Jersey Hot Tub Repair

Many of customers have been having reporting good experiences with Pleatco filters. That's all we recommend now. Dave

When the temp reached 114, did you get that number from the control panel or from an independent thermometer? In other words, is that temperature accurate? Most Ssundance's uses a temp sensor that is mounted in the filter compartment. Is that what you have? If so, it could be that cold air is hitting the back of the sensor (the part that's not in the water) and affecting its measurements. You could try stuffing a bit of fiberglass insulation into the cardboard or plastic tube the wires feed through, just to stop cold air from reaching the sensor. More likely, your temp sensor is bad. They're not that expensive and easy to replace. Make sure you buy the mounting o-ring as well. It's a $.29 cent part, I don't know why they don't include it with a new sensor, but they don't. You'll have to drain the tub down to install it. Dave

Here's a photo of a thermospa ozonator from their website: https://online.thermospas.com/product-p/ap1220.htm BTW, they list it at $249, not $1500. If they really charged you $1500 for a $249 component, I'd give them a call and ask them to explain why. Thermospa is a good company and doesn't make a living ripping off its customers. It could be a mistake, or it could be a misunderstanding. Dave

Sounds like the pump is bad. I wouldn't waste my time trying to repair a 15 year old pump, get a new one. To verify the pump's bad and it's not something else, I would take the other pump, that is the good one, and connect it to the first pump's connector on the circuit board. Then see if the control panel buttons operate the second pump as expected. You could also connect the suspected bad pump to the other pump's connectors to see if the malfunction continues. The whole point of swapping the pump wiring is just to verify it's the pump that's bad and not the circuit board. Dave

The balboa pack doesn't exactly send 220 to the heater. It sends 115 to each electrode. First of all, at the circuit board, you should get 230V if you measure across the heater strap connectors. If you don't, the problem is at the board. Next, check the voltage at the heater electrodes: left electrode to ground. Should be 115VAC right electrode to ground Should be 115VAC across both electrodes Should be 230VAC when the heat light is on If you're reading 0 across both electrodes when the heat light is on, either the element is bad or the circuit board is bad. Power down the spa. Disconnect the heater from the circuit board. Make sure you hold the bottom mounting screw when you turn the top one or you will break the electrode. Check continuity across the element electrode. If there's no continuity, the element is bad. What do you find? Dave

If it's got a Watkins control pack, the heater would be connected to the mini circuit board on the left side of the pack. If it's a 230VAC installation, Black generally goes to H1 and White to H2, however both lines are carrying 115VAC so it's doesn't matter which color is connected to which terminal. Dave

It sounds like pump 1 is a problem. I would first mark the pump number onto the harness where it plugs into your circuit board. Now swap the pump plugs on your circuit board, put pump 1 into the plug for pump 2 and visa versa. Now, see if the GFCI trips when you press jets 1. If not, but it trips when you press jet 2, the problem is obviously pump 1. Is the GFCI tripping problem following the pump, or is it associated with pressing the JET 1 button? You can also put the circ pump into one of the jet pump connectors and see if that shorts the tub out, just make sure you're putting a 230VAC pump into a 230VAC plug. It sounds like you have 3 jet pumps and a circ pump? When you power up the spa, does the circ pump come on during the PRiming step, or does it try to come on after priming and then the breaker trips? If you have the Laing E-14 circ pump in your spa, it is a common failure pump. It would be a miniature pump with 1" fittings that runs into the heater. If all the wire swapping indicates that all your pumps are working okay, and the problem isn't the ozonator, blower or heater, try disconnecting the spaside. Those control panels occasionally get water in them and can short out the tub. A balboa controller will default to 80 degrees without the spaside connected, and it will test all the jet pumps during it's priming mode. If everything starts up normally with the spaside disconnected, and you are sure that every component turned on and worked properly, then the spaside is the problem. If it still shorts out, the only thing left is the circuit board. Dave

Please clarify what you wrote: You've replaced the original pump because it had that problem, and the new pump is still exhibiting the same problem? Dave

I have several customers with Laguna Bay hot tubs. It sounds like you got one that was assembled on Friday afternoon at 4PM, some of the gluing mistakes are really inexcusable. But I've seen plenty of expensive, big-name "American Made" tubs that had crimped 3/4" tubing, glue joints that were missing glue and hose clamps that were on the hose but not on the port the hose was attached to. My biggest complaints with Laguna Bay, from a service standpoint, is those sides are a real pain to put back on after you remove them. The screw holes in the sides have to line up perfectly with the holes in the corners which are made of plastic, or you'll break the corner pieces. Of course, how a single technician is supposed to hold a 20 pound sheet of plastic (ie the side) that's 6 feet long perfectly straight and still while their other hand holds the screw and their third hand holds the screw gun is quite a feat. I don't think I've ever seen a Laguna Bay tub that didn't have cracked corner panels from either a repairman or homeowner trying to screw the sides on. Until recently, Laguna Bay/Dr. Wellness/Energy Saver was using a Chinese make electronic pack which you can only get from them. The same is true with their heaters. A few years ago I had a customer who waited 6 weeks for a heater in the middle of the winter because the part was backordered. If it was a Balboa, Gecko, Watkins or Jacuzzi part we could get it from dozens of dealers, overnight if necessary. Also, all the sensors in a Laguna Bay heater are built in. If your Balboa sensor goes bad, a new one is going to cost your $20-50 and take ten minutes. If your Laguna Bay sensor goes bad, you have to replace the entire heater, which will cost closer to $200 and require the tub be drained before removing the old heater. The pumps, hoses, PVC, and jets are all common parts, easily replaceable from any dealer who sells hot tub components. Of course, if you happen to get a Laguna Bay tub that was put together on a good day with good parts, you save a lot of money versus buying a high end name brand like Jacuzzi or Hotsprings. I guess you get what you pay for. Dave

Hotsprings are a pain to work on because the sides are both glued and stapled on. You can get those sides off, but it'll never look as good when you put them back. Working from the bottom of a slat, pry it away with a screwdriver. You're going to have to be careful and patient. You'll probably have to pick away 4 or so inches of pumped in foam to get to the back of the moto massage housing. There's usually an outer layer of very hard foam, which is almost like plastic, that you'll need a tool to break away, and then a softer inner layer of foam you may be able to pick apart with your fingers. There's a plastic nipple in the moto massage backr that tends to break off. I've bought brass nipples with threaded backs, and drilled the broken nipple out and replaced it with the brass. Inside the tub it connects to the moto-massage wand. In the cabinet, it attaches to a small hose. See here: https://photos.app.goo.gl/0dPJtPOVYvDP5ZBM2 It's a lot easier than spending a couple hundred bucks on the moto-massage housing and then spending a day screaming and cursing trying to get the old one out,. Dave

Don't bother replacing the hoses unless they're cracked. A heat gun will soften them up so you can work with them. Those hoses should last for the life of the hot tub. Also, the existing hoses are vinyl. 3/4" PVC is a real pain to work with and isn't intended for hose clamps - it's intended for gluing. If you try to clamp them, you're going to have to soften them up with a heat gun anyhow. If you want to replace the hoses, just get some 3/4" vinyl at home depot. The only thing I replace whenever working in a tub is the 2" O-Rings or gaskets on the pumps. Those typically have a 5 or so year lifespan, depending upon the water in your neighborhood, and as long as the tub is drained, may as well replace them now. Dave

Your original bad motor may have put a heavy draw on your tub and blown a fuse. I've seen that happen several times. Check the 20, 25 or 30AMP slo-blo ceramic fuses. Dave

If the element has no continuity, than it's bad. You need to disconnect the element from the circuit board before testing for continuity. OH is caused by either a bad hi limit sensor, a bad circuit board, or a heater that's gone over 118 degrees. So, the first thing you want to do is check the heater when the OH error appears. If it's too hot to touch, then it's overheating, which is probably caused by water flow issues. If the heat light is on and you're not heating up, CAREFULLY check the heater electrodes. Each electrode should show 115V to ground. Measuring across the electrodes should give you 230V. A clamp on ammeter should show Amperage in the range of 11-15 Amps, depending upon your installation. If the heat light is on but you don't have the proper voltage or amperage, that indicates the circuit board isn't closing the heating relay's, which indicates a circuit board problem. If we've determined that the heater element is okay and that the circuit board is heating properly, let's test the upper limit. While the tub is heating, turn down the temperature at your spaside. Check at the heater electrodes to see if the heater turns off. The Heat LED may turn off, but the heater could still be on. In other words, assume your water is at 95 degrees. You set the spaside to 90 degrees. The Heat light should go off and you may hear a "click" as the heater relay opens. Once again, use your anmeter to check the amperage at the heater. Is it still drawing? If it is, that means the heater relay on the circuit board is not opening, which means the tub will continue to heat until it reaches it's hi limit point, around 118 degrees. If that's the case, your 20 year old circuit board is ready for replacement. Dave

I've never seen a circuit board and circ pump die simultaneously. My recommendation would be to replace the circ pump. Even though the circuit board isn't reacting properly, let's see how it acts when the circ pump is replaced. Before replacing the circ pump: 1) Check all the wiring to the circ pump to insure there are no broken or burnt wires. 2) Disconnect the circ pump from the circuit board, then plug it into a standard wall outlet. Obviously, be careful. Let's see if that gets the circ pump working. If not, replace the circ pump. With the new circ pump, I'm assuming your hot tub will start up normally and begin to heat. When it reaches 104 degrees (or whatever you have it set for) the heater should turn off, even though the circ pump stays on. If it continues to heat beyond your set temperature, it's probably time for a new circuit board. Once it hits 118 degrees, you will get the watchdog error. If the hot tub stops heating at the set temperature, the problem is probably in the circuit board logic, it just isn't reading the flow switch. If it continues heating, the problem is probably in the heater relay; it won't open up. Either way, you 'll need to repair or replace the circuit board. Dave

The whole point of this was to see if the problem was with the flo switch or the circuit board. Step 1 tested that the circuit board was able to recognize the flo switch open. It did. Step 2 tested that the circuit board was able to recognize the flo switch closed. It did. Step 3 tests the circuit board. If the circuit board sees the flo switch activated BEFORE the circ pump turns on, it thinks the flo switch is bad and should shut down and give you a FL2 error. By twisting the red and black leads together on the circuit board side of the flo switch wire, you are faking the flo switch being closed with no circ pump action, generating the FL2. If the spa starts up with the flo switch closed (which we faked by wires twisted together) it indicates that the circuit board isn't interpreting the signal from the flo switch properly. Summing up, your circuit board can read the flo switch being open and closed (steps 1 and 2). But it isn't reacting properly to the hot tub starting up with the flo switch being closed which indicates a problem in the circuit board. Here's a video about flo switches that might help if I'm not explaining it well: Dave

I guess I wasn't clear on the flow switch testing. By putting your leads across the wires going to the flow switch, you are creating a path for the voltage to activate the heater circuit. You need to cut the wire so you can check for continuity at the flo switch when water is still and when it's flowing. IOW, you should have no continuity with the switch open and continuity with the switch closed. (FYI, voltage between 12-15VDC is considered "normal." That's what the transformer is supplying to the DC circuits. But you actually said what the problem was. The circ pump isn't coming on, the heater is overheating and the high limit sensor is tripping, giving you the watch dog error. During normal heating, the heater will only go to 118 degrees, which is the maximum allowed temperature of the water. You should be able to touch the heater with no problem at all. In your case, however, there's no water moving through the heater so those few ounces in there are getting zapped with 15 AMPS at 240 volts and getting scalding hot, and tripping the hi limit sensor. The real question is why is the heater coming on if there's no water moving to activate the flo switch. If the flo switch is closed on power up, the spa will generate an FL2 error and stop. If there's no flow of water, the switch isn't supposed to allow the heater to turn on, the circuit board is supposed to give you an FL1 error. Next step - cut the flo switch wire. The part that's connected to the switch you can ignore for now. First, power up the spa with the two leads separated. You should get an FL1 error (some spas will give a FLO error). If so, that's good. With the power still on, twist the wires together. The FL1 message should go away and the heater should turn on. Since there's no water flo, it will overheat. Power down the hot tub. Your flo switch was most likely bad, because you have just performed the same action that a normally operating flo switch does and the spa reacted properly. Now, twist together the two ends of the wire connected to the circuit board. On power up, you should get an FL2 error. If you do, and the heater doesn't turn on, your flo switch is bad. If the heater still turns on, you have a circuit board problem in addition to your circ pump problem. Strange coincidence, but the circuit board isn't supposed to allow the heater to turn on if there's no flow. Dave

That is a bulb on the end of a copper capillary tube. It's either a hi limit sensor or a thermostat. Follow the capilary tube to the other end. If it goes to the temperature knob, it's your thermostat. If it's a hi limit sensor, it would go to a doohikey mounted on the circuit board. Because of your erratic temperature control, It sounds to me like it's yoiur thermostat and it's responding to the temperature in the cabinet, instead of the water. The temp sensor is usually mounted under a little metal flap on the heater. Your tub may have two bulbs mounted there, one for the hi limit sensor and one for the thermostat. This is not a Hotsprings heater, but it gives you a general idea of where that thermostat should go. In the top photo, on the left side of the heater can, notice the metal piece held on by a nut. You will have something similar to that to put the thermostat bulb in. It may be wing-nutted on, or it may be held in place by friction: https://www.spapumpsandmore.com/Heater_Info_on_Spa_Heater_Elements_Spa_Heaters_H_p/heaterinfo.htm

In your photo, the flow switch is definitely open. When it makes sustained contact with the middle element, it is closed. When it's closed, it tells the heater that it can turn on. For the flow switch to be installed properly, the flow of water should push the paddle against the middle element. There is an arrow molded into the plastic of the housing to show you the direction of the water flow. If the paddle is almost touching but has a small flutter, the switch is probably working. You can strip the wire and test for continuity with the tub turned on, it's only a 12VDC circuit and it's either on or off, no resistance is being measured so you can cut those wires and splice them without affecting the operation of the tub. If you have continuity when the water's flowing, than the switch is operating properly. Usually, you will get an FL1 error if the switch is bad; watchdog means there's something going on that is hazardous to the bathers, like an overheat condition. If you hear the pump and see the paddle moving erratically, it may be an obstruction in the line. Often, that can be air, especially if you've drained the tub prior to the problem occurring. Bleed the line by disconnecting it from the flow switch and letting some water flow out. But once again, that should give you an FL1 error, not a watchdog error. Circ pumps are notorious for breakdown. However, once again, a bad circ pump almost always gives an FL1 error, not a watchdog error. The watchdog error usually means the hi limit sensor is tripping. I would un-mount the hi limit sensor from the heater and leave it just hanging outside the tub. Then turn the tub on and see if the problem reoccurs. Keep close watch on the heater to make sure it's not overheating, which can damage it. You should be able to touch the metal of the heater when it's turned on. If it's too hot to touch, the problem is not the hi limit sensor. You were getting the watchdog because the heater is too hot. If you get the watchdog error with the hi limit sensor unmounted, then you probably need a new hi limit sensor. You can also grab the hi-limit sensor in your palm and see if it generates the watchdog error. If it does, your hi-limit sensor is tripping at 98.6 which is too low. Of course, if it doesn't trip the watchdog error, that doesn't prove it's good, it just proves it can tolerate 98.6 degrees. One other problem I've seen is a heater relay on a circuit board goes bad and won't open. In other words, it's always heating which will lead to overheat errors. In those conditions, the water will get over 104 degrees, eventually tripping the hi-limit sensor somewhere around 118. Hope that's not your problem, Jacuzzi circuit boards aren't cheap. Dave

The circ pump is a tiny pump with 3/4" tubing that connects to a heater, which would be stainless steel tubing. If you post a photo of this "thermocoupling" you see, someone here can probably identify it. You said it only heats if the jets are running sometime. Then you said f the jets are running, it gets boiling hot. Then when you turn the jets off it gets ice cold. Those are difficult symptoms to understand. Depending on the outdoor temperature, it could take days for a hot tub to drop from 104 degrees to "ice cold." I suggest you get a thermometer so you can see what the temperature is. "Boiling hot" to me means 212 degrees, but my guess is your tub isn't boiling. "Ice cold" to me is 32 degrees, but you wouldn't get me into a hot tub at 70 degrees because it would be too cold. Dave

If the paddle in the flo switch is moving, than you have circulation which means the circ pump is running. The motor itself could be turning on, but if the impeller isn't turning, it won't move water. The jet pumps shouldn't activate the flo switch. If the circ pump isn't running but the flo switch is somehow activated, the water in the heater will quickly heat up beyond 118 degrees and activate the hi-limit swich, which could lead to the watchdog error. Watchdog error could also occur if either temp sensor or hi-limit sensor is bad. Dave

Sorry, I can't answer specifically what Master Spa is using. However, for many spas there is a separate LED controller. Follow the wire from the circuit board and see where it goes. If you find a little black box somewhere, that's probably what got flooded. Dave

Many hot tubs use 2 pumps, one for roughly each half of the spa. Often, pump 1 is a two speed pump where low speed runs the heater and high speed provides more jet turbulence. Usually (but no always) Pump 2 is a single speed pump that just provides flow through half the jets. (Some tubs have 3 pumps with each controlling a third of the jets, and some tubs also use a circulation pump for the heater and pump 1 is only for jets) You said that if you press the AUX button, the jets turn on "briefly." What could be happening is the pump turns on, quickly overheats for whatever reason, and the thermal switch shuts it down. Dave

It seems like "AUX" is a second pump, and it sounds like, from your description, that the pump isn't working. Probably time for a new pump. Dave

It may be time to get out the thinking cap and duct tape. This is starting to sound like a job for MacGyver. There is a "Universal Lo-flo" heater that uses 3/4" tubing as a replacement for Watkins: http://hottubpartsofamerica.com/hotspring-heater-low-flow-retrofit-4-0kw-watkins-iq2000-system/ The sensors and electrical connections are for an IQ2000 electronic pack, but depending upon what you've got you may be able to adapt it to your tub. Does your heater box have sensors in it, or are the sensors in the plumbing lines? You would need to connect the bare wires from the Universal heater to the plug that you've already got. Be careful, use a good physical connection, don't just wrap them up with electrical tape. The universal heater has the sensors for the temperature and hi-limit safety pre-installed. If you don't need them, just leave them in-place as plugs. I don't know what you have in your existing heater but I doubt it's the same. If you can figure out how to share some photos, I might be able to suggest more. I would need to see the photo of the entire heater, not just the element, and the electronics box for the hot tub. I would also need to see what kind of sensors you have, if any, in the plumbing lines and where they are installed. Look for wires coming out of PVC pipes. Just put the photos onto pinterest, instagram, a photo sharing website or your google drive and share the link. Dave

Have you tried calling a local hotsprings dealer? They sometimes have old parts sitting in the back room.