Crack In New In Ground Vinyl Liner Pool...normal?

[NJNJ]

Hello,

I just had a new in ground vinyl liner pool installed (4/2010 & still not done) and a big sinkhole developed in the corner of the pool once water was added. The pool contractor then fixed that problem but another big crack/collapse developed in the same corner. They then fixed that and now another crack has developed although this is a smaller crack than the others.

Each repair consisted of taking out the cracked sections of vermiculite concrete and loading stone in the hole and then covering back up with new vermiculite.

The pool contractor charged an extra $3000 to control water and this was stipulated in the contact and I actually expected the charge would apply. The pool contractor is now telling me that these cracks are "Normal and since it is not getting bigger" it should be fine. We are swimming and using the pool. I don't think they properly controlled the water in the first place and now they are telling me that they can also dig a ditch, fill it with gravel and divert the underground water away but there will be an EXTRA charge.

My question is this...is it normal to have cracks in the concrete from day one of having an in ground vinyl liner pool? The contractor tells me it is but I don’t buy it!

Anyone have any thoughts on this? Thanks,

[BillinKingstonSprings]

The cracks don't sound normal to me at all. I wouldn't pay them until it is completely repaired. When we dug our pool we found soft ground at the bottom finish grade. The soil pumped when walking on it. We continued to dig the hole at least 3 foot deeper than the depth of the pool and added 1" rock and fill dirt "clay". We then used a plate compactor to compact the rock added more fill dirt "clay" and compacted again more rock ect... until we were comfortable the ground was stable. You might also need the curtain drain too if you have a high water table. We take that chance when we choose to install a pool. I would stay on him until it your foundation is solid. You don't want to develop issues later down the road. Here is something to consider. In my area when we had incredibly heavy rains early in May. I heard of problems with pools where the water table rose under the liners and caused bubbles where the pool had to be drained bottom repaired and a new liner installed. You need to have it done right the first time or you will have a hole in the yard where you toss your money.

[NJNJ]

Thanks Bill. I agree that this does not seem normal; especially since it has a crack/collapse that has been repaired in the same area a total of 3 times now and this is the first time I am being told that these cracks in the foundation are normal. This is new construction. This crack happens to be in the deep end but on the angled wall that transitions from the bottom of the deep end to the verticle steel wall of the deep end. It is under the liner and visible and extends about 5 feet. I have been billed an extra $3,000 for encountering water so that they can properly control the water...this I expected but I did not expect to ask to pay more.

Would you agree that the initial charge of $3,000 should cover this water control issue?

Thanks again!

[jkusmier]

Hello,

I just had a new in ground vinyl liner pool installed (4/2010 & still not done) and a big sinkhole developed in the corner of the pool once water was added. The pool contractor then fixed that problem but another big crack/collapse developed in the same corner. They then fixed that and now another crack has developed although this is a smaller crack than the others.

Each repair consisted of taking out the cracked sections of vermiculite concrete and loading stone in the hole and then covering back up with new vermiculite.

The pool contractor charged an extra $3000 to control water and this was stipulated in the contact and I actually expected the charge would apply. The pool contractor is now telling me that these cracks are "Normal and since it is not getting bigger" it should be fine. We are swimming and using the pool. I don't think they properly controlled the water in the first place and now they are telling me that they can also dig a ditch, fill it with gravel and divert the underground water away but there will be an EXTRA charge.

My question is this...is it normal to have cracks in the concrete from day one of having an in ground vinyl liner pool? The contractor tells me it is but I don’t buy it!

Anyone have any thoughts on this? Thanks,

Was your pool built on fill? I'm wondering why the contract includes a provision for "controlling water." Where do you live? Can you post a copy of the contract? Lots of questions...

[NJNJ]

Hi,

The ground in this area is "Marl" or clay based. All pool builders that I spoke with have an extra charge if they have to control water...meaning...if they dig and find underground water, they will have to use stone/gravel or build a French drain or a similar process to control the water so that the pool base does not crack. In my case, the pool base has cracked 3 times and in each case, immediately after the repair was made, a crack develops in the same area. They now tell me that this is normal and since the most recent crack is relatively small, that it should be fine. The pool is open and we are swimming(vinyl liner covers the crack) but I suspect that the crack will grow in size over time, just like the others did. The final payment for this project is due upon completion and all work is warranted for 3 years; once I make that final payment...I suspect getting any repairs made will be like pulling teeth.

Construction began in April/2010 and in my mind, there should be no cracks in a brand new pool.

Thanks.

[BillinKingstonSprings]

My thought is if your installation contract includes a cap of $3000 for water control then the installer should honor the contract. I would recommend going to the BBB if you have to and possibly small claims court if you still can't get anywhere with it. I am sorry you are having so much trouble.

[jkusmier]

How convenient - they provide for a charge if their is a problem resulting from hydrostatic pressure but apparently took neither precautions to evaluate the likelihood of such problems occurring nor any measures to mitigate those problems. Clay is extremely dense and doesn't absorb much water, so any groundwater will find the path of least resistance, which may well have been a different type of soil surrounding/underlying that corner of the deep end where the cracks developed. Mind you, mitigating measures could have been quite expensive (excavating a much larger area, backfilling with non-native soil of a different type, compacting that and installing drains, sumps and hydrostatic relief valves in your main drains come to mind. So $3K might seem like a bargain - unless the problem keeps coming back, which it may well since patching the crack isn't addressing the underlying cause.

[mercurial]

You paid for a new pool, not a pool with a crack. Look at your contract carefully, and note whether there is any language that mentions that cracks are normal and acceptable. Contact a different builder and ask him if this condition is normal, and if water pressure is a likely cause. Finally, check your contract language and see if the $3000 was an estimate or a fixed fee.

If indeed the $3000 is a fixed fee and cracks are not called out as normal or otherwise acceptable, you should withhold any further payment to the builder and consult with a different company on a repair estimate.

[jkusmier]

You paid for a new pool, not a pool with a crack. Look at your contract carefully, and note whether there is any language that mentions that cracks are normal and acceptable. Contact a different builder and ask him if this condition is normal, and if water pressure is a likely cause. Finally, check your contract language and see if the $3000 was an estimate or a fixed fee.

If indeed the $3000 is a fixed fee and cracks are not called out as normal or otherwise acceptable, you should withhold any further payment to the builder and consult with a different company on a repair estimate.

Good advice. What state are you in, and did you sign the contract? The Statute of Limitations for written contracts is usually 1-2 years, but the SOL for oral contracts can be longer (e.g. in Illinois the SOL is 1 and 5 years, respectively). If I were you I'd withhold final payment and see what happens through next August - although, realistically, the problem could re-occur anytime, or never again. I suggested a soil problem but upon further thought, vinyl-pools are routinely installed in soils heavy w/ clay. I wonder if there was a structural problem? Call at least 2 other builders and ask what they think.