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Question: Adding Extra Insulation


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#1 m3722

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Posted 16 September 2006 - 07:25 PM

I have a Nahanni Spa by Maax, which I just love. I would like to a little extra insulation on the inside of the cabinet. It is the Thermo-pane style of insulation right now. Just wondering if anyone has done this or has any "Do's and Don'ts", they could share.

Of course, the company says that theirs is the most efficient system out there, but I'm not so sure.

What I am planning on doing is adding 1 1/2" blue styrofoam on the inside of the cabinet and maybe the expanding spray foam in the corners. On the inside of the frame(closer to the tub) I thought of adding that thin reflective insulation. So, the order starting at the tub----- factory sprayed foam, air, reflective, blue stryofoam and then the cabinet.

Any thoughts.

THanks in advance

#2 dlynn

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Posted 17 September 2006 - 06:48 AM

QUOTE(m3722 @ Sep 16 2006, 07:25 PM) View Post

I have a Nahanni Spa by Maax, which I just love. I would like to a little extra insulation on the inside of the cabinet. It is the Thermo-pane style of insulation right now. Just wondering if anyone has done this or has any "Do's and Don'ts", they could share.

Of course, the company says that theirs is the most efficient system out there, but I'm not so sure.

What I am planning on doing is adding 1 1/2" blue styrofoam on the inside of the cabinet and maybe the expanding spray foam in the corners. On the inside of the frame(closer to the tub) I thought of adding that thin reflective insulation. So, the order starting at the tub----- factory sprayed foam, air, reflective, blue stryofoam and then the cabinet.

Any thoughts.

THanks in advance


Nightrider added insulation to his hot tub, you can read about what he did on the Costco Platinum Elite forum subject here on this site. I am planning to add some insulation to mine, but haven't yet, I think I will try the reflective foil insulation first and see how that helps (mine already has styrofoam panels). I have installed a Thermometer inside my cabinet. I bought it at Walmart for $15 and it has a wireless transmitter temp sensor that I put inside the cabinet of my spa, the display is inside the house. I can see the current temp inside the cabinet and the high and low temp since resetting. I am recording the outside temp, the water temp setting, and the inside cabinet high and low. Last night (over night) the outside temp was 42 the cabinet temp low was 82 the high 92. Last evening, when I used the tub, the temp outside was 45. Before I got in the tub the cabinet temp was 86, it got up to 105 during use while the pumps were running. My water temp is set at 100 (my sensor is currently laying on the floor of the cabinet and I plan to mount it mid height, but haven't done that yet). After I add the insulation I will be able to see how much it changes. You better be careful mentioning subjects like this on this forum, the bashers will come out and tell you that you bought a bad tub and that you would not need insulation if you had just paid a few thousand more and got their favorite brand. Enjoy your tub this winter. Your plan sounds good.

#3 Chas

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Posted 17 September 2006 - 08:46 AM

QUOTE(dlynn @ Sep 17 2006, 07:48 AM) View Post
You better be careful mentioning subjects like this on this forum, the bashers will come out and tell you that you bought a bad tub and that you would not need insulation if you had just paid a few thousand more and got their favorite brand.

Please keep posting. This is very interesting, and I think that with active moderators now watching the board, personal attacks will be a thing of the past.

Be sure as you add insulation that you don't do anything that might block the airflow to motors or other items which need to be kept cool.

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#4 kenupnorth

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Posted 09 October 2006 - 12:42 PM

I also bought a Nahanni Rivers Gate spa recently and had the same idea of bolstering the insulation, almost exactly as you plan. Have you done this and how did it go?

#5 Spa User Guy

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Posted 09 October 2006 - 07:07 PM

QUOTE(m3722 @ Sep 16 2006, 08:25 PM) View Post

I have a Nahanni Spa by Maax, which I just love. I would like to a little extra insulation on the inside of the cabinet. It is the Thermo-pane style of insulation right now. Just wondering if anyone has done this or has any "Do's and Don'ts", they could share.

Of course, the company says that theirs is the most efficient system out there, but I'm not so sure.

What I am planning on doing is adding 1 1/2" blue styrofoam on the inside of the cabinet and maybe the expanding spray foam in the corners. On the inside of the frame(closer to the tub) I thought of adding that thin reflective insulation. So, the order starting at the tub----- factory sprayed foam, air, reflective, blue stryofoam and then the cabinet.

Any thoughts.

THanks in advance

Adding extra insulation seems like a great idea however one question came to mind. Does adding extra insulation to your spa void the factory warranty??

#6 m3722

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Posted 14 October 2006 - 07:36 AM

Ken check your PM

#7 spababe

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Posted 28 October 2006 - 03:40 PM

111

#8 paintnsunni

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Posted 29 October 2006 - 03:02 PM

QUOTE(dlynn @ Sep 17 2006, 06:48 AM) View Post

Nightrider added insulation to his hot tub, you can read about what he did on the Costco Platinum Elite forum subject here on this site. I am planning to add some insulation to mine, but haven't yet, I think I will try the reflective foil insulation first and see how that helps (mine already has styrofoam panels). I have installed a Thermometer inside my cabinet. I bought it at Walmart for $15 and it has a wireless transmitter temp sensor that I put inside the cabinet of my spa, the display is inside the house. I can see the current temp inside the cabinet and the high and low temp since resetting. I am recording the outside temp, the water temp setting, and the inside cabinet high and low. Last night (over night) the outside temp was 42 the cabinet temp low was 82 the high 92. Last evening, when I used the tub, the temp outside was 45. Before I got in the tub the cabinet temp was 86, it got up to 105 during use while the pumps were running. My water temp is set at 100 (my sensor is currently laying on the floor of the cabinet and I plan to mount it mid height, but haven't done that yet). After I add the insulation I will be able to see how much it changes. You better be careful mentioning subjects like this on this forum, the bashers will come out and tell you that you bought a bad tub and that you would not need insulation if you had just paid a few thousand more and got their favorite brand. Enjoy your tub this winter. Your plan sounds good.

My Wife and I have added insulation to the elite platinum II spa where there ia a gap between the shell and the skirting. We are debateing about adding the reflective buble foil in addition to the styrofoam panels already there or to remove the 1/2 ich styrofoam and instsall foil backed styrofoam, not sure yet as i broke my wrist two weeks back so the tub just kinda well got moved off my priority list till now:)

#9 JSW

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Posted 06 November 2006 - 02:25 PM

I added extra insulation to my Platinum Elite II as well. The tub came with foil bubble wrap under the skirting and 1/2" styrofoam behind that. I added 3.5" of Roxul insulation (R14) inside the styrofoam. Roxul is a mineral wool insulation. It repels water and therefore doesn't lose its insulating value if exposed to moisture. Its soft like fiberglas but denser and stiffer. It was easy to fit into tight spots where pipes come close to the cabinet. It can be easily cut to shape where necessary and is stiff enough that its doesn't sag where there is no support. I installed it right up to the underside of the shell, so it also closed off the gap between the shell and the skirt. I left a gap between the shell and skirt near the blower pump so that the blower would have a supply of fresh air. I used thin wood dividers to keep the insulation away from the pump motor air intakes. I used dlynn's idea and put a remote temperature sensor in the cabinet. The base unit sounds an alarm if the temperature falls below a set point. This gives me some peace of mind when its really cold out. I suspect the foil interferes with the signal - the readings are sporadic at times. I also added a plastic bubble blanket that floats on the surface of the water. When I'm finished using the tub, I turn off all the air controls. Hopefully all these measures will keep the energy consumption down in the cold winter months.

#10 m3722

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Posted 06 November 2006 - 08:21 PM

Were you able to take any temperature readings before and after to compare the difference. I did the same thing and although I only got a couple of nights readings before I added the insulation, the difference was quite noticeable. the cabinet dropped to 68F before and about 84F after adding the insulation, even though it was about 10 degrees colder. The air temperature was close to freezing.

#11 JSW

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Posted 07 November 2006 - 07:23 AM

I got a similar result - about a 20F increase after adding the insulation. The minimum cabinet temperature is now consistently about the same as the water - 103F. The max temp is about 10F higher when the pumps run. Outdoor temps are around 25-35F lately.

#12 wesj53

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Posted 07 November 2006 - 07:48 AM

I don't mean to be rude to you guys with HydroSpas, but I read your posts (here and elsewhere) about constantly altering your units with insulation, taping switches, replacing control panels, etc and I wonder what kind of company produces units with so many problems? Now before you jump on me for stirring the pot of emotionalism, please note I recognize you guys spent a heck of a lot less $$ on your spa than I did, but my question is would you do it all over again knowing the problems you have faced since buying your units? I, like most, like to save money, and was seriously considering a HydroSpa when I was in my search. Unfortunately, my Costco store does not sell them and I would have had to buy a dealer model at a long distance from my home at a cost of upwards of $7k for a similar model to the Platinum II and without the strong return policy offered by Costco. Any thoughts?

#13 paintnsunni

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Posted 07 November 2006 - 10:14 AM

I don't mean to be rude to you guys with HydroSpas, but I read your posts (here and elsewhere) about constantly altering your units with insulation, taping switches, replacing control panels, etc and I wonder what kind of company produces units with so many problems? Now before you jump on me for stirring the pot of emotionalism, please note I recognize you guys spent a heck of a lot less $$ on your spa than I did, but my question is would you do it all over again knowing the problems you have faced since buying your units? I, like most, like to save money, and was seriously considering a HydroSpa when I was in my search. Unfortunately, my Costco store does not sell them and I would have had to buy a dealer model at a long distance from my home at a cost of upwards of $7k for a similar model to the Platinum II and without the strong return policy offered by Costco. Any thoughts?

considering I saved easilly four grand???????MMMMMMM Yup!

I don't mean to be rude to you guys with HydroSpas, but I read your posts (here and elsewhere) about constantly altering your units with insulation, taping switches, replacing control panels, etc and I wonder what kind of company produces units with so many problems? Now before you jump on me for stirring the pot of emotionalism, please note I recognize you guys spent a heck of a lot less $$ on your spa than I did, but my question is would you do it all over again knowing the problems you have faced since buying your units? I, like most, like to save money, and was seriously considering a HydroSpa when I was in my search. Unfortunately, my Costco store does not sell them and I would have had to buy a dealer model at a long distance from my home at a cost of upwards of $7k for a similar model to the Platinum II and without the strong return policy offered by Costco. Any thoughts?

color=#FF0000]considering I saved easilly four grand??????? MMMMM ERRRRR YUP! laugh.gif [/color Also, I haven't had any "issues" other then learning how to use it.

#14 Stevie

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Posted 07 November 2006 - 10:15 AM


considering I saved easilly four grand??????? MMMMM ERRRRR YUP! laugh.gif


I'm guessing you could buy a WHACK of insulation for 4 G's! tongue.gif

#15 JSW

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Posted 07 November 2006 - 12:14 PM

... my question is would you do it all over again knowing the problems you have faced since buying your units?


Yes, I would do it all over again. I have no regrets. At first, I was hesitant about the Platinum Elite II, but the more I shopped around and researched, the more I realized that its a terrific deal (IMHO). I knew, thanks to this forum, that the insulation was an issue and that more could be easily added. So I don't consider it to be a 'problem'. I've had no significant problems. We've enjoyed our spa immensely. This spa may not be suitable for everyone but it was for us.

A satisfied customer.

#16 JoeM

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Posted 03 January 2007 - 09:10 PM

I added extra insulation to my Platinum Elite II as well. The tub came with foil bubble wrap under the skirting and 1/2" styrofoam behind that. I added 3.5" of Roxul insulation (R14) inside the styrofoam. Roxul is a mineral wool insulation. It repels water and therefore doesn't lose its insulating value if exposed to moisture. Its soft like fiberglas but denser and stiffer. It was easy to fit into tight spots where pipes come close to the cabinet. It can be easily cut to shape where necessary and is stiff enough that its doesn't sag where there is no support...


I'm interested in where you got the Roxul product. Can you share where it may be avaiable to do a job like a hot tub?

#17 jmendoza17

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Posted 05 January 2007 - 02:27 AM

Yes, I would do it all over again. I have no regrets. At first, I was hesitant about the Platinum Elite II, but the more I shopped around and researched, the more I realized that its a terrific deal (IMHO). I knew, thanks to this forum, that the insulation was an issue and that more could be easily added. So I don't consider it to be a 'problem'. I've had no significant problems. We've enjoyed our spa immensely. This spa may not be suitable for everyone but it was for us.

A satisfied customer.



One reason anyone should be hesitant about Hydropsa is that their service is terrible. Go and read my posts about the quality and level of their service. It is more accurate to say "lack" of service.

#18 GDM

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Posted 07 January 2007 - 08:56 AM

Would it be possible to post pictures, or send me an e-mail? I have a Platinum II, and the energy bill is killing me. I live in So CA so we already have high electricty rates, but my bill tripled with the new spa. I desperately need to cut down on the power usage or the hot tub will turn into a $4k paper weight.

I don't remember seeing any bubble wrap in the cabinet, only blown on styrofoam (on the underbelly of the shell).

Thank you!!!!

#19 JoeM

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Posted 07 January 2007 - 03:41 PM

I suggest posting pictures here so everyone can see. I'm really interested in adding insulation myself and would like to get ideas from others. I have gotten a few ideas but more wouldnt hurt.

#20 Brent Hamm

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Posted 08 January 2007 - 06:50 AM

I need to check our bills more carefully, but so i have not noticed any huge increase (and we live in Manitoba Canada).

But, am also interested in more insulation anything that saves me money with little cost is a good thing!

GDM my tub has silver bubble insulation between the styrofoam and the shell. Its a Platinum II.


I might be wrong...but something tells me i read somehwere that the cdn version had more insulation. Which is probably the bubble layer???

#21 JoeM

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Posted 11 January 2007 - 08:31 AM

I'm waiting to hear more examples of people who added insulation to their tub but I'm not really hearing anything that can help me. Most of what I've heard is the use of Polystyrene panels on the inside of the cabinet. My 2005 GC has a wooden frame with three removable real redwood panels on EACH SIDE of tub (total of 12 panels). Polystyrene panels would be impossible for me to get on the inside of the cabinet in one solid piece as the air blower and ozonator are mounted to the exterior walls of the cabinet in between removable redwood panels. Polystyrene panels would be easy to use on the back of redwood panels themselves, but Im afraid it wont be enough and should back the area between panels themselves as well. Then I feel it would be hard to overlap these panels when the door panels meet the interior panels.

Ideally, I would like a pliable type insulation (Fiberglass) to surround the interior of the cabinet and bend-to-fit around blowers, plumbing, doors, etc while easy to use. The problem with Fiberglass is its susceptibility to lose R-value when wet from either excess hot tub water (overflow) or excess condensation (extreme temperature difference). I live in Madison, Wisconsin and definitely need to do something quickly to help my increasing costs (new owner and donít have full months electric costs yet but will soon).

Someone above mentioned the use of a Roxul product which is a mineral wool, water-resistant and fire retardant (similar to fiberglass) type product. I am very interested in this as it seems perfect for the environment of a Hot Tub. I have contacted a Roxul provider in Milwaukee as they sell 24" x 48" batts (8x) per package for around $30 for the Roxul AFB product.

Does anybody else have a problem with Polystyrene panels or have any experience with using Fiberglass type insulation in their cabinets? If so, how well did it work? Did it help your costs noticably?

#22 JoeM

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Posted 29 January 2007 - 09:12 AM

I spent about 2 hours yesterday (sunday) adding the Roxul AFB product to my Gulf Coast Rotunda (2005 model). It took me a while to get it tucked in everywhere but did so successfully.

I dont yet have any hard data as to improvements but I do already notice that the cabinet temp is more stable (before I was anywhere between 60-70 degrees within 20 minutes or so) and pump #1/heater isnt running NEARLY as often as it was before. I think the pump was kicking on/off often per the anti-freeze function. With only about a days worth of data, I now seem to be keeping a more constant temp at about 64 degrees with it being about 15 degrees outside.

It was more of a pain than I originaly thought it would be to add the insulation. On my gulf coast, my ozonator and blower are mounted to the horizontal framing of the cabinet and made it difficult to get insulation around those without blocking air inputs to assure continued operation.

Also making things more difficult were portions of the plumbing fitting tight against the cabinet and not being able to move them away to accomodate the extra 3" of insulation. For these ares, I had to do my best at providing insulation without making it too bulky that I couldnt fit my cabinet doors back on.

I'm failry comfortable that the product I used will keeps its R-value over the years as it is water resistant and fire retardant.

#23 flibotte

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Posted 29 January 2007 - 09:23 AM

Please let us know how it worked. I was planning on doing it this fall but was way too busy with work. I'm planning on adding it myself this spring as well as getting a better cover.

#24 GDM

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Posted 29 January 2007 - 06:04 PM

Joe- would it be possible to post pictures? I am interested in doing the same thing, but am unsure as to how it should look when I am done.

#25 JoeM

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Posted 30 January 2007 - 05:57 AM

I should have taken pictures when doing it, unfortauntly, I did not. Which may be a decent thing because I'm not sure if i did it "right." It was about 10 degrees outside on Sunday when i was doing this and frankly, just wanted to get it done. Sorry for not taking pics.

Again, I have no idea if I did it right or not, but I just bought 24"wide x 48"high X 3"thick Roxul insulation. I then cut it to height of my tub, enought to get it under the cabinet upper lip, and placed it lengthwise. I continued this all around and cut out areas for the blower, ozonator and other plumbing features impossible to move further inward in the cabinet. I put it on the outside of the foil bubble wrap and on the inside of my 1/2" styrafoam boards attached to each of my cabinet panels.

After two days worth of data, my temp has remained pretty stable instead of up and down so often. I has increased the temperature of the cabinet but I have noticed that my anti-freeze cycle kicks on about 3 to 4 times less then it did before (just a guess). Even with that, I'm pretty happy that my investment of $50 of insulation should reduce my power consumption.

#26 deandog

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Posted 30 January 2007 - 06:15 PM

Hi all.

I also have the P2 from cost co and am very happy with the tub except for a few factory defects that they are coming to fix. I just recieved my first hydro bill from Dec 6th to Jan 4th and it was 200 $ more than usual. I live in Ontario Canada and it has been very cold lately -10 C to -5 in the daytime. I definitely need to add some insulation and will try the roxul when the temp outside warms up. Thanks to all you who gave this idea. Do any of you have your new hydro bill yet since insulating? What were the results? Thanks again for the great info everyone. By the way where do I get one of these remote temperature gauges for the inside of the tub. Does Home Depot or Rona sell them in Canada? What is the product name I am looking for. TIA

Deano

I will take some pictures during my install, hopefully I do it right. So it should be between the foil wrap and the 1/2" cheap white flimsy styrofoam when I do it right. TIA

Deano

I also wondered if we have to worry about the roxul fibers getting sucked up by the blower and injected in to the tub? Has anyone had a problem with this?

Deano

#27 Chas

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Posted 31 January 2007 - 01:45 AM

I have helped owners of non full-foam spas add insulation. The power costs here are high, so even though we don't have the cold weather some of you folks do, it is still a concern. Please allow me to pass on some things I have learned.

A couple of things I have learned over the years may help here. One is that the first month of operation is always much higher than subsequent months. By far. And if you are opening the cabinet to make changes and the like, be sure to consider how much heat is lost during the operation itself. So give the tub a full month of operation with it's new insulation before you worry about how much it has or hasn't helped. Generally it does help. In my experience, if the tub is not heavily insulated and you add insulation, you will reduce the costs of operation significantly.

Another thing I have learned is that the only way to know how much power your tub is using is to put some form of meter on it. Unless you live in an area where you depend on huge amounts of airconditioning during the summer months, it will cost more to run a house in the winter than the rest of the year. I'm talking about shorter hours of daylight, running more lights, more heat, portable space heaters being huge energy hogs, cooking more vs. eating out, dryer loads vs. hanging laundry out to dry in the sun, and about a hundred other tiny increases which all add up. I can't tell you how many times I have gone over bills with my customers and I simply asked them to bring in two years prior to purchasing the tub. Historically their bills were much higher in winter by far - even before they bought the new tub. So don't count on your power bill to give you any indication of the cost your spa is running up. It is also true that with a tub you may very well be home - enjoying yourself - much more. You may even skip traveling on a vacation one or more weeks this year. So many many things will impact the bill that only by metering the tub can you clearly define what it is costing you.

Having said that, you oviously can't negate the benefits of having a tub cycle less frequently or run quieter. These are some very nice side benefits to better insulation, and are hard and fast.

I am not making a judgement on you or your tubs by this next statement, I am just trying to help here. But it is something I have notcied seems to be true over my twenty years of selling these things: Regardless of the style of insulation scheme, tubs with a heavy foam layer somewhere between the tub and the outside cost far less to run than tubs with layers of thinner stuff.

I have seen some people put styrofoam shipping pellets into trash bags and stuff the entire cabinet. They avoid the areas adjacent to the pumps and blowers, but fill the rest of the cabinet. Seems to have helped a lot with heat, and a side benefit was sound.

I have seem folks put a solid wall of rigid building insulation - 1.5" thick - along two or three walls of the tub and noticed a reduction in cycling, and costs. I am talking about simply putting the insulation against the outside of the cabinet and holding it there with whatever works from screws with large washers to wire to simply pushing the spa against a wall to pin the insulation in place. Looks funny, and would absorb water in deep snow, but it works surprisingly well and may be an option if the tub is set down in a deck, or against a wall of the house or a retaining wall. Avoid trapping moisture against your spa's siding.

I have also been hired to spray in foam insulation. It can be very expensive. In our inland valleys it gets cold at night in the winter - nothing like what some of you are reporting, and it warms during the day, but still far colder than here on the coast. Those folks have sometimes spent a thousand dollars on a heavy spray foam job. About a quarter of that was labor, the rest material. They reported a reduction of $50 or more per month - often as high as $100 during the coldest months, so they expected a payback by the end of the second winter. Payback would have been sooner in a colder climate, but they also liked the quieter operation and less frequent cycling. The extra freeze protection was not a huge concern since it rarely stays below freezing all day even in the deep of winter here.

If you save a hundred dollars of power costs for just four months out of the year, it will only take three years to add up to $1200. That could buy a spa with more insulation initially, or pay for a pro to come spray foam it. Or you could spend the money on materials and spray it yourself as some of you have. All are viable options.

HTH.

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#28 Brent Hamm

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Posted 31 January 2007 - 10:23 AM

Good news..

I just found out my work has several meters. I will take one home in the next few days. Its very easy to hook up and will log all the data to a computer.

I will check the consumption of the tub..and also record some out door temps during that time.

Will let you guys know what it shows.

Further down the road (when its not so cold) i will add the insualtion. Guess i will not be able to re-test tell next winter (unless we get a warm spell soon)

#29 deandog

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Posted 05 February 2007 - 06:18 PM

QUOTE(Chas @ Jan 31 2007, 04:45 AM) View Post
I have helped owners of non full-foam spas add insulation. ...

.... All are viable options.

HTH.

cool.gif



Great info thanks

#30 JoeM

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Posted 05 February 2007 - 09:59 PM

agreed, thank Chas, very good info!

#31 NightRyder

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Posted 07 February 2007 - 11:38 AM

Does anybody else have a problem with Polystyrene panels or have any experience with using Fiberglass type insulation in their cabinets? If so, how well did it work? Did it help your costs noticably?


I added 1/4" foil covered foam radiant barrier insulation on the inside of the cabinet panels, and John Manville Comfort Therm poly enclosed fiberglass bats fastened with Velcro for easy remove-ability inside the cabinet. I've had this setup for over 2 years and it works really well. The cost to run my PE I spa averages about $30 to $35 per month during the winter in NW Oregon.

NightRyder


#32 NightRyder

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Posted 08 February 2007 - 09:33 AM

Call me slow but I can't picture what you did. It sounds like it works well, so can you go into detail?
I can't comprehend what you did? To where? With Velcro?
GREG!


Comfort Therm bats are wrapped in plastic, I used adhesive Velcro - One part attached to the Bat in several locations - The other part attached to a corresponding point on the spa frame.

NightRyder

#33 Studlygf

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Posted 13 February 2007 - 01:26 PM

Hi
I have read with interest all your posts, i donít know if i can add to them but i will certainly pass on any of my experiences. I am from Ireland/ Northern Ireland and I have just recently purchased a spa, being a budget spa (if I can say budget) approx 6,000 USD but things here are a lot more expensive, I have found the insulation to be very thin but then it did originate from Florida so except there is not much need for insulation there.

Ok now the point of my post, I am going to try to insulate it more, obviously some of the names you mention I can not get here but some one did say about expanding foam, I have thought of spraying this round the pipe work as I found that when I turn off my jets for about a minute and then on again I can feel that that water sitting in the pipes have already started to cool. Does any one know of any problems with spraying this foam around the pipes?. I had also thought of stuffing the cabinet with fibreglass but I have a blower and was afraid of it sucking in bits of fibreglass, and also the fact of it being nasty stuff anyway. So tomorrow I am going down to my local pub, I mean hardware store to see what insulation they have. I will be happy to post photos if someone can tell me how?. By they way it is San Marino tub 5 seater with blower if anyone is interested.


#34 Studlygf

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Posted 08 March 2007 - 06:23 AM

Wow! Was it the Northern Ireland thing????????

#35 Chas

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Posted 08 March 2007 - 06:34 AM

quote=Studlygf " Hi
I will be happy to post photos if someone can tell me how?."

Post the pictures to any of the many free websites such as PhotoBucket or similar. Then click on the little 'tree' icon in the reply window. That puts this bit of code in place:

[ img] http://www.hotspring-ventura.com/ [ /img]

You just insert the address of the photo where I have put my URL.

cool.gif

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#36 GKL

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Posted 08 March 2007 - 06:45 AM

Hi
I have read with interest all your posts, i donít know if i can add to them but i will certainly pass on any of my experiences. I am from Ireland/ Northern Ireland and I have just recently purchased a spa, being a budget spa (if I can say budget) approx 6,000 USD but things here are a lot more expensive, I have found the insulation to be very thin but then it did originate from Florida so except there is not much need for insulation there.

Ok now the point of my post, I am going to try to insulate it more, obviously some of the names you mention I can not get here but some one did say about expanding foam, I have thought of spraying this round the pipe work as I found that when I turn off my jets for about a minute and then on again I can feel that that water sitting in the pipes have already started to cool. Does any one know of any problems with spraying this foam around the pipes?. I had also thought of stuffing the cabinet with fibreglass but I have a blower and was afraid of it sucking in bits of fibreglass, and also the fact of it being nasty stuff anyway. So tomorrow I am going down to my local pub, I mean hardware store to see what insulation they have. I will be happy to post photos if someone can tell me how?. By they way it is San Marino tub 5 seater with blower if anyone is interested.

I've been cautioned to remove any added insulation in the summer months to prevent heat build-up and possible damage to the pump motors.
GREG!

Hi
I have read with interest all your posts, i donít know if i can add to them but i will certainly pass on any of my experiences. I am from Ireland/ Northern Ireland and I have just recently purchased a spa, being a budget spa (if I can say budget) approx 6,000 USD but things here are a lot more expensive, I have found the insulation to be very thin but then it did originate from Florida so except there is not much need for insulation there.

Ok now the point of my post, I am going to try to insulate it more, obviously some of the names you mention I can not get here but some one did say about expanding foam, I have thought of spraying this round the pipe work as I found that when I turn off my jets for about a minute and then on again I can feel that that water sitting in the pipes have already started to cool. Does any one know of any problems with spraying this foam around the pipes?. I had also thought of stuffing the cabinet with fibreglass but I have a blower and was afraid of it sucking in bits of fibreglass, and also the fact of it being nasty stuff anyway. So tomorrow I am going down to my local pub, I mean hardware store to see what insulation they have. I will be happy to post photos if someone can tell me how?. By they way it is San Marino tub 5 seater with blower if anyone is interested.

I've been cautioned to remove any added insulation in the summer months to prevent heat build-up and possible damage to the pump motors.
GREG!

#37 Ric

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Posted 08 June 2007 - 02:47 PM

Here is what I did. inside the cabinet of my spa.
1 - Put blue styrofoam panels on the floor.
2- Placed fiberglass insulation with the pink plastic wrapper throughout the inside of cabinet. Had to cut insulation, therefore it did not remain sealed. Made sure to avoid coming too close to motors.
3 - Bought a roll of reflective foil sandwiched bubblewrap type insulation. Stapled that to the frame covering the whole outside of all 4 sides. Reattached redwood sides which sealed up against sandwich foil wrap.

I live in NH and like to run hot tub in winter for apres skiing. My cost to run was about $50 per month in winter. IMHO, pretty good.

CONS: Over time the insulation picked up some moisture. Insulation also attracted field mice during winter. Not right away but after many years. They build nests and pee and poop in insulation. Not pretty. (If you don't live near nature...you might be ok with this solution.)

Accumulated moisture also attracted carpenter ants who ate on corner supporting member. Last summer I removed all insulation and used HT only in summer.

I am looking for better ideas than fiberglass insulation. Packaging "popcorn" whether loose or in black trash bags was a thought. I wouldn't mind spraying some expanding foam if I new where to get. The little cans would probably be too expensive, but then maybe not.

BTW, I am going to check out the waterproof insulation, but will the mice still nest in it? Hmmmm...

Just my experience and hope it helps.

Ric

#38 Roger

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Posted 08 June 2007 - 05:27 PM

='Ric' date='Jun 8 2007, 05:47 PM' post='28206']
Here is what I did. inside the cabinet of my spa.
1 - Put blue styrofoam panels on the floor.
2- Placed fiberglass insulation with the pink plastic wrapper throughout the inside of cabinet. Had to cut insulation, therefore it did not remain sealed. Made sure to avoid coming too close to motors.
3 - Bought a roll of reflective foil sandwiched bubblewrap type insulation. Stapled that to the frame covering the whole outside of all 4 sides. Reattached redwood sides which sealed up against sandwich foil wrap.

I live in NH and like to run hot tub in winter for apres skiing. My cost to run was about $50 per month in winter. IMHO, pretty good.

CONS: Over time the insulation picked up some moisture. Insulation also attracted field mice during winter. Not right away but after many years. They build nests and pee and poop in insulation. Not pretty. (If you don't live near nature...you might be ok with this solution.)

Accumulated moisture also attracted carpenter ants who ate on corner supporting member. Last summer I removed all insulation and used HT only in summer.

I am looking for better ideas than fiberglass insulation. Packaging "popcorn" whether loose or in black trash bags was a thought. I wouldn't mind spraying some expanding foam if I new where to get. The little cans would probably be too expensive, but then maybe not.

BTW, I am going to check out the waterproof insulation, but will the mice still nest in it? Hmmmm...

Just my experience and hope it helps.

Ric



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#39 Ric

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Posted 18 June 2007 - 04:44 AM


Roger,

Thanks for the info!

Ric





#40 Tom

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Posted 25 June 2007 - 01:47 PM

QUOTE(m3722 @ Sep 16 2006, 09:25 PM) View Post
I would like to [add] a little extra insulation....


Here is one possible emergency solution, seen in Edmonton, Alberta last winter. Cardboard box on corner prevents string from cutting into foam. Photographer identified brand as one commonly sold in box stores.



#41 spray25

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Posted 26 June 2007 - 07:15 AM

I'm new here, but wanted to contribute to this thread. I have been interested in adding insulation to my spa. I purchased two part spray foam from this company http://www.polytechf...ge=TWOCOMPSPRAY It was $250 shipped to my door for the 200 board foot kit. That should easily be enough foam to put 2" on the skirt of my spa. The claimed R value is 7.2 per inch. I feel more comfortable with a spray foam than rigid foam because it will fill all voids easily and be seamless.

I am not sure when I will have time to install it but will update when I do.



#42 Jim_The_Jim

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Posted 26 June 2007 - 09:30 PM

QUOTE(spray25 @ Jun 26 2007, 07:15 AM) View Post
I'm new here, but wanted to contribute to this thread. I have been interested in adding insulation to my spa. I purchased two part spray foam from this company http://www.polytechf...ge=TWOCOMPSPRAY It was $250 shipped to my door for the 200 board foot kit. That should easily be enough foam to put 2" on the skirt of my spa. The claimed R value is 7.2 per inch. I feel more comfortable with a spray foam than rigid foam because it will fill all voids easily and be seamless.

I am not sure when I will have time to install it but will update when I do.


That sounds like a good plan, but keep in mind the temperature of the pumps in summer. And that there is also "radiant" heat that escapes. A layer of thermal foil will help with that.
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#43 spray25

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Posted 27 June 2007 - 06:40 AM

QUOTE(Jim_The_Jim @ Jun 26 2007, 11:30 PM) View Post
That sounds like a good plan, but keep in mind the temperature of the pumps in summer. And that there is also "radiant" heat that escapes. A layer of thermal foil will help with that.


Do you think the pumps will over heat in the summer? Hot for us is in the upper 80's to low 90's (very low humidity). I live in the mountains so even with highs like that it gets cold at night. Yesterday was upper 70's but last night was mid 30's. We dont use the spa during the day in the summer but the pumps do run for filtering which I have noticed raises the temp significantly.

I'm not sure how to address any overheating issues with this type of insulation.

#44 BlueSpa

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Posted 19 August 2008 - 07:39 AM

QUOTE(Chas @ Jan 31 2007, 05:45 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I have seem folks put a solid wall of rigid building insulation - 1.5" thick - along two or three walls of the tub and noticed a reduction in cycling, and costs. I am talking about simply putting the insulation against the outside of the cabinet and holding it there with whatever works from screws with large washers to wire to simply pushing the spa against a wall to pin the insulation in place. Looks funny, and would absorb water in deep snow, but it works surprisingly well and may be an option if the tub is set down in a deck, or against a wall of the house or a retaining wall. Avoid trapping moisture against your spa's siding.



With winter coming I was wondering about adding insulation to our spa and was considering adding to the OUTSIDE of the cabinet as Chas suggested but the moisture issue makes me hesitate.

Our spa already has the 1.5" thick insulation panels inside the cabinet and there's not really any room to add additional inside the cabinet except maybe for the bagged popcorn insulation idea. But the unit was shipped with that great foil bubble wrap around the outside of the cabinet and I saved the stuff since I knew I'd find another use for it (yes, I'm a bit of a packrat).

The cabinet is some sort of poly/composite stuff and it won't be seen. But I wasn't sure how the panels would look after a Maryland winter - not sure drawing mold & mildew into the unit would be a good idea.

Anyone successfully insulated the outside of their cabinet??






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