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Everything posted by PoolGuyNJ

  1. We need a lot more info about the pool. A 1.5 ppm of combined chlorine (2 TC - .5 FC) is way too much CC. 100 ppm of CYA is too much, especially in the NE. A 0 ppm TC value means you aren't adding enough frequently enough or you're not using a chlorine elevator. Scott
  2. There are no fiberglass pools 10' deep. That would make them too long and too wide to travel on a truck. The main reason they have a lower chemical usage is they are smaller. It's that simple. The gel coat on them does wear out. Nothing will make it look new again though some paints will make a markedly improved appearance over a work shell's existing. It's a lot of work though. Liner and plaster pools can go to 10' deep. Remember though, with the added depth, the width and length of the bottom and slope increase. You'll get just as wet regardless of the pool, even a kiddy pool. Wet is wet. A plaster pool has a little more care needed than a liner pool in most cases due to the need to watch the calcium level. With liner pools, this is usually only needed in areas of hard water but for all plastered pools, the calcium is the main ingredient in the cement used and, with plain plasters and products like Diamond Brite, the marble dust in them is also largely calcium. Water, being the "Universal Solvent", when a pool is incorrectly balanced, can either etch or form scale if the pH balance is off. Not a big deal as testing and corrective action are pretty simple. Different plasters have different life spans. Plain plaster lasts about 10 years and is then redone. High aggregate finishes, such as Pebble Tech or Wet Edge Pearl Matrix have live spans over 25 years. I have never heard of either being replaced due to wear. They cost more but when amortized over the same life span, they come out less costly. Liners by me typically last about 10 to 12 years and are then replaced. Costs will vary for each by location. An apples to apples comparison doesn't exist as every build or install is different. As I have said before, beware of low bids. That usually winds up costing you more somewhere. Scott Scott
  3. Likely to be the filter's belly ring, the o-ring between the halves. Scott
  4. I would think a 1 HP would be fine. No real need that I see going to a 1.5 HP pump. I don't build pools,. I just fix them. As such, I have no preference for the wall brand. Ask the local township engineer what the local soil conditions are. It sounds like clay by your post hole digging experiences and precautions may need to be taken, especially if there are drainage issues in addition to or as a result of the build. The existing soil may not be a suitable bed and would need additional measures such as gravel added, the use of other than dig spoils for back fill and french drains. You might need a soils engineer's report. They cost but can save you worse expenses later if precautions weren't in place and were needed. A pool this sized will need 3 Color Logic fixtures. I can't comment on the other fixtures without knowing what they are. Remember, if it isn't in writing, it wasn't said. Scott
  5. All three liner manufacturers have 20 and 28 mil liners. Walls and floors are typically 15% more for each. FYI, thicker doesn't last longer but rather is used with concrete or rusted walls. I agree with LegsOnEarth that PB#2 shows more promise. An S310 is a better sized filter. The 3/4 and 244T from PB#1 is too small, as is the 1.5 pipe. You need more than 1 skimmer. if the surface area is 1400 sq feet. . Scott
  6. I really think you'll be better served bringing in a vinyl liner kit. I have little confidence in a filled block wall. You'd need #4 rebar, 12" on center or better and the side walls of the block to be able to support the pressure without crumbing the cement holding their aggregate. The block used in construction here in the North East are called cinder blocks and contain a lot of aggregate. If you have the same type, they are great when pressing weight from above but, even when filled, the actual block may deteriorate because of the pressure. A denser cement block with more cement and a finer aggregate will be needed and a 10-12" bond beam around the perimeter built. The floor almost has to be poured. A 6" thick floor with #3 rebar on 12" centers is the bottom line with 4000 psi concrete. Those rebars need to climb up the wall and block be inserted when building the wall. Seems the idea of laying horizontal rebar more than every row would exceed the minimum strength I see needed. Dobies will be needed to keep the rebar in the concrete. Any in-ground kit will need excavation. With a liner kit, you can over dig the hole some for walking room. to put in plumbing. I'd use either a sand bottom or 2" cement with chicken wire mesh reinforcement, assuming a sandy bottom. Somehow, I can't see a clay bed being there. Back filling is easy with sand plentiful. It'll come on pallets and boxes. Just know what depths you want so the liner gets made right. It's just so much faster and easier to put a liner pool in your location. Scott
  7. Ozone only? Hello algae. Hello person to person transmission of infections and the like. Hello to an increase in bather wastes in the pool. Ozone is not a primary sanitizer. It can only augment it. If someone is touting otherwise, either the person representing it that way has no clue how and or why it might work or the snake oil salesman can safely be given. AFAIK, ozone has no effect on algae. It will grow. Ozone has a short half life. It breaks down quickly. therefore, there can not be a useful residual in the pool. It won't last long enough. It takes up to five turns of the water volume to filter all the water in most pools. Since the ozone injection point is normally on the suction side of a pump, it takes an equal amount of water to pass (five turns worth) to potentially (the ozone molecules may miss the target since the concentration is low) oxidize the water. With a residual sanitizer in the pool's water, chances are that anything that needs oxidizing, such as sweat and tanning lotions, has already been gotten at before it hits the ozonated water at the pump. Just for argument's sake, lets shut the pump off at sundown. In an hour or so, all the ozone will be gone. In a B&B with a pool, what are the chances someone will want to swim one night, before bed. Sweat, tanning lotions, dead skin, and any other form of bather waste is now in the pool. And for how long? Let's say it rains. Rain can carry algae spores. You'd soon have an algae bloom in the pool and ozone injection couldn't do anything about it. Scott
  8. Here's the Wiki on mud jacking, aka slab jacking: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Concrete_leveling A number of holes are core drilled in the floor and slope. Fill one with the desired amount, reseal the core with hydraulic cement. Continue as needed to right the ship, so to speak. Sometimes cheaper than busting out and rebuilding a gunite pool bottom. Building up a bond beam and replacing the skimmers so they are at the right height may not keep it from happening again. Scott
  9. You are going to be pretty limited in your selection of a fiberglass by requiring an 8' depth. If by a good diving board, you mean a 1 meter spring board, you're looking at 10 to 12' of depth and longer and wider slopes for the hopper. For the rest of us, we have non-spring loaded boards. Very little bounce. Pool installers need warmer weather to work so the more Southern states can be priced more competitively. Don't get fixated on cheaper. You'll get what you paid for but that may not be what you need. Scott Scott
  10. How are you going to prevent it from doing it again after it's fixed? That's the purpose of the report, It'll say if drainage is needed and where it is suggested. Lets say it was just mud jacked level. Two years of normal to heavy rain soak the ground and cause any clay finding the moisture and swell. Two years of dryer than normal conditions and the swollen clay has now shrunk. This time, the deep end sinks. Putting drainage where needed keeps the moisture away. Digging out a new bed and refilling it with something more suitable or mud jacking services aren't cheap. Doing it twice? Nah. Scott
  11. An indoor commercial pool like a Y's competition pool or a residential outdoor 16x32, it wouldn't matter much for many. Yes, salt can and does accumulate, but particularly with indoor facilities. Then would be an ideal time to install a salt cell.The important thing is that the salt contains chlorine. Whether its magnesium, potassium, or sodium, all work. The coating on the cell may benefit by being different as I am not sure but I don't think it's lye that is produced as a standard by product when potassium or magnesium salts are used. Therefore, the ruthinium oxide coating on the titanium blades may be useless. Damages what internals? Cheaply made metal parts? If there are micro-currents in the water, the pool isn't well bonded or chemically unkempt (unlikely) and doesn't have a sacrificial anode or two.
  12. NO ALGAECIDE, especially ones containing copper. Algaecides don't kill, they help prevent. Chlorine kills. Shock it to start killing the algae. Hit it with 5 pounds of cal-hypo granular, three in one shot in the morning and 2 more later in the day.. Lithium is quite expensive and since you have a low CH, the cal-hypo will add some for you. Its cheaper too. Run the filter 24/7 for now. Lets kill the algae first. After 24 or so, it relaxes its hold on the surface it adhered to and makes vacuuming easier. The chlorine level will also have dropped. Don't brush! That would put everything in suspension and possibly make particles that are too small to be easily filtered.. Save that task until you are close to finished. Vacuum to waste. Start at the shallow end. Move fairly quickly and don't try to be precise. Lets get the mass majority first before you run the water too low. This may take more than one session. Your hose to fill the pool should be on. I'll bet the pH is about 7 now. You added quite a bit of acid. If you pool is as swamped as I think it is, getting the pH, Alk, and CH levels will wait until you get the algae out. Vacuuming to waste will just blow out any chems added so don't worry over them yet. Scott
  13. First, you'll need a soils report from a soils engineer. If the pool raised or lowered, it means the soil moved. A pitched shell usually means expansive soil (clay usually) as a bed for the pool to rest on but can also be caused by creeping soil. Scott
  14. A bilge pump won't do it AFAIK. Bilge pumps need a sump to sit in and are not self priming. That mean digging a pit so it can get enough water from the suction plumbing via gravity/air pressure. It would also need to move at least 40 gallons a minute for a number of hours. That is a lot of water to move and that costs wattage, at least a 1/2 HP (746 Watts = 1 HP) plus the motor's Service Factor multiplier. Getting enough water to flow into a sump without suction will mean a lot of added complexity. Figure a 1/2 HP motor with a 1.5 SF rating would draw 4-2/3 amps at 120VAC or 2-1/3 at 240VAC. It also would make manually vacuuming a pool very difficult. Figure a salt cell is good for about 500 watts. A pool is not built with single story structure strength in mind. The pressure of the water trying to escape in all directions except up, and any land movement is likely to cause the shell to crack unless there is a rebar mesh, encased in cement, supporting the shell. The concrete needs to be at least 3500 psi rated and at least 6" thick on the floor and thicker on the walls, especially the top foot which needs to be 12" and with extra rebar used to form the bond beam. I don't think blocks will do it. They are great for supporting a vertical structure but the forces exerted for a pool are not just vertical. They aren't made for that. Pool lights are flood type in nature, not spots. The fixtures are also water proof and meant to be submerged. In order to get enough lumens in the water, higher wattage fixtures are needed. It's one thing to illuminate an air space and quite another to illuminate a water space. Scott
  15. If the motor isn't too old, I'd just put a smaller, one HP impeller and seal set for the pump and the heater warrants a 400,000 BTU unit because of the surface area of the pool. Scott
  16. Yes, location matters. So will the type of pool construction (liner, concrete, or fiberglass), features desired, and how much you want/are able to do yourself.. A $40,000 pool isn't likely to get you everything you want but it'll be close. Size, decking, fencing, etc.... make this a huge variable too. Scott
  17. Nope. No real need to bump up the plumbing line size. What I do see is a too small a heater and too big a motor for your pool. I also suspect the pressure gauge is bad or there isn't enough sand in the filter or the sand has channeled (not likely though possible). I would expect 16-18 PSI with a clean filter system of this size. Scott
  18. Do not use a stainless brush on a painted concrete, vinyl liner or fiberglass pools. Scott
  19. The ozone has a large profit margin. While ozone is good for commercial outdoor needs, indoors, it can, if not properly sized and the room not properly ventilated, can create serious breathing issues, especially for youths and young adults. For a well designed residential indoor pool, just a salt cell or the roll-a-chem liquid feeder is usually fine. There is no need for anything to augment it. The use of magnesium chloride may be harder to test for (not sure if strips work) and is significantly more expensive (and more profit). Plain sodium chloride is suggested. Use a cartridge filter and there isn't any pool water from backwashing needed. Properly sized, I doubt it would need cleaning more than once or twice a year. Being indoors will keep a very large percentage of the dirt a pool normally accumulates out. Your outdoor environment can't be effected by salt water from the pool unless you drain the pool. Scott
  20. I have heard a lot of negative things about saltcells.com screwing people over. An auto-fill usually has a port in the pool that leads to a small vessel with a toilet tank float based water valve. I wonder if the hose bib for the old slide is on the same line as the auto-fill's supply. We'll do the best we can to help you but please understand that there may be a language barrier. The grammar used leads me to think the English is not your native language.
  21. First, ionizers don't/won't cut it, ever. At 130' from the beach, the water table will likely be high. This will keep at least some of the pool above the earth. That will mean thicker walls or raised earth. I am not a fan of using filled blocks. The blocks usually aren't as strong as a poured wall and floor. The use of forms for the walls with reinforcement from a rebar mesh and a vibrated pour will provide an air space free wall structure that is strong enough. Hand mixed? That's a LOT of labor, even with cement trucks and a wheel barrow brigade. Consider a fiberglass pool if you have a way to carry it like a crane or track hoe. A liner pool with enough back fill or an above ground pool might be a better option. An above ground, with a deck around it can look just as nice. I am assuming the US standards for the construction of a commercial pool are not needed. Are there any construction requirements the local government maintains must be met? The use of sea water is NOT recommended. There are a lot of electrolysis related concerns and special equipment needed. Operation, spare parts, and chemistry will present a lot of problems you don't want to go through. The use of fresh water is strongly encouraged. With a properly maintained pool, you will minimize water usage. While there are sea water capable systems, they are awfully expensive. Sea water has about 40,000 ppm of salt. A salt water chlorine generator will only need 3500 +/- 500 ppm in the water. At 3500 ppm, regular residential gear would work fine. That will minimize the need for bringing in other chlorine sources such as cal-hypo, dichlor, unscented bleach or chlorinating liquid (just a stronger bleach). The cell will handle most of your daily chlorine needs but you will still need to raise the level for chlorine periodically and balance the water with some dry goods like sodium bicarbonate (aka baking soda) and others. Have a weather proof storage room for their safe keeping. The amount of space will depend on the pool size, bather load, and length of time between resupplies. Expect about a 3000 watt demand at 240 VAC (50/60 Hz) on the solar array/battery storage. This gives you a little head room for the pump, salt cell and lights (LEDs use 90 watts max for each fixture and usually less vs. up to 500 each for a white incandescent fixture). Tropical storms and cyclones are the biggest issue. They can blow in debris, dilute the chems in the water, and bless you with algae. The need for on site spare parts is suggested for timely repairs. Watching your pool go green because the motor failed on the pump and waiting two weeks for a spare to be shipped (and that's a rush job too!) is also troublesome. As I said before, having a weather tight storage facility will be important. Scott
  22. A spray won't be enough to degrease. I use a clean garbage can and a about a half a box of cheap powdered dishwasher detergent. This solution also is useful for soaking DE panels. I generally use an 8 hour schedule as a minimum The body excretes skin oil so even if you don't use lotions for tanning or bug repellents, there is still going to be oils that are absorbed by the pleated material. Bather load plays into this too. What others use may be unknown. Cleaning weekly will actually shorten a cartridge's life and keep it from filtering as well as it can. For a pool filter, this can also cause other parts such as the middle O-ring and clamp to wear prematurely. If it's really needed weekly due to the environment, the cartridge is undersized. For many spas, the threads that hold the element in place can wear prematurely and the plastic top, bottom, and any bands around the middle of the cartridge meant to separate the pleats. Unless you have hard water, acid baths aren't needed normally. A 4 -1 water acid solution for a short spell will dissolve any leftover calcium. If it needs to be done, do it after degreasing or that becomes a non-removable goo and the cartridge is toast. If it is needed more than quarterly, your CSI is too positive. Scott
  23. I would keep a close eye on it. If it doesn't grow, its not algae. It would just be an organic stain that will fade with exposure to chlorinated water.. Scott
  24. Gaskets need to be replaced periodically. That isn't an unusual event. Blisters and bulges are a different matter. Bulges can form with the movement of the earth. When this happened, the gel coat may have cracked slightly. That let water get to the fiberglass caused it to begin to break down. Scott
  25. Pool Clown is very likely correct in that the HI error is a problem with the coolant in the compressor. My point about downsizing the pump is also valid in that the 24" sand filter is both only 1.5" internally and the velocity and volume of the water through a 2 HP Super Pump is too much. An external heater bypass and flow meter wouldn't be needed if this system were properly sized to begin with. Inch and a half pipes can't move enough water to overcome the the internal bypass of a heater or heat pump with a residential pool pump. Scott
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