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You could have an experienced carpenter build an access panel into the deck floor. If you can find a good carpenter, this will be nearly unnoticeable to most people who walk on it.

I went out to test the water on my 2007 Sundance Optima and noticed a clear screen, except for a series of dashes (-----). According to the owners manual, this is the watchdog mode. If it senses something wrong, it will shut down and go into this watchdog mode. I turned off the breaker to the tub for a couple of minutes, then turned it back on. This seems to have cleared up whatever went wrong...for now. But, this has spawned a couple of questions: 1. Any idea what could have caused this? 2. Is this a sign of more trouble ahead?

Check out these threads, they may help: Bromine Shock Bromine Questions To answer your question...I really don't know much about the different products that are out there. So, I'm not sure if the Spaguard brominating concentrate is the right product for establishing a bromide bank/reserve or not. I can tell you, the product I use is 99% sodium bromide. That probably doesn't help too much.

After a fresh refill, you will want to get everything else in line first...pH, TA, Calcium Hardness, etc. Then, I add sodium bromide to establish a bromide bank. Then, I shock to get the bromine level above 10 ppm. I run the pumps for about 30 minutes. I leave the cover open as long as possible. After the bromine level drops to a safe level...under 10 ppm...I place the floater in. Exposing the water to sunlight will help deplete the bromine, if that tip helps any.

This is just an assumption on my part...I'm no expert on this chemistry stuff. I'm assuming the bromine level stayed high, after the shock, because there were no "nasties" in the water to use up the bromine...the water was pretty clean and free of contaminates. Now, this may be because you don't use it that often. Therefore, you are not introducing nasty contaminates into the water. This happens to me periodically. Because we don't use the hot tub too often, I don't shock it too often. My floating bromine dispenser slowly builds the bromine level above 10 ppm (it's barely cracked open). Once I notice the bromine level is too high, I remove the floater and wait for it to come back down. I have found that I can leave the floater in for about 2 days, and then remove it for nearly 2 weeks if we don't use the tub. In that amount of time the bromine level will only drop a few ppm...nothing drastic. This routine usually keeps the bromine level around the 3 - 7 ppm range, depending on how often I check the water Hopefully, others will chime in to help you further, and/or to correct any of my mistakes.

Even with 8 air changes per hour all of the humidity is not always removed. After a few months of not cleaning the walls and ceiling, look up into the corners of the bathroom, near the ceiling, and most people will have a little mold growing. This just shows how exhaust fans are not the ideal means of controlling humidity. Another example of this is a public indoor pool...look around and you will likely notice there are no exhaust fans. If you happen to see an exhaust fan, its purpose is to remove chemical odors. The heating/air conditioning system handles the humidity, and sometimes odors with charcoal filters. The best way to control humidity is with a dedicated (serving the basement only) heating/air conditioning system. Without getting too deep into the engineering, basically the air handler will pull the room air across a cooling coil to drop the air temperature below the dew point, causing the moisture in the air to condense on the cooling coil so it can then drain outside. If the room doesn't need cooling, just dehumidification, then a heat source will reheat this cooled air back up before it gets pushed back into the room. Quite costly to operate and install for the average residence. By the way, white cobra, placing a register in the exposed duct of your basement will not help any potential humidity issue. Also, by doing this, you will take air from the rest of the house. Possibly starving the rest of the house if your system is not sized to handle the basement and upstairs simultaneously. I don't want to see you create a problem by "solving" a problem. Now...are you going to have a humidity/mold problem if you place your tub in the basement??? It's hard to say for sure, there are too many unknown factors involved. Typically, it is not something I would suggest, but you can always remove it if it starts giving you trouble. But, as SmilinBare said, mold problems are not always immediately noticeable, it can easily develop inside walls and grow for years before you become aware of it. Good luck, and whatever you decide to do, I hope it works out great for you.

Every situation will be different. A few factors involved might be the quality and seal of the cover, how often it gets used, the temp. of the water, the temp. and humidity in the basement, ventilation/conditioning of the basement, etc., etc., etc. Basements are sometimes mold/mildew prone to begin with, so adding a hot tub may make matters worse. Here is something I wrote previously about ventilation issues regarding a hot tub indoors, it may or may not be relevant: _______________ Interesting question. It is logical to think that an exhaust fan (EF) will remove humidity, and to some degree, it will. But, unfortunately, EF’s are not usually intended for humidity control. They are typically used to contain and remove odor, smoke, air born particulates, air born bacteria, etc., as well as achieving specific room pressurization criteria. If you were to use an EF for humidity control, you will need some means of replacing the air that you are exhausting. This will most likely come from outside the building. So, if it is warm and humid outside, you will be bringing in warm humid air to replace the humid air that you are trying to get rid of. Not very practical and somewhat counter-productive. Also, if it is cold outside, you will be bringing in that cold air while exhausting the humid air. Again, not very practical. Plus, this introduction of outside air is unfiltered and unconditioned, causing your heating/air conditioning system to work harder. The only time this would be feasible would be during ideal outside air conditions, which does not happen often enough to make it worthwhile. Another option would be to bring the outside air in through your heating/air conditioning system first. This way the outside air would be filtered and conditioned before it gets to your room. But, this can be costly to install and will certainly cause your heating/air conditioning system to work harder. Perhaps even requiring a completely different heating/air conditioning system to handle the added load requirement. Controlling humidity within a building is usually accomplished by a heating/air conditioning system alone…no exhaust fans. But, a system designed for this type of control is more elaborate than the average home system. It is also much more costly to install and operate. In most cases, not very practical. I would suggest you go to your local hardware store and purchase a couple of dehumidifiers. Start off with 1 or 2 and see how it does, and add more if necessary. _______________ Other things to consider may be...what if there is a leak...what about draining the tub every few months...if it is a living space, what will this do to the comfort/condition of the space? Having the tub in the basement is a wonderful convenience, but there are risks that my or may not arise. Hope this helped.

I am not at all familiar with Marquis, mine is Sundance, so my input may be way off. I'll through some thoughts out there anyway. This may be normal for your spa. I suspect the pump will need to run, even though the heater is not, to provide continuous filtering. My recirc pump runs all the time, regardless of call for heat, unless I reprogram the controller to cycle the pump periodically. Perhaps you have already done this, but my suggestion would be to check the owners manual to see if this is normal for your spa, and to see if you can reprogram it to cycle as often as you would like. But, to maintain water quality, you will want the pump to run periodically so it will continue to filter your water even when you are not using it. Hopefully someone with more knowledge will chime in to clarify some of this.

I may not be of much assistance, but I have a question that might help others by clarifying what you are asking. Are you saying the heater continues to run after it reaches set-point? or Are you saying the heater shuts off after reaching set-point, but the pump continues to run?

After shocking and getting the bromine level above 10 ppm, leave the cover open for a while. Also, exposing the water to sunlight will help lower the bromine level a little faster. I would recommend a drop test kit instead of the test strips. Since you are using bromine I would suggest the Taylor Complete FAS-DPD Test Kit - K-2106 (just perform a google search and you will find a handful of places that sell it). They make one for chlorine and another for bromine, so make sure you get the proper one. It is a bit expensive but very much worth it in the long run. It's much more accurate than the test strips. Here is a detailed description of using bromine as written by someone much wiser than I: ___________________ First, you need to establish a bromide reserve in the water. Bromine tablets can do it by themselves but it can take literally weeks until enough dissolve. Some people crush about 6 of them up and put them in the water on each water change to achieve this but it really is easier and cheaper to add a packet or two of sodium bromide. Bromine tablets contain both bromine and chlorine to oxidize the bromine into an active sanitizer. If you do not add the sodium bromide and just put in bromine tabs then you will be starting with a chlorine system until enough bromide dissolves in the water. There are basically 2 ways to do a bromine system…2-step and 3-step. 2-Step System In the 2-step system you add the sodium bromide to the water in the proper concentration, then add oxidizer on a regular basis (usually, chlorine, MPS, or ozone, or a combination of them) to oxidize the bromide ions into hypobromous acid, your active sanitizer. It's pretty easy but does require a bit of attention daily to maintain the bromine levels in the water. If you are using the 2-step bromine system (no tablets) then you would add your oxidizer on a regular basis to maintain the 4-6 ppm bromine level and shock it weekly with a larger amount of oxidizer to burn off the organics with the higher bromine levels that are created. 3-Step System The 3-step system is identical to the 2-step system except for the addition of bromine tabs in a floater. This will help maintain a more constant bromine level in the water with less maintenance but otherwise there is no difference. The 3-step system costs more since the bromine tablets are the most expensive part of this equation. The dimethylhydantoin in the tablets seems to have a similar (but not identical) function in a bromine system as CYA does in a chlorine system. It tends to stabilize it but, like CYA, too much is not good. Not that much info is readily available on the effects of dimethylhydantion other than that it makes the bromine more difficult to destroy, a consideration if you ever want to switch over to a chlorine system. In a 3-step bromine system (with tabs in a floater) the tabs are what keeps the bromine levels at the 4-6 ppm range (they contain both bromine and chlorine) and you still need to shock weekly with additional oxidizer to burn off organics. If you add sodium bromide to your water, and have an ozonator, you might be able to achieve the constant bromine level without the floater since the ozone is constantly oxidizing the bromide while it is on. However, you might deplete the bromide reserve quickly this way, leading to a shorter time between drain and refills. Also, ozone can cause bromates to form in your water. Bromates are a suspected carcinogen in drinking water. You still need to superoxidize (shock), usually about once a week to destroy organics in the water whether you chose the 2-step or 3-step method. I prefer plain, unscented laundry bleach (5.25%) for shocking a bromine spa. 1-1/3 to 1-3/4 cups per 500 gallons is about right. If you use Ultra bleach (6%) then you need about 1 to 1-1/2 cups. You can also use 12.5% pool chlorine at half the ultra bleach dose. They are all sodium hypochlorite, just in different strengths. If you do not want to use a liquid shock you can also use: calcium hypochlorite granules (slow dissolving and will cause your calcium levels to rise), Lithium hypochlorite (very fast dissolving but very expensive, however my first choice for a granulated shock since it really has minimal impact on your water like the liquid does), or MPS--potassium monopersulfate, also called non chlorine shock (will lower your pH and TA and add sulfates to your water). There is no advantage to using dichlor (stabilized chlorine) for shocking a bromine system but it probably wouldn't hurt. CYA (stabilizer) does not stabilize bromine. You should shock weekly to get the bromine levels between 10 ppm and 20 ppm. Usually just above 10 ppm is sufficient. Leave the cover off and the filtration running until the bromine levels drop, usually a few hours to a day. Exposing the water to sunlight will help the bromine level drop faster. Here is a step-by-step description: 1. On each fill balance the water (adjust TA and pH. Add calcium if below 125 for acrylic spas or below 200 for plaster.) If you have metals in your water add a metal sequesterant. 2. On each fill add sodium bromide to the water. (Follow manufacturer's directions on dosing. You will end up with about a 30 ppm concentration of sodium bromide.) 3. Shock with your preferred oxidizer (chlorine or MPS) and turn on the ozone if you are using it. Your bromine levels should now be above 10 ppm. Wait until they drop below 10 ppm before entering the spa. 4. If using the 3-step system, add your floater with bromine tabs and adjust it to maintain a 4-6 ppm bromine level. If using the 2-step system, add your preferred oxidizer as needed (and adjust your ozone) to maintain a 4-6 ppm bromine level. 5. Shock weekly to burn off organics that collect in the water. (If you are using ozone and your bromine levels are staying at 4-6 ppm then you can shock less often.) Wait until the bromine level drops below 10 ppm before entering the spa. 6. Test bromine and pH before entering spa each time. Test all water parameters (bromine, pH, TA, Calcium Hardness) weekly. 7. Drain and refill about every 3-4 months.

As I understand it you have 2 options as to how to maintain a safe level of bromine. 1. Pour in the same shocking agent (bleach, MPS, etc.) every day, just in smaller amounts to keep the bromine in a safe range. 2. Get a floating bromine dispenser and put some bromine tablets in it. Then adjust it to the proper opening and it will maintain the bromine level for you every day until all of the tablets dissolve. Here is a detailed description of using bromine as written by someone much wiser than I: ___________________ First, you need to establish a bromide reserve in the water. Bromine tablets can do it by themselves but it can take literally weeks until enough dissolve. Some people crush about 6 of them up and put them in the water on each water change to achieve this but it really is easier and cheaper to add a packet or two of sodium bromide. Bromine tablets contain both bromine and chlorine to oxidize the bromine into an active sanitizer. If you do not add the sodium bromide and just put in bromine tabs then you will be starting with a chlorine system until enough bromide dissolves in the water. There are basically 2 ways to do a bromine system…2-step and 3-step. 2-Step System In the 2-step system you add the sodium bromide to the water in the proper concentration, then add oxidizer on a regular basis (usually, chlorine, MPS, or ozone, or a combination of them) to oxidize the bromide ions into hypobromous acid, your active sanitizer. It's pretty easy but does require a bit of attention daily to maintain the bromine levels in the water. If you are using the 2-step bromine system (no tablets) then you would add your oxidizer on a regular basis to maintain the 4-6 ppm bromine level and shock it weekly with a larger amount of oxidizer to burn off the organics with the higher bromine levels that are created. 3-Step System The 3-step system is identical to the 2-step system except for the addition of bromine tabs in a floater. This will help maintain a more constant bromine level in the water with less maintenance but otherwise there is no difference. The 3-step system costs more since the bromine tablets are the most expensive part of this equation. The dimethylhydantoin in the tablets seems to have a similar (but not identical) function in a bromine system as CYA does in a chlorine system. It tends to stabilize it but, like CYA, too much is not good. Not that much info is readily available on the effects of dimethylhydantion other than that it makes the bromine more difficult to destroy, a consideration if you ever want to switch over to a chlorine system. In a 3-step bromine system (with tabs in a floater) the tabs are what keeps the bromine levels at the 4-6 ppm range (they contain both bromine and chlorine) and you still need to shock weekly with additional oxidizer to burn off organics. If you add sodium bromide to your water, and have an ozonator, you might be able to achieve the constant bromine level without the floater since the ozone is constantly oxidizing the bromide while it is on. However, you might deplete the bromide reserve quickly this way, leading to a shorter time between drain and refills. Also, ozone can cause bromates to form in your water. Bromates are a suspected carcinogen in drinking water. You still need to superoxidize (shock), usually about once a week to destroy organics in the water whether you chose the 2-step or 3-step method. I prefer plain, unscented laundry bleach (5.25%) for shocking a bromine spa. 1-1/3 to 1-3/4 cups per 500 gallons is about right. If you use Ultra bleach (6%) then you need about 1 to 1-1/2 cups. You can also use 12.5% pool chlorine at half the ultra bleach dose. They are all sodium hypochlorite, just in different strengths. If you do not want to use a liquid shock you can also use: calcium hypochlorite granules (slow dissolving and will cause your calcium levels to rise), Lithium hypochlorite (very fast dissolving but very expensive, however my first choice for a granulated shock since it really has minimal impact on your water like the liquid does), or MPS--potassium monopersulfate, also called non chlorine shock (will lower your pH and TA and add sulfates to your water). There is no advantage to using dichlor (stabilized chlorine) for shocking a bromine system but it probably wouldn't hurt. CYA (stabilizer) does not stabilize bromine. You should shock weekly to get the bromine levels between 10 ppm and 20 ppm. Usually just above 10 ppm is sufficient. Leave the cover off and the filtration running until the bromine levels drop, usually a few hours to a day. Exposing the water to sunlight will help the bromine level drop faster. Here is a step-by-step description: 1. On each fill balance the water (adjust TA and pH. Add calcium if below 125 for acrylic spas or below 200 for plaster.) If you have metals in your water add a metal sequesterant. 2. On each fill add sodium bromide to the water. (Follow manufacturer's directions on dosing. You will end up with about a 30 ppm concentration of sodium bromide.) 3. Shock with your preferred oxidizer (chlorine or MPS) and turn on the ozone if you are using it. Your bromine levels should now be above 10 ppm. Wait until they drop below 10 ppm before entering the spa. 4. If using the 3-step system, add your floater with bromine tabs and adjust it to maintain a 4-6 ppm bromine level. If using the 2-step system, add your preferred oxidizer as needed (and adjust your ozone) to maintain a 4-6 ppm bromine level. 5. Shock weekly to burn off organics that collect in the water. (If you are using ozone and your bromine levels are staying at 4-6 ppm then you can shock less often.) Wait until the bromine level drops below 10 ppm before entering the spa. 6. Test bromine and pH before entering spa each time. Test all water parameters (bromine, pH, TA, Calcium Hardness) weekly. 7. Drain and refill about every 3-4 months.

This was posted by another member a number of months ago, so I can't take credit for it, though I wish I could. Get a piece of pipe (I use 1/2" PVC) that is longer than the tub is deep (mine is about 3-1/2 - 4'). 1. While holding the pipe out of the water, place your hand over one end 2. Submerge the other end in the water, placing it beside the sand/gravel you are trying to remove 3. Quickly remove your hand from the end 4. Watch the sand/gravel get sucked up into the pipe 5. Place your hand back over the end 6. Remove the pipe from the water 7. Place the pipe outside the tub 8. Remove your hand from the end 9. The water, sand and gravel will fall out of the pipe and onto the ground 10. Repeat as necessary Kind of like playing with a straw in a glass of water.

Nitro is correct, and it does work well. Use it with confidence. But, if you are interested in having your own program on your computer just type "pool water software" into any search engine and look at what pops up. Research many of the sites that pop-up because there is a significant price difference between some of them. Some even offer a free trial. I like having my own because I can enter the names of the chemicals that I'm using and the percentage of active ingredients found in that product. This makes for a little more accuracy in the calculations of what needs to be dumped into the spa. It will also give hints as to what may be causing any water discoloration and how to treat it...a little more informative for the novice.

I am a relative newbie…had the tub for a little over 1 year. So, there are tons of folks here that are much more knowledgeable than I. While we wait for them to read and respond to your issue, I thought I would add my $0.02 First, I would suggest getting a water test kit where you have to use drops of chemicals. With this type of test kit you fill a tube with water and place drops of chemicals in that tube until you get specific color results. It sounds a little intimidating at first, but with a little practice it really is quite easy. If you are using bromine in your tub, I would suggest the Taylor FAS-DPD Kit #K-2106 (just do a web search and you’ll find a few different places that sell it). They have a kit for chlorine and another for bromine, so make sure you get the proper one. It is a bit pricey, but well worth it in the long run. I purchased a computer program off the internet for about $25 that tells me exactly how much of what chemical to add to the tub after I enter in the test results. Now, there is a learning curve associated to getting the program set-up for your situation and chemicals that you plan to use. But, after using it for a while, it has proven invaluable for me. Again, just search the internet and you will find a handful of different programs out there, if you are interested. You don’t need some of the traditional spa/pool chemicals. Baking Soda will raise alkalinity…Borax will raise pH (running the air pump and/or air jets will also raise your pH). Although, acid is the only thing I know of to lower pH. There is a wonderful discussion on this board about how a lower than normal alkalinity level will help keep the pH from rising when your tub’s pH has a tendency to creep up. I keep my alkalinity between 30 and 80 for just this reason. Search this forum for that topic, it may help. I don’t use the frog, but I do use a floating bromine dispenser with bromine tablets in it. I’m assuming these are similar devices. For me, variations in how often we use the tub really effects the bromine level and requires a little more attention to the floater setting. Sometimes I have to remove the floater to get the bromine level back down to the proper range. If you have added Sodium Bromide to establish a bromide “bank” (bromide sitting in reserve, waiting to be “activated”), then all you should need is regular unscented chlorine bleach to shock the tub. This will raise the bromine level above 10 ppm for shocking purposes. Then wait for the level to drop below 10 ppm before entering the tub. You may not have to add any more Sodium Bromide to the tub during that fill if you are using the frog, unless there is unusually high usage and shocking required. There are discussions on this topic here within this forum. Search for them and they will help you determine how much bleach to add when you want to shock your tub. Much of this water balancing seems quite daunting at first. But, with some research on this board, asking questions on this board and some practice on your part, it becomes fairly easy. Have patience and learn by asking and doing…it will pay off soon.

I tend to have the same problem when we go too long without using the tub. I take the floater out for a few days to let the bromine level drop. I have found that placing the floater in the tub, barely cracked open, for 2 days will produce about a 6 - 7 bromine reading. Then I remove it for about 4 days and the bromine level slowly drops to around 1 - 2, and then I put the floater back in. Remember, this is only if we are not using the tub for awhile. Otherwise, I need to open the floater further and leave it in all of the time.