trader4

You don't say who makes them and there are different types. Mine, and I'm not sure who makes them either, are made of two seperate parts. One piece has male pipe threads and screws inside the female pipe fitting. The eyeball then goes in, followed by an outer ring that screws on to the first piece. To remove the inner part, you need a plastic key that is made for that purpose. It looks like a thick credit card, only smaller and slides into two groves in the eyeball fitting. You then use pliers or an adjustable wrench to turn the key and remove. See if you have two grooves in the part of the eyeball that is still attached. Also, if there is any part # on the piece you do have, just putting that # into google may reveal info, like a datasheet that shows what it is that you have.

Now I'm completely confused. Over the years I've seen the 10X shocking guideline used in many places that seemed credible. And it's always been referenced to being 10X the combined chlorine, ie chloramines, not ammonia. Meaning that to shock the pool you use chlorine equal to 10X the combined chlorine reading. I agree that actually the amount to achieve breakpoint is about 7.6 and that the 10X includes margin. Am I/we wrong here? I see your point about ammonia. If the pool has excess ammonia that hasn't been converted to chloramines, then as you add chlorine, it will get converted, using up some or all of the chlorine. So, it would seem to me that 10X the combined chlorine woult be the minimum you might need, but it could take a lot more, no?

A bad or missing ground is a safety issue and would need to be fixed, however it should have nothing to do with a current carrying conductor getting hot. The melting "end cap" sounds like a wire nut, which is used to twist together and connect two wires. If the connection is not secure, gets corroded due to moisture, etc, it can create resistance in the wire nut between the two joined wires where there should be none. That turns the connection into a mini-heater. That's one possibility, but there may be other things wrong with it as well. You should leave the circuit off until it is diagnosed.

we replaced the cracked manifold and replaced two fingers. Haven't tried checking the air relief filter. where is that located? seems when I bump de might be going back to the pool. is this something to do with this air relief filter? Thanks! You should probably find another repair guy. The advice to run the DE filter without DE was bad. And if you have to replace the manifold and 2 fingers, I don't know why he would not have recommended replacing the entire assembly. That makes sense because: A- the whole assembly as a package is usually favorably priced compared to replacing it a couple pieces at a time B- If 2 fingers and the manifold were bad, it's a good sign the rest isn't going to last that much longer C - An hour or two of the guys labor when he has to come back is equal to the difference in cost between the 3 parts and the full assmebly

Suggest you read my comments in the thread here from may 2, "Help with new pool" You need to find out how much combined chlorine you have and shock it with enough chlorine equal to 10X the combined chlorine. You likely have little or no free chlorine, it's all combined.

Id start by cutting the power to everything and letting it completely reset and then make sure the time-clock is off. RTFM, read the manual for the controller. IF you tell it to turn on the pump does anything happen? Any fancy one like this has error codes, status info, etc. If that fails, then why not have either the company that installed it or that was maintaining it come out and take a look? That would seem to me to be a better route than re-installing everything. Unless you have a good idea of what is wrong, you could be doing a lot of work and re-installing a failed part.

My understanding of the normal functioning of the bottom drain versus the skimmers is the same as yours Todd. That is the skimmers bring in floating debris and the main drain also draws in water separately during normal operation. Also, I'd double check what you were told about one hole in the skimmer going directly back to the pump and the other being connected via the bottom drain. I'm no expert here, but in my skimmer basket those two holes are different sizes. My assumption would be that the reason is so that if you're using 2" pipe you use one fitting, and if you use 1 1/2" pipe you use the other. Check the other one with a screwdriver and I bet you will find it's actually closed and goes nowhere. That's how mine is. It looks like it could be a knock-out type thing that you pick the one you want to use at install time. Also, I don't see the point to running more pipe between the skimmers and the bottom drain. Regarding no valves to adjust/control things, don't know where you are located, but up north, the main drains always have a shutoff because to winterize it and protect from freezing, you need to get it full of air, then close the valve to airlock it. I guess the other obvious question is to make sure the main drain really isn't either actually taking in water that you can't see or else plugged with debris, or maybe even a real plug....

A big part of the question is your definition of the word "need". I believe prior to 2008 hardwired pumps did not require GFCI, but the 2008 NEC does require them. However, that is for NEW installations or when change work is done. Only then does the code require it. If you want to check on that, a good place is alt.home.repair. There are a couple of electricians in the group that regularly answer code questions like that. However, I agree with the above advice. Anytime you have electricity and water around each other where someone may be fiddling with the pool eqpt while standing it water, it's better to err on the side of safety. Depending on how the circuits are run you could possibly do it with just one GFCI breaker, ie for the feed to the sub-panel. Also, there is no risk of damage to the pool eqpt. If it trips, it just disconnects as any breaker would. If you have one breaker feeding a 240V pump AND other 120V eqpt, make sure you get a 240V GFCI breaker that includes neutral protection. One that does not will instantly trip anytime a 120V load is turned on. Now, perhaps you can help me. I see you have a Suntouch solar pool controller. I am considering buying one for a new solar install. I made a post here a few days ago in this section that asks questions about how it really works versus the confusing manual. Could you read it and see what you think?

I went back to the store with water from today and they said there was little to no chlorine. He recommended adding 5lbs of shock to put some back into the pool. Will this be the same as buying a bunch of bottle of bleach and pouring it in? I suggest you stop listening to the guy in the store and get a test done at either that shop or somewhere else that gives you the TOTAL Chlorine and the FREE/Available chlorine. Take the difference between the two and that is the COMBINED chlorine. You need to add chlorine equal to a minimum of 7.6 times that value and usually to give some margin a factor of 10X is used. That is how much chlorine you need to do the shock. You're just tossing it in a little at a time, which can actually make the combined chlorine increase, instead of fixing it. As far as chlorine to get the required PPM, yes you can do that with regular bleach, the 5 gal pails of stronger 12.5% chlorine sold at pool stores or with a number of other shock products. The chlorine content is listed on the shock and varies from product to product. The other effects on the pool, eg what it does or doesn't do to PH varies among the products as well. For your problem, I'd probably just use liquid chlorine, either bleach or the 5 gallon pail depending on cost. You are likely going to need a LOT. But first, don;'t you think you should know exactly how much you need? I highly recommend getting a copy of The Complete Pool Manual by Dan Hardy. He goes over all of this and a lot more. Also, google on pool shocking or pool super chlorination (same thing) and chlorine lock.

What is critical here but missing, is the TOTAL CHLORINE reading. Either the pool store did not give it to you or else you didn't post it. There are two kinds of chlorines, free and combined. Free is what you want because it is active and kills bacteria. Combined chlorine is chlorine that is bound up as chloramines and isn't available as a sanitzer. Combined chlorine = total chlorine - free chlorine. To get rid of the combined chlorine, you shock it. The amount of shock must have sufficient chlorine to equal at least 7.6 times the amount of combined chlorine. For margin, a factor of 10 times is usually used. So, if you had total chlorine of 4, free chlorine of .5, you have combined of 3.5 and would need to add chlorine equal to 35ppm. Further, that chlorine should be added all at once, as if you do it incrementally, it can actually make things worse. With a pool that is under control, people usually just toss a given amount of shock in once a week or so which is OK because the combined chlorine is low and it's sufficient to achieve the correct ratio and eliminate the chloramines. But with an unknown pool full of gunk, you definitely want to figure out the correct amount of shock before you add any more.

All good points/questions. Fortunate for me,I don't work for Pentair. Hey, i didn't see if you posted earlier but, does this Suntouch work OK? I don't know if it works OK or not. I am looking at buying it for adding solar heat to an existing pool and that's why I wanted to know how it works. It looks like it's been out for about 2 years and lots of places online are selling them. However, it can also be used as a general pool/spa controller, so no way of knowing how many are used for solar installations. I can tell you one thing. While this could be perfect for adding solar to an existing pool, there is no way I would use this for general control of the pool pumps, spa, lights, waterfalls, etc that it can also do. It has a very basic small LCD display and a half dozen or so buttons with vague lables. IMO, it would be like trying to run a nuclear reactor from a digital watch.

That's for sure in this case.

Hello, all. Occasional visitor here where I've found lots of good and useful info. Now I have a question that hopefully someone with some experience with the Pentair SunTouch Solar controller can answer. I'm looking at using one of these to add solar heat to a pool. The problem is, I've read the manual front to back and IMO, a lot of the solar mode operation explanation is either wrong or makes no sense. The unit comes with 2 sensors, one for location in the pool water line to measure pool temp and the other that goes near the solar collector to measure the temp available at the panels. Here is how I would expect this should work. There are two factors. First, is the pool below the desired set temp? If so, then we would like solar heat. Next, is the temp at the solar sensor high enough above the pool water sensor temp to make it worthwhile to turn on solar heat and if it is, then it activates the valve and turns on the pump. Further in the solar mode in this contoller, there is the ability to set the turn-on differntial from 3 to 9 degrees and the turn-off differential from to 2 to 5 degrees. To me this would logically be the temp differential BETWEEN THE POOL WATER SENSOR AND THE SOLAR SENSOR temps. Meaning, if I set the turn on diff to 6 and turn off diff to 3, the solar sensor would have to be 6 degrees higher than the water sensor to start heating. And then it would stay on until the solar sensor is 3 degrees or LESS above the water temp, at which point it would shut off. All this assumes of course that the pool water temp is below the set temp, ie the pool needs heat. Here's the problem. The manual makes a whole bunch of statements that to me seem either totally wrong or at least make no sense. Some examples: 1 - Solar heat is available when the set point water temp is higher than the solar temp and the solar temp is higher than the actual water temp. 2 - Solar heat is not available when the set point water temp is lower than the solar temp and the solar temp is lower than the actual water temp. 3 - If "start" differential is set to 3deg, this ensures that the solar collector water temp has to deviate by at least 3deg to the specified set point temp before it switches on. 4 - Stop differential sets how close to the target set point temperature to switch off solar heat. I was on the phone with tech support today and couldn't get past #1 above. We read it together from the manual and he insisted it's absolutely correct and that's how it works. Maybe he's right and someone here can enlighten me. Curiously, according to the LX220 manual, which I believe was the previous Pentair product, that works like I think it should work, but it has a fixed turn on differential of 5 deg between the pool water sensor and the solar sensor. So, does anybody here have one of these and/or really know how it works in solar mode? This really looks like the right product for what I want to do and I'd like to buy it, but only if it works like I think it should. I'm particularly interested in what the differential settings actually relate to. Here's the link to the manual if you want to take a look. The relevant stuff starts on page 4 of the manual. http://www.pentairpool.com/pdfs/suntouchUG.pdf TIA for any help.