curls

Replying to myself here... I read the Decontamination post and will be doing an Ahh-some purge tomorrow evening (it's on order from Amazon now). There's gotta be something in these lines that's eating up the bromine.

Hey folks. I used to have a Freeflow tub, and recently disposed of it (multiple inacessible leaks). Anyhow, I located a free, used Strong Spa which had no pump or heater, so I was able to use my relatively new heater and pump setup from the Freeflow in this one. The former owners said the tub sat in their garage, on edge, for the last 6 months... so likely not very damp inside at all. Long story short, the 'new'/used spa is 250 gal / 1000L. It looks very clean, and I filled it with ~250 gal fresh water, used Waterbear's method (TA to 100-110, pH to 7.6, add calcium, add sodium bromide (50g which per the package pre-treats 1000L of water), then shock with bleach (4% sodium hypochlorite = 1.33 cups, if I remember correctly). The bromine levels shot up to shock levels. I have a Taylor kit but it's got the colour comparator for bromine... not counting drops. The levels were what I would expect for a freshly-shocked tub - above the 'high' and soon settled down to a perfect 'ok' (sorry, at work and cannot remember the actual values, but it was in range of 'ok'). I added the floater with brominating tablets, set about halfway open. Son and wife had a few soaks over the following two days. I tested about 2 days after setting water initially, using the test kit and noticed bromine was ZERO or at least too low to measure. Shocked with bleach as per above, bromine levels went back up to high as was normal for post-shock. Overnight, bromine levels dropped to very low again. I believe son had a soak that evening also. Shocked again, and adjusted the floater to wide-open / max. Overnight, bromine levels dropped to very low again. Note: Water is crystal clear, nothing gross in filter at all, no abnormal smell. Changed filter with a new one, and then super-shocked with 3 TBSP dichlor, left lid open all evening (not in direct sunlight), definitely smelled the chlorine, and once it was bedtime I tested with test strips and bromine was in range to close the lid, so I did. Checked bromine just now (the super shock was last night)... back to negligible/zero. What is going on here? Could the bromine tabs have become less effective as they were possibly frozen over the winter in the garage? Or should I use a spa purge/flush product and superchlorinate again to clear any possible issues from the plumbing?

Nothing is cheap here anymore. $12 for the 100g packet of the Brom Start is about 50% more than pre-pandemic. It's readily available... Just not cheap.

Pure sodium bromide. 98%. See here, "Outcome of Science Evaluation" section. https://www.canada.ca/en/health-canada/services/consumer-product-safety/reports-publications/pesticides-pest-management/decisions-updates/reevaluation-decision/2018/sodium-bromide.html#a2

Hey waterbear... Just a correction - sodium bromide is NOT banned in Canada. It was, but it's back available again. I bought some just last week. Also, jumping in on this thread. I have the same issue right now, but it could be that my kids are now using the hot tub way more than before, so the bromine puck floater isn't set to the right level. I have cranked it wide open to see if it catches back up. I have shocked it 3x in the past 3 days with chlorine bleach, and confirmed that the bromine levels were near zero and then above 10 after shocking, using a Taylor test kit.

Where? Somewhere not near the access hatch. I couldn't see anything and being a rotomold I can't just go blindly cutting (did that last year with a more minor leak and ended up cutting a line, which was fixed but f that in the future). I'm done with this tub anyhow, it's been a piece of crap for a few years now. I can't get a picture of the inside of the cover from the La-Z-Boy one, as it's about an hour away from me. I'll try asking the person for it though. I know the exact specs and model on my current pump so if I know the replacement needed for the La-Z-Boy I would be able to x reference.

Hey folks, My 2010-era Freeflow "Passport" spa developed an unreachable and unrepairable leak. Besides the point but relevant... I am looking at a free La-Z-Boy "The Seduce" spa which is a similar size and needs a pump (I suppose it blew it's pump). My questions: 1. Since the Lazboy has flexible piping, would the pump from my Freeflow work? The Freeflow is a 48-size. It's just over 18 months old so still pretty new. I can't find specs for the required pump online. 2. The control board on the La-Z-Boy is a Balboa VS501Z according to specs. My pump is 220v and on my Freeflow VS300 board I needed to set a dip or move a jumper I believe... (Was outputting 115v to the 220v pump). Does this jumper exist on the VS501Z board? Bonus question - would the heater (4kw) be the same on both? I will keep my current one as a backup as it's fairly new also.

False alarm. Secondary issue was a bit of water seeping up the heater post causing continuity to ground. Cleaned it up and will monitor for a bit.

Hey again... Maybe not a pump problem this time... GFI breaker tripped overnight at some point. It didn't get to a warm temp and I didn't get any codes from the panel before it happened -it was while we were sleeping. Dad is going to amp probe the components but doesn't have his GFI detection equipment with him here to look into that detail. It's there anything else we can check? Likely culprit? Thanks again! Edited to add -- the problem isn't immediate. It can't be replicated reliably with pump on high or low, heat on or off, light on, etc. Which means a ground fault is unlikely although not impossible.

Btw, I am certain the gasket material is from the gate valves. Neither one had any gasket left (and they don't hold back water). Here's a picture of the gasket bits. None of the Jets had dark coloured gaskets so it's the only other logical option.

THANK YOU!!! She's purring and pumping nicely now. I'm sending you a pm... Please check it.

Figured out the problem -the pump I was sold is a 240V but my old pump is a 120V. It's there a way to use the jumpers on the board to flip the output to 240V?

The same rating and voltage. No picture of the gasket stuff. I might be able to get one later if there's any left at the bottom of the tub, but it's pouring rain and I'm not home right now. Haha ironic ain't it?! It's a convertible spa that has been running at 240v for many years now. Dad is an electrician and wired it. Pump runs high and low. Wiring appears correct. Dad is actually on his way here today for a visit so I'll have him double check. Filter was out at one point with no change in flow. Didn't leave it out for long as there was a lot of that crud floating around. I'll remove that cover on the suction/drain in the footwell. I'll inspect and even fish tape it to bust any potential clogs. Will also fish tape the filter to pump line. I assume that line is a straight shot with no others feeding in except the line from suction drain? Lastly I will remove heater tube and inspect in it, and will be able to inspect the other gate valve at the same time. All of the above will need to wait until it stops raining as, well, water and circuit boards don't mix lol. Thanks for the help. I'll report back.

Update... Drained tub. No apparent damage to the impeller, no real debris, either. One human hair, that's it. I guess the next step is blow out each jet and then flush the system? It's there any particular method to that madness? Where to start? Leave all Jets open? What's the flushing point with the garden hose?

Freeflow Passport... ~2011. I think I have old, dried-up gasket debris in my lines. My old pump gave up the ghost recently - a long time coming. The new pump was installed in place and hasn't provided adequate flow. I suspect one or both gate valves are internally destroyed, as closing them had little effect on holding back water, which meant the tub drained itself before I could get the new pump in (also didn't want to replace a pump with 40*f water pouring onto my hands!). I got the new pump hooked up and after refilling (TWICE) I have determined the problem of very low flow isn't an airlock, as the system burped itself the second time, but there was a LOT of tiny bits of old gasket material in the tub. Who knows where from -- no leaks are apparent. I have had a tripped GFI, an OH, and a few LF (I think - Low Flow) error codes since replacing the pump. So, I believe there's a reasonable chance that the pump itself may have an internal blockage of debris. Also, probably some in the lines. What is the best way to tackle this situation? My preferred way of selling the hot tub at a steep discount, was nixed by the wife. LOL. I suppose I could drain the tub again, take the new pump out, clean out the impeller, and replace it, but that doesn't fix any debris in the lines and the problem could easily happen again.

indeed!

To put some closure to this topic, we ended up shocking enough that the levels weren't dropping below about 8ppm bromine, so we figured we were safe to soak. No problems thus far. I did change the water on Sunday and am monitoring bromine consumption carefully for the next week to see if anything might have been in the piping.

Pics from this morning:

Checked this morning and it's looking less green and more of a tinted cloudy appearance. I can see down further than yesterday -- I can see the edges of the seat contours, etc. Smell is actually quite normal. The bromine level is now somewhere around 8-10 (again, only have strips at the moment). Chlorine is now at marginal levels (almost nil). pH is just above 7 (due to the acid from last night). TA and Calcuim are normal. So maybe I should have my wife shock it once more right now (I'm at work)... 3/4 bleach (normal shock)? Or another 2 cups super-mega shock? Thanks, Eric PS: Will try to post pics in a few minutes.

Thanks Chem Geek. I added about 2 tbsp dry acid and will check the levels of everything in the morning. I would explain the water as being semi-cloudy with a greenish tinge. I can easily see the highest jets but the second set, which is about 6-8" below the first set, is barely visible. Normally, we can easily see to the bottom 34" down or further. If the acid doesn't help and the bromine is still high (above 10ppm), what is the likely cause? How can I know if its safe, or unsafe? This biofilm... What is its typical impact on the various tests for bromine, ph, etc...? Thanks!

Ok, so what I did when I got home was add just over 2 cups of bleach. The bromine level barely spiked past 7. So about 1 hour later I checked and it was down to 1-2. I added about one more cup of bleach and a packet of shock which has clarified in it (not sure what chemical but the Spa store near my office recommended it). The level went well over 10 this time and I have been filtering with some air throughout the evening. I noticed some murky scum floating around after that last shock. It has pretty much disappeared but the water still looks greenish. Not as bad, but definitely not clear. 2.5 hours later and the bromine and chlorine levels are still well over 10. (note, at this time I am just using test strips instead of my Taylor kit as it ran out of bromine test chemical, as I found out tonight). So, I think the best I can hope for is to find a clarifier to make the water less green, knowing that whatever is in the water is now nuked and harmless...? Any recommendations? My wife was really hoping to have a soak tomorrow night, so anything I can do to get this tub ready for then would be appreciated!!!

As assuming that's what it is - degraded bleach - the solution of new bleach in higher concentrations should(??) clear up the water by tomorrow? Keeping in mind the bromide reserve is now definitely topped-up and the bromine tabs are full in the floater. Remove floater for this super-shock...?

I follow the Bromine for Beginners and admittedly have been slacking off a bit with keeping on top of things lately. I went to use the spa a few days ago and it had a noticeably green tinge to it, and the bromine was at zero. Floater was empty (my fault). I added tablets and shocked the tub (hadn't been done in about 10 days due to low usage) but it never went above 2ppm bromine. Today, it's back to zero and still has a cloudy green appearance. I tried re-shocking with bleach (3/4c as per my tub size) and the level went to 2ppm and back down within about 30 minutes. I added 2 tbsp of sodium bromide and shocked again... same result. I then searched these forums and found out that bleach can get "old" and lose effectiveness. I had been storing my bleach container in a deck box on my deck all summer. *DOH!*. Throughout this process, the test strips are showing NO chlorine. I use my Taylor kit for the bromine, TA, PH, and hardness readings, but do know that the strips I have show chlorine and that it usually shows as "some" chlorine when shocking... but if the bleach is bad... no chlorine? We have friends coming over tomorrow - I need this fixed today or else I have to drain/refill tonight and I'm not due for my every-3-month-drain/fill until mid-November. Would the easy fix be to buy new bleach and shock it again? I think i just need to shock it enough to burn off the organics and the old bleach isn't giving the bromide reserve enough of a kick-start to do so. Am I correct in my thinking here? Thanks!!

We just bought a Freeflow Passport 5-person spa and love it so far. We'd like to look at the possibility of soundproofing it as much as possible as it's on a solid wood deck right below our childrens' rooms. The vast majority of the cabinet is full-foam insulation, so that's fine, but the access panel where the pumps and control boards are -- about a 18x24" panel -- is not insulated. There's an exterior synthetic wood panel, and under that is a piece of plexiglass/plastic recessed into the main structure of the cabinet. Between this interior access panel and the exterior synthetic wood is about a 3/4" area where I THINK we can get away with some sound insulation. Does anyone see any problems with this approach? I was told (by my father) that acoustic ceiling panels (like on a drop-ceiling / suspended ceiling in a basement or an office building) would be perfect here. Easy to cut to size, and, they're acoustically dampening which would serve my requirements perfectly. Any other suggestions? Maybe some thin 1/2" or 3/4" styro-board insulation as it's probably more moisture-resistant? Cheers, Eric

Thanks - re-read step 4. Makes sense!