub. Sleep mode allows the temperature to drop 20 degrees below the set temp. If you anticipate going days between soaks, the temp may drop the whole 20 degrees. These tubs heat at about 7 degrees an hour, so it'll take 3 hours to heat your tub up to set point again should you decide to use it. Economy mode works best for us. If you find you use your tub during the same time period every day, economy mode is probably the best choice balancing convenience (of having the tub at the right temp) versus cost. I find that Dec-March is the time we use our tub the most. There were some weeks last winter we got in the tub every night. I can't wait for the temps to turn colder - I love getting in the tub when it's really cold outside. We hardly used our tub at all this summer - I just couldn't get motivated to get into a 100 degree tub when it's 90 degrees outside. I hope other Infinity owners step up and share their experiences. Regards, Ken

I wish I could say definitively that the insulation helped, however, I only had the spa 1 month before I decided to insulate it. The first months electric bill versus the previous years bill had increased 81% to the tune of $186. After I applied insulation, the following months bills were much more manageable increasing over the prior year of $39, $39, $51, $70, and $59 - an average increase of $51/month. The $70 increase was in January when I drained, refilled, and reheated the tub. All the data (and a better explanation) are in the 2nd post of this thread here. I definitely think the insulation kept the heater from running, especially this summer. I set the setpoint of my tub to 90 degrees and put the tub in Sleep mode (meaning, the heater would only go on if the set point dropped 20 degrees below the setpoint, i.e. 70 degrees). The temp of the water hovered between 99-101 degrees the entire summer. The only source of heat was the 24-hour circ pump and the 2-hours the low-speed pump was on during the filtration cycle. Ken

I purchased an Infinity spa and insulated it - details can be found in the thread here. Scroll down to post #14. There are some pictures as well. I didn't have any problems at all with pumps overheating, however, that doesn't mean I won't down the road. I don't have a thermometer inside the cabinet so I can't comment on what the ambient air temperature is and what affect it is having on the motors. My tub is wrapped pretty tight - it has the "spray" foam insulation on the underside of the tub and all the plumbing. The foam is nominally about 1/4" thick. It then has 2 inch rigid foam, foil backed panels on every side. I used additional spray foam to seal up any air gaps between the foam panels and framing members to cut down on convective heat losses. These panels are wrapped with 4 mil plastic sheathing to further reduce any convective heat losses. The rigid panels are foil faced to reduce the radiant heat losses. Finally, the plastic sheathing is wrapped in Reflectiv foil wrap to further reduce any radiant heat loss. I then used a roll of weatherseal tape along the top and bottom seams to, once again, cut down on air infiltration and any convective heat losses. HTH, Ken

Greg, I installed my 450 gallon tub on a paver patio a little over a year ago in September 2007. Since then, the bricks haven't shifted or settled at all. A little bit after we installed the tub, we expanded the patio and moved the tub. There is no evidence that the weight of the tub had any effect on the pavers. Ken Original Install Expanded patio

I wasn't aware of the dangers of dihydrogen monoxide (dmho) until recently. Concerned, I tested my spa for its presence and found (un?)usually high levels of it. Draining my spa seemed to remedy the problem, but shortly after refilling, the dmho levels would be at their pre-drained levels again. I own an Infinity spa - I don't know if high dmho levels are specific or common to Infinity spas or whether high levels can be found in other spas as well. The levels of dmho don't seem related to the actual water source I used to fill my spa. Some have noted that well water may have high levels of iron or other minerals versus municipal tap water. My experience is that dihydrogen monoxide levels are similar irrespective of whether the tub is filled from the tap or from a well. Interestingly, if I leave the cover to my spa off, the dihydrogen monoxide levels will drop slightly on hot, sunny days but will rise slightly during rain-storms. Regards, Ken

I have a few suggestions: Are you turning on all your jets on high speed to help priming mode? If not, I would turn them on. Also, I would check to ensure that you don't have any air locks by purging air out of the lines. Many of the Infinity tubs have thumbscrews near the pumps that allow a user to bleed out the excess air. Here is what the manual says about priming mode: Pump Priming. As soon as “Pr” is indicated on the topside panel, push all Jet buttons to start the pumps. On models with a combined Jet button, push it until all pumps are on high speed. All pumps need to be running in the high speed mode to facilitate priming. If the pumps have not primed after 2 minutes, and water is not flowing from the jets in the spa, do not allow the pumps to continue to run. Turn the power off at the main power panel and repeat the process of venting the air from the pump(s). (See step 4 on this page). After venting air from the pump(s) a second time, turn the power back on at the main power panel. This will initiate a new pump priming mode. Sometimes momentarily turning the pump off and on will help it to prime. Do not do this more than 5 times. The instructions above reference "Step 4". I've copied it below: 4. Vent air from the pump(s). Do this by loosening the union nuts on the discharge of all pumps. Allow a small amount of water and air to escape from the pump(s) and related plumbing. Retighten the union nuts. HTH, Ken

and the Infinity bashing continues.... I had previously created a posting with pictures on how to do this here. On some models, you have to turn the drain, on others, you have to push it in. It isn't quite obvious the first time you do it. HTH, Ken

Congrats on getting your tub working. The wheel on the pressure switch is for adjusting the sensitivity of the pressure switch. The way the switch works is by completing a circuit to the heater. When there is sufficient pressure detected the heater will turn on (if the other conditions are met, i.e. water temp less than set temp, pump is running). Insufficient pressure because of clogged water lines, air-lock, jammed impeller, etc. will show low pressure where the switch is. The switch will then not complete the circuit. Sometimes, the switch needs adjustment. By turning the switch, you can make the switch more or less sensitive to the pressure. Ken