waterbear

Taylor has a few different test kits they call "Complete". Do you have the K-2005 (DPD test for chlorine), K-2105 (low range DPD), or K-2006 (FAS_DPD test for chlorine which does not bleach out at high sanitizer levels and does not require sample dilution for testing when shocking. It is the one that I would recommend, or buying the stand alone FAS-DPD kit to add on to the K-2005). What is your cYA? FC level is dependent on CYA. FOR the normal CYA level of 50 ppm for a manually chorinated pool FC should be maintained in thed-3-6 ppm range and shocked to 12-15 ppm. What is your Calcium Hardness? Cal Hypo adds 7 ppm of CH for every 10 ppm of FC added. Is your pool plaster/aggregate, fiberglass, vinyl, or tile? A few things about this(unfortunately too common) practice, this is equivalent to pouring acid into the skimmer, which can damage pump seals, cartridge filters, and DE grids. If you have a sand filter it's possibly ok but can still damage pump seals. Trichor is extremely acidic and when it sits in the skimmer with the pump off the pH in the skimmer drops to below 3.0. When the pump comes on it's like pouring a shot of acid into the skimmer without diluting it first. If you are using trichor and you don't have a feeder get a floater, they are not expensive. Be aware that trichor adds 6 ppm CYA for every 10 ppm FC added but if you start at 30 ppm at the start of your swim season (which is probably around 4 months in Seattle) you should be fine if you are only using the trichlor to maintain the FC between adding your cal hypo, which should probably be every few days. As the CYA climbs toward the end of the season bump up the FC (with either cal hypo or bleach/liquid chlorine) to 5 to 8 ppm (shock to 18-20 ppm) as long as the CYA is not over 80 ppm. You can enter the pool as long as the FC is below 10 ppm when there is at least 30 ppm present.

Actually, balance calcium hardness first (can't be done with strips since they only test total hardness), then Alkalinity--be aware that diclor and tricolor need the TA in the 100-120ppm range while cal hypo,SWCGs, liquid chlorine,and bleach have the best pH stability in the 50-70 ppm range with 80 ppm being the highest. (read this: https://www.poolspaforum.com/forum/index.php?/topic/28846-lowering-total-alkalinity-howto/ ), then pH using aeration to raise it if necessary or acid to lower it slightly, then Stabilizer if needed. How high was your FC? What form of chlorine did you add (tricolor and dislocated both net acidic while cal hypo and bleach or liquid chlorine are net neutral.) Also be aware high chlorine level will cause pH to read lower than it actually is. Read this: https://www.poolspaforum.com/forum/index.php?/topic/58991-false-high-ph-readings-when-shocking-some-truths/ Finally; how are you testing the water? If you are using strips be aware that they are basically useless for balancing water since they don't have the precision needed. Also be aware that outgassing of CO2 is the main cause of pH rise. Read this: https://www.poolspaforum.com/forum/index.php?/topic/52523-some-truths-about-ph-and-ta/ Hope you find this helpful.

Personally, I would go with a Hayward SWCG with the 15K cell if you are not having the automation control the spa. Are you susing separate heaters or only heating the spa? Personally, it still might be more cost effective to set up a shared system with only 1 salt cell, 1 heater and a single pump and filter since the automation will handle handle it. It will even let you set it up so you can use the spillover or not which is a great way to only have to add chemicals to the pool and run it on spillover to distribute them to the spa then turn the spillover off. Makes maintenance much easier since you only have a single body of water to treat. IF you set up a dual system you will lose the ability to use the spillover , which makes changing out the spa water problematic, IMHO. Because of the small water volumeto bather ratio in a spa the water does need to be changed every 3 to 4 months because of the buildup of organics from bathers in the water. With the spillover running for an hour or 2 every few days this eliminates the problem.

IF you are getting the omnilogic it can be set up as a shared system with oine pump, filter, and SWCG. This is the setup I have and it works well. The Omnilogic can also control a dual system with 2 pumps and filters.

I assume it will be a pool pump and sand filter since I know of no sand filters for hot tubs. In that case I would just get a small SWG for an ingound pool and make sure you set the run time on it low enough to maintain your desired FC level. For example, in my system I run my salt cell at 8% and only filter for a couple of hours a day unless we are using the spa. I do have a shared system and automation so I don't have to change valves manually and my pool runs 10 hours a day on low speed with the salt cell running at 15% for the pool. I have a Hayward system with a 40K salt cell but they make much smaller ones. I would look for a salt system that is for a 15K pool, which is probably the smallest you will find.

are you using a shared pump and filter or adding a separate pump and filter and do you have an automation system?\

Sounds like your SWCG died. The algae is an easy fix. You just need to add chlorine as I said. I would suggest liquid chlorine or bleach. To make it easy add 6 gallons of 6% chlorine laundry bleach or 3 gallons of 12.5% liquid pool chlorine at sundown and again in the morning with your pump running theme whole time. You might need to do this a second day but it will clear your pool. Strips are useless I recommed getting a Taylor K-2006 test kit for testing your water. (Not the K-2005). Strips are not very precise at testing CYA and your unit recommends between 50 and 100 ppm . The Hayward recommends 60 to 80 ppm. Best precticeviscto keep the CY a at the high end of the recommended range. For best pH stability don't let your pH go lower than 7.6 and don't lower it onto it goes above 7.8. (You can't monitor pH that precisely with strips. Keep the TA at 60 - 70 ppm to minimize outgassing of CO2 which causes pH rise and is why SWCGs cause pH to rise (hydrogen generated in the cell aerates the water and cayse the outgassing). Adding 50 ppm borate also helps pH stability by adding a secondary buffer in addition to the bicarbonate/carbonic acid buffer we call TA. If your pool is plaster keep the Calcium Hardness around 300 to 400 ppm. If fiberglass or vinyl it can go as low as 200 ppm. You can't test Calcium hardness with strips. They only test total hardness, which is a useless measurement for pools and spas "Normal limits" tells us nothing about your water chemistry. We need numbers. You might want to read these: https://www.poolspaforum.com/forum/index.php?/topic/52523-some-truths-about-ph-and-ta/ https://www.poolspaforum.com/forum/index.php?/topic/28846-lowering-total-alkalinity-howto/ https://www.poolspaforum.com/forum/index.php?/topic/58991-false-high-ph-readings-when-shocking-some-truths/ https://www.poolspaforum.com/forum/index.php?/topic/53108-some-truths-on-bleach-dosing/

First what is the make and model of your SWCG? Second, what is your CYA reading and how was it tested? (Liqiud reagent turbidity test read by view tube or meter), strips either manually read or with a meter, or dry reagents--powders or multitest discs read in a machine). If your salt dropped then most likely so did your CYA Third, post a full set of test results and how they were obtained (stripsxwithbor without a meter,liquid reagents, dealer testing, or direct reading pH, ORP, and salinity meters) so we have some idea of what's going on in your pool. Post results for FC, CC or TC -- these readings can be converted back and forth mathematicall, pH, TA (sometimes called ALK), CH (not TH-- strips only test TH) , CYA, and Borate if you use it --highly recommended for salt pools. If the FC is low and the cell us generating then something is burning through your chlorine. If the CYA is low (normal is somewhere between 50 ppm as bd 100 ppm depending on the manufacturer with most suggesting 80 ppm) then your chlorine won't hold until you get it into correct range. You said the pool is black. That sounds like a bad algae outbreak and the core for that is chlorine once you have the CYA and pH in line. Get the pH between 7.6 and 7.8 and maintain the FC at about 20 -25 ppm (assuming normal SWCG CYA levels) by adding liquid chlorine or bleach, this is what your SWCG is producing so it will have the least effect on your water balance. You need to get the free chlorine up AND KEEP IT THERE by testing 2 or 3 times a day c and adding chlorine to get the level back up. It will get consumed quickly killing the algae so the more often you test and replenish the FC the faster you will kill the algae.

The mineral cartridge lasts about 4 months. The smartchlor cartridge about a month in a 400 gallon spa. It requires the use of their special test strips since their smartchlor is not regular chlorine but is a proprietary chemical that tests as combined chlorine and not as free chlorine. The system is expansive to maintain compared to chlorine or bromine and the 'minerals' are metal salts (silver) that have slow kill times and are ineffective against viruses. I am not a fan of mineral systems. King Technology makes several versions of the Frog @ease (silver and chlorine) and Serenity (silver and bromine) for several brands of spas and also generic inline and floating systems. It would help to know the brand of your spa and how many gallons to better answer your question but in a nutshell it seems that weekly changes of the smartchlor is excessive.

In that case both alkalinity increaser and pH increaser will void the warranty since they are sodium bicarbonte and sodium carbonate. My suggestion is to ask for someone that actually understands spa water chemistry and the chemistry of bromine instead of some clueless customer service rep.

Does your tub have a salt water chlorine generator? If so you can't use bromine since it can damage the unit. You must use salt (sodium chloride). Your tub will be chlorine. If you have ozone it's possible that your bromide reserve can be converted into bromate. However if you are draining and refilling every 3 to 4 months as recommended it shouldn't be a problem. Not sure why they said anything about UV unless they are using UV ozone generation (very likely since it is much less expensive than CD ozone generation but useless IMHO) then the same caution about bromate formation applies. Finally, I would suggest not using MPS but using bleach instead since MPS is a known sensitizer. Just my 2 cents.

Bleach can kill mold but if really bad replace the filter.

with what? If you fiter is 8 years old replace it. IMHO, filters should be replaced every 6 months to a year and cleaned every 2 to 6 weeks depending on usage.

I will give you my 2 cents but you might not like it. They probably won't because of the cost. Depending on the state and the Health Department regulations for commercial pools they will do the minimum testing needed to pass inspection. I rest my case Not uncommon if a flow meter is not required by law. Actually, high calcium and allowing scale to deposit on pool surfaces is sometimes used for commercial pools, especially when they are using cal hypo for sanitation. Downside is scale formation in heat exchangers and plumbing if pH is not closely monitored. As I said above, this is one of the downsides of high calcium. If the calcium in their fill water if high then there might not be much they can do about it. Your IP is from Newark. I am originally from Millburn, NJ and my parents had a water softener because our water was hard even though it was mountain water that came from the reservoir and I believe Newark has the same water since it's also Essex county. When I was working at a commercial installation we often "guesstimated" how much acid to add. If you do it every day for a period of time you get pretty good at doing that. You do need to test pH to make sure you are in ballpark after acid addition. I do the dame for my own pool. Vinegar is too week an acid. Do the chips dissolve in muriatic acid? could be from a copper based algaecide, scale is usually cream colored to white. Most likely algae. Moot point, it's not your pool. However, calcium silicate does not tend to chip off like calcium carbonate. It's not your pool and you aren't paying the maintenance and repair costs so I would let it slide. If the scaling bothers you then I would find a different facility.